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-   -   South Park Creators 'promised' death by Muslim extremists (http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?t=203613)

urluckyday 04-21-2010 05:55 PM

South Park Creators 'promised' death by Muslim extremists
 
Link

Apparently showing Muhammed in a bear mascot outfit is wrong too...*sigh*

The group said that the post was not a "threat" but rather, it's just the "reality" of things to come for the creators, Matt Stone and Trey Parker.

I have no problem with Muslims who actually understand their religion, but I don't know how to even come close to tolerating extremists in any religion...I know there are extremists for every group/religion, but there's a reason we don't hear as much about them...

Can't wait for tonight's episode of South Park, though! :thmbup1:

JediAthos 04-21-2010 07:30 PM

Extremists (of any sort) say a lot of things....98.9 percent of it is garbage, and largely I think it's so they can hear themselves talk.

jrrtoken 04-21-2010 07:38 PM

The jurisprudence on depictions of Muhammad, et al differ upon scholar; the general consensus is that depictions of holy figures lead to adoration, reverence, and ultimately idolatry, the very principle which Muhammad denounced. Indeed, there have been many ways to swerve past this; Persian illustrators depicted Muhammad and Co. either with metaphysical parchment shielding the face or silhouetted with smokeless, ethereal flames.

Again, the above was in a positive light; the South Park thing has the intent of humor, and is barely acerbic. Muhammad is not even visually shown; only described. That is far less of an offense, and goes nowhere towards the brink of blasphemy. If one wishes to see a depiction of Muhammad that would most certainly earn the ire of many Muslims (and, possibly conscious Westerners), one need only read Dante's Inferno; even a picture would suffice:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_M5mQhY1Rgc...00/inferno.jpg

urluckyday 04-21-2010 07:56 PM

I'm all for a religion who doesn't want the idolizing of major figures like muhammed or even jesus...but to promise to kill someone who doesn't even practice the religion because they made a joke about it is crazy.

jrrtoken 04-21-2010 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by urluckyday (Post 2720260)
I'm all for a religion who doesn't want the idolizing of major figures like muhammed or even jesus...but to promise to kill someone who doesn't even practice the religion because they made a joke about it is crazy.

Indeed, which is what makes this seem like a 1300-year step backwards to the time of ultraradicals such as the Khariji from the very roots of Islam. Definitely not a pleasant notion, that's for sure.

Liverandbacon 04-21-2010 10:28 PM

So... South Park made fun of the whole "portray Muhammed and we'll kill you" thing, showed a guy in a bear suit so as not to actually portray Muhammed, and a bunch of idiots do exactly what they were being made fun of for doing in the first place. Classic. Seriously, the treatment of Islam on the show is much tamer than the treatment of other religions. If Parker and Stone do get killed by muslim extremists, like Theo van Gogh did, I'm reenlisting.

Sabretooth 04-21-2010 11:46 PM

Until the Ayatollah confirms its fatwaness, it's a pretty boring threat. Then South Park can be equated with Salman Rushdie.

urluckyday 04-22-2010 12:59 AM

I loved how during the entire episode Mr. Garrison kept asking "Is this still okay to do?" whenever they'd 'portray' Muhammed. I understand first amendment rights but doesn't this all fall under threats? I really want to find out if either of the 2 creators have responded to this yet...I'm almost 100% sure they're not scared or anything like that because I'm sure this isn't the first time they've gotten death threats...

True_Avery 04-22-2010 01:06 AM

They found and killed that film maker in 2004, so I wouldn't put it past them to give it a shot.

I get why the image is banned but at the same time I don't, but this entire issue has been taken too far. Not only do we censor it, but its censored because of radicals like this group. This may be very callous and ignorant, but by censoring it we are only giving extremists like this power in the long run. Sure, its blasphemous but what happened to free speech?

They let an image of Jesus crapping on the American flag air, but refused to show Muhammad without a censor bar. If anything, the episode went out and did exactly as intended.

PS: South Park has already drawn and depicted Muhammad as a fire shooting crime fighter in the episode Super Best Friends, fully drawn and fully animated. It was censored on air, but you can watch the uncensored version on their website so the controversy is a little late. They also used the same threat in Cartoon Wars.

Totenkopf 04-22-2010 01:18 AM

I'd say that Theo van Gogh's murder is proof that the extremists aren't necessarily talking just to hear their own voices. Whether it's, as Saber argues, little more than a boring threat at the moment will remain to be seen. However, if it goes the way of Theo, I'd have no problem shutting down or putting many mosques (esp those plagued w/wahabbism) under heavy surveilance.

Samnmax221 04-22-2010 01:20 AM

Comedy Central must have told them no again, and they ran with it. Comedy Central is run by cowards.

True_Avery 04-22-2010 01:34 AM

Found the clip:

View page
YouTube Video

I don't recall much of any backlash when this episode aired, and that was years ago.

Darth Avlectus 04-22-2010 02:17 AM

Come on people, don't you all know that the UN *must* step in and supersede laws of governments all over the world just so they can limit free speech to make sure one group of extremist nut-cases isn't offended? :rolleyes:

In all seriousness, they don't even know what a bad dissing is. South Park disses on everyone and frankly it's giving the moslems an easy ride by far. Am I right? Thanks in advance.

urluckyday 04-22-2010 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by True_Avery (Post 2720327)
Found the clip:

View page
YouTube Video

I don't recall much of any backlash when this episode aired, and that was years ago.

This was from 2001

lol they made fun of this in the 200th episode...something along the lines of "Things have changed since the last time we saw Muhammed..."

Quote:

Originally Posted by True_Avery (Post 2720316)
They found and killed that film maker in 2004, so I wouldn't put it past them to give it a shot.

I get why the image is banned but at the same time I don't, but this entire issue has been taken too far. Not only do we censor it, but its censored because of radicals like this group. This may be very callous and ignorant, but by censoring it we are only giving extremists like this power in the long run. Sure, its blasphemous but what happened to free speech?

They let an image of Jesus sh***ing on the American flag air, but refused to show Muhammad without a censor bar. If anything, the episode went out and did exactly as intended.

PS: South Park has already drawn and depicted Muhammad as a fire shooting crime fighter in the episode Super Best Friends, fully drawn and fully animated. It was censored on air, but you can watch the uncensored version on their website so the controversy is a little late. They also used the same threat in Cartoon Wars.

I think the creators put the "censored" bar over muhammed in the episode not anyone else. It was actually funnier that way.

True_Avery 04-22-2010 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by urluckyday (Post 2720401)
This was from 2001

Yep, but it was also censored back in 2001. The Youtube clip is from the DVD set.

Quote:

Originally Posted by urluckyday (Post 2720401)
I think the creators put the "censored" bar over muhammed in the episode not anyone else. It was actually funnier that way.

It made the point hit home harder, but rest assured the creators -did- want to show Muhammad and have tried to do so for years. It was Comedy Central that has censored all, I believe, 4 cases of them trying. In all cases, Muhammad has been animated but always censored, because he is uncensored in all the DVD releases. Trey and Matt are probably two of the most anti-censorship people in media today, and have gotten into numerous fights with CC and Fox over it.

Its just Comedy Central being hypocrites and cowards, and after the online threat CC censored not only Muhammad, but also any mention of him in the episode and refuse to show the uncensored version of the episode online like they usually do, as well as refusing to show the censored version of the episode on TV again for now.

Blix 04-22-2010 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTA:SWcity (Post 2720332)
Come on people, don't you all know that the UN *must* step in and supersede laws of governments all over the world just so they can limit free speech to make sure one group of extremist nut-cases isn't offended? :rolleyes:

In all seriousness, they don't even know what a bad dissing is. South Park disses on everyone and frankly it's giving the moslems an easy ride by far. Am I right? Thanks in advance.

I agree with this, I mean Jesus and Satan (oh and God too) have been made fun of: Jesus dying again in Iraq, Satan dressed up as Britney Spears, and God was made out to be a fugly cross between a monkey and a lizard. If anything the Catholic, Satanist, and overall Christian faith in general have more room for making deaths and spouting hateful rants than these hyperactive idiots with guns.

Darth Avlectus 04-22-2010 09:40 PM

That's only taking into account the number of times cap-ons have occurred as per each group. We're not even considering how light, by obvious comparison, the disses are yet.

urluckyday 04-22-2010 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by True_Avery (Post 2720462)

Its just Comedy Central being hypocrites and cowards, and after the online threat CC censored not only Muhammad, but also any mention of him in the episode and refuse to show the uncensored version of the episode online like they usually do, as well as refusing to show the censored version of the episode on TV again for now.

I'm almost sure that the "censored" bar on ep. 200 was the creators...that was the running joke throughout.

swphreak 04-22-2010 11:42 PM

The censored bar was on purpose, the bleeping of any reference to Muhammed was done my Comedy Central. While it wasn't intentional, I laughed my ass off near the end of the episode when they're giving their speeches and saying how they all learned a lesson but Comedy Central bleeped it. It was 3 long bleeps. It was just so absurd and ridiculous I couldn't help but laugh.

From what I read online, the "lesson of the episode" didn't even mention Muhammed. So there was no point in bleeping that whole minute.

Samnmax221 04-22-2010 11:45 PM

http://i41.tinypic.com/2rf3l28.jpg

Liverandbacon 04-23-2010 12:42 AM

The "freedom go to hell" poster amuses me. I suppose the sort of mind that is attracted to religious extremism is also dumb enough to not realize that in a country without freedoms such as free speech, he'd be jailed or summarily shot for the sort of protest he was taking part in.

urluckyday 04-23-2010 02:28 AM

I'd like to take a swing at just about every one of those protesters...

Darth Avlectus 04-23-2010 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samnmax221 (Post 2720518)

Hmm... so we have the extreme of basically killing for "insults".

Europe is the cancer and Islam is the answer. Wow, and Europeans are typically some of the most tolerant and accepting of people so I don't think I want to know how America is viewed by them. Oh wai--

Something on how Europe will pay.

Something that says fantastic 4.

Islam will dominate the world.

And... Freedom go to hell... which I can onlyguess means that they despise anyone who isn't under their thumb and law.

How droll.

urluckyday 04-23-2010 10:29 PM

Matt and Trey released a statement today on southpark studios.com

Quote:

A Statement from Matt and Trey

In the 14 years we've been doing South Park we have never done a show that we couldn't stand behind. We delivered our version of the show to Comedy Central and they made a determination to alter the episode. It wasn't some meta-joke on our part. Comedy Central added the bleeps. In fact, Kyle's customary final speech was about intimidation and fear. It didn't mention Muhammad at all but it got bleeped too. We'll be back next week with a whole new show about something completely different and we'll see what happens to it.
I can't wait for their response next week...

Revan 411 04-23-2010 11:03 PM

I don't mind South Parks intent on religious humor; it's simply just trying to make people laugh. But the way these religious extremists are, is absolutely ridiculous, and shows us the negative, dark side to humanity, and is one of the main reasons why some third world countries haven't taken a step up in Civilization. And this doesn't go towards "only" Islam. Just a few days ago, I heard of an abuse that occurred in the Catholic Church.

Again, don't me wrong; I don't mind people worshiping God, Jesus or Mohamed, but when extremists freak out at a simple joke that some cartoon made, then that's when I start rants like these.

Blix 04-23-2010 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liverandbacon (Post 2720526)
The "freedom go to hell" poster amuses me. I suppose the sort of mind that is attracted to religious extremism is also dumb enough to not realize that in a country without freedoms such as free speech, he'd be jailed or summarily shot for the sort of protest he was taking part in.

I'm trying to think of a word that would sum all of this up neatly..."irony" maybe?

Quote:

Originally Posted by urluckyday (Post 2720540)
I'd like to take a swing at just about every one of those protesters...

Here I'll lend you my aluminum bat :)

Darth Avlectus 04-26-2010 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liverandbacon (Post 2720526)
The "freedom go to hell" poster amuses me. I suppose the sort of mind that is attracted to religious extremism is also dumb enough to not realize that in a country without freedoms such as free speech, he'd be jailed or summarily shot for the sort of protest he was taking part in.

Ehh, moronic hypocrisy? :p

Quote:

Originally Posted by urluckyday (Post 2720540)
I'd like to take a swing at just about every one of those protesters...

How abaout a Samurai's Kanabo? :devsmoke:

urluckyday 04-26-2010 08:20 PM

^Lol, I should make a list with all the stuff I'd like to hit 'em with.

Jae Onasi 04-27-2010 01:50 PM

OK, enough with the weapons-of-Muslim fanatics-destruction. Move along, move along....

Ping 04-27-2010 05:17 PM

Honestly, this is only going to continue until the end of time. Christians have their fundamentalists, Muslims have their fanatics. I think people should just grow spines and ignore the protests and outrage unless it's very plausible someone is going to kill them. Honestly, if I were in the South Park creators' (and Comedy Central's) position, I wouldn't take these guys seriously until I find a death threat in my mailbox.

Darth Avlectus 05-01-2010 12:26 PM

Problem is, that's just the sort of thing these people are resorting to--ANYTHING they can to barb your psychological well being. They might be kinda nuts, that doesn't mean they are necessarily stupid. Course that doesn't mean they are the only ones that can "lose it" either.

Then you also have people who make threats or something to try to rattle sabers or whatever charade and try to intimidate you into doing what they want.

The real danger are those who don't want your attention because they actually mean to do you harm; these are more dangerous than anyone else. Then there are masterminds doing both.

Of minor relevance you can tell a lot by someone's body language and demeanor in person if you know what to look for.

Point being is gauging the threat level: you can safely ignore many extremists, but that doesn't mean there aren't still people among them who will do something waiting for you to turn a blind eye.

Tommycat 05-04-2010 10:06 AM

The sad thing is that the Muslim extremists actually make the Christian extremists look better by comparison...

It's time for another "Real Men of Genius"
*Real Men of Geeeniuuus*
Today we salute you Mr Muslim Extremist Cartoon Hater.
*Mr Muslim Extremist Cartoon Hater*
How do you make the Christian extremists seem like they aren't so bad? Up the ante and threaten to kill anyone who portrays your religious figure in any way shape or form even if he's hidden.
*AhlaLAAAAAH!*
Thanks to you, the religion of peace can be portrayed as complete nutters ready to kill anyone at the drop of a hat.
*Is that a fedora?*
You give FoxNews, Glen Beck, and Michael Savage, ammunition against Islam.
*Baaad choice of words*
So crack open an ice cold Bud Light you master of meatheadedness, because you are the point of the jokes.
*Mr Muslim Extremist Cartoon Hater*

Totenkopf 05-04-2010 05:59 PM

^ nice. Haven't seen one of those commercials in awhile. Guess we dodged yet another bullet. Thank God for incompetent enemies, especially when we have incompetent morons running parts of the govt.

Q 05-04-2010 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tommycat (Post 2722595)
The sad thing is that the Muslim extremists actually make the Christian extremists look better by comparison...

It's time for another "Real Men of Genius"
*Real Men of Geeeniuuus*
Today we salute you Mr Muslim Extremist Cartoon Hater.
*Mr Muslim Extremist Cartoon Hater*
How do you make the Christian extremists seem like they aren't so bad? Up the ante and threaten to kill anyone who portrays your religious figure in any way shape or form even if he's hidden.
*AhlaLAAAAAH!*
Thanks to you, the religion of peace can be portrayed as complete nutters ready to kill anyone at the drop of a hat.
*Is that a fedora?*
You give FoxNews, Glen Beck, and Michael Savage, ammunition against Islam.
*Baaad choice of words*
So crack open an ice cold Bud Light you master of meatheadedness, because you are the point of the jokes.
*Mr Muslim Extremist Cartoon Hater*

:rofl:

Darth Avlectus 05-08-2010 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tommycat (Post 2722595)
The sad thing is that the Muslim extremists actually make the Christian extremists look better by comparison...

It's time for another "Real Men of Genius"
*Real Men of Geeeniuuus*
Today we salute you Mr Muslim Extremist Cartoon Hater.
*Mr Muslim Extremist Cartoon Hater*
How do you make the Christian extremists seem like they aren't so bad? Up the ante and threaten to kill anyone who portrays your religious figure in any way shape or form even if he's hidden.
*AhlaLAAAAAH!*
Thanks to you, the religion of peace can be portrayed as complete nutters ready to kill anyone at the drop of a hat.
*Is that a fedora?*
You give FoxNews, Glen Beck, and Michael Savage, ammunition against Islam.
*Baaad choice of words*
So crack open an ice cold Bud Light you master of meatheadedness, because you are the point of the jokes.
*Mr Muslim Extremist Cartoon Hater*

:laughing::lol:
:rofl:

True_Avery 05-12-2010 12:51 AM

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37089242...ope/?GT1=43001

The Swedish artist was recently attacked. Again.

Dr. Makaveli 05-27-2010 02:49 AM

Well, I'm in agreement that this extremist violence was wrong, of course. But in the case of this guy... what the heck was he thinking? I know there's the whole thing about making a point, and testing freedom of speech. But depicting Muhummad as a dog? I find it hard to believe he didn't anticipate or court this reaction. There's making a point, and there's common sense.

In the larger sense of this argument, i think it's more a judgment on our sense of taste/humor/respect. There should be no banning, but must we really go here? I have yet to talk to a muslim friend or classmate that is not pissed about this. How is "pushing the boundaries" it worth it.

Chistian fundamentalists are equally as bad... they're just generally not violent. Like those people a while back 'protesting' at military funerals. It's all disgusting.

I'm not convinced all of these instances were designed to provoke, so the instigators could come back and say "look at these people, they don't like free speech!", plus the whole publicity factor.

Just trying to see things from the other perspective.

Totenkopf 05-27-2010 05:16 AM

I agree that doing something "just b/c you can" isn't necessarily the best way to go. However, for free speech to have any meaning, you often have to tolerate such insults and dismiss them as eccentricities or ignore them altogether. But the extremists do prove one thing, if nothing else.....that people will be cowed into some form of submission if credibly threatened w/violence.

Tommycat 05-27-2010 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Makaveli (Post 2726921)
Well, I'm in agreement that this extremist violence was wrong, of course. But in the case of this guy... what the heck was he thinking? I know there's the whole thing about making a point, and testing freedom of speech. But depicting Muhummad as a dog? I find it hard to believe he didn't anticipate or court this reaction. There's making a point, and there's common sense.

In the larger sense of this argument, i think it's more a judgment on our sense of taste/humor/respect. There should be no banning, but must we really go here? I have yet to talk to a muslim friend or classmate that is not pissed about this. How is "pushing the boundaries" it worth it.

Chistian fundamentalists are equally as bad... they're just generally not violent. Like those people a while back 'protesting' at military funerals. It's all disgusting.

I'm not convinced all of these instances were designed to provoke, so the instigators could come back and say "look at these people, they don't like free speech!", plus the whole publicity factor.

Just trying to see things from the other perspective.

That's the thing though. The reaction is disproportionate. Christian fundies, Mormons and Scientologists have been made fun of and they haven't been violent in their response. What was their response? they quit watching the show. Or at the most boycotted the advertisers. Christian fundies have been violent to places like abortion clinics. But in their eyes the abortion clinics are legalized murder(not my view, just going by their wording).

I am not saying that the Muslims can't be ticked about it. Anger is justified. The threats of violence and calling for the heads of Matt and Trey are just over the top. How can their anger be taken seriously when they play into the hands of the creators.

And yes, it is a lack of respect on the part of South Park. But they actually show a lack of respect for a lot of other religions, and causes. The whole show is about making fun of somebody. Why should muslims be treated any differently than say the Japanese.


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