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Revan: The Novel Spoilers (Oh god...)
Basically there was this guy on another forum who had got a copy of Revan by Drew Karpyshyn early, and he pretty much wrote most of the plot in his post, of course naturally, people didn't believe him so he posted pictures of the book and pages, it looks legit. However, too be honest, the book seems terrible, this is how the guy summarized the book.
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Oh no.... Link for original post http://forums.spacebattles.com/showthread.php?t=202146 EDIT: In a blog post by Drew Karpyshyn on Sept 30, he mentions he knows that this person from the spacebattles forum had got the book early, and he mentioned how people started emailing him about the book, it's a good read. Here's the link. http://drewkarpyshyn.com/c/?p=302#more-302 |
*sigh* I read the spoiler so I wouldn't have to read the book. In my opinion, this is the ultimate form of "urinating on your own art". Rubbish, all of it. First of all, Revan and the Exile, when you get right down to it, are PLAYER CHARACTER AVATARS. That means each of these personages are created by each and every person who plays the KOTOR games. Why do we need to have a "canon" Revan (male) and a "canon" Exile (female)? Basically, what this so-called "novel" does is thumb its nose at the KOTOR storylines, and fans' creativity.
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What creativity?
Further, if I may quote the only sane man from page three of that thread (for I find it an appropriate response to the average reaction): Quote:
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Oh, look. It sucks.
I'm shocked. :dozey: EDIT: I seem to remember predicting years ago that KotOR2 would be retconned out of existence. |
Im going to go out on a limb and say that this is either a very simplified early version or not the real plot.
Sorry for the spelling or writing,....using cell to post this. There are some items mentioned while others left out that causes me to doubt the source... Number one is that the person does not show how this book connect to existing information known about Revan or hk-47. Swtor's reveal on Revan show that the Sith will now know what he was hiding in his base ... which if Revan is drugged or in a cryo in large points in the book... How did this base come about? When did he build it ? There is also mention in the Revan reveal that the Sith seem to talking as if Revan is either dead or unknown where he is now. If he was in cryo... Why talk about him in such manner. Then comes the mask being shown on an alter. If Revan was in cryo... He would be wearing the mask... How would it get there. The poster never talks about HK 47 who everyone loves... When we know hk is at This secret Revan base. I would like the poster to actually post more informative details since it comes off as the poster hates the book and never connects it to what is known from swtor info. I wish people would not take posts like this persons at face value. There is no proof he has the book. The one image I can see shows no content just a title page which can easily be created in photoshop. Logan |
You guys know that the name Darth Scourge makes this obviously fake, right?
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to lordjedi, where is your link that states that Darth Scourge is a Jedi knight companion?
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http://www.hotrodacc.com/swtor/comp.html Just a few links. |
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Something I found interesting from the passage:
"Anyway, they go face the Emperor where the three of them go face to face, until Scourge gets a vision of a different Jedi facing the Emperor. Figuring this must be the red skinned bastard's eventual killer, he stabs Meetra in the back with his lightsaber and the Emperor electrocutes Revan into submission." Considering Scourge is a companion for the Knight in TOR, it is possible that the different Jedi he sees facing the Emperor, is you, your character and other Jedi players in TOR, and like in WoW how the Lich King was a raid boss, the Sith Emperor will eventually be one? |
Sounds ****, they should of just left Revan and the Exile alone... Though I think K2 is the far more interesting story, as it's not a strict light dark dichotomy and retconning it away is only something a complete fool would do. I do agree with TK about Revan being totally blown up by fans own ego's but meh, I think Star Wars needs to remember part of the Original Triologies mystique was not spelling everything out... In this case leaving what happened to Revan and the Exile would of worked a lot better.
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So... does it look too bad to be legit? Can I read it, the spoilers I mean?
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Rubbish, ****, or not, I'd much rather wait and read the book myself than base my view on someone else's negative opinion of the book.
The fact that this is just one person's summary makes it worse, especially as they've already decided that it sucks. |
I'm more disturbed by how horrible the prose is in the excerpts than any retcon that might be made by the book.
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The other question is this the final version or an early version sent to an editor.
This hints that this is legit at some level but also the reviewer gives a very poor review mainly says this stinks which even if he has the final version .... The review he presents is poor when reviewing a work of literature. |
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I'm not familiar with publishing practices, but is it normal to have an uncorrected proof bound? And if it is uncorrected, how did he get a copy (I just assumed it was an advance copy to a reviewer/whoever that got leaked)?
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OT: Strange story. Why drag another Sith Lord in? Exile and Revan should have been enough. And the Exile isn't a powerful Jedi...she just leached the energy from the Lost Ones around her, becoming a superhero Jedi. And the Lost Ones didn't go with her to the Unknown Regions so it's only logical she only has her 'standard' powers left. It does feel a bit...bad to have Revan and the Exile in stasis. This means they can be dragged out of storage room for an appearance TOR. They should've killed Revan of or had him kill the Emperor, leaving a big question mark for TOR to fill. I do feel we need to get the cane out of the cupboard and give that Emperor a darn good spanking for hurting our beloved Revan. |
Well ****. Saw the part of the emperor "dead at another jedi's feet" so I guess now we know for sure which is the canon ending.
Then again, spoilerific thread, oh noes! :thmbup1: Though for the record my attitude on this game just went back down slightly into "BULL ****!" To be brutally honest, it's Drew Karpyshyn's character and he is at full creative liberty to do with it as he wishes. I don't agree with it, but whatever. I'm not so attached either. I'd probably be the same were I in his place, though I'd try to be a little more respectful of preexisting canon (but who cares right?). Paraphrase: "We can't keep up with every little piece and detail of canon because SW EU canon is massive--but we tried pretty hard." [HK-47]Mocking Translation: Oh I "fixed" what I didn't like about previously established SW canon, and if you give me the benefit of a reasonable doubt, you'll believe that I genuinely tried my best not to **** it up. I was just a little more modest about it this time so I could get away with it. Heheheh Dumb@$$es. [/HK-47] Hint: Form VII EDIT: I tease of course, because the source of the leak is blowing things WAAAY out of proportion based on that which Drew Karpyshyn didn't pay any attention to, like little details (detracting from the point of the story). I'm sorry but you CANNOT make a judgment based off assumptions made from a LACK of evidence unless it is obviously conspicuous. Example: Since KOTOR 2 was not well known to the rest of the Galaxy, it is unlikely the little details about the members of the sith triumvirate would be common knowledge. Even if the rebuilt jedi order knew some of it, they collectively could not have pieced it back together to give a 100% recitation on EVERYTHING.[/EDIT] BTW has anyone read the bio about Darth Jadus? Show spoiler
Also if that force ghost on the Taral V Developer walkthrough is indeed that of the Exile as some youtuber suggested to me...then the only face and hair I can come anywhere even near matching that with of the female player faces in K2 is the bushy blonde used for that one jedi woman in the malak recruit vision in Kressh's tomb: Show spoiler
@J7 I agree. I, too, wish they would have left them alone. Sort of. Retconning K2 is a fool's move and that Revan has been blown out of proportion by fans. Side note: I suppose now we'll never know about Arren Kae. Quote:
I am not surprised in the least, though, that Karpyshyn decided to marginalize K2. Not only is it a very deliberate ****ting on Obsidian, but to add salt to the wound, gave the exile a very lackluster end. [EDIT]: That *is* just my opinion though. Production of just about any kind is a competitive business afterall. I may not like it, but it is what it is. Out of necessity. [/EDIT] So now it was Revan, not the Exile, who detonated that Mass Shadow Generator. [EDIT]: Again, the exile's story was unknown to mast the galaxy, that doesn't mean gnost dural's recitation of history is infallible or inaccurate. [/edit] BTW, KOTOR2 isn't "completely" retconned, just compartmentalized: Show spoiler
They'll probably say Nihilus had the powers too but was so weak anyways, that it didn't matter and that the universe wasn't actually in any danger from him. Like master Vrook Lamar said, "Perhaps it is merely what you believe." ...Then he somehow got spooked into believing it b/c his death was imminent and the force betrayed him. Quote:
Then again, we already know about HK-47 more or less. It looks like an intentional leak to me. Unverifiable on purpose. Careful on what information to release. @ thread: personally I didn't know what to expect. Actually this somewhat supports this little nightmare theory that has been gaining traction in my head for some time now. Anyone care to guess what that is? :devsmoke: Hint: He who looks like anakin in the timelines has been reborn as one who looks like vader in the cinematics. There have been a lot of little hints to this end. |
Thanks for posting all this info, Avlectus...
But this one page is it? Revan doesn't break free to have an actual duel with the Emperor? Seems a bit of a wussy way to go for him. For the Exile, okay...beytrayal was the central theme of her story anyway. And refusing to pass on to the netherworld in order to piss off the Emperor feels like her as well. However, I don't know if the hair on toy figures is canon. I recall a story about a Revan toy which had a bald head. That doesn't mean 'bald Revan' is the canon Revan though. He could've shaven his head. Just like Nihilus could've been in a Bob Marley mood. I'd prefer Three Little Birds over evil theme music any day... ;) |
EDIT, 10-06-11: It seems I might be being harsh. Part of this was due to my initial revolt when I originally posted which I'd think is fairly understandable. I am sorry if it offends, but I am not sorry for being opinionated.
Now that I have had some time to remove that revolt, let me clarify: I am not BASHING on Karypyshyn. I don't think I like how it is for the exile because I am a bigger fan of the Exile than Revan, but I'll accept it considering the alternatives. Furthermore I do agree with Drew Karpyshyn that to leave the Exile OUT would be an insult. I can accept what happens to Revan because, again, Revan was created by Drew Karpyshyn and anything players got to do with Revan was strictly 'borrowing' the character. Same goes with the Exile. Anything we do is "borrowed". I don't like being put back into a spectator role (as J7 says below) and disagree with it intensely. Still, it is what it must be. I wish others would acknowledge that. /EDIT @Topic: I would not say that KOTOR 2 has been retconned so much as marginalize because it was not largely known to the galaxy. Basically just because something is not spelled out or given specific attention does not mean that it necessarily has been retconned. However it seems Drew Karpyshyn has responded to criticisms that K2 has been retconned. I'll let you decide for yourself. Linky ======== @ spoiler: Now I looked carefully at the page on the right in that spoiler image of the proto-book and text. From what little I could decipher
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<BAAAAAARRRRRRF!> :cry8: Sorry. Just heaving up my exile fanboyism. As far as Revan being "taken down in such a wussy way"...well, look at the bright side: you can't call him a mary sue anymore now, can you? Not at Ztalker but @ Revan fanboys in general: Seriously, if everyone is still complaining about him being a mary sue and yet also complains about him NOW being taken down so easily (which would tend to negate that mary sue thing), then you need your head examined. /rant
I don't think this was meant as a finale but merely a transition, as a supplement to the game. Actually, I have sort of had this notion in my head building up for awhile now, that somehow Revan is still alive even into the old Republic. (I wish it wasn't the case, but it looks like it's happeing. Oh well.) I personally think we have been looking at "Revan" since 2009. I have found some little hints to this end. It's a genius idea. Also note this book will be short: http://drewkarpyshyn.com/c/?p=296 Quote:
For your interest: http://drewkarpyshyn.com/c/?p=239 Quote:
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Yeah that's why I said speculative. Also I know about the bald Revan figure which was made that way in order to be able to make the hood thing work. I guess I'm trying to critically analyze this using symbolism and abstracts as evidence. The best ways you can tell if symbolism is in play are prominence and coincidences. Fatal alliance novel by itself made no sense whatsoever in the greater scheme of things and yet even as much of a cluster**** as this is all turning out to be, they still would not put someone up in a main novel who wasn't important in some way. However there are a lot of seemingly random odds and ends. At first they make no sense, until you begin searching out similar instances and associated narratives with those instances. Darth Jadus and bio. Okay... at first we're kind of :indif:. Analyze the bio and find the character is a lot like Nihilus minus the hunger thing. Then Aurebesh says he also has a daughter. In an odd sort of way that makes sense as a nod to Visas. The Sith council is also wary of him, but he has no "hand" (force user) in his employ, only strictly intelligence. Next, who would that daughter be? I don't know for sure...but I made an educated guess.
You have the narrative: a mysterious, enigmatic, emotionless and quiet councilman. Presence almost like death itself embodied. Someone about whom "there can be little doubt he is playing a long game", and in the meantime it is a stalemate in terms of what the other sith would do about him. "Who is the hand of Darth Jadus?" EDIT: @CAD yeah, I guess I should spoiltag even if some of it is publicly available. |
Suddenly we need spoiler brackets on the title because something tells me the last four posts weren't spoiler-free...
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Basically what I am saying is the story "twist" of the Jedi Knight and Sith Warrior classes will be something akin to Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi regarding a certain character.
@Ztalker: (Wanring, Decieved spoiler)
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I sent the following email to Mr Drew Karpyshyn, not expecting a response as I would imagine he's busy with his various projects. Did direct him to this thread so we may hear from him...
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So, have either of Revan's names been revealed? I say "either" because I find it reasonable to assume that he has had two identities: his birth name, which he would have used up until the Revanchist movement, at which point he became "the Revanchist," followed by "Revan"; and then his new name given by the Jedi Council following his memory wipe, along with an entirely new identity complete with made-up memories. I think it is likely that the Council would have given Revan a name and identity that was completely different from his previous past so as to make it less likely that they would lead to his resuming his mantle of Dark Lord of the Sith.
Are either of Revan's names revealed in the book? |
To be honest the Taral V flashpoint official video spelt it out in everything but name, so in a way it comes as little surprise to me.
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Note: This post is an assumption based on info known or leaked.
After seeing the Taral V flashpoint (Thank You, Jaevyn, I had not seen that before) this is starting to make a lot more sense and the book seems better. For those who had not seen the Taral V flashpoint, please see it here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2I0imBz6y38 I believe the force ghost in the video is the Exile. What we know so far is she dies and turns into a force ghost. When she is talking to Master Oteg she mentions a prisoner, this prisoner is most likely Revan. She says he has been imprisoned for 300 years and is extremely powerful. After doing some research I found other discussion threads regarding this topic. http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...a-Revan-novel) A user in the thread (Page 2) says he read the book and at the end Revan and Lord Scourge are kept alive by a Sith Alchemy technique only the Emperor knows, I would assume it also keeps them from aging (Scourge leaked pictures). I think this means that the Emperor had imprisoned Revan alive to consume his power and Lord Scourge ties in with this as he is a Jedi Knight companion. So I think Revan is not dead, and it's the players (end game content? since Taral V is only a level 32 dungeon I don't think Revan will be rescued) who rescue him. |
I see some assumptions being made.
What makes anyone here think "revan" will still be in cryo incubation when you get to that point? What makes you think a being with such a powerful force essence is going to be left dormant, just laying around for someone to find and rescue? What makes anyone think "Revan" will still be in a form we recognize as the Revan we know? What makes anyone think that "Revan" in whatever form he is currently taking will even remember his previous life? What makes you think that just because says prisoner, that it is meant literally? I'm suggesting "how about prisoner of the darkness only, like his current form is physically free to roam while the past is a mystery to him". In other words, he is working for the enemy and currently unaware he once sought to destroy it. Quote:
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Her speaking in metaphor about "ashes raining down on lifeless planets" and "stars burning black" also coincides with
It's great, and nobody believes me either. Quote:
I think when you get to that complex, it will be empty. Revan won't be there. The Emperor knew about it obviously. And if the Emperor ripped the mask off Revan's face and "plumbed revan's mind", don't you think HE could have had access to the complex? I think the complex is part of the story's "end game", as a trap: this will be the case regardless if you are jedi knight or sith warrior. Why Jedi knight is obvious. Why Sith warrior? Well say you killed the Jedi order, and made an example out of the Chancellor and Satelle Shan before executing him and giving her the choice to convert or die. You don't think the Emperor is wary of you? That you aren't a threat to him now? You might just have a vision of being the new emperor yourself. Or maybe you just want to sit back and watch the world burn starting with his corpse. Quote:
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So this is basically the Star Wars version of "My Immortal"?
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I received a reply from Mr Karpyshyn;
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Seriously, your email to Drew would have served no purpose. The book is on the verge of release. And judging by the spoilers, I believe that that Drew has been disrespectful to both Revan and Exile. However, we can only pass final judgment after reading the Novel. Also, I disliked your approach of strongly defending your favorite character, Exile, in your message while you bashed Revan for no apparent reason. This was completely uncalled for and it reveals your jealousy. If you talk about powers, I can put a much more convincing case that Exile wasn't as powerful as her fans make her out to be. She was nothing major without her companions and her being wound of the Force. However, I being a fan of Revan, still dislike the way Exile has been treated in the Novel. Just like the fans of Exile have expectations from there character of getting a good role and performance in the Novel; same is true for the fans of Revan. Unfortunately, Drew had a chance to satisfy the fans of his works worldwide but he seems to have blown off the opportunity. I can think of a far more convincing story but what can you expect from a writer of average caliber? Drew is just OK. He does comes up with brilliant ideas but he is not a brilliant story teller, as far as Star Wars is concerned. And you can never ever expect a Force-Titan from him. He has a very different perception of Force and he believes that the Force has limitations. |
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I'm also sorry I hadn't realised two adults weren't allowed to have a conversation/send each other emails even if "it's pointless" (which for point of fact most of our correspondence with other human beings is, for example what purpose did this reply serve? Or my reply back serve? You think I'm going to change my mind after a few ad hominems from you?) Quote:
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You can email Drew a thousand times and I wouldn't care. However, your message to him that you revealed here is not fair to Revan fans in my opinion. You dubbed Revan fans as ego-centic fools in your message, which is a very clear insult. Quote:
Also, you can have different opinion from me. I have no issue with it but your message is not balanced. Read it yourself and then get back to me. When you are addressing a writer, you should try to be fair in your message, if you plan to reveal it in the public. Quote:
Also, I admire Yoda, Vader, and Sidious. Yoda and Sidious were certainly among the most powerful Force users in Star Wars mythos. Vader is also among the decent lot. Quote:
Also, what is this? "Now if they (Revan and the Exile) fought one on one, I think the Exile would win, however it would never get to that point as Revan would set a trap and use others to kill the Exile." Quote:
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