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Saesee Tom 10-31-2000 03:20 PM

What console shall I get? (2)
Could you give me more info on the Dreamcast regarding graphics and framerate (ect). What would be the Voodoo equilvilent?

I ask this because I currently own a Voodoo 3500 graphics card and it makes games look cool! Is the DC equilly cool and fast as the PS2?

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Dave Maul 10-31-2000 05:29 PM

Straight from :

CPU: Hitachi SH4 RISC CPU with an operating frequency of 200MHz at 360 MIPS/1.4FLOPS.
Graphics Sub-system: NEC PowerVR Second Generation (rendering capacity of more than 3 million polygons per second).

Sound Processor: Yamaha Super Intelligent Sound Processor (simultaneously articulates 64 voices) with 3D environmental audio effects.

Operating Systems: Customized Sega OS. Dreamcast is also designed to run a custom flavor of Microsoft Windows CE, and will display the official WinCE logo at startup if the game that's running utilizes it.

Memory: 16MB main memory, 8MB video memory, 2MB sound memory. Total system memory: 26MB.

CD-ROM Drive: 12x (Maximum) proprietary Yamaham GD-ROM (Gigabyte Disc) capable of holding up to 1GB of data.

On-board Modem: 56 Kbps

Controllers: Gray casing, featuring analog thumb stick, floating digital D-pad (cross-style), four face buttons (A, B, X, Y), and two analog triggers. Top of controller features two VMS slots and a small groove for routing the cable vertically. Controllers are expected to ship in multiple colors (red, blue, green, yellow, black) on a future date.

Visual Memory (sold separately): A liquid-crystal display PDA for game data backup and data exchange.

Console Dimensions: 7 7/16" X 7 11/16" X 3"

Weight: 4.4lbs

Included Accessories: Composite A/V cable, power cord, modular telephone cord, Dream Passport Internet access software, one controller.

Straight from :

CPU: 128 Bit "Emotion Engine"

System Clock: 300 MHz
System Memory: 32 MB Direct Rambus
Memory Bus Bandwidth: 3.2 GB per second
Co-Processor: FPU (Floating Point Multiply Accumulator x 1, Floating Point Divider x 1)
Vector Units: VU0 and VU1 (Floating Point Multiply Accumulator x 9, Floating Point Divider x 1)
Floating Point Performance: 6.2 GFLOPS
3D CG Geometric Transformation: 66 million Polygons Per Second
Compressed Image Decoder: MPEG2
Graphics: "Graphics Synthesizer"

Clock Frequency: 150MHz
DRAM Bus bandwidth: 48 GB Per Second
DRAM Bus width: 2560 bits
Pixel Configuration: RGB:Alpha:Z Buffer (24:8:32)
Maximum Polygon Rate: 75 Million Polygons Per Second
Sound: "SPU2+CPU"

Number of voices: ADPCM: 48 channel on SPU2 plus definable by software
Sampling Frequency: 44.1 KHz or 48 KHz (selectable)
I/O Processor

CPU Core: Current PlayStation CPU
Clock Frequency: 33.8 MHz or 37.5 MHz (selectable)
Sub Bus: 32 Bit
Interface Types: IEEE1394, Universal Serial Bus (USB)
Communication via PC-Card PCMCIA
Disc Media: DVD-ROM (CD-ROM compatible)

You figure out which is better; I've cancelled my PS2 and I'm getting a DC sometime in the near future.


Pedro The Hutt 10-31-2000 06:10 PM

Good choice,Dave!
And BTW, how was your trip,and did you miss that storm that went by the UK and other countries(including Belgium, you should take a look at our garden.)
Oh yeah, about those coloured joypads, you already can get those and other special joypads on import.(don't worry(be happy), they work fine on european machines)

I am your father.

Dave Maul 10-31-2000 06:14 PM

I came back just in time to catch the end of it; jeez, my pond overflowed! The fish were down by the plants at the bottom of the garden! My garden table smashed into the fence! One of my chairs is MIA (okay, not really, but you get the point).


Darth_Simpson 10-31-2000 07:11 PM

Good choice Dave!

Lotsa good games await you!

And Tom, maybe you should get your P$2. Since you are a PSX fan, maybe you will enjoy the P$2 as well. I understand that you and Dave live pretty close to eachother. You could play DC at his house, maybe borrow it from him, while he does the same with your P$2.

Darth_Simpson 10-31-2000 07:16 PM

Oh, and regarding graphics and such...

I would say that the DC has very impressive graphics! It's hard to compare to a PC, because each PC has a different setup!

Go to and visit the different sections, DC, P$2, PC and compare some screenshots! That'll give you a good idea!

Saesee Tom 11-01-2000 02:25 PM

It's easy for Dave to say $od the PS2, he's got a PSX. The price difference between the PS2 and DC is 150, and that is a heck of a lot of money for me. The big question for now is which will last longer?

What I mean by this is;
If I get a DC, will the games slowly fade away (the popularity decreases and will slowly grind to an early halt)? Of cource the PS2 will be more popular next year when everybody gets one for around 250 and all the companys like Sony again, The problem was it just got off on the wrong foot, so why are you dissing it?

Let's just say you only live once, fellas...
...I am getting a PS2! Anybody who objects please speak now or forevor hold your peace.

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[This message has been edited by Saesee Tom (edited November 01, 2000).]

[This message has been edited by Saesee Tom (edited November 01, 2000).]

Saesee Tom 11-01-2000 02:58 PM HA HA! OH YES! WAHOOOO!!
Oh goodness, HA HA!!!!!!

I was right! Star Wars Episode I: OBI WAN is coming out for PS2! That's why they postphoned it! Check out or whatever the hell it is.

The Ba$t**ds did it! And I am so proud of them. Well, to re-assure you of my choice, I am getting a PS2. You read it.

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Dave Maul 11-01-2000 04:28 PM

can you post a link to the page you saw it, because I can't see anything about it. All I found was this...


Announced at last year's E3 as a surprise title for the PC, LucasArts' Star Wars: Obi Wan brings with it the promise of the fantastic Jedi Knight, only on more powerful systems and with newer, better features. Even more intriguing is the game's elusive nature. Few PC journalists have seen the game, which was originally due in late fall 1999 or early winter 2000.
Making things murkier is George Lucas' new obsession. It's clear that Lucas's recent focus has been on PlayStation2. Showing up in public meetings with Sony's president and stating his fascination with the powerful PS2 has been more than enough evidence for any thinking person to see where his latest and greatest games are going to end up. Obi Wan, originally scheduled for PC, is certainly in a transition period and we think its time has come for PS2.

After all the PS2 is a great first-person perspective system. It's not lost on anyone who's played PlayStation games before. Compared to the PS2, the PlayStation was practically a vacuum of first-person shooters. The system's lack of a floating-point processor and its minimal amount of RAM created an environment extremely difficult on which to create fast-moving, Quake-style games.

While LucasArts hasn't announced its intentions with this prospect, LucasArts is looking into other platforms for this one, and PS2, along with the X Box and the DreamCast is certainly a candidate.

Nothing is for certain, but we're hopeful. This year at E3 Obi Wan will become playable for the first time on PC, and we will be there to play it. Keep an eye out for this potentially killer PS2 game.
It hasn't been slated for a proper release.


Dave Maul 11-01-2000 04:31 PM

UPDATE! The release date page shows it for "TBA 2001". However, the same page has Munch's Oddysee slated for June 2001, and we know now (sniff) that won't be happening...

Games I'll definitely be getting for DC: Crazy Taxi, JPB, Super Bombad Racing, Racer, Demolition, Half Life, Unreal Tournament. Any other recommendations?


[This message has been edited by Dave Maul (edited November 01, 2000).]

Saesee Tom 11-01-2000 04:33 PM

Sure! But first the reason why the long wait and cut for the PS2...

"Tied in to aliasing and anti-aliasing is the problem of flickering. In short, early PlayStation 2 games flickered and had no aliasing, and it showed, and it hurt. By bringing games up to a higher resolution many developers can eliminate flickering, and also reduce the harsh look of anti-aliased games in one."

And for you techies...

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Dave Maul 11-01-2000 04:37 PM

So, after the long talk today, and after your decision to get a DC, you've set your sites on the PS2 again?!?!?

It is being released for Game Boy Colour, but these graphics don't do a good game justice. Where's our beautiful DC/PS2 port?


[This message has been edited by Dave Maul (edited November 01, 2000).]

Darth_Simpson 11-01-2000 05:25 PM

Dave, the GBC game is a different game, not Obi-Wan. It's called Obi-Wan's Adventures, and is not the same as the PC version.

Oh, and add Shenmue to your list. Looks set to be the best game on all platforms this year!

And where did you get your P$2 info regarding Obi-Wan, Tom?

Darth_Simpson 11-01-2000 05:31 PM

Oh, and I see Obi-Wan on the P$2 release list...Hmmmm...

The game is not coming out for P$2, nothing at all has been announced! Gawd, I hope it isn't true. If it is, I might abandon LEC completely!

Dave Maul 11-01-2000 06:57 PM

Thank god it's not the same game. And I'll look out for Shenmue, I've heard good things about it.


Gary The Gungan 11-01-2000 07:17 PM

Hedo dere, guys! Mesa back! Gary bin haven lowda exams at da skool, so mesa nobein able to posten often. But mesa poppen in every nowanden.

Mesa got da bombad Dreamcast! Itsa muchen bedder dan da PlayStation 2! Gary be sayen dat it haven a maxi-big life. Peeple onlee liken da PS2 becus it haven a DVD, but you can picken up a DVD player for dirtee-cheep!

Dave, yousa bombad! Get da Dreamcast, poodoo to da PS2!

Gary The Gungan

Darth_Simpson 11-01-2000 07:39 PM

Damn, that Gungan is smart!

Welcome back Gary!

Pedro The Hutt 11-01-2000 07:51 PM

Yeah, where have you been?
Oh, and Dave, You should also add Soul Calibur & Virtua Tennis(yeah, I know it sounds dull, but just read the reviews&btw, it's one of the best MP-fun you can get) to your list.

I am your father.

Darth_Simpson 11-01-2000 11:02 PM

I tried the Demo version of Virtua Tennis, and it's actually really cool! I don't have the full game, but I wish I had!

Soul Calibur is pretty much the best beat'em up ever!

I also tried Ecco The Dolphin the other day, and it was surprisingly good. It sounds stupid, but it's really cool, just swimming around doing nothing...until you start the story that is...I'll be getting that as well!

A lot of the magazines seem to be excited about Jet Grind Radio as well. Personally I didn't like it...played the demo from the Official DC mag...

Saesee Tom 11-02-2000 04:14 AM

Don't hate it because it had a DVD - and that it got off in the wrong foot - It's cool. And OBI-WAN is on the final list of, take a look.

You were right at the beginning, guys. "Mabye I should get a PS2, If I am such a big fan of the PSX..."
And I am. PS2 just got off on the wrong foot... and do you know why? Because they were making the console itself better for the public. Long live the PlayStation 2!

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Saesee Tom 11-02-2000 04:20 AM

There's nothing bad about the PS2, it's just missing an Abe or two.

[This message has been edited by Saesee Tom (edited November 02, 2000).]

Darth_Simpson 11-02-2000 10:13 AM

Obi-Wan is still scheduled for PC only Tom. IGN is by no means an official source!

Wadda ya mean, "Wrong foot..."?

Saesee Tom 11-02-2000 11:46 AM

You know, 'a bad start'. Why do you dis it?

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Dave Maul 11-02-2000 11:56 AM

Here's why I'm not getting a PS2:

Sony made such a big fuss over the console, fueling the need to pre-order. I fell for it.

But the cancellation of Munch's Oddysee (the main game I was looking forward to, and indirectly the reason I pre-ordered) was a wake-up call. I looked at the 22 launch titles and said "Eugh."

The only good launch titles in the UK will be Starfighter and Rayman 2: Revolution. then, Super Bombad Racing, Metal Gear Solid 2, and Silent Hill 2.

Dreamcast has great games like Demolition, Racer, SBR, JPB, Crazy Taxi, I need to go on?

It's not worth paying 300 for a console, when there are only two good games to play. Then, I have to wait until January until I can play SBR.

I can pay 150 now for a DC, and have a wave of quality games. Then, this time next year, when there are a great set of games, I can pick up a PS2 for almost half the price.

I will definitely be getting a PS2, but I'm not dishing out 300 for it, just so I can be the first to have one. I can wait, and the DC will tide me over until then.


Dave Maul 11-02-2000 04:00 PM

And, if you like the PSX so much, why not save 220 and buy a PSOne?


Darth_Simpson 11-02-2000 05:26 PM

Even I would get a P$2 before the PSOne!

And Tom, why I don't like the P$2?... Haven't I explained it already?

I'll explain it again if you want...

Pedro The Hutt 11-02-2000 07:52 PM

I've heard it about a 257 times, but if you REALLY REALLY REALLY have to, don't make it longer then 5 lines allright?

I am your father.

Darth_Simpson 11-02-2000 08:15 PM


I won't explain it again. Don't worry, it was just a friendly threat...

Dave Maul 11-02-2000 08:37 PM

Seriously, would you spend 300 plus about 70 for two games at launch, when you could get over 1000 games on a cheap console? Do the math. Or, better yet, I will.

The PlayStation 2 will cost 300 at launch on November 24th. Of the two dozen titles to be released, only two look any good. Those will cost a bare minimum of 70. Plus 20 for a memory card. That's a grand total of 390 for a console, one controller, one memory card, and two games.

The Dreamcast costs 145. With that, you get one controller, Chu Chu Rocket, and Sonic Adventures. The games cost a minimun of 30. The VMC costs 20. That's a grand total of 195 for a console, one controller, one VMC, and two games.

Difference? 195. You could buy two Dreamcast packages for the same price of one PlayStation 2 package (but I don't see any reason to).

The PlayStation or PSOne costs 80. With that, you get one controller. A Memory Card costs 10. Games cost between 20-30. That's a grand total of 150 for a console, one controller, one memory card, and two games.

Difference? 240. You could buy a PlayStation and a Dreamcast for less than a PlayStation 2.

You know what? You're probably not even taking any of this in. I'm trying to say, don't waste your money just to be the first kid on the block with a PlayStation 2.


Darth_Simpson 11-03-2000 10:11 AM

Good comparison Dave!

But seriously, who would buy a PSX or PSOne now when their sequel is out?

Dave Maul 11-03-2000 04:44 PM

Because there are NO GOOD GAMES out for the PS2. Jeez Simpson, I thought at least you would be with me

Who would pay 300, when they can get a less-powerful but more-enjoyable console?

<FONT COLOR="#353535">500,000 fans, that's who!


[This message has been edited by Dave Maul (edited November 03, 2000).]

Darth_Simpson 11-03-2000 05:29 PM


True, you are right! I just see little reason in buying a PS at all... ;-)

Saesee Tom 11-04-2000 05:59 AM

...and most of the games I want for PSX are out for Dreamcast too... And even better graphics with an internet connection and 4 player sockets.

Hmmm... (thinking)

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Dave Maul 11-04-2000 09:07 AM

If you want the Playstation 2 because of it's DVD player, then get this. For 250, you can get a Dreamcast, a Controller, Chu Chu Rocket, Sonic Adventures, a DVD player, and Lethal Weapon 3 DVD. All you'd really need is VMC, about 20. Where from, you ask? Toys 'R' Us.

But the deal may change on Monday, when if you buy the DVD player you get Toy Story 2 DVD free.


Dave Maul 11-04-2000 09:10 AM

And those X-Box stats you wanted:

CPU: 733 MHz Intel
Graphics Processor: 300MHz custom Xchip, developed by Microsoft and nVIDIA
Total Memory: 64 MB
Memory Bandwidth: 6.4 GB/sec
Polygon Performance: 300 M/sec
Sustained Polygon Performance: 150+ M/sec (transformed and lit polygons per second)
Micropolygons/particles per second: 300 M/sec
Particle Performance: 300 M/sec
Simultaneous Textures: 4
Pixel Fill Rate - No Texture: 4.8 G/Sec (anti-aliased)
Pixel Fill Rate - 1 Texture: 4.8 G/Sec (anti-aliased)
Compressed Textures: Yes (8:1)
Full Scene Anti-Alias: Yes
Micro Polygon Support: Yes
Storage Medium: 4x DVD, 8GB hard disk, 8MB memory card
I/0: 4x DVD, 8GB hard disk, 8MB memory card
Audio Channels:64 (up to 256 stereo voices)
3D Audio Support: Yes
MIDI DLS2 Support: Yes
AC3 Encoded Game Audio: Yes
Broadband Enabled: Yes
Modem Enabled: Future upgrade
DVD Movie Playback: Built in
Game Pad Included: No
Maximum Resolution: 1920x1080
Maximum Resolution (2x32bpp frame buffers +Z): 1920x1080
HDTV Support: Yes

Note Anti-Aliasing, like the PS2.

Basically, they are capable of producing graphics like this.


[This message has been edited by Dave Maul (edited November 04, 2000).]

[This message has been edited by Dave Maul (edited November 06, 2000).]

Saesee Tom 11-04-2000 10:49 AM

Like 'what'?

Sorry Dave. As you said, 'I will definately be getting a PS2, but not yet.'

Well, see you there.

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Darth_Simpson 11-04-2000 12:04 PM

So now you're waiting for the price to drop?

I think I might rent a P$2 when Starfighter comes out. I have to try it out! You can rent a P$2 at Blockbuster for 5 days for $20. Pretty good deal...

Saesee Tom 11-04-2000 01:02 PM

No, still getting a PS2 now. Can we stop the bickering and changing our minds now? I am very sorry if I have offended anyone in any way through this last discussion. Thank you all for your views.

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[This message has been edited by Saesee Tom (edited November 04, 2000).]

Dave Maul 11-04-2000 06:03 PM

Tom, when you started a topic named "What Console Shall I Get?", you must have realised that there would be "bickering".

I've just brought my Dreamcast for Christmas. Console, one Controller, one Visual Memory, Scart Lead, Chu Chu Rocket, Sonic Adventures, Tomb Raider TLR and UEFA Striker. All for just under 180 (roughly $270). An excellent deal if I do say so myself. Even the guy in Game said that the Dreamcast will be the top console for years to come.

Viva La Dreamcast!


Darth_Simpson 11-04-2000 06:21 PM

How is TRL on DC?

And did you sign up for that Sega.Net deal?

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