LucasForums

LucasForums (http://www.lucasforums.com/index.php)
-   JO Mapping (http://www.lucasforums.com/forumdisplay.php?f=359)
-   -   The RichDiesel University Tutorial Questions Thread. (http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?t=65341)

WhiteShdw 03-15-2002 04:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Wes Marrakesh
how do you know brush cleanup has done it's job and which brush it was?
Well you can see that in the console window(is that what it's called, i'm not sure). That should show how many duplicate brushes have been deleted, if any. If there haven't been any, then it just says 0 duplicate brushes deleted.

I don't think you can tell which brush was deleted. I think it just deletes brushes you can't see anyway, or duplicate brushes that overlap eachother. Anyway you won't see any difference in your map, it will just compile better. I'm no expert at this plugin, i just used it a couple of times and it helped me when i had a compile error.

I'm pretty sure it won't destroy your map or anything.

:D

Derisor 06-28-2002 02:28 AM

The RichDiesel University Tutorial Questions Thread.
 
I thought all of us using these wonderful tutorials could ask our questions here to be answered by him or one of the other sith lords around here that really know what they are doing.

For those of you that dont know abotu the tutorials, they are an awesome introduction to mapping and I think even some of the pros might be able to learn a thing or two. You can find them at the following link.

http://richdiesal.jedioutcastmaps.com/tutorials/

Read them. Bookmark them. and then, after that, come and ask questions here

Note: I dont agree with RichDiesel about choice of tools. Get the second tools package from where he says but I encourage you to use the GTKRadiant version specially designed for JKII Outcast. JK2Radiant gave me fits and this one has been great.
GTKRadiant for JKII Outcast
GTKRadiant for JKII Outcast Getting started Guide

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Section below is from original post and never edited.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

My questions.

A) Why are my curves showing up in game as a series of planar polygons instaead of smooth arcs?

B) Given that I create a curved tube or pipe, How can I fill it with water? For horizontal as well as vertical pipes.

C) When creating curves. I draw the brush in XY view and then appy the curve function. Why does it always seem to try to create a curve rotated from what I intended? For example if I create a box for a hallway 500 units long and 80 units wide, and 60 units high, the blasted thing keeps trying to create my inverted endcap oriented to the 500 dimension and not the 80x60 dimesion.

D) How can I create a spotlight where th light is opaque from the side and shines out in a direction?

E) How can I put a light source INSIDE a brush to make it appear to be shining out from that spot?

F) When are you going to finish the other tutorials we are salivating for? :)

G) How can I create a brush that has a trigger that is electrified when hit by a gun but only just for a few seconds then returns to non electified?

RichDiesal 06-28-2002 02:42 AM

A) Because that's how the engine renders Curves. :) At a distance, they appear less smooth but when you get close, the appear more smooth. This is to cut down on the total number of polygons rendered at any one time. They should appear fairly smooth when you're right up next to them, though. There is no such thing as a true curved surface in Q3A though, so don't expect it to be perfect. :)

B) Depends. You can technically just lay down a large square water brush around the pipe (the water will conform to its shape), but if you want to be able to see your pipe from the outside, that won't work. In that case, design your level differently. :p

C) Radiant defaults to one specific angle when creating curves. I would suggest that you start EVERY curve off as a perfect cube shaped brush. Make it into a curve, rotate/size it how you want it, make the endcaps you want, and THEN drag the vertices to shape it how you want it. Just easier that way.

D) That is an effect called a beam shader which was not included in JK2. You [I]can[/] make one, but that will require either knowing how to write shaders or stealing one from RTCW or Q3A. :p

E) Just...put the light inside it? :D Not sure what you're asking.

F) It will be a while. I have gone back to mapping projects for the time being (learning cinematics) so that I can write those as well when I get back to writing them in general. Just wait. :p

G) func_multiple targetted at a func_timer targetted at a trigger_hurt :p

Derisor 06-28-2002 02:42 AM

H) Why in your tutorial do you create a door using 2 brushes instead of one?

RichDiesal 06-28-2002 02:43 AM

H) Because the left half opens left and the right half opens right. :p

Derisor 06-28-2002 02:47 AM

GAh! Good answer. Thinkign too much about technical stuff and missing the obvious. What about A through G ? :) :jawa

Derisor 06-28-2002 02:59 AM

Hmmm weird forum bug .. didnt see your first reply.

Ok folks .. the letter is at G. :)

Should prolly make it sticky too.

JustAnotherJedi 06-28-2002 03:37 AM

hrm
 
1. How the hell do i make a bloody tree?
2. How the hell do i make a bloody sky?
3. How do i found out exactly how big something is? Convert it to JK2 feet? Or are all those lines in Radiant supposed to mean something ?

:p

4. Back to step 1 ... the box.

Those are just some questions ....

BRING ON THE EWOKS!!!!! :ewok: :ewok: :ewok: :ewok:
SERIOUSLY!
SOMEONE MAKE A BETTER EWOK MAP!!!!
IM GOING INSANE!!!!

:ewok: :ewok: :ewok:

-JustAnotherJedi-

RichDiesal 06-28-2002 03:50 AM

Trees are models. :) Find the model and reference it from your assets0.pk3 by using:
http://richdiesal.jedioutcastmaps.co...gc102lsn5.html

Skies, you just apply to the faces you want to appear as skies:
http://richdiesal.jedioutcastmaps.co...gc102lsn6.html

You can determine how big soemthing is in reference to your info_player_start. Put down an info_player_start - that's about the size of Kyle.

:D

Derisor 06-28-2002 04:26 AM

Lighting:

Is there a way I can add ambient light to a texture, then put a light inside of that so that the room is lighted from light comming from the inside of that brush and further, that the brush actually looks alight.

RichDiesal 06-28-2002 05:20 AM

Eh... kinda. I would suggest making light-emitting shaders that look like they have light sources inside them. That gives the most realistic effect.

You can see an example of light-emitting shaders with... oh, every light in duel_kamino. :D

Derisor 06-28-2002 05:33 AM

Im working on the dome tutorial and had a question. Why do you put caulk brushes above the dome itself ?

RichDiesal 06-28-2002 05:49 AM

Because if you didn't, the engine would draw that surface behind the curve (even though you wouldn't be able to see it). Remember (and I'm sure you read the compiling tutorial), the VIS process completely ignores curves - thus anything behind a curve is drawn. If you texture a surface behind the dome, that's just more triangles (and thus lower framerate).

Grets Sirob 06-28-2002 06:20 AM

Rich, I'm understanding your tutorial quite well(haven't used anything yet, but what the heck...)

However, why are you doing things the hard way?

Allow me to elaborate, in your domed ceiling tutorial, you say to make the bevel, drag the vertices, etc.
Why?
Why do I have to do all that work, when I can simply make a cone?
Same with the spike thing.




:trooper: Hey, you there!

Darkpetzi 06-28-2002 06:58 AM

I guess the answer to your question is : to have nicer curves and much more beautiful lightnings. Am I right, Rich ?

Grets Sirob 06-28-2002 07:07 AM

I would think that having multiple bevels would increase chances of sparklies...

Whereas, a cone would do no such thing, it is a single object, not four.




:trooper: Hey, you there!

Derisor 06-28-2002 11:07 AM

Many times you mention creating light emiting shaders. How does one go about doing such a thing?

Ah Boon 06-28-2002 11:26 AM

RD, in ur making brush detail tut, wut do u mean by 'touching the void'?

Derisor 06-28-2002 01:11 PM

I can answer that.

What he means is that the area outside your map is called the void. The endless void of space. So detail brushes can only be inside other brushes that are touching the void and not detail brushes. This is because the renderer skipps them.

RichDiesal 06-28-2002 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Darkpetzi
I guess the answer to your question is : to have nicer curves and much more beautiful lightnings. Am I right, Rich ?
Mostly, yup. And also because the Curves tutorials are primarily to get you to learn how to use curves by making things with examples. :) Many people hide from curves, but once they make a few things with them (ala the tuts) then they are more likely to implement some in their own maps.

Quote:

Many times you mention creating light emiting shaders. How does one go about doing such a thing?
That is a bit complicated (and there will be a tut on it later) but I'll go over a shortened version.

First, you need to make your own shaderfile for whatever map you're working on. We'll say ffa_map for now.

So, make ffa_map.shader (a text file) and put it in your shaders/ directory. Then edit the shaderlist.txt file and add the name of your shader (ffa_map). Also add a subdirectory to textures/ of the same name (textures/ffa_map/).

Next, if you want to make one of the stock shaders light-emitting, open the appropriate stock shader file, copy the script of the shader you want, and paste it into YOUR shaderfile.

The first line of the shader is the name of your shader, so change it to something like textures/ffa_map/mynewshader

Now, after the first bracket (before anything else) add the line:
q3map_surfacelight 1000
(you can change the value for different light levels)

Save the file, restart Radiant, load up the ffa_map texturelist, and you should see your new light-emitting shader there. :)

There is a bit more to it (and it does get a bit more complicated) but that will be in the tut. :p My advice for now would be just to play around with it and see what happens. :)

The_Preacher 06-28-2002 11:03 PM

This concerns my problem of having a warning as follows.

WARNING: Fog brush 97 has multiple visable sides

well i followed richs tut as best i could. however i think i might have done somthing arry without realisng. when going through the caul tut. (basically it says caulk everything lol)

ill go through my process for making my water to narrow it down (thx for thelp in advance guys you rock)

I make my water.
Texture the top, and bottom with a water texture.
i put a nodraw brush in between the top of the water, and the bottom of the water, (in the middle)

i then went around the Outside, of the water, the 4 right left front and back sides (not top and bottom) and added a caulk texture to it.

i think. possibly, i have added caulk to the outsides, instead of a nodraw. perhaps have got confused :/ i dunno.

also one more probem wich has arisen. (for the love of god why )

when you try to duck in water, the model doesnt know wether to stand or to duck, so he judders, between ducking and standing.

if you move whilst ducking, and let go f the keys, they continue walking in the last direction pressed.

the only thing i could think of was perhaps i had made my water a depth that was inbetween, walking depth and swimming depth.

hence when standing its seems like standing depth. and when ducking, you go almost fully submerged but not. thats why it judders. but i dont know, thats my guess.

oh and once again. cheers rich on the tutorials. its like my bible. if i ever get stuck, or fancy trying something perhaps a little out of my depth. i just load up the page, and sit and read for a bit, following step by step.

The only problem i have ever had from the beginning has been this damned water. and according to your tutorial, its supposed to be the easiest damned thing to do lol.


anyway i have said enough
Preach out

Anakin 06-29-2002 04:22 AM

Soooo how do I get FX fetures to show in GTKRadient oh great one???

RichDiesal 06-29-2002 05:17 AM

You don't. :) fx_runners are used as described in http://richdiesal.jedioutcastmaps.co...en220lsn2.html

You never get to actually see anything in Radiant except for the fx_runner. Only way to figure out which EFX you want is to experiment and look at a few. :)

As for the fog brush error, that's actually a common problem with liquids. You see, water creates a fog when you move inside it. That's why it your view tints and you can only see a short distance in front of you (Fog doesn't actually refer to fog shaders). When you have a hole in the side of one of these brushes, it gets confused.

If you caulked the sides (as you should have), there must be absolutely no places where that caulk is exposed to the world. None whatsoever. If there is an exposed side to your water, the engine gets confused as to where to actually DRAW the fog, and thus can't compile with it (so it disables the fog and continues - that's why it's a warning and not an error). You need to make sure that your water (the caulk sides) is not exposed to the playable part of your level anywhere.

And if you're having that problem with the water... why don't you change the height of the water? :D I've never actually seen that, what height of water brush are you using (for my and everyone else's future reference)?

Jagepage 06-29-2002 05:31 AM

220: Lesson 1,

I tried your switchable dynamic lights tutorial, but there's one weird thing in it.

I have a simple multiple trigger that does nothing when you press it. So I can press it and all the lights I made for my lamp (7) are linked to one info_null. But nothing tells my lamps to switch on/off and i didn't see it in your tutorial. :p

And btw, I think lamp style is optional, so i left it this time and didn't touch them. But still I think there must be something..

The_Preacher 06-29-2002 05:33 AM

yes rich its correc. as soon as i finished wriing that, what i did was lower the level of the water, and i have had no problems, with the juddery animations. i guess i had managed to find a height in between swimming and standing.

the height was. using a grid of 4.

it was 10 units high.or around about there.

since trying to fix the water. i have also some how managed to get sparklies.

god knows where those sparklies have come from, as i have virtually everything you cant see caulked.



btw. is there a jedi mapping irc channel, where we could hang out and talk to each other in real time?? "Each other" being all the mappers.

would be cool. imo

RichDiesal 06-29-2002 05:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by The_Preacher
god knows where those sparklies have come from, as i have virtually everything you cant see caulked.
Well there's your problem. EVERYTHING you can't see should be caulked. :p

Quote:

btw. is there a jedi mapping irc channel, where we could hang out and talk to each other in real time??
JediOutcastMaps.com runs one on... some... IRC server... I don't even know. :D I'm sure it's linked on their site somewhere.

Quote:

Originally posted by Jagepage
It does too tell you. :) You should have your target_multiple targetted at your lights, which are in turn targetted at your info_nulls.

Derisor 06-29-2002 06:55 AM

RD: a Couple more from your friendly jawa.

I made a cool pipe that the player can jump down from tzhe starting point. It is a cylinder and not capped. The pipe is 8 feet in diameter (64 units) and Kyle floats nicely over it without falling in. From the top view he is pulling a neat aeriel stunt as he is touching no ground at all. What gives ?

Also what are the miniimum sizes for sdoors that kyle can get through. What about minimum size for him to walk while ducking ?

Jemek Sunns 06-29-2002 08:22 AM

Hi, I've been trying a few of teh tutorails and I have some questions. My problem may just be that I can't understand what your saying, and that's my fault but I'll ask anyway.

1. How exactly do you construct a water basin, I kept looking at the picture and I just couldn't figure it out.

2. For the domed ceiling, I've gotten as far as inverting the bevel, but then I'm not quite sure what to do from there.

Thanks in advance.

Derisor 06-29-2002 08:42 AM

RichDiesel:

How much do patches affect game performance? Do I notice a degradation if I use, for example, 4 bevels instead of a single end cap?

RichDiesal 06-29-2002 11:56 AM

Quote:

I made a cool pipe that the player can jump down from tzhe starting point. It is a cylinder and not capped. The pipe is 8 feet in diameter (64 units) and Kyle floats nicely over it without falling in. From the top view he is pulling a neat aeriel stunt as he is touching no ground at all. What gives ?
I've never encountered that myself... why don't you just use four bevels? That will work (example is in my Curves 201 tutorial under Hole in the Ceiling, I think it is).

Quote:

Also what are the miniimum sizes for sdoors that kyle can get through. What about minimum size for him to walk while ducking ?
Don't know, actually. I have yet to research that (though if you'd like to and get back to me, feel free. :D)

Quote:

How exactly do you construct a water basin, I kept looking at the picture and I just couldn't figure it out.
It's basically just four rectangular brushes standing on end in a box shape. :)

Quote:

For the domed ceiling, I've gotten as far as inverting the bevel, but then I'm not quite sure what to do from there.
Inverting it's matrix? That's where you need to enter (as I think Antilles said?) the wonderful world of vertex editing. Turn on the Vertex Tool (V Key) and draw the vertices in the 2D View. That will get you started. :)

Quote:

How much do patches affect game performance? Do I notice a degradation if I use, for example, 4 bevels instead of a single end cap?
Instead of 2 end caps, you mean? There is no disadvantage to using four bevels instead of two end caps in that the same number of triangles are drawn in both cases. There IS a disadvantage (in terms of tris) to use patches where you could use brushes instead. But they look so much better. :p

VIO 06-29-2002 12:10 PM

ok quick thing vis ignores curves so, hmm how to say this... if i but a brush thats the width and hieght iof the curve RIGHT behind it and caulk it, will ther be a difrence in well speed if that brush is father away from the back of the curve....premiss being you can't see behind the curve, or should i even make a brush behind it, i do need a brush behind it right i can't have a curve have its back to the void, right wait no i know thats right

RichDiesal 06-29-2002 12:16 PM

You need to have caulk behind it... somewhere. Specifically where doesn't matter in terms of visual quality, but you will want to make that space appropriately sized (be it big or small) to make your compile times as fast as possible.

That is of course assuming you are using the curve in front of a structural brush. If you have curves in the middle of your room (for example, a sphere in the middle of the room), you don't need brushes at all. :)

Ah Boon 06-29-2002 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Derisor
I can answer that.

What he means is that the area outside your map is called the void. The endless void of space. So detail brushes can only be inside other brushes that are touching the void and not detail brushes. This is because the renderer skipps them.

why would i wanna make anything outside the map? can u give me a lil bit more example?

Master Xavier 06-30-2002 12:06 AM

Firstly....Rich, great tutorial! Its so easy to understand! Oh and I love your Kimino Map :D

and for some reason I can't find the option to change MP and SP entities off (switch between SP and MP map making), ALL i find in procject settings is the path'ways and a list of goop, I can't find SP entities anywhere? :eek: :confused: :eek:

Derisor 06-30-2002 01:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ah Boon


why would i wanna make anything outside the map? can u give me a lil bit more example?

No, you dont get it. Your maps hang in an endless void of space according to the 3d engine. You define your map sort of like building a space station in space. Detail brushes are like thin walls made of wood. Structural brushes are like big thick metal walls. Obviously in our space station we want the big thick metal walls to be touching space. Not the thin walls. This is a metaphorical desription.

To be more technically correct, when the compiler renders your map, it creates big spaces that constrain your map. Then it only worries about those spaces. If you have structural brushes then they constrain the space. Only what is inside that space matters. If you dont have structural brushes then it would have to worry about hte entire endless void.

However if you have structural brushes inside others completely (like you make a table out of 6 brushes) then you are making those big cubes used for calculating things smaller and smaller and smaller which is obviously bad for compile.

Derisor 06-30-2002 01:58 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Master Xavier
Firstly....Rich, great tutorial! Its so easy to understand! Oh and I love your Kimino Map :D

and for some reason I can't find the option to change MP and SP entities off (switch between SP and MP map making), ALL i find in procject settings is the path'ways and a list of goop, I can't find SP entities anywhere? :eek: :confused: :eek:

YOu have to edit this in the project settings if you are using JKradient. If you are using the new package of GTK for JKII then its in the project settings.

Grets Sirob 06-30-2002 02:50 AM

Uh-oh, he's a moderator, I'm dead!

(I had to say that...)




:sithm: You will die, painfully.

RichDiesal 06-30-2002 03:28 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Master Xavier
ALL i find in procject settings is the path'ways and a list of goop, I can't find SP entities anywhere? :eek: :confused: :eek:
But if you look in the project settings, you should see SP_Entities.def (by default) in the entitypath. Just copy the path to your JK2 dir from the other options (assuming you already set them correctly) and after GameData, add the text "\\tools\SP_entities.def" (without quotes)
:D

Derisor 06-30-2002 02:31 PM

By the way.

The smallest tunnel Kyle can duck through is 48 units heigh by 36 units wide.

Guardian Omega 06-30-2002 02:55 PM

Exactly how you put chaulk on the nonvisible sides of any patch mesh? (Including cylinders, bevels, the likes......)


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:36 PM.

Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LFNetwork, LLC ©2002-2011 - All rights reserved.