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Old 07-02-2006, 03:24 PM   #149
-Synthetik-
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Join Date: Jul 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TK-8252
I was under the impression that part of being a Mandalorian is being part of their bloodline, and Jango was just a kid who got adopted by the Mandalorians. I guess I'm off on that one.
No, no bloodline needed, Mandalorians come in different races, not just a bunch of people with british accents (Lots of those somehow)

Quote:
Originally Posted by TK-8252
If you look at their genetics, they are not 100% human. They were heavily modified by the Kaminoians just like the rest of the clones.
Being a human has nothing to do with having the "human" biological structure, its the ability to have a soul, the freedom to feel emotions and to act by them. and THEY DO have souls, they feel happiness, they feel sadness.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TK-8252
"Primitive" in the sense that their genetic modifications "took away" some of their mental capacity during cloning. Still better than droids, but not like a regular human.
As in

Quote:
Originally Posted by TK-8252
I have a hatred for a lot of the EU, because it contradicts so much movie material. The books stray so much from George Lucas's original intent. If you just watch the movies, you would have the idea that the clones are completely loyal. And yet money-hungry EU authors just HAVE to make these stupid side-stories about how oh, this clone goes AWOL and gets it on with Jango's ex! And yet people consider it canon. Sigh. It sounds more like celebrity tabloid material.
the thing is, Delta Squad is EU themselves, so i guess its a little bit more open for people to expand (with limits to actual connections to events), rather than to try to fit into the story. IN ALL HONESTY, i do not like Lucas, or just Star Wars itself, BUT I LOVE the whole idea of Star Wars, thats why i would rather side with the EU aspect instead of the material already written.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TK-8252
You're forgetting that droids only are rebellious when they change owners, and don't have their memories wiped. The reason why R2 ran off from Luke was because he had a mission from his former owner, who he still thought WAS his owner. Because his memory wasn't wiped.

Clones do not rebel against their training. If they did, they would have ignored the advisor's order to leave Sev behind.
Nah, droids dont neccessarily have to have different ownerships. Logically, AI would start off as an obedient child, feeling experiences, and finally maturing into adulthood. Those experiences factor into what they will become and thats why they are formatted, to prevent their individuality. I know this will be a horrible example and in KOTOR2 in Telos while trying to infiltrate the Czerka Office to steal data, you take control over a bot (forgot the name). This bot is confronted by an R2 unit, and it had ownership BUT after a few rounds of dialogue, it goes and kills the guards outside. After that they become static NPCs and the little thing gets offended by calling him small and stuff.

Some do(did? will?), BUT only because their genetics werent one hundred percent to kimoanian specs. The thing is, they are still driven but outside influences, Darman got laid, that wasnt supposed to happen. Its all really what experiences they have recieved. Losing a lot will do that to them. And at the end they clearly wanted to stay, and were really fighting the urge to go back and get him. The seed has been sown, and it will grow

Quote:
Originally Posted by TK-8252
But that's the thing, you can't think like them. They don't think like you would. They think duty first, brotherhood second.
but they do, they love, they feel emotions of guilt, pain, sadness, trust. Emotions will always rule over duty. Brotherhood is emotions manifested, its really what keeps them obedient. It MIGHT take a bit to get to that point since it is programmed but there is a chance of it happening. If they cut out individuality they would have cut out rebellious urges, but they didnt. That would defeat its own purpose though.



Right, just like how all the clones turned against the Jedi. But they ALWAYS stay loyal to the Commander-in-Chief.



Quote:
Originally Posted by TK-8252
They're not Mandalorians. They're Republic commandos.
They are, the only human interaction that theyve had was the training from Walon Vau, who was a mandalorian, who had great pride in his heritage and shared it with his troops. Besides, what better template for clones than those from an already militaristic culture? Cussing in Mando'a and then dancing Dha Werda

Quote:
Originally Posted by TK-8252
Instinct is something that all life has. Instincts are not learned; they are built in. What instincts the Kaminoians wanted to give them are the instincts they had.
BASIC instincts are, but those are emotions, mainly fear. Those things werent built in, there is no genetic code to obey. Its only because they have no outside interaction whatsoever outside of a militaristic one. They arent going to disobey because everyone around them are obeying the same orders BUT outside influence, like lets say Darman's love interest, Atin's desire to kill his commanding officer, shows that they are able to do those things with the right exposure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TK-8252
Genetically, they are identical.
No, at the beginning of the game ko sai tells them that they are better. I guess the whole premise of it is the less mechanical/droidy or the closer they are to being Janga, the better. Commandos are just a step closer to being arcs, commanders are just regular troopers who have excelled more than others.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TK-8252
Sev dying at the hands of the enemy would not be stupid. It is part of war. And it would send a message: live by the sword, die by the sword. But hey, he doesn't have to die, he could just be imprisoned. Delta could come across him later in the game, but their objective in the first few missions would NOT be to rescue Sev. Yoda already poo-pooed that.
Yeah it would be, look at how he died, the fiercest of the group dying just because he was alone? Thats lame, he was alone infiltrating the CIS base, and theres were SBDs AND Elite geonosians. If he were to die, it would be because of something greater in scale rather than trying to rendezvous. and thats why i said, they need to finish up what they need to do first. I didnt say they are going to jump off that gunship to rescure their vod. More like realizing that a part of them are missing and they go awol to look for it again

Quote:
Originally Posted by TK-8252
You mean too many people have died?? In Republic Commando, no one in your squad died!
No i just mean, its cliched in the star wars universe. but again, star wars intself is a drab unemotional thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TK-8252
Yes, that's what the very small number of ARC's did who went AWOL. ARC's didn't have their genetics messed with. But the rest of the clones did, making them essentially mental slaves.
ARCs did, but they still did. Theyre genetics are more like leashes rather than complete diminishing. Like ive said before the basis of rebellious feelings is from EMOTIONS which they clearly have. It will be dependant on their experiences

Quote:
Originally Posted by Niner_777
Yeah. I think that it would be possible, but quite unlikely. I do believe that if a clone, commando or up most likely, felt love for a jedi that was in his scope during Order 66, he may not fire. He may try to protect that jedi even, but once the others realized this, I think that the other clones might kill this clone. (Probably not his own squad mates though) Its confusing me trying to type it, lol.
Thats why its about the squads shown compassion and treated as humans by their sargeants (mainly Delta and Omega squad) and not about the other clones. One little event such as a team going rogue and doing their own stuff isnt going to change a lot in the main story of star wars. As long as they dont do anything extreme as chancellor assassination attempts i dont see why it wouldnt be possible.
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