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Old 08-31-2006, 02:24 PM   #15
Wudan
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Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Salt Lake, UT
Posts: 1,442
Quote:
Originally Posted by ensiform
That is not the point, you have'nt been around the community long enough. Mr. Lucas is afraid people will steal his precious Star Wars content. Whether or not ID releases Q3 source has nothing to do with JKA. There is a big difference. JKA has many places they have to get permission to say they can release. One, LucasArts, Activision, Raven Software, and ID Software. Also, most of us fear they do not want to give out code for the ghoul2 and ik systems as well as icarus and many of the other closed stuff in the engine. You cant make a game off of a GPL'ed source and make people pay for it, it is against the license.
Ghoul2 is deliberately obscure in the JKA source, and the filetypes are not released with the JKA SDK. This is a pretty clear indication that Raven thinks Ghoul2 is something special, and something worth keeping to themselves. Lucas, from what I understand, sees free games and fan created content as a tribute to his great creation. However, when it's created by his employees, or under his direction, I think you can see where he doesn't want to give it away for free.

I don't think JKA's ghoul2 system is anything to get huffy over, the IK, collision detection, and 'bolt-on' system are all inconsequential, and can be done using different methods, without shedding a tear over the fact that you don't have the JKA engine source code.

I'm not sure why people would want Icarus, either, since, as I understand it, it is a proprietary scripting language that has caused way more headaches than it should have.

People have asked me numerous times if a Quake3 engine project is going to (basically) emulate JKA, and frankly I don't see why anyone would want to. JKA's source is just filthy, and the gameplay was never quite up to spec. I've always had more fun seeing what different things I could do with the engine or the formats, which has been a pretty rewarding process.

@ ensiform, the GPL doens't prohibit you from making money off of GPL software. It just means you must provide the source code upon request (and include a guide to requesting the source), or include it in your binary distribution. Carmack himself said in his QuakeCon keynote that he was disappointed there had not yet been a Quake3 GPL commercial game, which, when you think about it, is possible (and sanctioned by id.) Carmack even says its ridiculous how some development houses have paid the license fee just to keep the source for a few miniscule features to themselves. Here's a link with the top 10 misconceptions about the GPL:

http://www.itmanagersjournal.com/art.../08/21/1659203

It's a good read.

Anyway, last word on the "raven won't release the source" topic. I think they don't have any reason to, and since this is a licensed title, the legal hoops to jump through are not worth the reward ... which is absolutely nothing.


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I made a silly little program called Dragon, which is an animation tool for the GLA format, used in Jedi Outcast, Jedi Academy and Krakatoa.
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