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Old 10-22-2006, 06:36 PM   #195
Spider AL
A well-spoken villain...
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Help, help, I'm stapled to my workstation.
Posts: 2,162
If you're so tired of being homosexual, why not just choose to be straight? They've got nothing to lose, sans perhaps a boyfriend. Unlike quitting prostitution, which leads to monetary loss, or rebelling against oppressors, which might lead to reprecussions from the oppressing party, "switching sides" to heterosexuality would be completely harmless.

My point stands.
Your point only stands if you completely ignore most of the reasoning in my previous response. Let me re-iterate:

Just because a choice isn't conscious, just because a choice isn't instantaneous, doesn't mean it's any less of a choice.

Let me give you an example. If you make a choice to say... get a certain job, it doesn't happen all at once. You decide over a long period of time that you want the job, for many many reasons, some you're consciously aware of, some you're not consciously aware of. Then you have to train for the job, then you have to apply for it, then you have to stomach all the unsuccessful job interviews, then you have to land the job, then, and only then, can you do the job.

Now that's a relatively minor life-choice. And it's not a one-moment choice, it takes lots of factors to come into being.

So your reasoning that "oh, homosexuality can't be a choice, because suicidal gays don't immediately choose to be straight out of self-preservation" is deeply, deeply flawed. Devoid of logic.

First, the choice to engage in a "straight" lifestyle is so much more complex than other choices, the suicidal person simply won't have time to make the necessary decisions before lassitude claims them and they jump off the roof.

Second, you presume that all the factors involved in a "choice" are conscious, i.e: consciously decided, when it's clear that they are not.

Third, homosexual people (and furries, and seemingly all others with "alternative" i.e: perverted sexualities) often define themselves by their sexual identity. Some could theoretically stop doing the things that they do that make them socially outcast, but like religious people, to deny this part of themselves is too high a price to pay.

Fourth, you, like many others, seem to be saying that there is NO factor of choice in what sexual activities you engage in. i.e: It is either 100% choice, or ZERO per-cent choice. This would seem to me to be just as fanatical a point of view as that held by the hyper-religious set. It is perfectly plausible that there is a percentage of choice involved. Just as there is an element of choice in everything we end up doing. You seem very anxious to imply that people have NO responsibility for their actions and attitudes, and I would find that quite patronising, if I happened to be of a homosexual persuasion.

The situation is just not as cut and dried as everyone likes to think it is.

I was referring to the reason they were depressed.
There is rarely any "reason" to be depressed, and certainly very few reasons to kill yourself. There are few problems that cannot be solved. Reason and logic have little to do with clinical depression, however.

My point was that "reasons" are usually tertiary. One is either prone to black moods or not, and there are many mentally healthy homosexuals around, so the one does not necessarily follow from the other.

[FW] Spider AL
Hewwo, meesa Jar-Jar Binks. Yeah. Excusing me, but me needs to go bust meesa head in with dissa claw-hammer, because yousa have stripped away meesa will to living.
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