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Old 11-27-2006, 01:17 PM   #169
Jae Onasi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spider AL
Your knowledge on the topic appears incomplete.
My knowledge on many things is going to be incomplete--there's no way to know everything. I research the things I choose to learn more about, and frankly, the issue of displaying coffins is not on my top ten list.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spider AL
The US government has blocked the release of all such images since 1991.
That's fine, but what I saw may have been released by the gov't itself. It's been too long for me to remember where and when I saw the clip/documentary/whatever it was.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spider AL
How DARE you.
I find the use of images of what would be my husband's remains for political gain, pro OR con the war, to be just as immoral.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spider AL
Total double standard, railing against imaginary violence on the idiot-box while not railing against the invasion of Iraq.
The thread's about the FCC and content on TV, not the Iraqi War or my stance on it, so I wrote my comments accordingly. Talking about the Iraqi war is actually off-topic for this thread--my views on anti-war protest has nothing to do with the FCC and censorship.
However, since you obliquely ask...we obviously should not have gone into Iraq, but now that we've done this, we need to fix it and get out.
There are multiple factors contributing to violence in society, and I think extreme violence on TV and in movies is one of the contributing factors. Since the content of TV directly affects my children far more than protesting the Iraqi war, I adjust my actions accordingly. You choose the Iraqi war as your windmill at which to tilt, violence on TV and against children and women is mine.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spider AL
You don't need a chip, you need a cupboard that locks. If you're not around to supervise the child's use of the TV... he/she doesn't get to use the TV.
You don't have kids, do you? Yeah, you do need a chip. If I have a babysitter over and they decide to watch TV for instance, at least I know the inappropriate content theoretically will be blocked.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spider AL
It's very similar to IT this respect. I'm sick and tired of "concerned parents" campaigning for censorship in video games, greater leglislation for control of internet content... all because they're not "concerned" enough to bother supervising their kid.
Video games--simple solution like what they did in Neverwinter Nights--have an adjustable violence setting.
Parents cannot keep up with all the things out on the internet--actually, no one can. My kids only use the internet while they're in the same room with me or hubby. That doesn't mean that they couldn't accidentally type something and end up at a porn site--something as similar as a single letter typo in amazon dot com or using dot com instead of dot gov when trying to access some government information sends someone to porn sites. I can black- and white-list sites, but many parents don't know how to do that kind of thing and don't know about programs like NetNanny.
One solution to that might be to put a 'rating warning page' on the home page of any adult content sites so that if someone accidentally ends up on an adult site, they aren't exposed to the adult content right off the bat. It's not going to stop someone from entering the site but it does give parents a warning ahead of time about content.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spider AL
Here you show a lack of taste and a lack of understanding with regards to cinema and the history of cinema. Some of the greatest, most influential, most critically acclaimed movies of all time have also been the most violent.
I very specifically said *most*, not all. Please don't impugn my taste/understanding of cinema/history of cinema when you have no information on that--I wouldn't be surprised if I've seen and appreciated great (and sometimes violent) movies longer than you've been on this planet.
There are numerically a lot more crappy slasher and violent B-movies out there than there are critically acclaimed works like Schindler's List, Platoon, and Apocalypse Now. Viewing those is also a choice--I saw probably a dozen of the best 'Nam movies during my History of Vietnam course in college--and appreciated nearly all of them--but I was an adult choosing to take that course. The movies also have ratings, and theaters (theoretically) don't allow kids into R-rated movies without a parent.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spider AL
Hell, what would Shakespeare be without the violence? 'Titus Andronicus'... 'Macbeth'... You wouldn't have much text left if you excised the violence from them.
If you're talking cable/movies, leave it be. Some things just should not be seen by children, however, and parents either need a warning ahead of time or the inappropriate material needs to be cut. It's impossible to expect parents to be familiar with new programming unless they have some kind of advisory information.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spider AL
Yes Jae, in a society with free speech you have the right to campaign for anything, even campaign for the limiting of the free speech that allows you to campaign. Of course, I have the right to respond and to show exactly how immoral your stance is.
There is nothing immoral about wanting privacy to grieve and having control over what happens with a loved one's remains.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spider AL
The idea that "Once a soldier's dead he's no longer a public servant!" doesn't fly. He died for an illegal war that the public is paying for. Once again, the public's right to see ALL the consequences of wars fought in their name is inviolable.
My individual rights are also inviolable. He died serving his country, regardless of whether someone feels it's illegal or not to do so.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spider AL
Once again, you are asserting that your right to withhold images of the coffin outweighs the entire US public's right to see it as it is a result of a war started in their name. Which is frankly ludicrous.
Some individual rights do outweigh the public's 'right' to see or do something.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spider AL
Jae's right to hide the truth vs. the entire US public's right to see the truth... Hmmm. Moral quandary.
Jae's right to privacy during a very difficult time in life vs. those who'd like to use those images for some political agenda, because that's the sole purpose I can see for the display of those images when the gov't already releases the numbers of dead/wounded. No moral quandary for me. If someone else wants to give permission for their soldier's or sailor's coffin to be displayed, that's their choice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spider AL
Oh do be serious. I called your statement amounting to "If we show pictures of the soldiers coffins, their family home could well be broken into and the family victimised!" ludicrous, bordering on paranoia. Which it clearly is. As for "implying that you're paranoid", that's your inference, not my implication.
So just what exactly was your implication with that particular comment?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spider AL
It's typical for pro-war people to call anti-war people condescending. I think it has something to do with the shock of having their dearly-held pro-war delusions challenged.
I don't recall ever saying I was pro-war. We shouldn't have gone in, we need to take responsibility to fix our mistakes and get out. Just because I don't make anti-war protests doesn't mean I'm pro-war.
Chomsky--is a linguist, about as left-wing as Limbaugh is right-wing (and I give about equal weight to both their levels of bias accordingly). He is not a Middle Eastern political science expert. He may self-educate on war and Middle Eastern affairs to be sure, but it's not nearly the same as someone who has spent a lifetime studying the politics of that region. I give about as much credence to his views as I do Bush's comments that all is going well in Iraq.


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Last edited by Jae Onasi; 11-27-2006 at 01:32 PM.
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