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Old 11-05-2007, 09:30 PM   #182
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Originally Posted by Jediphile
I remember this argument. It's exactly the same argument that the powers that be at Paramount made when they declared it "necessary" to "reinvigorate" the Star Trek franchise by going back in time and doing the Enterprise show, even if it alienated the fanbase, because they needed attract a new audience. Result? The show was cancelled and thefranchise crashed and burned...

Sloppy comparison. Even had too much Star Trek and it was a time when they couldn't take it anymore. Then the show kinda sucked, which doesn't help. They're going back in time with the new Trek movie, who knows what's that going to do? KotOR doesn't need a change and still is strong, so going into a different direction won't seem like a very desperate measure.

Originally Posted by Jediphile
Actually, I'm far more likely to throw a fit over people on the internet who make what I consider arrogant presumptions about what I do or do not think...

Except that, you do sound that way and I say this in the most polite manner. When you post about your opinion, people are going to assume certain things from what you wrote. That's natural and something we all have to deal with.

Originally Posted by Jediphile
Me? Absolutely not. But..

1. I'm not the only one voicing this position.

2. Do you honestly - honestly - think that you liking the idea of the MMORPG will make LA do it, even if lots of fans say they hate the idea?

No, I'm not that important, but then neither are you.

1. There's about 1000 members of the KKK in the world (I think). Does it mean that every white guy in the world hates n*****?

2. Actually, a recent poll on showed that there was good interest in a KotOR MMORPG. Hardly a survey of the gaming population, but it means that the base is there. Even Penny-Arcade made a comic and blogpost about how exciting it could be.

Originally Posted by Jediphile
That's just what Paramount argued for the Enterprise tv-show... Alienating the hardcore fanbase is usually a recipe for disaster, because they are the meat and potatoes of your industry that keeps you alive. Dreaming about tapping into the cashcow market of WoW or its ilk is no doubt tempting to LA, I understand that, but if they step all over their own fanbase in their lust to cash in on that market, then they could easily be putting a noose around their own necks...
Except that dumbly following the fanbase can also be counter-productive. The Warcraft universe easily got through because World of Warcraft was a very good game. The example of Star Trek is very sloppy again. Enterprise can hardly be considered a good show, while the result of the change in the Warcraft franchise was very good. How is that not possible with KotOR?

Originally Posted by Jediphile
No, it's not. Because K3 is a pure excuse to print money - lots and lots of us will buy it. We will be very skeptical about the MMORPG that has the gall to replace it, however, and so the game has to struggle to create its own entirely new fanbase.

As you say, it's a different game. Why then won't you acknowledge that this also says something about the fanbase? The people who like the KotOR games are SPRPG-players. If they were not, they would not have played the games. You're not going to get the fans of EVE Online or WoW to suddenly jump ship simply because you release a MMORPG that says both "Star Wars" and KotOR on it, because it's going to be a non-factor to them. If it's good, then the MMORPG-crowd will play it, but they'll do so whether it says KotOR on the box or not. The reverse is not the case, however - the fanbase of the KotOR games is not going to play it automatically just because it says KotOR on the box, because - as you say - it's a different game, and we'll all know that.

Unlikely, because the fanbase will then be so alienated and disappointed that KotOR is, essentially, dead. After all, LA refused to reward us for our loyalty to the SPRPGs, so why should we buy any of their products? Loyalty goes both ways. It's a pact. If LA won't honor it, then why should I or anyone else?

Seriously, stop acting as if you were the representative of the entire KotOR fanbase. Your personal opinion, is exactly that your personal opinion. I consider myself a KotOR fan and in no way do I have the same take on this as you. The only reason Moeller told you to stop focusing on "alienation" is exactly that. You have no proof of it and don't speak for every single one of us.

Now, some of the points you keep bringing makes it seem like you never read the thread and post in the dark. Many people here, including myself, think that any KotOR MMO should steer clear of K3, for various reasons. In other words, we keep the hope that a K3 SPRPG will be made. Others, have a more economic take on this: why have two games when it will up production cost and not necessarily bring in more money? Which is why they believe only one game will come out. So people arguing somewhat in favor of a KotOR MMORPG do not have the exact same opinion on how it should be done.

My personal take on it is that both can be done without too much problem or increased production costs. Remember that the KotOR universe is relatively vast and plenty of areas can be covered in an MMORPG without touching K3.

Originally Posted by Char Ell
What have you read that makes you think BioWare's MMORPG is their own IP? That flies in the face of the BioWare and Pandemic Studios profile that EA published on their investor website right about the time they made the announcement of the BioWare/Pandemic acquisition. The row for the BioWare MMORPG doesn't have a check mark in the owned IP column, like Mass Effect and Dragon Age do, thus leading one to conclude the BioWare MMORPG is using a licensed IP for their MMOG.
Still, I'm sure you agree, it is weird for EA to be excited about that. It does cast some reasonable doubt. -A friend of mine and an aspiring filmmaker.
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