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Old 04-20-2003, 01:27 PM   #121
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Old 04-20-2003, 05:23 PM   #122
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Post Admin Mods.

(Disclaimer) Just some dork moaning about admin mod) (If you don't care or dont want to waste your time click back. (If your bored or you are actually interested in this, READ ON.



Hi, I haven't posted in a while. I posted a while back on some things but whatever. In gaming on jedi knight 2 these days I have seen things become increasingly more difficult to deal with in terms of how servers are run. In patch 1.03 you joined a server and you were immediatly on your guard because you could be killed at any time reguardless of your saber down or not. (I usually follow this but not of late). It was survival of the fittest. If you could not defend yourself you learned to adapt or you left the server, Righto!

Now having said that, I bring the topic to today's gameplay. Patch 1.04 MODS everywhere, Academy, Omni, Vulcanus, Ect. Joining a server involves downloading a mod first. Ok simple enough. Upon joining the server you get a list of rules. NO SWEARING! NO ATTACKING PEOPLE WITH SABER DOWNED! (LAMING). IF YOU SEE A LAMER REPORT IT TO AN ADMIN! DONT COMPLAIN! Ok? Saber up Lets go!

My first encounter on the server is in bespin on a random rooftop where two (Clannies) are having some secret conversation, alright cool lets get a fight going (Saber up) I slowly approach my pray and SLAP! Oh wait what just happened? Im flying through the air dazed on my way to my death as i fall off the side of a building. What just happened? I look at the upper left corner of my screen and see words of LAMER! DONT ATTACK SABER DOWNED PEOPLE. Ok thats fine i guess. I walk around with my saber down for a few minutes all other people's sabers are down and they are chatting. Now i come to realize.. This is really boring. "What is the point of this server? A chatRoom" What are you guys doing? Slap! No complaining! Riiight. So i stand among the crowd of players looking for some one who may want to fight. I challenge a few people and i get a reply with a head shake or just being ignored. Whelp this is fun.

Somone by the name of PADAWAN joins the server i hope he doesnt complain. I watch him run to the crowd and swing his saber at random targets POW up in the air he goes and disconnects before hitting the ground. Well darn, i guess he couldnt adapt, i am having a hard time at it to. what is the point!

During my confusion somone runs by me and wacks me with his saber before running on, AH FINALLY SOME ACTION I give chase and grip him from behind his saber automatically goes off and a chatbox appears over his head. Hmm what should i do here? I see the word lamer appear again in the upper left and then the screen freezes and i get a popup of SERVER DISCONNECTED.

Well i guess that guy adapted pretty well eh? All he has to do is say LAMER and a random person gets kicked from the server. Today's jedi are weak little ..... well trying to swear here. They hide behind admin commands and random rules that they make up on the spot. I am now banned from over 15 servers for extremely stupid reasons ( Draining is considered laming to some people) and i would like to know what the hell happened to the old jedi knight i used to know and actually enjoy playing!!!


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Old 04-21-2003, 10:32 PM   #123
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I hope you don't act like that when you try and talk to him Marker. Geez. He asked for constructive criticism on April 18. And you're calling him a prick after not posting on the 20th? The guy doesn't have a lot of free time to check forums hourly. He's usually only active on the Academy channel for 20 minutes at a time, if that much. Don't go insulting the guy just because he hasn't had the chance to get back yet. The Forums were down for many of us yesterday as well. Maybe he wanted to post and wasn't able to. After what you said I wouldn't blame him if he doesn't.
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Old 04-22-2003, 02:25 AM   #124
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marker grow up. you're pissed? fine. we don't want to hear about it.

you should really grow up marker.

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Old 04-22-2003, 04:55 AM   #125
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in guns servers, truely i only get kicked for what i say. But still, the admins are my friends. so most ctf servers that i goto are mostly fine. Because most of them have passwords anyway like the alt server, MoD, jk2 ctf.

However, the sabers servers, ya I get kicked alot. But now, I don't play on pubs ffa, cuz its all junk. Servers I play on, including, shockwave, SD, infinite fragging for sabers ff, are all places where you don't meet up with bad admins too often. Especially since im one of the admins and so is UJ. However, u can meet up with sub par players alot and most of the time they leave. Thereefore, these servers are thought of to have a bad name because of so called lamers. What people do not understand is that the drain war is part of the game. Lightning has a reason to be used, and true the EURO community in general does make lv2 lightning and drain very annoying. But most of the tiem lightning in 1v1 is used as a distraction rather than damage. So therefore, in conclusion, usually because of the attitude of the majority of jk2 players, the better player is more likely to be hated and kicked from the server. USually when im in a server, within 10 minutes everyone leaves unless some other elite is in the room.


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Old 04-22-2003, 08:37 AM   #126
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Buzz Vader:
Do you even read the posts? If you had you would have noticed it was the 17th & you would have also noticed I had said I had emailed him & PM'ed him a variety of times. We talk on the forums & on IRC channels to get some feedback publically, but I'm not some user who wants to know how to change his name, I'm another modder & I stopped what I was doing to help him out. Him & I IM each other quite a bit, so when I don't get PM'ed back, nor emailed back on a variety of times it isn't cool. I work with DAMN NEAR EVERY CODER in the community, I drop quite a bit of my work time to get all the coders in the community working with one another to improve all mods for the community. I was pissed because I not only dropped what I was doing with my mod to help the guy out, I also got him in contact with our coder so he could improve his mod, again, for the community.
So let's see here, I'm being ignored by someone when I am backed up in my own work, then drop my work so I can help him out, then he blows me off - nah, that shouldn't piss me off. :-/

Rumor:
Come & talk to me about growing up when you've been through half the crap any one of these modders have been through & are going through. I apologize if you caught me on one of my off days, but I put blood sweat & tears into my work for the community (& so do some others whom might not even make it, which leads to even more stress), so just ignore me (or any other real modder for that matter) if I am cryin.
For the service we provide I think we're entitled to a little slack. FYI, I'm not too worried about not making it. I do have a gameplan, but it will take at least a month or 2 for it to really kick in.

Everyone:
I do want to apologize to everyone. Looking at the posts I made it's scary because it's like I'm turning into that 1 modder (if you are really in this community, you know exactly who I am talking about, no names need to be mentioned) & that is really scary to me, so again folks, I really apologize. I should have been more professional about everything but I've been stressed out ALOT lately & I don't mind helping out, but it was just bad timing & being ignored was something that just made me flip my wig. I know that's no excuse & anyone who knows me knows I am not normally like that, just under a bit of pressure in my work life as well as personal. Again, apologies to everyone, especially CO.

I talked with CO, he says he never intended to ignore me, so we will call it miscommunication on my part & leave it at that; Ignored or not I should have been more professional about the whole thing, my apologies 1 last time.

We discussed some things about the new version of JA, did/doing what I could/can to help out. Here's some of them so everyone knows a bit about whats going on & perhaps we can get some more feedback.

The whole new gametype thing is out as that is client side, but it's rather irrelevant as the only real useful purpose the gametype would provide is JA users can tell right from their game browsers (GameSpy Arcade, ASE, I use GameSpy 3D) whether or not the admin allows the terminator & empower commands & if they do you can filter those servers out via your game browser, but that can all be done in a CVar which I think he has done or is doing. The only real differance is the map doesn't need to be restarted where with the new gametype it would be.
He's also adding a vote command to disable those commands from being used, which works great with users, but not admins, so he wants to have it kick the admin if he gets abusive with the commands, but I do not think that is the best comand to add for a couple of reasons...
#1) It'll end up being a tug of war. The admin on 1 end & all the users on the other. The admin has the advantage because he is the only one that has to keep persisting on his end, where on the other, everyone else in the room has to keep persisting. Not to mention to the fact that the admin will probably have all that binded, so it's rather redundant. It's not really stopping anything, just slowing it down.

#2) You shouldn't kick an admin from his/her own server, it's their server.

I think it should be set up so that when it comes to commands like that everyone should have to vote & the admin is treated as any other user. The admin shouldn't be able to enable/disable that CVar in a running server, it should be voted on. Again, this is for the terminator & empower commands only.

The only other problem with this is it is something that needs to be covered in the docs & NO ONE RTFM. I am doing an installer for Duelers Full & I am encouraging him to do an installer for the next JA with something that says "Tired of being lamed by admins with empower & terminator commands? Now you can vote out those commands! RTFM to find out how" type thing; For linux/Unix it would be a zip file with a comment. Obviously you wouldn't say RTFM, but FFS people, the readme &/or manual is there for a reason. If you really appreciate the work the modders in the community do, take 10 minutes out of your busy schedule & go over the readme &/or manual so we don't have to answer n00b questions.

Other Features That I Think Should Be Added
* NO DAMAGE to users who are slept by admins. I know I already said this but I am saying it again in case it was missed or forgot.

* Temp Ban CVar:
I'm trying to pursued Lee into this one for Duelers. Anyways, the problem with voting people out is they just reconnect, so what this CVar does is temp ban people who get kicked. This can be done by map or timelimit, I think a timelimit would be best, like 30 or 60 minutes.

* Max Bots CVar:
This sets the maximum allowed bots in the room.
The problem with using " bots_minplayers "2" " is what if you only want 1 bot in there, but don't want it to leave when someone joins? Setting a new cvar like bots_max "1", then bots_minplayers "2" would do nicely. The only reason why you would set 1 bot in there is because it attracts traffic (yes this actually works).

Asty from ICoP has a rented server & normally they don't allow bots at all (uses up more bandwidth or something), but he talked them into allowing him to have 1 bot, but 2 is out of the question, so this would be a nice CVar for those who rent servers.

* Vote Restrictions CVar:
This restricts clients to only being able to vote on changing maps & kicking players (this is already in Duelers BTW).

* g_timeouttospec fix:
Just found out about this one, the thing doesn't work right. I'm sure we will fix this in Duelers & post the fix in Razoraces thread for everyone else.

* Lagout CVar:
Like the g_inactivity CVar, except it's for 999 ping'ers only. I am trying to pursued Lee into this one.

Alright, that's it for now folks, drop some ideas if you have them, as for me I have spent waaaayyyyy to much time on this post. I'm going to go work on my project now.


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Old 04-22-2003, 12:58 PM   #127
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Marker 007

Do you know how the forum times work? I looked at the date Chosen last posted. For me its the 18th. It was very early in the morning on the 18th. Your post on the 20th was later in the day compared to it. I just have the time on GMT here because I don't check this place all that often and so it doesn't concern me when people last sent a message based off of my time. Think a little before you accuse me of not doing something I suggest thinking just a little bit more. I did read that you E-mailed and PMed him a variety of times as you put it. But over a two and a half day period or whatever you can easily miss someone that is busy with other things. There isn't really a ratio to the number of messages you send over a period of time before you are allowed to get pissed off. At least you apologized for your behavior.
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Old 04-22-2003, 01:11 PM   #128
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Everyone calm down please. I understand that this is a good issue for discussion.......so let's continue to do it in a respectful manner.

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Old 04-22-2003, 02:46 PM   #129
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Geezz guys i go on holiday for 5days and OMG going to have to put time aside tomorra on reading all this.


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Old 04-22-2003, 03:53 PM   #130
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What really hurts me is to see (with my ASE open)

-176 VAM servers
-209 JA servers
-0 Style Over Susbtance servers
-0 MotF Servers
-1 Movie Battles server.
-2 Duelers 1.2 servers.

Its like this community would rather run around slapping people, playing with emotes, and using their hand of god to dish out teachings, rather than play well made mods.

Style Over Substance was awesome. Slow motion dogeing using time scales.

Need anything be said about MotF?

Movie Battles is still in late beta but this mod is Last Man Standing team based.

On the other hand you have VAM and JA mods which do nothing more than use premade broken animations and give admins power. to abuse. The best thing theese two mods have are the multiple duels at one time. And that isn't really a great acheivement.

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Old 04-22-2003, 05:23 PM   #131
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jman3ooo
Its like this community would rather run around slapping people, playing with emotes, and using their hand of god to dish out teachings, rather than play well made mods.
Sadly, this appears to be the case. Mods with potentially good uses and features in a lot of cases just degenerate into foolishness.
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Old 04-22-2003, 05:37 PM   #132
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I would shoot for joy if I saw one duel server running Style over Substance....

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Old 04-22-2003, 11:06 PM   #133
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Buzz:
That's not what I see & it was not a day & a 1/2. In any event, whatever, I don't care. I have too many problems to worry about this.

Quote:
Originally posted by Jman3ooo
What really hurts me is to see (with my ASE open)

-176 VAM servers
-209 JA servers
-0 Style Over Susbtance servers
-0 MotF Servers
-1 Movie Battles server.
-2 Duelers 1.2 servers.
Get GameSpy 3D, there are always at least 5 Duelers servers online. Perhaps some of them only send their heartbeat to the gamespy master, but that is very unlikely.

Everyone:
Well things just got alot more stressful in my personal life. I am out of here within the next 2 to 3 weeks, more than likely permanently, so whatever it is I am going to do with Duelers Full, that's how much time I have to do it.


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Old 04-24-2003, 03:41 AM   #134
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Updates....

I'm still trying to reconstruct the whole empowerment thing, so its going to take some time because I dont want to jeopardize the serverside only feature. Thank all of you for the great ideas I really do appreciate it. razorace had a great idea about the gametype, but I may have to go around that with something else. Like I said, it'll take some time but I'm sure I'll come up with something. See you all soon


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Old 04-24-2003, 01:46 PM   #135
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Re: Updates....

Quote:
Originally posted by zERoCooL2479
I'm still trying to reconstruct the whole empowerment thing, so its going to take some time because I dont want to jeopardize the serverside only feature. Thank all of you for the great ideas I really do appreciate it. razorace had a great idea about the gametype, but I may have to go around that with something else. Like I said, it'll take some time but I'm sure I'll come up with something. See you all soon
Thanks for listening!
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Old 04-24-2003, 04:24 PM   #136
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Re: Updates....

Well, you could probably do it as a gametype inside a gametype like jedi vs merc.


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Old 04-24-2003, 11:41 PM   #137
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Hmmm...I found this in cg_servercmds.c

/*
================
CG_ParseServerinfo

This is called explicitly when the gamestate is first received,
and whenever the server updates any serverinfo flagged cvars
================
*/
void CG_ParseServerinfo( void ) {
const char *info;
char *mapname;

info = CG_ConfigString( CS_SERVERINFO );
cgs.gametype = atoi( Info_ValueForKey( info, "g_gametype" ) );
trap_Cvar_Set("g_gametype", va("%i", cgs.gametype));
cgs.needpass = atoi( Info_ValueForKey( info, "needpass" ) );
cgs.jediVmerc = atoi( Info_ValueForKey( info, "g_jediVmerc" ) );
//******************Cut Source***********************


I dont think I can do the gametype without editing the client :-(


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Old 04-25-2003, 12:45 AM   #138
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Well, in the case of jedivsmerc you need some client code to handle the menu/cvar changes. Just boosting the power level of a player server side doesn't have to worry about that.


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Old 04-25-2003, 04:32 PM   #139
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What would be the point in making it a gametype? The only advantage I see in that is...
#1) Clients can tell that the server allows that kind of thing & can filter them out via their gaming browser (gamespy, ASE, whatever).

#2) It's not on the fly, meaning the server would have to be reset in order for it to take effect.

A CVar that can only be enabled/disabled (on a running server) via voting would be the way to go. Hosts should be treated as just another client for this option. Now the server can shut the server down, change the CVar, then start it back up, but would you stay on a server that keeps rebooting everytime you vote out that option? I know I wouldn't.

All in all, I just don't see the advantage in a gametype, there's nothing wrong with a good ol' fashioned CVar as long as it can be displayed via gaming browsers & the only way the option can be enabled/disabled (again, on a running server only) is via voting. If anything, I think this is a better way of going about adding it, wouldn't you agree?


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Old 07-12-2003, 08:23 AM   #140
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I'm a little late to this discussion, but here's my take on it anyway.

Simple problem. Simple solution.

You don't like the way a particular server is being run?

LEAVE.

Can't find a server that suits your taste in how you'd like to play?

THEN PONY UP THE CA$H AND RENT YOUR OWN SERVER.

That's what I did, and I've never been happier.

We all get frustrated from time to time, granted. But get over griping about having your little joy-ride spoiled while it's on someone else's dime.

Here's the poop... it's MY server. I PAY for it. I put the time and effort into keeping it running (how I like it). You wanna shell out the $$$ a month, you can run your OWN server any darn well way YOU please.

I won't apologize for the way my server is run. Nor do I think anyone else should. Personally, I happen to prefer honest-to-goodness FFA and not RPG. But hey, that's my preference, if you don't like it, tough rocks.
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Old 07-21-2003, 04:23 PM   #141
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WOW

Old thread...


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