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Old 10-17-2004, 04:40 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally posted by Lieutenant_kettch
acquiring that firing solution earlier would allow the TLs to intercept the torp, and the massive u-turn would let many TLs to track and destroy the fighters
Supposition and conjecture. No torpedo in the movies was EVER destroyed by turbolasers, so we can assume that they are just too hard to target



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Old 10-17-2004, 04:43 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally posted by ET Warrior
Supposition and conjecture. No torpedo in the movies was EVER destroyed by turbolasers, so we can assume that they are just too hard to target
no torpedo was ever launched above the surface in the movies,
so by your logic, it's obvious that the death star had a massize weapons jamming system
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Old 10-17-2004, 04:44 PM   #43
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The rebels were still above the surface of the deathstar when they destroyed it...they certainly weren't flying INSIDE of it, just because it had a trench built into doesn't make the trench not the surface of the Deathstar



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Old 10-17-2004, 04:49 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally posted by ET Warrior
The rebels were still above the surface of the deathstar when they destroyed it...they certainly weren't flying INSIDE of it, just because it had a trench built into doesn't make the trench not the surface of the Deathstar
in every reference to the trench in all of star wars, the trench is NEVER above the surface, anything above the trench in considered above the surface.
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Old 10-17-2004, 05:22 PM   #45
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How would turbolasers be able to shoot down torpedoes? The turbolasers only took down one Rebel ship (Porkins), because the turbolasers are not meant for shooting small, fast-moving targets.

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We count thirty Rebel ships Lord Vader, but they're so small they're evading out turbolasers.
If turbolasers could barely destroy X-Wings or Y-Wings, how could they destroy a torpedo?
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Old 10-17-2004, 05:38 PM   #46
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Turbolasers did not take down Porkins. Starfighters can evade, but torpedos just fly in a straight line. That is why they are easier to intercept. Play X-Wing Alliance awhile and you will see what I mean. You can fly circles around capital ships and be fine, but you'll find that a lot of the time, your warheads will get shot down like nothing.
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Old 10-17-2004, 06:16 PM   #47
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Then what shot down Porkins? There were no Imperial fighters out yet.
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Old 10-17-2004, 07:25 PM   #48
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There was a mechanical failure on Porkins' X-Wing, so nothing shot him down.
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Old 10-17-2004, 07:27 PM   #49
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Then why were they showing turbolasers blasting up, Biggs shouting "pull up," and then Porkins' ship blows up just like when a ship is shot down?
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Old 10-17-2004, 07:42 PM   #50
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Porkins says "I have a problem here", then Biggs tells him to eject, but Porkins assumes the problem to be nothing to make the ship not flyable, so he continues to fly, but his ship blows up because of the mechanical failure, none of the turbolasers actually hit him. Either way though, it does not change the rest of the argument.
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Old 10-17-2004, 07:44 PM   #51
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No, Biggs says "pull up," not eject. And they showed the turbolasers firing for a reason. They wouldn't have if it was a mechanical failure.
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Old 10-17-2004, 07:50 PM   #52
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He says pull up, then he says eject. I just watched it. They showed the turbolasers because it is part of the atmosphere, the turbolasers were firing the whole time.
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Old 10-17-2004, 07:57 PM   #53
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Yeah, he does say eject. I thought he was saying Jek, which is Porkins' first name.

Where'd you find out that it's a mechanical failure?
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Old 10-17-2004, 08:41 PM   #54
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I think I have heard it in many places, so I will try to track down a few that I can rememeber.

http://www.starwars.com/databank/cha...ins/index.html
I guess that means it is official.

http://decipher.com/starwars/cardlis...oblemhere.html
The only other source I can find.
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Old 10-17-2004, 08:42 PM   #55
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From the official site:

His fighter was hit by the Imperial weapons emplacement, bursting into fiery fragments, and killing Porkins immediately.

Not shot down by turbolasers eh?
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Old 10-17-2004, 08:44 PM   #56
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Though his X-wing fighter was maneuverable enough to avoid the Death Star's sluggish turbolasers, a mechanical malfunction hampered his ability (stopped reading here) to dodge enemy fire.
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Old 10-17-2004, 08:45 PM   #57
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The mechanical failure disabled his manuverability, which allowed the turbolasers to shoot him down.

I see I have proved my point.
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Old 10-17-2004, 08:48 PM   #58
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I feel it proves my point as well, it is the maneuverability that prevents them from being hit, the torpedos do not maneuver, so they are easier for the lasers to pick off then evading starfighters. Thanks for pressing the issue, I would not have found this compelling evidence!
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Old 10-17-2004, 09:03 PM   #59
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Code:
 ===------(-
 /||
=|||
 |||||||======>       vs.          --
=|||
 \||
 ===------(-

    X-wing                       Torpedo
I wonder which is harder to hit....

*wonders*


edit: btw, if you scroll this page up and down really fast, you can get a seizure from looking at TK's sig

Last edited by coupes.; 10-17-2004 at 09:13 PM.
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Old 10-17-2004, 09:15 PM   #60
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Lets see, something flying in a straight line at a constant speed, vs. something that is dodging, varying speed, completely unpredictable, and focused on not getting hit. Hmmm, I'll have to go with the torp on this one.
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Old 10-17-2004, 09:38 PM   #61
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If you guys are gonna get technical and all why don't you first figure out how the hell an X-Wing could even exist since the way it travels in space is impossible in the first place

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Old 10-17-2004, 10:19 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally posted by Lynk Former
If you guys are gonna get technical and all why don't you first figure out how the hell an X-Wing could even exist since the way it travels in space is impossible in the first place

I'm not so sure its known how an X-Wing travels in space. Please enlighten us.
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Old 10-17-2004, 11:11 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally posted by Shok_Tinoktin
I'm not so sure its known how an X-Wing travels in space. Please enlighten us.
Er'... watch the movies... all Star Wars (And the other popular Sci-Fi shows of the time like Battlestar Galactica, Buck Rodgers, etc.) fighters fly like they are in an atmosphere more than the way a spacecraft would handle.

The best representation, in my humble opinion, of space combat would have to be the series Babylon 5.


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Old 10-17-2004, 11:34 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally posted by RedHawke
Er'... watch the movies... all Star Wars (And the other popular Sci-Fi shows of the time like Battlestar Galactica, Buck Rodgers, etc.) fighters fly like they are in an atmosphere more than the way a spacecraft would handle.
Exactly. There's no point argueing about such things when the whole basis of the arguement features machines that don't exist and that can't exist in their current form.

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Old 10-18-2004, 08:00 AM   #65
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Quote:
Originally posted by RedHawke
Er'... watch the movies... all Star Wars (And the other popular Sci-Fi shows of the time like Battlestar Galactica, Buck Rodgers, etc.) fighters fly like they are in an atmosphere more than the way a spacecraft would handle.

The best representation, in my humble opinion, of space combat would have to be the series Babylon 5.
they seem to maneuver like current aircraft in atmoshpere do because an aircraft maneuvers by redirecting air, which causes drag, and also changes lift, which allows aircraft to maneuver in it's dimensions. However, starfighters cannot maneuver via the redirectiong of air or by lift because they fly in vacuum. Thus, the designers created maneuvering thrusters(which are small thrusters that rotate the starfighters) and placed them on strategic places on the fighter to allow it maneuverability
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Old 10-18-2004, 01:18 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally posted by .:CoupeS:.
edit: btw, if you scroll this page up and down really fast, you can get a seizure from looking at TK's sig
Yeah, and you made the sig!
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Old 10-18-2004, 01:21 PM   #67
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We know that "manuvering" torpedoes exist in Star Wars (see Jango's "missile" that he fires at Obi-Wan's ship in AOTC). Even Luke's torpedoes fired into the exhaust port pull a sharp turn to go into the hole.

If the turbolasers can only hit one ship that's having mechanical difficulties and therefore flying in a straight line for too long, they're going to have a heck of a time hitting a tiny torpedo many times smaller.

The Death Star was built around a "large scale assault" involving capital ships ("they don't consider a small one-man fighter to be a threat, or they'd have better defenses"), it had great difficulty with one-man fighters, that was the whole point of the attack, and why Vader had to launch fighters to deal with them.


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Old 10-18-2004, 01:29 PM   #68
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For that matter, why not just have an armada of Rebel ships firing swarms of dodging missiles from their maximum range, instead of coming within their turbolaser range?
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Old 10-18-2004, 01:49 PM   #69
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Cause the deathstar had BIG GUNS to kill BIG SHIPS
they wouldnt have been able to go into range before they were burned to ashes
and besides, i dont think they had any on Yavin 4


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Old 10-18-2004, 04:00 PM   #70
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warheads have greater range than lasers, so they would not have to come within the range of their guns to fire warheads. also, an armada would not have to consist of capital ships, but could be swarms of starfighters (however, i intended it to mean everything they've got).


Whatever happened to the original topic?...

Well, this is more interesting anyway.
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Old 10-21-2004, 02:52 AM   #71
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There's also the theory that the Death Star had it's own invisible shield (not as powerful as the DeathStar 2's shield of course). Remember the "magnetic field" that the fighters had to slow down to pass through (they then "accelerate to attack speed" once inside)?

That might prevent missiles from being fired from long range to track into the hole. Also, there is mention of heavy jamming (more in the novel/screenplay but there's a few instances of pilots saying they "can't see" things). This jamming might make it difficult for missiles to track (hence why Luke had to fire his torps so close to the exhaust port, rather than a mile away or something).


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Old 10-21-2004, 03:05 AM   #72
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that makes sense, and could explain why they couldn't come in perpendicular. the turning radius may have made it impossible to get close enough to take the shot. after all, Biggs says "at that speed, will we be able to pull out in time?" and that is just the little change in direction to clear the wall. imagine a full u-turn.
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Old 10-21-2004, 03:10 AM   #73
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Quote:
Originally posted by Shok_Tinoktin
that makes sense, and could explain why they couldn't come in perpendicular. the turning radius may have made it impossible to get close enough to take the shot. after all, Biggs says "at that speed, will we be able to pull out in time?" and that is just the little change in direction to clear the wall. imagine a full u-turn.
Because it's a movie.


Yeah yeah, I know that you guys like to discuss this sort of thing but my overwealming commonsense is making me say all of this. It can't be helped.

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Old 10-21-2004, 03:14 AM   #74
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yeah, but my overwhelming nerdiness (if thats a word, and even if its not) makes me ignore it.
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