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Old 02-21-2005, 08:06 AM   #1
VampireNaomi
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Sherlock Holmes

Anyone around here who likes the greatest detective of all time?

I am completely in love with him, as much as one can love a fictional character, that is, and just ordered the complete collection which includes all stories and novels by Conan Doyle. Can't wait to have it delivered.

And if Sherlock is not your cup of tea, how about Hercule Poirot? He's great as well. There is just something about the way Brits write mysteries.


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Old 02-22-2005, 12:47 AM   #2
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I could meet anyone, fiction and non-fiction, I'd like to meet Sherlock Holmes.
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Old 02-22-2005, 05:47 AM   #3
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Sherlock Holmes is one of my favourite detective characters of all time (I'm ashamed to say I even stole a complete short story collection from the school library when I was a kid), but Poirot? seriously?

I find Agatha Christie to be one of the most offensively racist authors I've ever read. Not to mention the fact that the plots are so contrived that there is no possible way to figure out whats going on and the main character *always* knows more than the reader until they reveal it all in the last 5 pages or so of the book.

Just out of interest Naomi, if you had to choose between Brink an Sherlock Holmes - who would it be?


You mean the way the sea stays steady as a rock and the buildings keep washing up and down? Yes I thought that was odd.
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Old 02-22-2005, 07:29 AM   #4
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Wow, I never considered Christie's books to be offensive in any way. I absolutely love it that the reader is not able to guess who the murderer really is. Holmes and Poirot appeal to me in a different way.

When I read Holmes stories I most of the time know exactly who is to blame of the crime, but I am more interested in finding out how, why and when s/he did it.

And Poirot stories are fun because it's interesting to make a guess and try to solve the mystery before Poirot does. But I guess that is only a question of taste.

I also love Inspector Palmu, but I guess no one knows him around here.

Hm... Brink or Holmes... I really don't have an idea. I can't choose!


"Oho, my sainted aunt, have I become a victim of brain fever, the curse of academia...?" -- Jonathan Crane

Sweet As Mango: Nick/Olivia all the way!

Last edited by VampireNaomi; 02-22-2005 at 08:49 AM.
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Old 02-22-2005, 07:55 AM   #5
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Naomi has a thing for intelligent drug abusers I guess.


Guy.
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Old 02-22-2005, 08:48 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by Metallus
Naomi has a thing for intelligent drug abusers I guess.
My, you have revealed my secret. But I think I'd rather see Holmes having some action with Watson, so that would leave Brink for me. Unless someone else wants him and we have to fight.

</rant>

EDIT: neon_git, could you give me some examples of the worst racist parts in Christie's books. I'd like to take an objective look at her writing.


"Oho, my sainted aunt, have I become a victim of brain fever, the curse of academia...?" -- Jonathan Crane

Sweet As Mango: Nick/Olivia all the way!

Last edited by VampireNaomi; 02-22-2005 at 07:41 PM.
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Old 02-23-2005, 05:30 AM   #7
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[I'm quite sure I will get tons of bad responses, but I'll go ahead and say it anyway]
I find Sherlock Holmes to be a bit overrated. I mean don't take it the wrong way, Conan Doyle is a great writer, I must give him credit for that. But it's just too fictional, no man on earth can solve mysteries the way he does, simply because it's impossible.
You know who else is overrated, Jack The Ripper, the guy only killed 7 women, and never got caught. (No need to remind you that this was on a time when Forensic Science had just been applied to police work, so there were actually no ways to find a murderer.) But still, he is seen as the "greatest" of all serial killers, there's something wrong here.
CSI, Law & Order, etc. are overrated as well, but I'm not going to keep babbling about this. Anyway, back to the topic...
However, Agatha Christie was one good writer, I specially liked the fact that there were different characters per book, who solved mysteries (and actually made mistakes such as a normal person). But everyone is allowed to have his own opinions, again, Conan Doyle was a great writer.
But I guess I just got bored of thrillers, in the end they are all the same, and they have exagerated stories. I settled with science fiction (P. K. Dick, is one of my favourite writers) and other sort of novels.
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Old 02-23-2005, 06:24 AM   #8
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In a way Holmes is very overrated, I must agree. Some of the stories are very thin and his character doesn't really develop that much. But I guess that is one of the reasons I like him.

I have never heard of P. K. Dick. What kind of books has s/he written?


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Old 02-23-2005, 11:06 PM   #9
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As for Agatha Christie being racist, I can't really remember any examples off the top of my head. However I can tell you that for the most part, it's words like "chink", "******" and "wog" - that sort of thing.

Now you can argue that they are just words - but it is my opinion that when a word is used as a derogative term (and they are) it ceases to be just a word.

Philip K Dick is my favourite author ever. His most famous work (and probably one of his best too) is Do Androids Dream Of Electric Sheep, which was the basis for my favourite film ever, Blade Runner. He is a science iction writer who generally writes about what it means to be human, what quality's do humans posses that nothing else does.


You mean the way the sea stays steady as a rock and the buildings keep washing up and down? Yes I thought that was odd.
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Old 02-24-2005, 05:19 AM   #10
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Well, I can't really argue about the use of those words, but they are not even nearly enough to make her books look racist in my eyes.

I am now rather interested in Philip K. Dick. I think I shall check if my local library has any of his books.


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Old 02-24-2005, 12:00 PM   #11
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The first book I ever read by Philip K. Dick (Of course, I had seen "Blade Runner" before), was "The Penultimate Truth", I liked it so much, that I bought "Solar Lottery", and lots of others. However I think he only won one price in his life , for his book "The man in the castle" (Which is quite good by the way).

-----

I'm not so sure about A. Christie being racist, but I haven't read that many of her books so...
But anyway, shows like "Southpark", "Seinfeld, "SNL"(Needless to mention that "Southpark" is the most racist program out there, but hell that show is good), etc. are quite racist themselves, but that doesn't make them bad.
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Old 02-25-2005, 01:45 AM   #12
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Well, maybe it was just the particular Agatha Christie story I was reading that was all that bad. It was more about the way the words were used than the words themselves - which is why for me Agatha Christie is racist, but south park not.

Oh - and you'll love P.K.Dick Naomi - he's one of those intelegent drug abuser types.


You mean the way the sea stays steady as a rock and the buildings keep washing up and down? Yes I thought that was odd.
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Old 02-25-2005, 04:58 AM   #13
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Just checked my library's site. They have only two books by P. K. Dick. They are "Galactic Pot-Healer" and "The Collected Stories of P. K. Dick". I shall take a look.


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Old 02-25-2005, 07:59 AM   #14
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I'm not sure I knew the first book, probably because book titles vary in my language.
go to the Barnes & Noble website, you'll probably find most of his books there.

Oh, and Neon, I get your point, I feel the same way about Tom Clacy.
You know my best friend used to read a lot of Conan Doyle & Agatha Cristie's books, I'll ask him about the racism thing.

I haven't read any book by Phillip on a while now, I've been hooked up on a book called "The Mote in God's Eye", by Pournelle & Nevil. It's a great book, but I don't recommend it if you don't like Science Fiction, it's just too long (600 pages & 52 long chapters).
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Old 02-27-2005, 07:29 PM   #15
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No that you've brought up P. K. Dick, I'll join the conversation. And I might perhaps even make relevant statements if I try hard enough.

All I've read is VALIS, and I gotta say, I'm not the biggest PKD fan. It's not the stories themselves, but it's the way they're written. He writes very abstract storylines as if they were police reports. Not only that, but , as much as I find self-indulgence to be okay, self-importance is another thing. VALIS being semi-autobiographical really pulls out the whole "gloy of me" thing.

That being said, Blade Runner (the Director's Cut) was quite cool, and the film I'm most excited for this year is A Scanner Darkly but that's more for Richard Linklater and Bob Sabiston.

As for mysteries, Touching Evil and Twin Peaks are all I need.


There's no earthly way of knowing which direction we are going. There's no knowing where we're rowing or which way the river's flowing. Is it raining? Is it snowing? Is a hurricane a-blowing? Not a speck of light is showing, so the danger must be growing. Are the fires of hell a-glowing? Is the grisly reaper mowing? Yes, the danger must be growing 'cause the rowers keep on rowing, and they're certainly not showing any signs that they are slowing. AAAGGHHH!!!
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Old 02-28-2005, 02:19 AM   #16
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Okay, I'm not so sure if you are saying that you don't like PKD as a writer, whether you do like him, or else.
I will take into account that you don't like him, well there's not much to say here, except that everybody is allowed to have his own opinions, and that's what makes life fun (I know, big and old Cliché, but it's the only thing I can say).
Valis, I never got to read it. The only thing I think about K. Dick is that he over-uses suspensive dots (...), but I got to the conclusion that most sci-fi writers do so.
Now as for Blade Runner, it's great, simply one of my all-time favourites together with 2001.
You know I'm going to get killed by this,
spoiler:
Screw Star Wars, Blade Runner rules!

Anyway, you get my point...
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Old 02-28-2005, 03:38 PM   #17
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That whole thing you said to me was just a preamble to your statement, wasn't it? Well, you may be entitled your own opinion, but THIS is what I think of THAT OPINION:

spoiler:
I 100% agree with you on it. Don't tell anyone.


There's no earthly way of knowing which direction we are going. There's no knowing where we're rowing or which way the river's flowing. Is it raining? Is it snowing? Is a hurricane a-blowing? Not a speck of light is showing, so the danger must be growing. Are the fires of hell a-glowing? Is the grisly reaper mowing? Yes, the danger must be growing 'cause the rowers keep on rowing, and they're certainly not showing any signs that they are slowing. AAAGGHHH!!!
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