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Old 03-11-2006, 03:15 PM   #1
ShadowTemplar
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More Crap from the Culturally Corrupt

Be pissed off. Be very pissed off.

And then consider whether you really want a party that has not kicked out the gutter rat who distributed this to be in control of all four branches of government...

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Old 03-11-2006, 09:19 PM   #2
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I got something slightly similar a while back (over a year ago now), when I was registered as a Republican. I gave it a sarcastic eye-roll, laughed at their pathetic attempt at coercion, and shredded it.

This worries me a bit more, and not just because it's coming from Democrats...any political party keeping a database of information about Americans worries me, no matter the reason it's compiled.


Let every nation know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe, in order to assure the survival and the success of liberty.
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Last edited by rccar328; 03-12-2006 at 12:16 AM.
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Old 03-11-2006, 10:19 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rccar328
This worries me a bit more, and not just because it's coming from Democrats...any political party keeping a database of information about Americans worries me, no matter the reason it's compiled.
Eh?
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Old 03-11-2006, 10:52 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowTemplar
Be pissed off. Be very pissed off.

And then consider whether you really want a party that has not kicked out the gutter rat who distributed this to be in control of all four branches of government...
I agree with you. This should definitely be investigated, simply because it's so misleading; it reminds me of a scam. I did LOL at one thing though:

'You see the liberal Democrats don't agree with President Bush. They still want BIGGER GOVERNMENT and HIGHER TAXES. They want MORE OF YOUR HARD EARNED MONEY to spend on their big government programs."

Somehow I don't think that republicans are doing so much better than the democrats in that department right now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TK-8252
Eh?
x2. What's the connection? I think you accidentally used the wrong link.


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Old 03-11-2006, 11:04 PM   #5
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Rccar, are you suggesting that the Democrats are responsible for promoting magic and witchcraft with their Chronicles of Narnia website? I think I missed something here.


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Old 03-11-2006, 11:17 PM   #6
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I'd send it back without the $11.



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Old 03-11-2006, 11:46 PM   #7
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Why even bother sending it back? They wasted some of your time... why let them waste more in the amount of time it would take you to fold it up, stick it in the envelope, and walk it out to your mailbox.

Shred the thing! That's what we always do... nobody ever contacts us to see why we haven't returned our survey and nobody will. They'll get enough surveys returned (and enough money from donations) without yours, so leave your wasted time at a minimum.

And complaining? Betcha it won't get you anywhere. You'll be sent a nice thank you note for your troubles and nothing will ever really be done about your complaint.


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Old 03-12-2006, 12:15 AM   #8
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Sorry, don't know what happened with that link...needless to say, it wasn't what I intended to put there.

Here's the correct link:
Link

I'm also correcting it in the initial post.


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Old 03-12-2006, 05:51 AM   #9
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If I got that kind of crap, I would send it back. Along with a copy of the lawsuit notice and a bag of gravel (remember that they pay the postage...).

As for the democratic data mining project, well, that's cause for raised eyebrows, but frankly, I can't get riled up over it. After all, the Bush Regime uses government venues to compile the same information... At least the Dems have the common courtesy to ask before they put you in a file. The NSA doesn't even ask a court.

And if you believe that Karl 'Scooter Libby' Rove won't illegally use confidential information about you gathered in the bogus War on Terror, then I have a batch of Enron shares I want to sell.

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Old 03-12-2006, 09:06 AM   #10
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I'm in agreement with rccar. The increased tendency to create databases of information on people (as citizens, voters, concumers, etc.) is worrisome. Rather than make a product or create a position that comes from a quality idea, the manufacturers and politicians seek out their customers and voters and try to create what they think they want. This has some merit (if you're trying to represent a constuency), but in the end, quality probably suffers because they're only concerned with the opinions of those that will vote democratic and the information probably isn't geared to determining opinions of voters so much as it is counting potential votes.

Not to mention the fact that now there's a database with potentially personal information sitting around waiting to be missused. But lets not pretend the Dems invented this practice when it comes to political marketing. I think both the Democrats and the Republicans should get away from "marketing" and worry about truly representing their constituents.


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Old 03-12-2006, 05:13 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowTemplar
As for the democratic data mining project, well, that's cause for raised eyebrows, but frankly, I can't get riled up over it. After all, the Bush Regime uses government venues to compile the same information... At least the Dems have the common courtesy to ask before they put you in a file. The NSA doesn't even ask a court.
Bush isn't the only one...don't forget the FBI files that Hillary took off with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SkinWalker
Not to mention the fact that now there's a database with potentially personal information sitting around waiting to be missused. But lets not pretend the Dems invented this practice when it comes to political marketing. I think both the Democrats and the Republicans should get away from "marketing" and worry about truly representing their constituents.
I think this is worrisome from more than a political standpoint, too - not only can political parties and the government put together these sort of databases, but corporations can, as well, and then sell that information to the highest bidder (like how companies can sell your phone #/address to other companies for marketting purposes). The idea of these kinds of entities collecting personal information (be it a company or a political party) is unsettling, mainly because it's difficult to tell just what kind of data they're collecting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowTemplar
As for the democratic data mining project, well, that's cause for raised eyebrows, but frankly, I can't get riled up over it. After all, the Bush Regime uses government venues to compile the same information... At least the Dems have the common courtesy to ask before they put you in a file. The NSA doesn't even ask a court.
If you're talking about the whole wiretapping 'scandal', that's a whole other issue for a multitude of reasons, but two main ones:

1. The NSA is listening in on calls made to or originating from known terrorists

2. The NSA program is functioning in a national security capacity with Congressional oversight, not as a fundraiser for any political party or administration.


Let every nation know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe, in order to assure the survival and the success of liberty.
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Old 03-12-2006, 07:23 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rccar328
1. The NSA is listening in on calls made to or originating from known terrorists
Again, I dispute this. I don't believe that any government is good enough to be able to know who really are terrorists on such a massive scale. If the government is just so damn good that they can pinpoint exactly who the terrorists are, fine, wiretap them. But I don't believe it. If the government wants to wiretap people, they have to have follow the law.

What credibility does Bush have that he can give us another "trust me" on this, that his big government cronies aren't running wild spying on whoever the hell they want in the name of Homeland Security?
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Old 03-12-2006, 08:17 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rccar328

1. The NSA is listening in on calls made to or originating from known terrorists
Right, but who decides which people are known terrorists? And how do we know which people they wiretap, unless they kept a record or something... but wait, they're refusing to do so... I wonder why?

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Old 03-13-2006, 11:35 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by rccar328
Bush isn't the only one...don't forget the FBI files that Hillary took off with.
You are changing the subject, mister.

It's an issue of scale.

On the one hand, you have the Bush Party, which rutinely sets aside the constitution, rutinely spies upon its own citizens, is perfectly willing to commit treason if it favors its partisan interests, is in almost complete control of the media, grossly mishandles homeland security, grossly mishandles foreign policy, grossly mishandles the economy, and lies every time it opens its mouth.

On the other hand, you have the Democratic Party. Nobody is claiming that they are pure as the driven snow. But it would do your credibility no harm to acknowledge that for every infraction - real or imagined - committed by the Democratic Party, the Bush Party has done something a thousand times worse. A thousand times over.

Now, you may find that to be perfectly acceptable. You may believe that the fact that Bush is furthering the Reconstructionist agenda and pandering to the interests of the corporate oligarchy carrying out GOD'S PLANTM is reason enough to support him.

But your intellectually bankrupt attempts to equivocate stealing an apple, and laundering billions in drug money won't win anyone over who is in possession of a functioning brain.

Quote:
not only can political parties and the government put together these sort of databases, but corporations can, as well, and then sell that information to the highest bidder

[...]

If you're talking about the whole wiretapping 'scandal', that's a whole other issue for a multitude of reasons
Yet another example of how the doublethink autopilot engages immediately whenever you confront a True ConservativeTM with an uncomfortable fact. Thank you for proving to every single lurker here that you, and all those who think like you, are a intellectually bankrupt trolls.

Quote:
1. The NSA is listening in on calls made to or originating from known terrorists
And pigs fly.

Quote:
2. The NSA program is functioning in a national security capacity
Bull****.

Quote:
with Congressional oversight,
Riiiight...

Quote:
not as a fundraiser for any political party or administration.
In which ways are the two mutually exclusive?

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Old 03-13-2006, 11:38 AM   #15
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The initial link is down, but assuming that the following quote comes from it

Quote:
'You see the liberal Democrats don't agree with President Bush. They still want BIGGER GOVERNMENT and HIGHER TAXES. They want MORE OF YOUR HARD EARNED MONEY to spend on their big government programs."
This is the sort of thing that ALWAYS bugs me about the political debate both in the UK and the US. Its always "they want all your money to waste it" vs "they want to cut all the services". Both of which are stupid statements.

If both sides would just accept that there are some things the government needs to do, and some it can do better - and that is what taxes are for. But there are also some things it doesn't need to do.

Then maybe they could stop wating billions by yo-yoing all the services every 4-8 years and implementing/undoing/implementing/undoing things over and over again.

--

The second post just says that the deomcrats are trying to catch up with databases that the republicans already have. And with the patriot act being effectively permanent-ised the government is going to be keeping a much closer eye on everyone from now on.

In the Uk we are probably already on loads of deep datamined databases... from tesco clubcard which has data on almost everyone in the country, to doubleclick, so the soon to be implemented ID card, car tax, tv license, health registration etc... databases that will all be linked up.



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Old 03-13-2006, 11:00 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toms
The initial link is down, but assuming that the following quote comes from it
Yes, it was. I find propaganda from any side irritating, because there's only one thing it can be relied on to do - misrepresent the truth or even just lie outright. Ugh.

Quote:
If both sides would just accept that there are some things the government needs to do, and some it can do better - and that is what taxes are for. But there are also some things it doesn't need to do.

Then maybe they could stop wating billions by yo-yoing all the services every 4-8 years and implementing/undoing/implementing/undoing things over and over again.
I think we have 100% agreement on that one. That very behavior ticks me off to no end.

Quote:
The second post just says that the deomcrats are trying to catch up with databases that the republicans already have. And with the patriot act being effectively permanent-ised the government is going to be keeping a much closer eye on everyone from now on.

In the Uk we are probably already on loads of deep datamined databases... from tesco clubcard which has data on almost everyone in the country, to doubleclick, so the soon to be implemented ID card, car tax, tv license, health registration etc... databases that will all be linked up.
Also the databases which are kept by banks and the like. Just the other day Citibank had a major fiasco with a huge amount of data being lost. I really think that the government should crack down extremely hard on datasharing and collection, because for many people the situation is already out of control.


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Old 03-14-2006, 09:01 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samuel Dravis
I really think that the government should crack down extremely hard on datasharing and collection, because for many people the situation is already out of control.
Aye, there can be no two opinions about that. Unfortunately, with the morally bankrupt regime you people are stuck with, they'll only be cracking down on 'the other guys' data mining...

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