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Old 03-16-2006, 01:53 PM   #41
Darth Macca
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth_Terros
Infact all my facts on Darth Maul have come from TPM the Darth Maul novel shadow hunter the Darth Maul comics and the random stories seen in the tales comics
Fair enough.
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Old 03-16-2006, 02:33 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by Good Sir Knight
He did but do you think Dooku was the only man with pull in the Galaxy? Besides, Dooku doesn't know about the rule of two....
No evidence that he doesn't know it. We never see the Sith discuss the rule of two, only Yoda and Mace Windu discuss it (though I suppose Palpatine was within earshot at the time, heh).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Macca
Don't get me wrong, Dooku is a decent swordsman - but I don't agree that he is a match for Yoda in force power. In Episode II, Yoda calmly stops every obstacle thrown at him by Dooku with great ease. Dooku struggles to keep up with Yoda with the lightsaber so he flees. Yoda makes Dooku look very ordinary. I think Darth Maul (had he gained more power) would have become a great Sith Lord - a possible threat to Palpatine and Yoda. If he was given more time and learned the ways of the force more, he would have dispatched Count Dooku rather easily.
Yoda countered everything he threw at him, but even his counter attack didn't stop Dooku. One could argue perhaps that Yoda could have overpowered Dooku and chose not to, but why? He was serious about stopping Dooku, supposedly, so why hold back? Dooku's threatening the prone bodies of Anakin & Obi-Wan may speak of desperation in the fight, and it's the classic villian "cheater" thing to do, but still. Padme and a squad of clone troops were on the way and Dooku just wanted to escape. The Jedi had appealed to his pride and sucked him into a bunch of saber duels. Perhaps he just realized he's going to eventually get tired and captured? Who knows, but anyway, I still think it's fair to say that Dooku is a match for Yoda, all things considered. What we see in the film supercedes early script treatments that have Yoda beating Dooku and then about to kill him. Saying somebody is a "match for" somebody else is different than saying "they would beat them easily." It means the match could go either way since they are pretty much on the same level.

Dooku is Yoda's old Padawan, so they would know a bit about each other's styles and tricks. Yoda seemed a bit surprised by Dooku's lightning (not as surprised as he was by Palpatine's however), but anyway, see above.

PS: If any DM info comes from Tales check the issue numbers because the first 20 issues are non-canon.


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Old 03-17-2006, 06:16 PM   #43
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I think it's kind of a tough question, beyond who could take whom in a fight. Palpatine could've used Maul & killed him, choosing Dooku as his apprentice, but as a force user & saberist, I think Dooku was superior to Maul. Maul was obviously skilled with his staff, but as was mentioned above, Dooku was trained by Yoda, the best saberist among the Jedi (according to conversations in the movies), and used force powers in his fights. Maul didn't really use force powers in his fights, so I think it's safe to say that Dooku was more powerful in the force.

Given that, Palpatine may have chosen to kill Dooku and keep Maul, knowing that he had less to fear from Maul, given the great Sith tradition of killing the master to userp power.

Either way, Palpatine was grooming Anakin to be his new apprentice, so it's pretty clear that Dooku and Maul would've been taken out to give Darth Vader his place at Sidious' side.


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Old 03-19-2006, 08:08 PM   #44
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I don't believe Maul would have been able to take on Sidious. Maul may have been a great fighter (the actor who played him is obviously the best trained of all the saber duelists in the movies), but Sidious had more power in the Force. I do wish Maul hadn't died at the end of TPM, though, because I thought his character was fascinating. I did not like Dooku that much. He was just kinda boring.


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Old 03-20-2006, 05:57 PM   #45
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Old 03-20-2006, 06:36 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimbo fett 66
I don't believe Maul would have been able to take on Sidious. Maul may have been a great fighter (the actor who played him is obviously the best trained of all the saber duelists in the movies), but Sidious had more power in the Force. I do wish Maul hadn't died at the end of TPM, though, because I thought his character was fascinating. I did not like Dooku that much. He was just kinda boring.
lol...but then again, Palpatine gained more power as the movie and storyline progressed. Ans so could have Maul. But, meh. It didn't.

I do sorta wish Maul didn't die either. He was one of my favourite characters and as most people agree to. But, the storyline did fine without him....I think.


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Old 03-22-2006, 09:17 AM   #47
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If he was alive he would make the story even better. Though he was pretty quiet.

PS: He's the coolest zabrak ive seen.



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Old 04-16-2006, 07:02 AM   #48
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[QUOTE=Kurgan](We need not assume that to live Maul had to kill both Qui Gon AND Obi-Wan, perhaps he was forced to flee or something in our alternative scenario, though his "mission" was undoubtably to kill the Jedi and then the Queen if she failed to sign the treaty which by this time had little chance of happening).[QUOTE=Kurgan]

He would not have run from the Jedi he would have stayed and fought even if he knew he was going to die. He's way too loyal to run (plus he rocks all over the place)
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Old 04-16-2006, 07:22 AM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimbo fett 66
(the actor who played him is obviously the best trained of all the saber duelists in the movies), but Sidious had more power in the Force. I do wish Maul hadn't died at the end of TPM, though, because I thought his character was fascinating. I did not like Dooku that much. He was just kinda boring.
I fully agree with you there man, they are my thoughts exactly
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Old 04-16-2006, 07:26 AM   #50
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Sorry to tripple post but, Darth Maul is by far my fave Star Wars dude
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Old 04-16-2006, 07:19 PM   #51
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... He would have been killed by Count Dooku shortly after episode 1.
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Old 04-17-2006, 12:17 PM   #52
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hmmm well Maul in my opinion wasnt strong in the force he never used it he only used it once to push obi-wan over thats it oh and and like 2 jumps, Palpatine's style is lightning and stabs to the chest his style most likely origionated from the old sith teachings. Anikan is a fallen jedi so never truly learnt the sith technikes and never really fell to the dark side, Exar Kun was powerful and strong but in the end was beaten, Darth Revan was stronger than exarkun(my opinion) but we dont know how revans story played out(YET) But Maul was an assain that's it he wasnt strong in the force all he did was kill
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Old 06-15-2006, 09:31 PM   #53
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What I do beleive is, If Maul hadn't died Anakin wouldnt have been trained, he wouldve been sent back to Tatooeene or adopted on Naboo by Padme or otherwise, Maul wouldve never betrayed Sidious, he was a machine(figurtively). I beleive from there Mace and Yoda wouldve aproached Maul on Naboo and ultimately kill him. Thus if Obi-Wan had been killed no Darth Vader.
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Old 06-17-2006, 04:35 AM   #54
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Well, in one of the Star Wars Tales "Infinites" they have Maul fighting Vader... yes its silly but interesting at the same time.

Personally I think a clever Sith would have multiple Backup Plans. Even if Maul is around the plan would continue and CIS would still take place. Dooku would still be aligned with Palpy. Most likely Maul would have to duel it out with Dooku.

Palpy may also keep both, leaving the Apprentice seat empty deliberately to make the two work in competition.

On the side note... No one says a Sith can't break the rules and take more little Sith Lords... Its not like Plaggie would come back and give Palpy a nice spanking if he did. The "rule of the two" is just a good system to reduce the number of effective backstabbers.

Always, Always remember the sith code.
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Old 06-17-2006, 03:59 PM   #55
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Off topic:You mean this code

There is no fear, there is power.
There is no death, there is immortality.
There is no weakness, there is the Dark Side.
I am the Heart of Darkness.
I know no fear,
But rather I instill it in my enemies.
I am the destroyer of worlds.
I know the power of the Dark Side.
I am the fire of hate.
All the Universe bows before me.
I pledge myself to the Darkness.
For I have found true life,
In the death of the light

Or the one from Kotor or some place else

On topic: If Anakin got trained by the jedis i think Sidious would take him as apprentice, knowing he is the choose one. And i also think that Sidious just should have killed Maul when he no longer was necessary, but when that would happend i have no idea
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Old 06-17-2006, 05:55 PM   #56
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the kotor series version:

Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The Force shall free me.
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Old 06-21-2006, 10:51 AM   #57
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IF Maul had killed Obi wan... Then Luke would never been trained, and the darkness would rule in the galaxy.. ^^ Maybe not. If Obi Wan would been killed by Maul, then Luke would never been born. It's true !


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Old 06-25-2006, 11:47 AM   #58
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So if you think about it the whole, empire is Obi- Wans fault. lol
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Old 06-25-2006, 02:58 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zat
Off topic:You mean this code

There is no fear, there is power.
There is no death, there is immortality.
There is no weakness, there is the Dark Side.
I am the Heart of Darkness.
I know no fear,
But rather I instill it in my enemies.
I am the destroyer of worlds.
I know the power of the Dark Side.
I am the fire of hate.
All the Universe bows before me.
I pledge myself to the Darkness.
For I have found true life,
In the death of the light
Never heard of that one before, you got a source?


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Old 06-25-2006, 06:24 PM   #60
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http://ogrenci.hacettepe.edu.tr/~b0145446/

That should be it. I love that code, like it much better than the KOTOR version.
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Old 06-26-2006, 12:37 PM   #61
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Sounds crap to be honest like really bad goth poetry infact the more i read it the more i think its truly awful.

so is there a canon source for this or is it just some dorks bad attempt at trying to be dark and evil *and kind of missing the point of the sith*



Last edited by Darth_Terros; 06-26-2006 at 12:51 PM.
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Old 06-26-2006, 01:49 PM   #62
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The version I post comes from kotor series, and should one of the authentic ones. Note that it kinda responds to that dusty old Jedi codes, and responded to it.
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Old 06-26-2006, 02:04 PM   #63
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Yeah PoiuyWired version is THE sith code.


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Old 06-26-2006, 06:16 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth_Terros
Sounds crap to be honest like really bad goth poetry infact the more i read it the more i think its truly awful.
*
lol, yeah it seems that way XD
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Old 06-29-2006, 06:29 PM   #65
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Too much stuff to read, so I'll put in my two cents.

Darth Maul was a zabrak freak bred to destroy the Jedi Order by Darth Sidious ( supposedly). His assets to Palpatine were his insanely deadly abilities within the Dark Side.

Darth Tyranus/Count Dooku was a political idealist, whose purpose was to create a false enemy (The CIS) For which Palpatine could create military might, with the true intention of dominating the Republic and convoluting it into an Empire.

So in a way, each of these Sith Lords were important to Palpatine, and in the end, the ultimate Sith Lord is formed: Darth Vader.

Cheers

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Old 07-01-2006, 01:06 PM   #66
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Well, I won't say Vader is an "Ultimate" Sith Lord, for he is perhaps the most "flawed" creation of them all.
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Old 07-01-2006, 02:57 PM   #67
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well to be fare if ur son came to fight you would you completely kill him? The consept and training of vader wherent flawed only the light in him, all he wanted to do is save the ones he loved but this drove him to insanity when he failed twice but he suceeded when he saved luke from palaptine(the lightnin show)
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Old 07-02-2006, 12:15 PM   #68
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Well, if he is Sith enough he would maybe try to just dispose of his enlarged spermling. Obviously the better thing would be ganking up on Palpy somewhat and take the seat for his own.
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Old 07-16-2006, 06:12 AM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurgan
Why do people think Darth Maul is a "better Sith Lord" than Count Dooku? It's not as if Dooku can't fight, he clearly is a masterful swordsman and a match for Yoda in sheer force power. He only loses to Anakin when Anakin starts to use his anger (dark side) to win.
Don't forget that it was never Dooku's intention to kill Anakin, just lure him to the dark side.
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Old 07-16-2006, 04:02 PM   #70
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But it is definitely Dooku's intention NOT to get killed. >.<
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Old 07-17-2006, 05:18 AM   #71
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Perhaps he believed Sidious would take on two appretices.
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Old 07-17-2006, 07:11 AM   #72
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Not sure about that. He's a pretty cluey guy He generally knows what's going on. but then, he did get scissored...




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Old 07-17-2006, 07:50 AM   #73
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Old Palpy would have to rethink his plan I guess.

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Old 07-17-2006, 09:13 AM   #74
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I think if Maul stayed as Sidious's apprentice, Palpatine would still try get Anakin in his good graces and turn him to the dark side, and eventually test Anakin (or make him earn his place as apprentice) by defeating Darth Maul.

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Old 07-17-2006, 05:15 PM   #75
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No Kidding.

Though I think it might be a harder fight. Then again Dooku is already a great saber duelist.
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