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Old 03-06-2008, 04:43 PM   #1
Sun-Shine
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Does college equal success? Can a person make it on their looks alone?

I'm a very attractive individual. Most people tell me that I should be a model or on television. Now that California's State school budget has been cut, I'm not sure if I can get into college. Plus, with the war and high gas prices the future seems so bleek. Do you think it's possible for a person to make it on their looks? I see all of these celebrities getting rich with little to no talent. What do you think?


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Old 03-06-2008, 04:52 PM   #2
Ray Jones
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While an appealing appearance is generally "supportive", no.


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Old 03-06-2008, 04:52 PM   #3
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You've basically answered your own question. All you need to figure out is what kind of compromises you're willing to make that will let you stand out against other people using the same basic strategy.


Now, I want you to remember that no bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor, dumb bastard die for his country.---Patton

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Old 03-06-2008, 05:00 PM   #4
Jae Onasi
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Asking for advice from a bunch of Star Wars geeks like us, especially when we know nothing else about you than this one single post, is worth about as much as the electrons this is written with.

The only thing I will say is beauty fades, but a college degree is forever.


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Old 03-06-2008, 05:05 PM   #5
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Pix?


Oh, and Jae: pictures on the internet are forever too.

I don't know if anyone has made it through on looks alone, but it sounds like a pretty boring proposition to me.


"Words are deeds." - Wittgenstein
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Old 03-06-2008, 05:08 PM   #6
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I think Jae is right about two things. We know nothing about you and what you perceive as success or how long term you expect that kind of success to be. Also, in a youth obsessed culture, your looks will last as long as it takes for the next young hottie to take your place.


Now, I want you to remember that no bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor, dumb bastard die for his country.---Patton

There is no room in this country for hyphenated Americanism.---Teddy Roosevelt

I never forget a face, but in your case I'll make an exception.---Groucho

And if you all get killed, I'll piss on your graves.---Shaman Urdnot

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Old 03-06-2008, 05:09 PM   #7
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But I'm no Star Wars geek, Jae.


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Old 03-06-2008, 05:55 PM   #8
Achilles
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The value of an education (as opposed to going through the motions to get the piece of paper) cannot be overestimated.
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Old 03-06-2008, 06:11 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ray Jones
But I'm no Star Wars geek, Jae.
Yeah, he's just a geek.


Now, I want you to remember that no bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor, dumb bastard die for his country.---Patton

There is no room in this country for hyphenated Americanism.---Teddy Roosevelt

I never forget a face, but in your case I'll make an exception.---Groucho

And if you all get killed, I'll piss on your graves.---Shaman Urdnot

How would you like to own a little bit of my foot in your ass.---Red Foreman
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Old 03-06-2008, 06:13 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samuel Dravis
I don't know if anyone has made it through on looks alone
Right! Even super pr0n stars need to be good at... ah... y'know... their trade.



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Old 03-06-2008, 06:15 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InyriForge
Right! Even super pr0n stars need to be good at... ah... y'know... their trade.

Hmmm...

*wonders which universities offer degree programs in pr0nology*

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Old 03-06-2008, 06:46 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samuel Dravis
Pix?


Oh, and Jae: pictures on the internet are forever too.

I don't know if anyone has made it through on looks alone, but it sounds like a pretty boring proposition to me.
I got everywhere on my looks.


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I am life without limit.”
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Old 03-06-2008, 07:20 PM   #13
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Most wealthy people have inherited their wealth(either through family or connections) and success, have stolen it, and the few people who have worked REAL hard for it, will tell you that you need brains.

I mean, what happens when you turn 30 and your looks fade? You gonna take the roles as the evil witch or "yesterday's" model? I doubt it. You'll get some good time out of your body is you're REALLY lucky, otherwise no.


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Old 03-06-2008, 08:12 PM   #14
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My advice is to go to college. Try to fight you way in at any cost. Since if you don't in 20 years you will be sitting at your house crying because no modeling company will hire you anymore.


"There's gotta be a better way to make a living"
-Kyle Katarn
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Old 03-06-2008, 08:30 PM   #15
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Anything less than sheer perfection in looks and education is no good to a lot of people. Not only do you need qualifications that'll knock your employer's socks off you need the looks to sell a product, they want Padme rather than Mothma, Anakin rather than Sidious.
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Old 03-06-2008, 09:27 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sun-Shine
Do you think it's possible for a person to make it on their looks?
For a time my answer would be yes, but looks fade. I believe someone can get by on personality and brains longer than with looks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sun-Shine
I see all of these celebrities getting rich with little to no talent.
Are you sure, they have no talent or just a talent you do not appreciate? Even models that get by on their looks have some talent that allows the photographer to get the shot they want. Sure, there are some like Paris Hilton, but they were born into a famous family with money.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sun-Shine
Does college equal success?
No, but neither does hard work and dedication, yet all can help you become successful.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sun-Shine
Can a person make it on their looks alone?
I think that would depend on what you mean by “make it.” If you mean get by, then yes, perhaps for a while you can. If you mean becoming proud of who you are, then my answer is no. A college education can not do that either, but it can help how you think about yourself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Web Rider
I mean, what happens when you turn 30 and your looks fade?
Your looks do not magically disappear once you’re over 30. I represent that accusation. Wait, I mean I resent that accusation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jae Onasi
The only thing I will say is beauty fades, but a college degree is forever.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Achilles
The value of an education (as opposed to going through the motions to get the piece of paper) cannot be overestimated.
Don’t know how many times I will get to write this, I could not agree more with both Jae and Achilles on the topic of this thread.

--Jae



Last edited by Jae Onasi; 03-07-2008 at 01:53 AM.
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Old 03-06-2008, 09:51 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by millinniummany3
Anything less than sheer perfection in looks and education is no good to a lot of people. Not only do you need qualifications that'll knock your employer's socks off you need the looks to sell a product, they want Padme rather than Mothma, Anakin rather than Sidious.
That depends on what your doing. If you are running a very successful software business and your face has a large scar down the middle no one is going to care about your looks they are going to care about your software.

If your working at a job that doesn't require your appearance then the employer doesn't even care less what you look like. They just look at your resume and look at your qualifications.


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Old 03-07-2008, 12:39 PM   #18
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I think what Sun_shine is trying to get at is that with the rise in costs, would it just be better to work all your life rather than try for something that is wildely expensive and has been known to have people in debt for years? I believe I stated in another thread that with the changes in the Education budget and the cuts that fees were predicted to go up and more potential students are being turned away. My point there was that while we preach that everyone should get an education our legislation and excutive powers have made it more difficult. Recently a classmate who works for CalTans mentioned that the Governinator cut the state budget acoss the board meaning that a lot of our state budgets in every department were cut. Where all that money is going I have no clue but it is going to do nothing for our state economy. We already rank 50 out of 50 in education when we used to be number 1. How much more must we screw with our economy?

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Old 03-07-2008, 01:51 PM   #19
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Well I didn't go to University because I didn't get enough GCSE's or A-Levels to be accepted into higher education, I trained to be a Bricklayer, and although I am as Hot as a Pistol, I chose not to be a Model Slash Actor (lol,srcsm) nah... But life's not that black and white, you may not be intelligent or good looking enough to earn a living at either. I provide for myself and contribute to society as much as I can with what skills and guile I have.


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Old 03-07-2008, 04:52 PM   #20
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Looks definitely helps. And yes you can capitalize on it. Just know that it is a resources that does not last long, so use it while you can and get as much out of it as you can until it fades should you choose that path.

Oh, and like everyone else... investment is a good way to deal with yoru extra $$$. It goes a long way.

Then again, so did some old dude ready to go at any moment with your name as the sole benefactor in the will, along with his dog.

On college degree... unless it is something technical (in some famous collage even) whatever you learn from it is highly meaningless when you work for more than a couple of years and have the nice track record to prove it. Plus, if you have the cash many places would offer a degree... and it looks just the same to the world. But like I said a college degree is a resources... though you can acquire it at any time and still get its functionality done, like parttime studying later.
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Old 03-08-2008, 12:01 AM   #21
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I have always been taught, to go to college. Nearly all of my teachers say that it is worth it, and try no to think about the money. I definately know that that is a nearly impossible feat nowadays. I would definately say go to college, so at least you have something to fall back on if your plans to become a model or a actor on television don't work out (yes, I probably mis-interpreted this statement made by Sun_Shine, but regardless...). Or, at least, this is what I have been taught...

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Old 03-08-2008, 12:47 AM   #22
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Here's something to think about my grandfather told me today about when I asked him about college(he's really good with econonomics, he was a stockholder once),:

My aunt, my grandfather's daughter, went to college. She graduated and got a degree. When she went to get the job of her dreams, she found out she was overqualified, and couldn't have the job. It turns out she ended up working for the government's communications monitoring department, and is paid quite well; which was completely different than what she went to college for. Now she goes all over the world on different luxurious vacations, and she didn't even have a degree for the job that mad eher so wealthy, and what's funny is government jobs usually require degrees to get, but she got the job without the degree. Turns out she wasted 40,000 dollars on a college educaton she never ended up using, but she still got a great job.

And the moral of the story is... (Insert moral/helpful advisement here)


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Old 03-08-2008, 12:51 AM   #23
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Saying she never used her education is probably utterly and completely false. Perhaps you meant "she didn't use her education to get her job," which is an entirely different animal.

I'm not working in the field I have a degree in, but I apply my education to daily life -- each and every day mind you -- and I don't feel a penny was wasted.

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Old 03-08-2008, 12:53 AM   #24
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Well, things like that do happen in people's lives. But I think that it is generally, IMo, a good idea to still go to college mainly because you still don't know what is going to happen in your life. Plans don't always work out. I think that it would be better not to take that kind of a chance and just wait for a well-paying job where you don't really need a degree. Yes life is full of risks, but, in my book, you shouldn't wait for good things to happen to you/ come to you. Just my thoughts on the matter.

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Old 03-08-2008, 01:02 AM   #25
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The point I'm trying to make is this:

Most often a person goes to college, getting a degree in hopes of getting a certain job. And a lot of times it ends up that they either don't get the job or they end up getting a completely different job entirely. So if you were to go to college and get a degree, don't expect to actually get the job you're wanting, because you could get turned down for various reasons, even for being overqualified in some cases. The moral: Don't expect to get the job you want just because you went to college.

I'm not saying your education was totally wasted if things didn't turn out perfect from college, and I'm not suggestign not to go to college, I'm just saying that you should expect life to not always turn out the way you plan.


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Old 03-08-2008, 01:12 AM   #26
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True enough. And even if you do, supposedly the average person just graduating high school in the US can expect to change careers an average of 8 times if what I heard in the late 90s still holds true.

For most people, an education is still worth pursuing though.
1) Many employers use a bachelors degree as a way of seeing if a potential employee can see something through to completion that they start, and look to it as a measure of how dedicated a person can be if they're just starting out in the job market.

2) Like Achilles said, the value of a GOOD education, not necessarily the diploma itself is priceless. An education is the only thing you can spend money on and can never have it either taken from you, or be lost by other means like theft.


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Old 03-08-2008, 01:23 AM   #27
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I think that your work ethic makes or breaks you. That is one of the most important things that I have learned from a teacher, and in second, always try your hardest.
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I'm not saying your education was totally wasted if things didn't turn out perfect from college, and I'm not suggestign not to go to college, I'm just saying that you should expect life to not always turn out the way you plan.
That seems to be the case. I wasn't attacking you or anything, just a response. Education, is something that I think is taken for granted by a lot of people (by that I mean in my own country). I personally think that it is a gift, and I will try with the best of my ability to get everything that I possibly can from that gift. I think that education is very important. But, that is just my opinion...

~Rev

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Old 03-08-2008, 04:35 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sun-Shine
I'm a very attractive individual.
Attractive or merely beautiful?

I've met quite a few beautiful women who were extremely unattractive (well, to me at least ) because they hadn't bothered to develop any kind of personality or depth of character, aside from social vampirism.

Here's a thought: Are you sure you're not ugly and that people aren't telling you that you're beautiful just to spare your feelings?


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Old 03-08-2008, 11:39 AM   #29
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My advice: GO TO COLLEGE.
It gives you the perfect crutch to fall back on if you ever need to.

Trust me. As a fellow Californian teenager getting ready for college, I kno what u must be going thru. I want to be a music producer and, with the skills that I have, I could be the next Dr. Dre. But reblistically speaking, I kno that the chances are very slim.
All in all, the suggestion that I would give is to play it safe and not to jeapordize your future.


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Old 03-08-2008, 12:22 PM   #30
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Tch. I've been invited some times to be a teenage male clothes model and I've took it. But it was my decision and, as my contract specified, was just for about one summer. I made some good cash, but it surely isn't what I want to do next summer - much less for the rest of my life.

I've always had on my mind that I'm studying to reach but one objective: Get a good work that can keep both me and my wallet satisfied.

For me, the only feasible way of achieving that is through college, that'll broad my career choices a lot. Now, I may not be the best to advise on this, mainly because here the universities are for free, but I'm on the last year of High School and I plan on making my admission test this year yet.


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Old 03-08-2008, 12:44 PM   #31
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I can't remember where I read it, but some study showed that people with a college degree make more money over their lifetime than those without a degree. While someone with X major may not end up working in the same field, the skills someone learns doing research in one particular field can usually be applied to other fields.
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Old 03-08-2008, 01:33 PM   #32
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Here are some stats compliments of the university of Wisconsin.

What isn't shown here, but is similarly compelling, is the percentage of people unemployed vs their level of education. Not only does a degree help you earn more money, but it reduces your likelihood of finding yourself without a job. I guess for some strange reason employers like to hire skilled workers
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Old 03-09-2008, 05:26 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by *Don*
My advice: GO TO COLLEGE.
It gives you the perfect crutch to fall back on if you ever need to.

Trust me. As a fellow Californian teenager getting ready for college, I kno what u must be going thru. I want to be a music producer and, with the skills that I have, I could be the next Dr. Dre. But reblistically speaking, I kno that the chances are very slim.
All in all, the suggestion that I would give is to play it safe and not to jeapordize your future.

Well, you can do both really. I mean you don't have to super squeeze your studies within a few years. You can work a bit and study a bit at the same time, then you can get the feel of it better.

There is no rule saying you need to get a degree before xxyy.

To be fair college is all nice and fun, though it seems to be way more expensive.
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Old 03-09-2008, 06:32 AM   #34
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That's like saying one shouldn't invest in a retirement fund because it costs too much.

Yes, college is expensive, but as the stats provided above show, you'll most likely get that money back several times over. If I know that if I earn achievement X and as soon as I do so, I can reasonably expect to see a 70% increase in my earnings, why on earth would I want to put off doing X (says the hypocrite that put off doing his Masters thesis for 2 years because he was burnt out )?
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Old 03-09-2008, 01:38 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Achilles
~link snipped~ are some stats compliments of the university of Wisconsin.

What isn't shown here, but is similarly compelling, is the percentage of people unemployed vs their level of education. Not only does a degree help you earn more money, but it reduces your likelihood of finding yourself without a job. I guess for some strange reason employers like to hire skilled workers
Indeed. I had a question that involved that very graph on my math homework one day (making histograms I think?) and I was shocked at how much more someone with a professional degree made than someone that is just a college graduate. Amazing.

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Old 03-09-2008, 02:40 PM   #36
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The value of a college education in this day and age isn't that it's going to make you big bucks, but rather that it serves the same function a high school diploma did a generation or two ago. It seperates you from the fold. Much really depends on what kind of degree you get and what field you go into. Get a degree in social work and you may find that material success seems a lot more elusive than if you went into engineering or medicine. Don't make it high enough in your graduating class at law school and those good jobs will be a lot harder to come by when you hit the "real" world. There is no real cut and dry answer to this question. There are people who work in trades or sales that might not have a college degree, but may end up being more "succeessful" than many of those who do. Not saying don't go to college, just don't expect it to be some panacea either. It'll beat being reduced to saying "would you fries with that" or having to work lower end jobs on the economic ladder like aide or security guard, etc.....


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Old 03-10-2008, 11:58 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by JediMaster12
My point there was that while we preach that everyone should get an education our legislation and excutive powers have made it more difficult. Recently a classmate who works for CalTans mentioned that the Governinator cut the state budget acoss the board meaning that a lot of our state budgets in every department were cut.
[rant]
Well, considering that the CA state government controls about 25% of the actual budget, with the remaining 75% going to programs required by voter initiative, I can't imagine why they're having to make cuts in popular programs.

God, I love democracy, but my fellow Americans can be so short-sighted.
[/rant]

Okay, that's over. My advice to the OP: I am going to go on this rant on the assumption that you are looking to go into a career, etc, and not marry a sugar daddy. If you are looking to marry some guy with a huge...wallet (made you look ) that is about to keel over dead, you may safely ignore the rest of this post.

If you are trying to leverage your looks into a job...well...go for it. BUT, make note that if your "qualifications" are based upon your looks and not your knowledge, skills, and abilities; plan on changing jobs a lot. If you are hired based on sex appeal alone, be aware that sooner or later, the person that hired you is going to actually need you to perform the job. If you are incapable of doing this, it could lead to some difficulties, probably including getting fired. Make sure that you have another job lined up, locked, loaded, and ready to fire. And as others have pointed out in this thread, looks fade. If you are going to pursue a career on looks alone, be ready for the slight flaw in our biology that is getting older.

Now, I am no Nordic God in the looks department, so I had to go the more conventional route. I will preface by stating that I have a Master's degree in Oceanography. Half of my current job is computer programming and the other half is quality assurance work, making sure that what we send to our client is accurate. (Oh, and the other half? Making sure my employees do their jobs correctly) At any rate, none of what I do has much to do with Oceanography. Do I think that my degree was a waste of time? No.

You may ask yourself, "why does this obnoxious poster not think his degree was a waste?" Well, I'll tell you. It got me in the door. Now, good looks can get you in the door, too. (If that be the case for you, jump down to the next paragraph) A college degree can be leveraged into a job. Many people that do the hiring are impressed by this. Not all, mind, but there is certainly enough anecdotal evidence mounting to infer that a degree is pretty much a requirement for a job that doesn't entail asking if someone wants fries with their burger. A degree states that you have some basic skills. Most important among those skills is the ability to learn. Also, and especially in tough times, you can point out all the hoops you had to jump through to finish your degree. Hiring authorities like hearing that you actually had to get your hands dirty and work your tail off in order to finish your degree.

Now, once you're in, now what? Even if you have a "professional" degree (Doctor, Lawyer, Engineer, etc...) hard work and continuing education is essential. In fact, the best advice I ever had is "make yourself essential." That means lots of unpaid and unrecognized effort. However, it may also save you from the chopping block when the, er...stuff...hits the fan.

Frankly, whether you have a degree or not, you'd best be ready to work. The difference between someone with a degree and someone without is that the person without has got a longer road to walk and a few more roadblocks to overcome. The final question is one you have to ask yourself. How badly do you want to succeed?

At least that's my opinion. I could be wrong.


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