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Old 03-28-2002, 08:53 PM   #1
Master Blaster
 
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Crap is a Crap

After playing JK for almost 12 hours today - I'm taking it back tomorow Sad but has to be done.
I've been playing on Master Jedi dif. level and thats how you see CRAP. Almost non existing AI (compared to the other products on market), amazingly frustrating "puzzles". Totaly useless AUTO AIM which DOES exist despite what Raven says. Imagine there are 10 s.t.'s after you - you try to aim at the front guy and it suddenly jumps on to the guy behind just because I aimed at the first guys shoulder (I managed to turn it off through the console). And lots more annoying things.
Game gets better once you get a lightsaber but still crap.
Every aspect of the game has its faults.
The only people who really did a great job are those who did textures - ABSOLUTELY AMAZING
I was waiting for the game eagerly but now it has to go back.
Very, very sad
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Old 03-28-2002, 09:01 PM   #2
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Ok for 1, everybody is saying how awesome the AI is and your saying it doesnt exist? ROFL . Did you actually play it?
Anyways sorry that you dont like it, your loss. Take it back so somebody else can pick it up and be happy with it. Id like it if you could give us some examples of what exatly sucks about what your talking about..... Give us some detailed situations so we know exactly what your talking aboutl.

Eric
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Old 03-28-2002, 09:01 PM   #3
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I have to agree with you about the puzzels.....theres no need to have all this look for security key, and vents to crawl through...reall gets on my nerves, i sat for 45mins working out were to go, really frustrating, this is an fps after wall, we buy it for action, not for puzzels and mazes...in my opinion.

But i thought the AI ws quite good, better then in other games, like moh:aa. The graphics are superb, saber battles are very realistic, like in the films, nice story line, though i thought it was a bit rushed. Over all a top class game i think. Shame u don't feel the same way.
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Old 03-28-2002, 09:18 PM   #4
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Maybe "Non existing AI" was a bit strong but I still don't see that "praised by many" AI. I dont think great AI is : crouching, hiding around the corner and calling your mates for help. I haven't seen anyone actually running away from me no matter what weapon do I have in hands even when the enemy unit is own. Maybe that's because of difficulty level ? Try to kill someone with a lightsaber on Master Jedi level of dif. it's like poking with a toothpick
Graphics is good, models are good, atmosphere is good - but game still sucks.
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Old 03-28-2002, 09:20 PM   #5
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Maybe "Non existing AI" was a bit strong but I still don't see that "praised by many" AI. I dont think great AI is : crouching, hiding around the corner and calling your mates for help. I haven't seen anyone actually running away from me no matter what weapon do I have in hands even when the enemy unit is on its own. Maybe that's because of difficulty level ? Try to kill someone with a lightsaber on Master Jedi level of dif. it's like poking with a toothpick
Graphics is good, models are good, atmosphere is good - but game still sucks.
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Old 03-28-2002, 10:32 PM   #6
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Anyone who is a fan, a big fan of Jedi Knight or MOTS, will love JK2. This Master Blaster OBVIOUSLY was not.

Not his fault he was expecting something different. I knew exactly what to expect and i absolutely love it.


----Whatever hits the fan will not be evenly distributed----
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Old 03-28-2002, 10:32 PM   #7
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I have been playing on Jedi Knight level and I would say the ai is pretty good. Some run away from me to find cover while others duck or try to sneak behind me.

As for the puzzles I dont' think they are that hard so far. I know it is classified as a fps but I think it was aimed more for the Dues ex or half-life crowd then Quake or Ut style games. Oh well no game can please everybody!


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Old 03-28-2002, 10:45 PM   #8
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I like how you failed to give us examples like i suggested above. I really wanna flame you but instead im just gonna ask for your personal detailed opinion on the things you do not like about the game. So we can have a normal conversation. And what else do you want enemies to do in a game as far as AI goes? want them to scratch there ass and call there mom on the phone or stub there toe and cry? I dont get it. If you kill there leader or just many stormtroopers all at once in a surprize attack supposidly some might run. Try it =)

Eric
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Old 03-28-2002, 10:48 PM   #9
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I'm sorry to hear that you don't like the game. That's a real shame. I wonder...did you ever play the original Dark Forces, as well as Jedi Knight?

You see, what Raven have managed to do is combine elements from both of the preceding games...and Dark Forces did have several large puzzles, and security codes to bypass. As for Jedi Knight...that game too had it's puzzle elements...how do you get from A to B...etc. So Jedi Outcast is actually quite faithful to the games that preceded it, IMO. The puzzles can be a little tough initially...but once you figure them out, you kick yourself.

The thing to really keep in mind, I find, is that nothing is taking place for no reason. If you see something unusual, even from a distance, then it has some part to play.

As for the AI...I find it quite good, actually. The Stormies do run away, try to flank you, duck behind cover, call for assistance...and the Commanders keep them focused on you. They're also harder to kill, unless you can get a lot of headshots, and that's great too.

Of course, there are a couple of issues with the game, I agree, but on the whole, they don't detract from an enjoyable experience...for me at least. I can't say that I'm very fond of the dynamic crosshair either...especially in 3rd person, so I'll be trying to turn it off as well.
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Old 03-28-2002, 11:04 PM   #10
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if u dont like a story, then the Starwars universe is not for u.The game was never ment to be a Q3 or UT, were the story is a tournament were u have to kill all oponents.Half Life was considered one of the best games ever, and it had lots of puzzles to solve, just like DarkForces and Jedi Knight(wich I really loved by the way).The game hasnt reached portugal yet, but one things 4sure, as soon as its here, ILL buy it, finish the SP part, join a clan for MP maddeness and start creating mods 4 it.
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Old 03-28-2002, 11:12 PM   #11
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I for one don't mind the puzzles at all. That was part of JK to begin with. It seems to me that the people who don't seem to like this game much are those who never really played the original Jedi Knight or Dark Forces or just don't like Star Wars much. I'm only on the second level and I love the game. Its so cool to see how the series has evolved.


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Old 03-28-2002, 11:12 PM   #12
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so now im thinking this guy hasn't even tried out multiplayer ?

that's where it's all at man.
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Old 03-28-2002, 11:31 PM   #13
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Personally, I love the puzzles! I've managed to get every secret area so far thanks to my trying to solve puzzles (I know it's an FPS, but I love mind benders)
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Old 03-28-2002, 11:40 PM   #14
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Put it this way. I'd rather spend more time in the world of Jedi Knight 2 solving puzzles than spend less flying through it. Complaining that the game is too hard/annoying because of the puzzles, seems idiotic to me. For a game like MOHAA, that took me 6 hours to complete in one day. JK2 is a welcome relief!!

BTW the ingame videos of JK2 do not do the graphics and saber movement justice. You really have to play the game to see how awesome the saber really looks. So far i love the story. The references to the Valley Of the Jedi are awesome. Kyles character is exactly like in the previous games! Animations are amazing, especially the dying anims of enemies. All you fans of Jedi Knight and MOTS will love this one!! Trust me!


----Whatever hits the fan will not be evenly distributed----
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Old 03-28-2002, 11:49 PM   #15
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I love JK2!!! It like stated above, is a realy breather from all the short games i have been playing recently. I love the AI and SP is great. I have it on Jedi Knight and i like how some of the troopers run away while others just stand and shot their. I also like when you shoot them in the head, they die. I think that the game is really good. And MP rocks too. The only thing i think that could have been better is well the use of locking recticles like in JK for force powers. I mean sometimes in MP i have no idea who i am gripping or who i am pulling weapons away from. Thats my only beef.
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Old 03-28-2002, 11:53 PM   #16
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Sorry MB, better luck next time.


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Old 03-29-2002, 12:10 AM   #17
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Only 1 complaint

The only complaint I have about this game is when I play single player I get Motion sickness from it... then I have to take a break..


And one more compaint.. FKN PASSWORDS on the damn servers I try to join.. WTF...at least put PASSWORD in the game name..

thats all..

BTW THIS GAME ROCKS....

Ill duel anyone....I suck tho, but i will duel.. peace
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Old 03-29-2002, 12:27 AM   #18
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I don't like the real world. There are too many puzzles and sometimes the sky doesn't move. Sometimes I just wander around aimlessly with no direct guidance telling me what I must do to progress through life. Clearly the developers of the world are trying to rip us off by forcing us to get stuck all the time, making life take four times longer than it should! And it's got horrible AI. Sometimes I see people bumping into stuff and that's just not realistic.

Oh yeah, and I jump too high.

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Old 03-29-2002, 12:37 AM   #19
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Re: Only 1 complaint

this game is f'in leet...

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Econ
[B]The only complaint I have about this game is when I play single player I get Motion sickness from it... then I have to take a break..

i was getting that alot today during JK2, thats why is wicked :


.... :P
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Old 03-29-2002, 12:48 AM   #20
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Yea, I've had motion sickness once while playing (that was the first time EVER a game has done that to me). At first I just attributed it to looking at my flashing keychain a little too much and just played through it even though it felt like I was spinning around at 10 G's getting ready to fly outta my chair


I want to die in my sleep like my grandfather...not sreaming and yelling like those in his car
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Old 03-29-2002, 12:51 AM   #21
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lmfao cool :P


.... :P
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Old 03-29-2002, 12:54 AM   #22
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Post Please excuse me....

Please excuse me while I urinate on your FACE! ROFLMAO!!


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Old 03-29-2002, 01:07 AM   #23
Hoth
 
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I got the motion sickness too. I have 2 suggestions for those who get it:

1) Try and stick to "outdoor" maps; those without lots of winding corridors and rooms.

2) Switch off the "sway" option.

I still get a little woozey but switching off the sway thing definitely has helped me.

Hoth
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Old 03-29-2002, 01:22 AM   #24
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the sway option enabled while looking in 3rd person is the easiest on the eyes.
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Old 03-29-2002, 01:26 AM   #25
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Is there an option to turn off Autoaim?


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Old 03-29-2002, 02:34 AM   #26
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Disappointed

I just got JK2 tonight. My initial impression is a little disappointment. I loved Dark Forces and the first Jedi Knight and have been anticipating JK2. I played a little of the single player game and a little of the multi-player game tonight. The graphics, sound, and force powers are all top notch. Everything looks and sounds so cool. The quality is evident.

The problem I have with this game is the same problem I had with some other recent FPS games: everyone just plain moves around too fast. Ever see a stormtrooper bob and weave around like he is floating on air? Aren't stormtroopers supposed to be slow and clunky? In the first single player mission I was trying to hit a stormtrooper up on a ledge. He was bouncing around so much and so quickly that it actually made me laugh. Multiplayer is filled with a bunch of jedi bobing, weaving, and jumping all over the place. Coupled with that is the fact that all the weapons seem so inaccurate in this game. Landing a hit on someone seems to be more about luck than skill. Perhaps I am more cut out for tactic shooters. Perhaps I am just getting old and slow. Perhaps JK2 will grow on me. For right now I am a bit disappointed in the gameplay.
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Old 03-29-2002, 03:12 AM   #27
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I'm VERY disapointed by JK2. I absolutely loved the first JK and MOTS, but JK2 just can't compare. What really ****s me is the is the ST blaster, my favourite weapon in JK has become crap, esspecially with the new primary and alterante fire functions. Plus the projectiles moves way to slowly and the hit box is so damned tiny that my blasts has shot through their armpits on a number of occasions! It's too damned hard to hit anyone. I was standing a metre away from someone and fired 10 shots before it hit them, and my reticle was pointed straight at them. The shielding is useless compared to the first and you have a max of 100. There's also NO incication of when you're being hit when your shields are up. After a fire fight, you just notice you've lost most of your shields and wonder "WTF? When did that happen?!"
The AI isn't impressive at all, Jan shoots me up the arse all the time, all the stoom troopers do is just move from side to side, back and fourth, it's like what red faction's crap enemies do, it's not skilled AI, it's an annoying cheap tatic. The Puzzles are a pain. They don't belong in the game. The only thing it's got going for it are the graphics. Great models, textures, levels and animation.

I really think if Raven make changes in a patch like increase blaster projectile speed and hitbox size, increase the shields max to 200 in SP, give and indication of when you're being hit, and change the force power funcitonality to be like JK1's where you hold down the button, then an indicator comes up showing who it will effect then release the button to initiate force power. Then it would be far more enjoyable
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Old 03-29-2002, 03:23 AM   #28
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Well, I must say I'm really enjoying the game right now.
I really only have a couple of gripes. So far I'm getting really sick of getting stuck wandering around in SP. Regardless of this I still am enjoying it. And I find the StormTrooper AI to be excellent. They act exactly like they did in the movies!
My second gripe is the MP bot AI. I'm having an extremely hard time dueling with them. Once they're hurt they just walk backwards away and away until they're out of my sight.
But again, I don't really care. Most games have horrible bot AI or none at all. So I think we've still got things pretty good with JK][...


-PimpusOlympus-
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Old 03-29-2002, 04:57 AM   #29
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i just started playing SP for the 2nd time on medium mode and its ridiculous.
when you shoot at stormies with a blaster rifle its like your using a water pistol - it just cant hurt them, plus they run faster then the freakin blaster bolts, thats just stupid.

i got up to the bit where you have to stop the escaping slaves getting killed and deal with the ATst;s and gave up.
its absolutely impossible, the stormies all the way up on the ledge sniping me have pin point accuraccy with rapid firing blaster rifles while i emptied an entire full blaster rifle at one of them and didnt hit him once.

as soon as i jump on the big blaster cannon thing they blow it up from under me

i even used cheats to get the rocket launcher but it doesnt seem to work on the atst

this game could rock so hard if they just got the gameplay balance a bit better.
like someone else said they need to make a patch to make the blaster bolts move faster and the stormies move slower as well as make the size of the bolts bigger so they hit easier

the patch should also make it possible to use the force on the swamp level on doods who r in the water.

thermal detenators should be more powerful too, the grenades in MOHAA were even better.

-patch


-patch
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Old 03-29-2002, 05:01 AM   #30
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I don't have time to read all this, but there is one thing that I would like to add. The game is based on the Star Wars universe. Which means that Raven Software had to try to have the StormTroopers act as they do in the movies. And they are quite stupid in the movies. I don't know jack about ai routines, but appearantly it isn't that hard to create almost unbeatable ai. What they tried to achieve is getting you into the movie. I haven't played it yet, so I cannot be the judge of that until tonight (if I can leave work soon enough to get a copy), but please consider the intention of the game.


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Old 03-29-2002, 05:26 AM   #31
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LMAO at Run-onsentience!!

And, Master Blaster, Jedi255, and ]-UnderTOW-[ . . . . would you care for some cheese?
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Old 03-29-2002, 05:53 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally posted by ]-UnderTOW-[
I'm VERY disapointed by JK2. I absolutely loved the first JK and MOTS, but JK2 just can't compare. What really ****s me is the is the ST blaster, my favourite weapon in JK has become crap, esspecially with the new primary and alterante fire functions.
I felt the exact same way, till I reread the description of the ST rifle from JK1.. It is SUPPOSED to be inaccurate. Sadly though, the first levels kinda force you to use it --which I don't mind, but sometimes feel like it's a bloody waste. You know though, this is actually a boon.. It makes me think about what weapon to use more than just mindlessly relying upon the ST blaster (kyles pistol is much more accurate over longer distances).
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Old 03-29-2002, 07:59 AM   #33
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LOL, some ppl complain when AI is too stupid and dont move or run, others complain because they do run away.Some complain the game is 2 easy, others cause its 2 dificult, some say the puzzles r very easy, other say they r anoyingly dificult.Some even complain about the game being 2 fast, LOL we r talking about jedis, what where u especting?? Santa Clause?? and if u dont like playing in servers full of ppl jumping very high or running very fast, just create a game with no force powers alowed or join one with those caracteristics.Like Blade Said" Some Mother F****S r always trying to skate up hill!"
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Old 03-29-2002, 08:37 AM   #34
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The original Jedi Knight was amazing. I was so absorbed with the single player game that I completed it in the smallest screen size, low res in software mode on my old slow computer... but still enjoyed it immensely! Now if you can enjoy a game like that it really shows how good it it

I am reassured by the posts which state that JK2 is similar to JK. There were never too many "puzzles" as such, more trying to find out where to go. This sense of getting lost improved the game I think, it made you feel like you were in a vast world and not a tight, restricting and linear level (although it was linear).

I'm going to get my copy of Jedi Knight 2 this afternoon, hooray
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