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View Poll Results: Light Side Force Recovery
Yes, make it regenerate faster. 21 43.75%
No, what a silly idea. 27 56.25%
Voters: 48. You may not vote on this poll


Thread: May the light side be with you.
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Old 04-17-2002, 10:17 PM   #1
Nill the Mean
 
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Question May the light side be with you.

How about this:

Since so many people claim the dark side has an advantage over the light side, why not make the light side recover force quicker? It would make more sense in a way... what with the light side being the supposed "stronger" side.

Just an idea...

Bugger... this should be in editing really... sorry.
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Old 04-17-2002, 10:20 PM   #2
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Ill light side you!!!!!

Yes....well......


well i voted yes at any rate, more force for you means more health for me! (yes, stop *****ing about drain, first we need a target which heal doesnt and we only get as much health as you have force, draining someone dont guarantee health)
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Old 04-17-2002, 10:23 PM   #3
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Doesn't matter if they get health or not. Because they take all your force power. Leaving you helpless. While they have lots of force power to go around. Wow , just enough to force grip you till death.


:0
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Old 04-17-2002, 10:25 PM   #4
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I dont use grip or lightning or anything else in conjunction with drain. Infact the server i play on is restricted force to jump, saber throw, drain, team energize and sight. Its not a problem of drain its a problem of people exploiting a power for easy kills. And anyway lets not turn this thread into a flame war over drain.

Give the pathetic weaklings their increased force regen, might give you enough to use another burst of CowardPower before i kill you.
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Old 04-17-2002, 10:40 PM   #5
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I actually think that Lighties have a slight advantage over the rest of us. I mean, they can disappear, heal themselves, make themselves immune to force damage then pull a Strong Style special move on my ass. I often prefer to fight someone with darkside powers becasue they'll fire off a lightining at me and use up all their force power, so I can Grip 'em and push then to a horribe death.

No all the force should stay the same.


QUIT WHINING!
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Old 04-17-2002, 10:43 PM   #6
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I don't care what anyone says, heal is by far much "cheaper" than drain. I don't care what anyone says, it is very, very easy to avoid someone. If you are a light saber you can get away long enough to heal before you can be drained. I hate it when people heal during duels. They are impossible to beat. Running in circles waiting for their force to come back so they can heal...


hAHaDuDE
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Old 04-18-2002, 02:16 AM   #7
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I haven't really formed a solid opinion on this yet. I always play light Force powers and haven't brushed up on the darkside yet. But in my experiences in multiplayer, I haven't ran into anything yet that makes me think the darkside has more power, or an advantage. But I haven't had the time or the connection to play more online as of late.
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Old 04-18-2002, 02:40 AM   #8
Sartis
 
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It's very sad when people complain about how unbalanced drain is, when all it really does is drain a little too fast, slow it down 10% then its balanced fine. Now I see all these lightsiders wanting faster regeneration on mana. I can tellyou now you will not get this except maybe in a mod. Personally Lightside has an advantage over darkside as a whole right now. Sure Dark can drain/grip you does that mean you need faster mana rate? No, and really grip isn't too hard to get away from when it wears off.

Maybe I should make a thread stating how I want Darkside to regenerate hp. Sounds foolish right?

How about we think of some viable solutions ifyou think things are unbalanced, rather than tipping the scale hugely to one side. Think about your ideas before you get people to rally behind you, Or laugh at you.
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Old 04-18-2002, 02:55 AM   #9
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Yeap, though strictly speaking lightsiders dont use force, they use "CowardPower" (TM)

This amazing energy source gives you the ability to:

Hide!
Run!
Cower behind shielding against the force!
Cower behind shielding against sabers!
Run in circles like a headless chicken while healing!
Heal other cowards so they too can run about like insipid weaklings that little bit longer!


Dont delay! Join the light side and order a hefty dose of CowardPower (TM) today!

Bleargh, lightsider <spits in disgust>


Desann knows his stuff - The force is not a shield to protect the useless, its is a weapon to empower the worthy!
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Old 04-18-2002, 05:21 AM   #10
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just as darksiders use bully-power: what can they do? zap you, grip you, drain you, make you as harmless as possible before they dare to attack.

both sides can be abused but the point is: light side is defense and dark side is offense. i dont even know why dark side can heal at all if its nature is all agressive and DEstructive? you deal out the damage and we try to take that damage. but who cares, slow down drain so i can stop playing with one finger over the absorb button and it should be fine.

but one thing really bothers me: that 'if they have something to heal, we need something to heal too'. light and dark are supposed to be DIFFERENT, else i will start saying 'if they can deal damage i want to deal damage too'


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"...at least, he fails to appreciate Star Wars, which is a failing of intelligence in my opinion" - Jeanne Cavelos
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Old 04-18-2002, 05:37 AM   #11
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Quote:
I dont use grip or lightning or anything else in conjunction with drain. Infact the server i play on is restricted force to jump, saber throw, drain, team energize and sight. Its not a problem of drain its a problem of people exploiting a power for easy kills. And anyway lets not turn this thread into a flame war over drain.
how do u remove a particular force power from the server?
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Old 04-18-2002, 05:58 AM   #12
enDless_Deliriu
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by Darksider
Desann knows his stuff - The force is not a shield to protect the useless, its is a weapon to empower the worthy!
Heh, you just reminded me of Kenshin.

A sword is meant to kill, all sword techniques are techniques for killing. This will always be the way, and what they (lightsiders?) believe is just an idealistic dream. But I like that dream, and I hope the world will take that dream as reality, and leave how things are as a nightmare. (paraphrazed Kenshin of course)

Coward Power for the Lightside? Come on, you can think of something better than that can you? I mean, it must really take a coward to use completely PASSIVE force powers and still win right?


On another note. I'll agree, it's annoying having people constantly spam heal. Just like it's annoying when people keep draining you, you know they ahve full health (as they've already drained off 2 full force bars) but they still do it, just so you have no defense against them gripping you.

I meet a Drain/Grip (person who is payed for favors of an adult nature), and I get a bit annoyed, though I still try to kill the punk. Drain on it's own I don't mind, I'll just keep my force down on my own so you get nothing from it and still get you. I don't rely on the force for my kills, because it doesn't actively do anything for me, you have to do something for me to react.


But seriously people.. Coward Power that's horrible. That's almost as bad as Bully Power heh. All the philosophy behind the force and it can be summed up in this. "You are a coward!" "Shut up bully!"


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Old 04-18-2002, 08:36 AM   #13
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The powers are balanced as it is. You just need to know when to use each of them.

Personally, I like Jedi rather then sith because when I concentrate on just defending against force powers I must rely more on my light saber, so I get better with it. Dark siders rely too much on their force powers and are USUALLY worse with the saber. (this does not go for all siths, and is not ment to flame anyone, it is just from my vast experience).


I like Light because:

I can absorb any force power.
I can heal.
I really don't use protection or mind trick at all... I don't think they are very useful.
I always max out all my saber skills and I usually have jump maxed, or atleast with 2.
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Old 04-18-2002, 09:22 AM   #14
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Thumbs down Drain blabla...

The reason I said that the lightside should recover force faster is so protect and absorb can become more usefull. I can't remember ever having switched those on and having found them usefull.
I use push/pull and heal. And NO I don't spam heal or run like a cowardly headless chicken.

As for drain, it's seriously overrated. When people drain me I just stand there. It's not like it kills you or anything. When someone whips out grip directly after, I usually just have enough force to pull them after me. After pulling this one guy after me for the sixth time he got the point.

I personally never said there was an unbalance. God knows how many other people did.
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Old 04-18-2002, 09:35 AM   #15
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grip is a great move but its best use when ur opponent has there back to you because then they cant push u off, and then u either choke em to death or let them fall into space
i cant stand light, too goody goody
sith rules and just because we like force doesnt mean were crap with a lightsaber
u light guys make me sick

FEEL MY WRATH!!!!!!!


and now i play a nice violin song at ur funeral

muhahahahaha
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Old 04-18-2002, 09:55 AM   #16
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But lightsiders ARE cowards, they fear the true power of the force and half-use the weakest part of what they know, they fear the dark side more than they fear walking into battle using only their meagre powers, it makes them no less the coward

And I too am sick of people WHINING ceaselessly over drain, seriously if you have a problem with drain then cry me a river - so i can drown you in it.
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Old 04-18-2002, 10:02 AM   #17
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I will post here just this once and then leave the thread alone because it has potential to become like the bunnyhopping thread and that just got irritating.

Im not sure why everyone is complaining. About anything. My roommate plays Light and I play Dark. I use drain and grip.... I figure they are the darksides bread and butter. However, my roommate never complains or calls it cheap... the fact is, when I use drain he is fully able to speed up to me and start cutting me down while Im using it. I may be healing but a saber will get rid of that health faster than I can take it from him. Sometimes he pushes me over when I go for it. There are lots of ways to counter it if you are using your Force well.
If I try to drain/grip him... it may work sometimes but there is a delay between he use of force powers in multi and often times he has gained enough force back to give me a push to release my grip and hes gotten pretty quick at it. Sure I can still grip him and throw him off but I have to work much harder at it. Its not easy to maneuver him over the edge without falling off myself anymore... I have to keep him facing away from me, strafing around him to avoid his push.

On the other side, he uses heal but it never gives him too much of an advantage as a couple of saber hits or a toss of lightning will end all that. It may prolong a fight for a bit but never gives him unfair advantage. It WOULD be an unfair advantage if a darksider had no way to force heal.

I have never played online where either of these force powers unbalanced the game. I have had guys heal while fighting me , and I don't like to blow my own horn but, I was still able to cut them down using a combination from my own bag of tricks. I have also had players try to drain me and they may have but I must have not noticed while I was running in and cutting them down. So drain may drain too fast in some peoples opinions but I've never noticed or had it affect me much.

I think you guys just have to get a little creative with your responses to what people are doing in games.


Luminous beings are we... not this crude matter.
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Old 04-18-2002, 10:04 AM   #18
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Right on.

People should stop whining about drain and grip. Grip can easily be countered with pull/push/saberthrow/grip. Drain is also easily remedied. I usually pull the person (provided I still have enough force, otherwise I roll towards them) and then kick them. Knocks em down and then I finish em off.
This however, is not what the thread is about. It's about making protect and absorb slightly more usefull. I mean, I never use these. If you switch on absorb, no-one uses grip/lightning on you and your force just dies out very quickly. If you use protect, someone gets you and your force is empty straight away.
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Old 04-18-2002, 11:49 AM   #19
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The reason why people are mad at this post Nill is because your basically wanting to take away half hte good point of Drain, Drain isn't just used to heal, it's used to counter absorb/protect, and your saying you want ot take that away from us. Drain isn't just a heal, its a counter. And if your regenerating mana twice as fast it just becomes a heal util
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Old 04-18-2002, 11:50 AM   #20
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u cant counter grip if ur gripped from behind
u will choke at my wrath muhahahahaha
being light is cowardly
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Old 04-18-2002, 12:02 PM   #21
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Darthmark, incase you havent realised most people arent stupid and stay looking in one direction. They turn, and quickly to see whre they are being choked from, then they force push you and you try your grip again.

Also the darkside has lightning... so what? Im a lightsider and yes i complain of lightning non stop. But it doesnt mean when i see someone using lightning i run. Hell no i run into them push them then slice and dice, healing all the way.


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Old 04-18-2002, 12:20 PM   #22
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the point is once i have u from behind i can run around with u, so ui cant turn and face me cus ill always be behind u
also if i have u for about 5 seconds then ur character goes to that stage where he cant do anything but hold his neck
i always use it when there are a loot of ppl fightin in the same place, pick one up from behind, drag him away and slaughter him, works like a charm
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Old 04-18-2002, 12:32 PM   #23
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Who says the light side is "supposed" to be stronger?

Luke asks Yoda "Is the Darkside stronger?" to which the wise muppet-master replies "No! Quicker, easier, more seductive."

Notice he doesn't say, "Weaker it is, mmmm!" And why didn't he?

I'd say they're about equal, it's just how you use it that matters. Yoda was just saying that the Dark Side is easier to pick up, and more tempting to use (kind of like the darkside for some JK2 players). ; )

If Vader and Palpatine, using the Dark Side, were able to destroy the Jedi Order (lightside), I'd say that'd make a pretty good case for the Dark Side being "stronger." But I think the above point makes sense, don't you think? As usual, I'd say instead of people complaining about imbalance, they should just become more skilled (through practice). Raven's own council they will keep on what needs to be changed, mmmm! (er, sorry for the Yoda bit)
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Old 04-18-2002, 01:22 PM   #24
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The dark side only seems more powerful just as Yoda said in the movies. The light side used correctly can be MUCH more beneficial in the long run.
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Old 04-18-2002, 02:31 PM   #25
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The powers are balanced, except for a couple issues:

1.) Drain drains force power WAY too fast; it's ridiculous to drain a full bar in a second or two of drain(which only costs a couple bars for the person using it).
2.) Absorb and Protect are difficult to use effectively because they drain power constantly, and the dark sider can run away until Absorb turns off, then drain you so you can't use it again. Absorb and Protect should stay on until you turn them off(or maybe when you're below 1/4 power or something), and simply prevent regeneration. This way a lightsider can defend themselves indefinitely against dark powers or physical attacks, but they make it almost impossible to use any other powers.
3.) Level 3 Grip is ridiculous. Not just for dropping people off edges, but the damage it can deal. If you drain someone empty then immediately grip them, you can hold them until they take the big 50-or-so hit of damage before they have the power to push you. Even if they do have the power, you can run circles and spin them around and they'll have a real hard time targetting you.
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Old 04-18-2002, 02:45 PM   #26
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i've noticed some of the strategies seem to require low pings... sorry, but it's tough targeting a gripper when he dances around me and i'm lagging

and DarthMark, how much you wanna bet that a low-pinger can spin in a 180 degree circle faster than you can run around them as they turn?
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Old 04-18-2002, 03:21 PM   #27
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well, how about this, make absorb require no force to activate, but still fill you meter when powers are used on you, even drain...

i though of that when i noticed absorbing drain didnt fill your meter, unless my lag muffs it up a lot....

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Old 04-18-2002, 06:27 PM   #28
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fair enough FarmerBOB but on summit like a LAN game where the pings are at 0, then ull feel the wrath of the dark side, MUHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 04-18-2002, 07:08 PM   #29
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The better solution

If you're wanting to make absorb/protect more useful, the quick, easy, logical way that in no way adds or detracts from any force power's FUNCTION, is to make it so you don't glow blue or green constantly, just when you are hit with either a force power or physical attack (respectively)

Doesn't touch anybody's force pool regen rates, absorb rate, drain rate, nothing like that. It just makes it much more of a strategic decision on BOTH sides.
DS: Does he have absorb on?
LS: Am I wasting my force pool?

The problem with absorb IMO is not that it counters all force powers, but that it is easily avoidable. For everyone who "whines" about it countering their dark powers, the easy counter is to just wait him out. Especially easy since you can run away as fast as he can advance. An absorber who tries to use force speed to catch up to you is just doing your job for you (sucking down his own force pool). This pretty much goes for any force power they try to use.

Protect ,as is, is extremely easy to counter. DRAIN! Watch that green glow go bye-bye.

TDS
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