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View Poll Results: Should seatbelt wearing stay a law?
Yes 22 84.62%
No 4 15.38%
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Old 06-08-2003, 08:06 PM   #1
Thrackan Solo
 
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Exclamation Seatbelts

Do you think wearing your seatbelt should be a law?


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Old 06-08-2003, 08:58 PM   #2
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No.


While I do, and always have worn my seatbelt whenever i'm in a car, and I believe that everyone SHOULD wear them, I dont think that anyone has the right to MAKE me wear it. It's a personal choice, if I want to make an attempt to save my life it's up to me. I'm not endangering ANYONE else by not buckling up, so it should be my choice.

I can understand laws about speeding, driving recklessly, etc. because those can cause injury or death to others. But not wearing a seatbelt would only hurt someone if my body got launched out of the car in an accident and my body were to slam INTO somebody.......but the odds of that happening are not good.



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Old 06-08-2003, 09:04 PM   #3
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I agree, it isnt the governments job to keep you safe from yourself, its there job to keep you safe from others


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Old 06-08-2003, 10:48 PM   #4
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Yes, it should stay a law.

Most people simply do not know the dangers of not wearing a seat belt, and therefore they are unfit to make a proper desiscion on whether or not they should wear it. The goverment's job is, amongst other things, to protect you from both others and from yourself. There is no doubt that the amount of seat bealt-using car drivers would go down if the law had been removed.

There's simply too many dumb people in the world, but we can't risk their lives just because of that.


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Old 06-08-2003, 11:03 PM   #5
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It is a law in Denmark. Makes a lot of money for the State in fines, lol. Seriously, though, a fine works a lot better than any kind of ad campaign, IMO. And since it doesn't exactly hurts to buckle up, I can't see what harm such a law does.

Quote:
I'm not endangering ANYONE else by not buckling up
Not quite correct. If you get yourself killed or injured, the state will have to:

1) Find some way to cover the loss of tax-income.

2) Patch you up/dig you down.

3) Take care of any minor children that you may have, which are left unsupported.

4) Pay for psychological counseling for your family and others who may be traumatized by the experience of seing you hurt/dead.

All of this nice money could have gone into hospitals, which could have saved people's lives. So, in a way, you are starting a contingency that costs lives, other than your own.

Quote:
it isnt the governments job to keep you safe from yourself, its there job to keep you safe from others
But you would expect the govt to send probes to find out whether the ice on the local lake was thick enough to support you, no? And place a 'Traffic on ice illegal' sign if it wasn't, no?

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Old 06-09-2003, 02:22 AM   #6
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We have a law about seatbelts in Canada. It's just an attempt to get more funds for the state (just like Photo-Radar), so that Jean can spend taxpayer dollars on a new private jet. I love this country, but I have a great distrust of our government. One problem is that Government and Politics get mixed together sometimes, so we conform to the majority sometimes. The bigger problem, tough, is that we have elections by the people. Democracy doesn't work in real life, I'm afraid, just like Communism doesn't work in real life. Stupid people can vote, and they do vote (usually for the guy with the best ad campaign). Well, now you've got me rambling so I'll just stop now before I upset someone.
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Old 06-09-2003, 04:14 AM   #7
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Quote:
There's simply too many dumb people in the world, but we can't risk their lives just because of that.
WE aren't risking anything. THEY are risking their lives. And if they are too stupid or too careless to buckle their seatbelts, then i'm sorry, I don't feel sorry for them. EVERYONE is told hundreds of times when they are little and when they get older that buckling their seatbelt can save their life. They force-feed it to us in school.

If we can choose to smoke cigarettes and choose to drink alcohol, then I think we can choose whether or not to wear our seatbelts.



The loss of tax income would probably be negated by the amount of money that the government would end up paying in social security/ medicare once this person grew older.

In the US medical/funeral bills would be the problem of the family of the deceased.
as would Psychological treatment, which the majority of families who go through such events do not even resort to.




Quote:
And since it doesn't exactly hurts to buckle up, I can't see what harm such a law does.
And it doesn't exactly HURT to have government cameras installed EVERYWHERE, and it sure would make catching criminals a lot easier.....



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Old 06-09-2003, 11:34 AM   #8
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Thumbs up

Well i believe in individual responsibility, and don't like when the "state" imposes these types of rules. You and I and everybody else pay in the long run for the careless drivers.


SO yes i guess it is a good thing.

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Old 06-09-2003, 02:25 PM   #9
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WE aren't risking anything. THEY are risking their lives. And if they are too stupid or too careless to buckle their seatbelts, then i'm sorry, I don't feel sorry for them.
Try telling that to the wife or child of the guy who was propelled through the windshield of his car when he was hit by a drunkdriver. All that pain and suffering could have been avoided if there had been a law that forced that man to wear his seatbelt.

Granted, he still might not wear it. But it makes it more likely that he would.

That aside, if there were no seatbelt laws, then car manufacturers might not even install seatbelts in their cars. Perhaps they would make it an option that you pay out the nose for...


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Old 06-09-2003, 03:01 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by ShockV1.89
That aside, if there were no seatbelt laws, then car manufacturers might not even install seatbelts in their cars. Perhaps they would make it an option that you pay out the nose for...
Why would they ever do that? They made seatbelts in cars LONG before there were laws about wearing them. Car dealers want to make their cars as safe as possible so that people will buy THEIR cars because they are safer.

That family should have pushed their father/husband to wear his seatbelt, because they KNEW it could save his life.



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Old 06-09-2003, 03:50 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by ET Warrior
That family should have pushed their father/husband to wear his seatbelt, because they KNEW it could save his life.
But the state can't push it?

Yes, it should be required by law. It's such a small thing, it doesn't hurt, it takes no time to do and you'll be all the better for it. I can't imagine why people would want to drive without it.

It's like those lines on train stations where they mark how close to the rails you can go before the train stops. Surely it's up to people themselves to determine how far they're willing to risk their own life?


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Old 06-09-2003, 04:37 PM   #12
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seatbelts give me a rash. i still wear it but it gives me a horrible rash and i break out. so they do hurt me. at least those over the shoulder ones. i don't like the idea of someone telling me to do things but i mean if it effects the people pushing me that's ok(like family) but the gov. won't miss me... unless they want me to be part of their nationwide army recruitment to take over the world.


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Old 06-09-2003, 04:40 PM   #13
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Originally posted by InsaneSith
seatbelts give me a rash. i still wear it but it gives me a horrible rash and i break out. so they do hurt me.
I stand corrected.

Me wrong.


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Old 06-10-2003, 06:16 PM   #14
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but the gov. won't miss me... unless they want me to be part of their nationwide army recruitment to take over the world.

I will miss you Insane, and who knows maybe I am part of the govt.


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Old 06-10-2003, 07:27 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by InsaneSith
but the gov. won't miss me... unless they want me to be part of their nationwide army recruitment to take over the world.
Sure they will. You pay your taxes, right? Any goverment's job is to take care of the people, and to do so, they are dependent on the people itself. This is why there is a law that makes you wear a seatbelt, because it's the goverment's job and because the goverment needs you. What would a goverment be without its people?

And in any case, just think of what any goverment does to protect its people. Hell, all laws are to protect them, so why not have a law that forces people to take responsibility for themselves if they can't do it without the goverment's help?


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Old 06-11-2003, 12:43 PM   #16
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Yes.

While ET Warrior is right, but it's not right on the other hand. Think if I chrashed up in the *** (I blanked out the word myself ) of yours, and you flew through the front window and, of course, died. Would I have good feelings after that? Sure not. I would blame myself for killing a fellow forumer

Airbag does also have an effect (that's why they're equipped )


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Old 06-11-2003, 01:47 PM   #17
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But how often does anyone fly through TWO windshields with enough force to kill another person?

I've never heard of that happening.

I just dont think we should be responsible for other people's stupidity. If i'm in a hurry and my seatbelt doesn't buckle right and comes undone while i'm driving, (which has happened to me) I dont think I should get a ticket.



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Old 06-11-2003, 04:06 PM   #18
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I said YOU!!! flew through the window...But you're right...Just my opinion!


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Old 06-11-2003, 08:17 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by ET Warrior

I just dont think we should be responsible for other people's stupidity. If i'm in a hurry and my seatbelt doesn't buckle right and comes undone while i'm driving, (which has happened to me) I dont think I should get a ticket.
People does not deserve to die due to stupidity. People with a lower-than-average IQ still has the right to live. And just because they aren't smart enough to wear a seatbelt unless there is a law about it, does not mean we should just forget about them and let casualties in car accidents go way up.

If your seatbelt comes undone while driving, then you probably didn't take enough time to fasten it. And in any way, it will be extremely easy to fasten it again. I think you should get a ticket if you are caught without belt on.

But there is one thing that's a bit strange though. There is a law tat forces us to use seat belts. Yet, there are no laws that forces us to wear helmets when biking. I really think there should be a law that makes people use bike helmets. We see way too many serious damages due to biking that could be avoided if people were wearing helmets.


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Old 06-11-2003, 11:44 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by Breton
Sure they will. You pay your taxes, right? Any goverment's job is to take care of the people, and to do so, they are dependent on the people itself. This is why there is a law that makes you wear a seatbelt, because it's the goverment's job and because the goverment needs you. What would a goverment be without its people?

And in any case, just think of what any goverment does to protect its people. Hell, all laws are to protect them, so why not have a law that forces people to take responsibility for themselves if they can't do it without the goverment's help?
i don't pay taxes. well not in my name. i help my parents out sometimes when they don't have all the money for it. its usually no more than 200 dollars though.


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Old 06-11-2003, 11:46 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by Echuu Shen-Jon
Yes.

While ET Warrior is right, but it's not right on the other hand. Think if I chrashed up in the *** (I blanked out the word myself ) of yours, and you flew through the front window and, of course, died. Would I have good feelings after that? Sure not. I would blame myself for killing a fellow forumer

Airbag does also have an effect (that's why they're equipped )
airbags have killed more people under the age of 30 than it has saved. just a friendly statistic i got from doing research on safety when i was in the 8th grade.


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Old 06-12-2003, 12:21 PM   #22
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Quote:
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airbags have killed more people under the age of 30 than it has saved. just a friendly statistic i got from doing research on safety when i was in the 8th grade.
Whaaaaaaaaaaaaat???????? But it saved my father!!


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Old 06-12-2003, 04:13 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by Breton
If your seatbelt comes undone while driving, then you probably didn't take enough time to fasten it. And in any way, it will be extremely easy to fasten it again. I think you should get a ticket if you are caught without belt on.
Of cousre it's because I didn't take enough time to fasten it. And you know what? It's my own damn fault. If I die it's MY fault, and nobody elses. And lets say that my seatbelt comes undone while I'm driving, and since I'm so freakin worried about getting a stupid ticket about it I take one hand off the wheel to pull it back across me, but while my attention is sorta divided a little kid runs out in the street after a ball, the extra fraction of a second of reaction time i lose because i'm not paying full attention to the road could cost that innocent kid his/her life.

An unlikely scenario, but possible. Far more likely than me killing somebody else because I wasn't wearing a seatbelt and got ejected out of the car.

Quote:
People does not deserve to die due to stupidity. People with a lower-than-average IQ still has the right to live. And just because they aren't smart enough to wear a seatbelt unless there is a law about it, does not mean we should just forget about them and let casualties in car accidents go way up.
But shouldn't people be responsible for themselves? At what point do we draw the line between things we should be responsible for and things the government should. MANY people die from AIDS and other STD's every year. Should the government make a law that you HAVE to wear a condom during intercourse unless you and your partner both have blood tests that prove you don't have any STD's? Should there be a law that houses with small children and babies cannot have sharp corners or objects that the child could fall and hurt themself on?



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Old 06-12-2003, 05:17 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by ET Warrior
Of cousre it's because I didn't take enough time to fasten it. And you know what? It's my own damn fault. If I die it's MY fault, and nobody elses.
Of course it's your fault. That's why you get a ticket. If it was someone else's fault, then it would be unfair if you were punished for it.

If you rob a bank, that's your own damn fault. Yet, those actions are illegal because it does not only hurt yourself. That's the same with not wearing seat belts. If you die due to that, then it would clearly go out of your family and friends, and they do not deserve such pain because of your carelessness. Also, if you die, that would hurt the goverment.

Quote:
But shouldn't people be responsible for themselves? At what point do we draw the line between things we should be responsible for and things the government should. MANY people die from AIDS and other STD's every year. Should the government make a law that you HAVE to wear a condom during intercourse unless you and your partner both have blood tests that prove you don't have any STD's? Should there be a law that houses with small children and babies cannot have sharp corners or objects that the child could fall and hurt themself on?
People should indeed be responsible for themselves. But some people simply can't be responsible for themselves. That's where laws come in. They forces them to actually be responsible for themselves. Such a law will certainly not hurt people who can take responsibility for themselves, since they would use a seat belt anyway.


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Old 06-12-2003, 09:22 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by Breton
Of course it's your fault. That's why you get a ticket. If it was someone else's fault, then it would be unfair if you were punished for it.
But WHY should I get a ticket if i'm not endangering anyone else? I'm still driving perfectly safely.



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Old 06-13-2003, 12:16 AM   #26
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It's not YOU ET, but it's others. I've heard many people say "I'm a very good driver. I'm a very safe driver. Blah Blah Blah..." You may be a perfectly safe driver but it's other reckless drivers that cause crashes.


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Old 06-13-2003, 03:00 AM   #27
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I KNOW it's the other drivers that will cause the accident. What I am saying is that my not wearing a seatbelt in NO way affects the safety of ANYONE else, and therefore it is NOT the governments business to make me wear a seatbelt.



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Old 06-13-2003, 03:50 AM   #28
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oOo I misunderstood you there.


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Old 06-13-2003, 11:14 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally posted by ET Warrior
But WHY should I get a ticket if i'm not endangering anyone else? I'm still driving perfectly safely.
Because you are endangering yourself. The seat belt law is a law to protect you from yourself. This is also why suicide is illegal.

Quote:
I KNOW it's the other drivers that will cause the accident. What I am saying is that my not wearing a seatbelt in NO way affects the safety of ANYONE else, and therefore it is NOT the governments business to make me wear a seatbelt.
But it is. They excist to ensure the people's safety. Making them wearing seat belts is precisely that.


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Old 06-14-2003, 04:51 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by Breton
Because you are endangering yourself. The seat belt law is a law to protect you from yourself. This is also why suicide is illegal.
I find this to be f***** up. Why don't I have the right to take my life into my own hands? Why is the government so damned interested in protecting me, but they will still make me register for the draft so that I might have to go fight and DIE in a war?

Quote:
But it is. They excist to ensure the people's safety. Making them wearing seat belts is precisely that.
And just THINK how safe we'll all be when we're under constant surveillance by the government at all times! Then people will ALL be safe ALL the time.



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Old 06-14-2003, 12:53 PM   #31
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im eating a huge fries and grilled burger, soaking in it's runny fat (or as i call it a heart attack on a bun) I am endangering myself by taking away those few extra years and giving myself a greater chance of suffering from a heart attack. now im walking up very old stairs that could break. now im swimming, i could drown. see everything we do could kill us. hell even walking there is a chance a plane will crash and hit us. there is always a chance that we could die.why not make all that crap illegal? say i'm swimming and i hit my head on the wall and knock myself unconcious i will drown. should they make swimming illegal because of that, or maybe make us wear "Water Helmets"?
there was a law that they wanted to make bikers wear helmets and knee and elbow pads.what they are doing is making children weak. like those parents that overreact because their kid coughed so they take the kid to the emergency room and say i think my kid is dying. and yes that does happen... and quite alot, atleast here where i live.


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Old 06-14-2003, 12:55 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally posted by ET Warrior
I find this to be f***** up. Why don't I have the right to take my life into my own hands? Why is the government so damned interested in protecting me, but they will still make me register for the draft so that I might have to go fight and DIE in a war?



And just THINK how safe we'll all be when we're under constant surveillance by the government at all times! Then people will ALL be safe ALL the time.
they want you to grow and breed children so they can make those kids soldiers so they can die "protecting" our rights in some war agains rhode island


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Old 06-14-2003, 12:56 PM   #33
ShockV1.89
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And just THINK how safe we'll all be when we're under constant surveillance by the government at all times! Then people will ALL be safe ALL the time.
Am I seeing a lead into a giant conspiracy theory, where the government is conspiring to take away all our rights, and it started with seatbelt laws?

I hate these.....


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Old 06-14-2003, 02:32 PM   #34
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Originally posted by ET Warrior
I find this to be f***** up. Why don't I have the right to take my life into my own hands?
Because you being dead will harm others. Not only family/friends, but it is your tax money that keeps the country up and running. And then you have all the expenses with funeral and paperwork.

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im eating a huge fries and grilled burger, soaking in it's runny fat (or as i call it a heart attack on a bun) I am endangering myself by taking away those few extra years and giving myself a greater chance of suffering from a heart attack. now im walking up very old stairs that could break. now im swimming, i could drown. see everything we do could kill us. hell even walking there is a chance a plane will crash and hit us. there is always a chance that we could die.why not make all that crap illegal? say i'm swimming and i hit my head on the wall and knock myself unconcious i will drown. should they make swimming illegal because of that, or maybe make us wear "Water Helmets"?
You eat burger because you think it is good. You walk old stairs because you need to get up/down. You swin because it is fun and healthy. But I really can't see the bloody fun in playing with death by not wearing seat belt.

And perhaps you should compare the number of people who dies due to lack of seat belt and those who die due to hitting their head in a swimming pool.


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Old 06-14-2003, 03:44 PM   #35
ET Warrior
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Quote:
Originally posted by ShockV1.89
Am I seeing a lead into a giant conspiracy theory, where the government is conspiring to take away all our rights, and it started with seatbelt laws?

I hate these.....
Not really a lead, just pointing out that giving up freedoms for a feeling of safety COULD eventually lead to this.

Quote:
Because you being dead will harm others. Not only family/friends, but it is your tax money that keeps the country up and running. And then you have all the expenses with funeral and paperwork.
My being dead will not HARM them, it will sadden them and cause them grief, but they will recover. I've lost 2 friends in car accidents, they were wearing seatbelts but they still died, but it doesn't haunt me every day. I cried a lot when it happened, but life goes on.
And the amount of money lost in tax dollars will be countered by both money they save on paying my social security were I to grow older, and the fact that more kids are born than people Die each year. The government can lose me and not care.

Quote:
You eat burger because you think it is good. You walk old stairs because you need to get up/down. You swin because it is fun and healthy. But I really can't see the bloody fun in playing with death by not wearing seat belt.
While eating that burger may be good, if I eat nothing but fast food I'm almost 100% guaranteed to die early of a heart attack. So if the government needs me alive so much for their taxes why don't they make me eat healthy?

What about going bungie jumping or sky diving? People can die EASILY from those, they are very dangerous. If the cord breaks or the chute doesn't open......................................



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Old 06-15-2003, 12:54 AM   #36
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wait... so there is not seat belt laws in the states? Wow! I am just so used to it I thought every country had one!

and as for this post:
Quote:
Originally posted by Solbe M'ko
We have a law about seatbelts in Canada. It's just an attempt to get more funds for the state (just like Photo-Radar), so that Jean can spend taxpayer dollars on a new private jet. I love this country, but I have a great distrust of our government.

Wow. nice to know your know your politics!

NOTE: that was sarcastic.

My dad works for the DND (Department of National Defense) and his job is to book and coordinate all those flights needed for the members of parlement. Those news planes you are complaining were in GREAT NEAD! The old planes were in ****ty state and couldnt fly quite far without the need of refueling.

Think of it this way. Would you rather have two new Challenger planes (allthough good planes, they are far from being fancy) which did cost a lot of money to the tax payers, but what planes DOESNT COST A LOT OF MONEY.

Here are the options:
- would you rather have the government buy two really expansive 747 airplanes with every possible high tech toys that gives you the ability to run a country on it that costs billions of dollars to maintain and operate... sorta like what the USA has.

- or would you rather get two smaller type airplanes that pretty much the exact commercial duplicate that any nation airline has.

I know a lot about Canadian politics and fairly a lot about internation affairs. Hell, if i dont know something i ask my girlfriend. she's studying political science. Sorry if i seem mean or rude, but i just really get into it when someone talks about national Canadian politics and get the facts wrong.


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Old 06-16-2003, 01:18 AM   #37
El Sitherino
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there is. we just think it shouldn't be. atleast i don't think there should be.


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Old 06-16-2003, 03:10 AM   #38
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A huge driving force in the seatbelt laws of the U.S. (and probably other countries as well) is the Insurance Industry. This is the same driving force behind the Helmet Laws, especially with child bicyclists.

If you think about it, it makes good sense: the number of accidents involving automobiles has increased exponentially since the advent of the automobile itself. The amount of money lost by insurance companies to the victims of accidents is significant. Studies show clearly that seatbelts save FAR MORE lives and avoid FAR MORE injuries than in people who don't use them.

The more people who wear seatbelts, the less death and injury, the less money paid by the insurance companies. All this translates into less money I have to pay in my insurance premiums each quarter.

The current drive to "click-it or ticket" is undoubtedly a direct result of lobbying by the Insurance Industry.

Still, I think that as long as you don't have passengers, seatbelts should be voluntary. Any and all passengers should be wearing them, however, and the driver should be the one held accountable for tickets in that case.

That's just my opinion. I wear the sh*t out of my seat belt. :-)


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Old 06-16-2003, 04:52 AM   #39
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I never thought about the Insurance companies......that is a good point, less car accidents = less money I pay for insurance.....


And I agree that it's the drivers responsibility to make his/her passengers wear seatbelts, because then you ARE in control of their lives and it's your job to protect them.



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Old 07-02-2003, 04:44 PM   #40
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Must admit I'm kind of with ET Warrior here, Seatbelts should be worn through choice. However i feel far more strongly that human life is precious so.... I voted yes.

However, people's life insurance should be void if they die in a crash with no belt on, after all they know the risks.

Sometimes I wear mine, sometimes i dont, it depends who is driving.


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