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Old 07-04-2003, 01:42 AM   #41
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I havent read anyone elses reply and I'm not going to I'm just going to state mine. First of All I do not hate anyone.

My opinion on Homosexuals or bisexuals well they are people and deserve the same repect I would give to any other person. I jugde people on their actions and word not their preferences. Ido however believe that homosexuality is unnatural. The main reason i believe this is beacuse I've read somewhere that their was studies originally when homosexual started openly comming out that showed clear evidence of mixed up Brain chemistry compared to heterosexual. If someone could find these studies or studies that disprove it please post it so I could read it.

Second reason I think its unnatural is because of the position many different Bibles have on homosexuality. Yes I'm religious but I do not believe in ANY organised religion as I consider that they are ALL corupt and no longer do as they preach!

Anyway thats my say.



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Old 07-04-2003, 02:11 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally posted by Thrackan Solo
But I really hate it when gay men hit on straight men.
Hey, if a guy goes up to you and buys you a beer, dont complain. its a free beer. and if you find it annoying then just maybe you just felt what most girls feel when a guy hits on them, especially at bars. not every girls go to bars to get hitched, they go there to have fun with friends.

As for the constant comments about homosexuality being unatural. how about this:

Your O' Mighty God has created the girafe. The wonderfull girafe with that o so tall neck. The Girafe is known to have homosexual sex quite often. Same with primates.

So if god created the girafes and apes and allows them to instinctivly (sp?) have gay sex, then why would he make it a"sin" for man kind to be gay?

I support the homosexual community world wide. I have friends who invited me to the Pride parades and I went to support them. So if I have sin according to your God then I show him the finger and tell him to get off my lawn. I'm sorry to sound so pissed off but I am. Who gives the right for an organised religious community to dictate how the life of someone who is NOT part of THAT community that they will burn in the afterlife.

And as for Die Another Day, I support you. and I admire your courage to stand before the people who hate you. Just like Rosa Parks did when she took a seat at the front of a bus. Be Proud. And I am curious, how does your country treat the homosexual community? I know Canada, Belguim and one other country (dont remember which) allows gay mariage. But how does the UK treat this case? I know Europe is a lot more open to change and differences. But what is its stance on homosexuality? I'm curious.


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Old 07-04-2003, 02:56 AM   #43
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I'm not jumping in any debates, I'm just stating my opinion, take it for what it's worth...

God taught us, above all, to love each other. I believe it went something like "Love thy neighbor as you love thyself." That is the overwhelming message I get from the Bible. Love unconditionally.

We must also remember, as others have pointed out, that the Bible IS a book writen by MAN from stories passed down for years. The Bible has been through many revisions to suit different people (why do you think the newest interpretation is called the King James Version?). Stories can be easily altered to suit the views and beliefs of the people telling the stories. And as such, you must make your own interpretations. Arguing over "What the Bible means" is like arguing over what your favorite food is. Some people will agree and many others will have a different opinion. It is pointless, because it means different things to different people and can be used to prove many different and conflicting points.

Believe what you will and no one should/does have the right to tell you to do otherwise.




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Old 07-04-2003, 03:55 AM   #44
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these forums are about expressing views and opinions, that's what i did and anyone who doesn't like it can sit down and shut up, that's one of my personal feelings

Die Another Day already sent me a PM saying that i should think before i say, too late, i already said it and that's what i feel, i'm not going to church up my beliefs for the best interest of this community when my HOME community has lots of influences (teens mostly) that go against gays, i have seen a few adults but not many, especially not my parents, but then again, i'm not them.

i didn't mean for my words to be offensive but i will not apologize for them, that's my statement and those are my beliefs, gays are fine as long as they don't hit on me or anything like that. these guys were standing out in the crowd and wonder why they get riddled like that? big mystery (ya right) if gays don't want to be made fun of or belittled then they need to understand that walking around looking like they're gonna film a porno is NOT a good way to go about mickey's house

EDIT: for the record, i'm not a homophobe, my freshman year of high school i dove w/a kid (we all knew he was gay but he denied it) and i was friends w/him, probably still would be but we just quit talking to each other, and also, my oldest bro and only sis have like 4-5 friends who are gay and i get along w/them just fine BECAUSE they don't stare at me like they wanna do me right there and they just act and dress like normal people, so THOSE kinds of gay people are alright


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Old 07-04-2003, 04:48 AM   #45
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The thing I've noticed about lesbians is that the ones in real life look nothing like the ones in the movies we used to watch when I was in the Army.... they're a little more.... manly.


All in all, after reading this rather lengthy thread, I see that we are all discussing how we, as individuals, feel. The sentiments of our fellow persons, in particular, homosexual persons, aren't really the issue of discussion.

We worry about how we feel. I see anger, hatred, guilt (about faith or about the treatment of gays), frustration, and even dispair.

All of our feelings that reflect this are based on the constructs of our cultures and family values... religion is a construct of culture, so it's included in that description.

What we didn't do is look at this objectively. Who cares if its "unnatural" or whether some people are born that way (which there is evidence to support this, btw) or whether god likes it or not? These are all irrelevant.

What is relevant, is what affect homosexuality has upon a society.

Can it destroy a society? Sure. But only if it were contagious. Then it could eliminate our species ability to reproduce. There is absolutely no indication that homosexuality is a contagion, so we can throw that out.

Can it affect family values? I don't see how. If you raise you children to embrace cultures that run counter to your own, is this not a positive value? Not being a contagion, it is unlikely that my children will catch it. If I teach my children that sexual intercourse at an early age is inappropriate and/or risky behavior, does that not include homosexual contact? Is open display of affection b/w genders acceptable in public? Then why should it be different when it is within genders? (no matter how you answered the former question, the answer to the latter is still relevant).

Can it benefit a society? I don't see how a society cannot benefit. Population growth is problematic in many ways, so a significant percentage of a population that is not reproducing is beneficial. For some reason, a trends in homosexuality seem to parallel, at least loosely, the art districts of many cities: their income and aesthetic benefits are obvious. Regardless, as an employed member of a society, they offer revenue in the way of taxes, consumer goods purchase, and service industry trade.

The classic idea of the homosexual being the cause/perpetuator of the AIDS crisis is simply not true. While the risks in this community are higher, there is a quick rising trend in the African American community, particularly among socio-economically deprived African American males in urban or semi-urban areas.

Discard all the nonesense that's floating around your brains due to society, culture, family and religion (each of these also has good values to offer... keep them, just discard the nonsense) and use some critical thinking skills. Analyze... scrutinize.... question... then, and only then, decide for yourself.

It is truly sad how hatred begets hatred.


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Old 07-04-2003, 09:46 AM   #46
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wholeheartedly agreed.

I would like to add:-
The bible(s) and religions for that matter are responsible for more biggotry and hatred than anything else on earth.

The sooner the religious zealots get it into their thick heads that most of the bible is fiction and misguided at best then we can start truly treating people fairly and with equallity.

btw, i dunno who said it and its unimportant, but the dude that feels uncomfortable when gay men look at him, should probably re-examine his sexuality. Personally i would feel flattered if a man or a woman was checking me out.

for the record there are gay animals too, so to say its un-natural is utter bollocks.

Personally i find homosexuality interesting, i really can not see how a man could find another man attractive, for that matter how do women find men attractive?

Also its fair to say that gay people have had to put up with a lot of crap from the ignorant and as such they are brave people for being able to embrace their true self in a world that is clearly against them.


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Old 07-04-2003, 10:27 AM   #47
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I don't want anyone to get mad at me so im gonna be very vague, I have truly never seen a gay man, ive only seen lesbians at my high school, some people speculate on this one guy but im not sure and for the most part hes really nice. Anyways from what i see on Tv and hear gay people are not gonna rape you or touch you up if yur not one going to agree to it, there people liek you or me, just different sexual prefrence. I think people should just drop the subject and start to concern them selves on more important issues like the State of emerrgency in america, Kids being kidnapped, alot of kids. anyways for the record I'm not Gay, I'm not against Gays, alot of people think if your not against them your one of them but thats not my case, and im not gonna get into any Bible quotes or anything because first, the bible does say alot of things, some even contradicting itself and i never read the bible i only heard people read passages.


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Old 07-04-2003, 12:12 PM   #48
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Okay, I'm going to keep this brief, because it's winding me up just thinking about it.
I freely admit now I've only read about halfway down the thread, I just need to post my feelings now. So I apologise if my points have been made by anyone in the last few posts.

Mainly, the Disneyland thing.
As has already been expressed, what kind of action is that?
1. You can't stop people going to a 'family' place because they happen to be gay. These people have families too, you know? Even if they're not there with their families, they so still know what families are and how to conduct themselves in public. Unlike other people.
2. Who are you to say what people can wear? If a bodybuilder is wearing a 'stereotypical' muscle-vest, or a punk is wearing spikes and torn jeans, do you start yelling at them? Social groups are identifiable in many ways, one of the primary ones is how they dress. As has been said, you don't complain when you see a girl in a bikini do you?
3. Even if they were kissing in public, it's not like they're having sex on the floor in front of Mickey Mouse is it? Their behaviour is no worse than that of any couple who are showing love and affection for each other. Homosexual couples can remain in loving, monogomous relationships you know.
Quote:
straight men don't wanna have to fight off the advances of guys
4. Do you realise how vain it is to think "Oh, there's a gay man, he must fancy me. He's probably thinking about having sex with me right now."
Do you instantly lust after every female you see? If you do find them attractive, do you then feel compelled to go and hit on them, regardless of how they are reacting?
No.

Next up, a lot of people are saying "I'm not scared of gay people":
ho·mo·pho·bi·a
n.
1. Fear of or contempt for lesbians and gay men.
2. Behavior based on such a feeling.
Although the 'phobia' is a part of the word, it isn't just being scared of gay people, that would be ridiculous: Who's scared of plumbers? Or actors?
As the definition, it's the general negative attitude to the gay community.
A lot of which is in this thread.

And lastly:
Quote:
Originally posted by Thrackan Solo
Well, quite frankly, the Bible clearly says a man shall not sleep with a man the way a man sleeps with a woman.
This is the Bible that told us we'd go to Hell if we ate meat on a Friday isn't it?
I always understood the principles of Christianity to be about fellowship and getting on with each other. But that's another thread.
I don't know how many of you outside the UK will have heard about this, but I found this story to be very interesting.
Basically, Rowan Williams is set to be ordained Bishop of Reading in October, and half the country's up in arms because he's gay. Bear in mind that by the time the plans went ahead for this, it had been approved by The Queen. Even the Queen of England has a sensible attitude towards this, and look at her reputation for being staid and old-fashioned! The man loves God enough to devote his life spreading the faith, and that's not good enough for half of the church-leaders.
Anyone want to buy tickets for a stoning?

Anyways, I've ranted on for far too long on this. Thanks for reading. I only want to add that I do respect all of your opinions, including the ones that I don't/can't agree on. At least you're making your voice heard, and that's what it's about.
Big peace all,
B.




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Old 07-04-2003, 12:29 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally posted by ep2 Anakin
these forums are about expressing views and opinions, that's what i did and anyone who doesn't like it can sit down and shut up, that's one of my personal feelings

Die Another Day already sent me a PM saying that i should think before i say, too late, i already said it and that's what i feel, i'm not going to church up my beliefs for the best interest of this community when my HOME community has lots of influences (teens mostly) that go against gays, i have seen a few adults but not many, especially not my parents, but then again, i'm not them.

i didn't mean for my words to be offensive but i will not apologize for them, that's my statement and those are my beliefs, gays are fine as long as they don't hit on me or anything like that. these guys were standing out in the crowd and wonder why they get riddled like that? big mystery (ya right) if gays don't want to be made fun of or belittled then they need to understand that walking around looking like they're gonna film a porno is NOT a good way to go about mickey's house

EDIT: for the record, i'm not a homophobe, my freshman year of high school i dove w/a kid (we all knew he was gay but he denied it) and i was friends w/him, probably still would be but we just quit talking to each other, and also, my oldest bro and only sis have like 4-5 friends who are gay and i get along w/them just fine BECAUSE they don't stare at me like they wanna do me right there and they just act and dress like normal people, so THOSE kinds of gay people are alright
they should have the right to wear what they want. i hate people telling me that i shouldn't have a mohawk and wear raggy clothes. this is what i like wearing. it's comfortable to me. it expresses my attitude and my personality. i belive i should have the right to wear what i want. it's not like they were walking around naked "riding" eachother. so stop bitching about it please. and like others have said you brought more attention to it bye yelling. not to mention you are just escalating the problems of the world.



just so you know. I'm a punker. i wear spiked bracelets, torn jeans, spiked leather jackets, i used to have a mohawk until i needed to shave it off to get hired for a job. but i still spike up my hair. i have a chain belt. if you ever told me to wear something else i'd tell you to rethink your life. stop making things negative. be happy. i do and i'm a better person for it. i don't fixate on the negatives.


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Old 07-04-2003, 12:30 PM   #50
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for the record there are gay animals too, so to say its un-natural is utter bollocks.
Please name one, if not some unpleasent mutation, I would agree with you then. I heard there are only sexual and asexual replication, gay animals can't replicate themselves, while everything we know bout nature says that it wants to consume and multiply, if it doesn't it's eliminated by natural selection. Do gay animals gene replicate themselves, I think they have no such opportunity, so they live and die and nothing more.
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Old 07-04-2003, 12:55 PM   #51
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The Bible is FULL OF contradictions. According to it, God kills every first-born in Egypt and then drowns a battalion of the Egyptian army. Then he tells Moses that it is wrong to kill.
It is wrong for humans to kill.But God made us, why cant God take us away? I believe that whatever happens is for Gods will and is good in the end for Christians.


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Old 07-04-2003, 01:05 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally posted by Thrackan Solo
I believe that whatever happens is for Gods will and is good in the end for Christians.
Well gay people 'happened' therefore that is God's will.
He may have destroyed Soddom and Gomorrah, but he hasn't spent every day since killing people simply for being gay.
Therefore it is God's will that there are gay people. QED.

Accept it as such.

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Old 07-04-2003, 01:16 PM   #53
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Originally posted by BLaCKouT_1138
Well gay people 'happened' therefore that is God's will.
He may have destroyed Soddom and Gomorrah, but he hasn't spent every day since killing people simply for being gay.
Therefore it is God's will that there are gay people. QED.

Accept it as such.

B.
No, times have changed since the Old Testament. God doesnt intervene as much as he used to.

And gay bashing just happened so accept it as such You can use that argument for abuot anything


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Old 07-04-2003, 01:30 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally posted by Homuncul
Please name one, if not some unpleasent mutation, I would agree with you then. I heard there are only sexual and asexual replication, gay animals can't replicate themselves, while everything we know bout nature says that it wants to consume and multiply, if it doesn't it's eliminated by natural selection. Do gay animals gene replicate themselves, I think they have no such opportunity, so they live and die and nothing more.
frogs and toads can reproduce having gay sex. but only on rare occasions such as harvest moons and drought. watch jurassic park. also they have gay sex store the sperm transmorph into a "female"(they actually just form eggs to be fertalized)


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Old 07-04-2003, 02:57 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally posted by Thrackan Solo
No, times have changed since the Old Testament. God doesnt intervene as much as he used to.
Correct. Times have changed since the New Testament as well.

Quote:
Originally posted by Thrackan Solo
And gay bashing just happened so accept it as such
I don't share your religious beliefs Thrackan. Therefore I don't have to accept 'God's Will'.
'Gay bashing' is wrong. Period.
It's up there with racism.

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Old 07-04-2003, 03:01 PM   #56
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First of all, I know that what I am about to say will offend many people in here. I don't care - almost half of you have succeded in offending me in this thread, and I'm merely stating an opinion.

The Bible is a load of rubbish.

I'm not just saying this because you are using it to back up your arguments, oh no. I've always held religion in the exact same view - rubbish. I don't believe in a God, and I don't worship or practice any faith. So, anyone coming to me arguing with religion can walk straight back out again... bye now.

As for raising children who have two fathers, I think that could be viewed as totally wrong by a majority. However, here in Great Britain, a gay couple have adopted a child successfully. I can't see how this affects the child in the long run - after all, you are BORN homosexual, so what can having two fathers do to you? Nothing. Myself and Anthony have no plans to start a family, and I can't see that changing. I don't really get on well with kids, anyway (they vomit, cry and cost money).
The situation in Great Britain is one of tolerance. There are more 'gay bars' here in London than you can shake a stick at (excuse the pun). Generally, people don't mind, or care, what goes on behind closed doors, as long as it doesn't affect them. I can live with that. My family have been a great support, especially my mother, who didn't like the fact at first but realised I was still her son at the end of the day, whatever my sexuality.

Oh, and Jah Warrior, I have to agree - lesbians scare the hell out of me! At least I have the sense to sleep with men... no offence to any lesbians out there, I'm sure you're perfectly nice people.

I'm getting the general picture that many of you simply don't believe in homosexuality. It's not that you hate gay people, and well done you. I can see that, if your religion says it's wrong, you won't agree with the concept. Fine, absolutely fine... just remember that not all gay guys are like me - I know a guy who is deeply religious and homosexual at the same time. He gets along perfectly, many of the people at his church accepting him for what he is - a fellow man.
At the end of the day, it doesn't matter who you love. You could sleep with guys or girls, but it's the person inside the counts. Anthony is a funny, charming, generous and happy person, but just because he's homosexual shouldn't automatically make him evil, or wrong, or a criminal of some sort. No-one here knew I was gay until yesterday, and you didn't need to... people were still nice to me, joking and playing the odd RPG. At the end of the day, I'm still me. No change. Me.

Oh, and another preconception that can be destroyed here and now - just because I'm gay, doesn't make me camp or woman-like. We don't all run round wearing flowery dresses shouting in high-pitched voices. Before I told people, no-one had the slightest idea that I was a homosexual. I actually walked into a bar once (exclusively for gay men) and found everyone staring at me, thinking I wasn't gay at all.
I love beer, I watch football, I know all about cars and nothing about gardening. Still a guy, not some dangerous half-breed.

I do find it funny, though - my favourite film character, James Bond, is possibly the straightest man in the universe! Interesting, no?


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I guess I'll die another day, it's not my time to go.

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I think I'll find another way, it's not my time to go.
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Old 07-04-2003, 03:40 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally posted by Die Another Day
There are more 'gay bars' here in London than you can shake a stick at (excuse the pun).
Ouch. Sorry, no excuse.


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Old 07-04-2003, 04:43 PM   #58
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As for Anakin's fear of gays hitting on straight men, I'd say the fear is unfounded. Would you hit on lesbians as well? What if you were getting all worked up over girl and in the middle of the conversation, she calmly says that her sexual preference unfortunately excludes you - would you then politely exit, or continue pestering her?

...'Coz I can you tell you right now that that's what gay men feel about you, and they sure aren't monstrous rapists, just like you aren't either.


Now, for the "unnatural" argument: Imagine if you and your heterosexuality were in the minority. Everyone around you was telling you that it's unnatural to love the opposite sex. But you couldn't understand it. They wanted you to love men, even though you had a girlfriend and couldn't imagine being with other men. You had always felt this way, even though all the movies and books had told you it was the other way around. It is unnatural, they say - people should stick to their own sex, just like they had always done. Yet you still couldn't understand it, it just felt awkward to love other men that way - like being told that rocks are indeed a nourishing food source. It feels so wrong, on a gut level, to eat those rocks and love those men.

That's how those unnatural, other people are feeling about this injustice. It's very natural for them, just like you couldn't possibly take someone serious if they told you to quit loving girls and start loving boys.


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Old 07-04-2003, 08:25 PM   #59
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Because I believe it is wrong. How am I being a hypocrit for stating my opinion? That is the exact OPPOSITE of a hypocrite.
Because first you bashed someone else, namely the people who are attracted to their own gender, and then you react to C'Jais when he attacks you for it.

If you attacked someone, you've got to tolerate that someone attacks you. If you can't stand the fact that people are going to answer you, don't post.

Quote:
Now, for the "unnatural" argument: Imagine if you and your heterosexuality were in the minority. Everyone around you was telling you that it's unnatural to love the opposite sex. But you couldn't understand it. They wanted you to love men, even though you had a girlfriend and couldn't imagine being with other men. You had always felt this way, even though all the movies and books had told you it was the other way around. It is unnatural, they say - people should stick to their own sex, just like they had always done. Yet you still couldn't understand it, it just felt awkward to love other men that way - like being told that rocks are indeed a nourishing food source. It feels so wrong, on a gut level, to eat those rocks and love those men.
Beutiful.

I believe that one of the things that should be done is that should be done is ban teaching in christian private schools about the negative parts of "gayness". Sure, they are allowed to teach the Bible, but look at laws that forbid a teacher to say bad things about different ethnic groups and culture groups, such as African-Americans. How long after it came out do you think people would start reacting when it came out? Private school or not, the teacher would get attacked for breaking the law by insulting an ethnic group -[i]even if he was quoting the Bible or the writings of some other religious/sect. So how can a christian fanatic teacher get away with subtly teaching kids to hate homosexuals?

Name one teacher who's gotten away with being reported for saying stuff like "all Nigerians are going to Hell for being Nigerians"?

PS: Yes, I heard about the bishop in the UK. I also heard about a minister in Norway (not as in priest-minister, but a minister in a political party) who had managed to rise to the powerful position of finance minister in his party. He even maintained this position after marrying a man (which is legal in Norway).

All I have to say is this: Aside from our right to excersise religion, I cannot see how the government thinks it's any of their business to dig around in our religious/private life. What's next, a law that forbids Muslims from refusing to faste? A law that forbids Buddhists and Hindus from eating meat?

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Old 07-04-2003, 11:11 PM   #60
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This thread is dragging me in, even though I know I should stay away.

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Originally posted by Homuncul
Please name one, if not some unpleasent mutation, I would agree with you then. I heard there are only sexual and asexual replication, gay animals can't replicate themselves, while everything we know bout nature says that it wants to consume and multiply, if it doesn't it's eliminated by natural selection. Do gay animals gene replicate themselves, I think they have no such opportunity, so they live and die and nothing more.
http://www.bidstrup.com/sodomy.htm

(note I don't agree with everything on that page, like that human beings are animals, but it's got what you asked for )


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Old 07-05-2003, 02:19 AM   #61
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The Bible is a load of rubbish.
I'm not just saying this because you are using it to back up your arguments, oh no. I've always held religion in the exact same view - rubbish. I don't believe in a God, and I don't worship or practice any faith. So, anyone coming to me arguing with religion can walk straight back out again... bye now.
If your going to say that the Bible is rubbish and what your saying is you dont like Christians then what is so wrong with me saying being gay is rubbish?



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Oh, and Jah Warrior, I have to agree - lesbians scare the hell out of me! At least I have the sense to sleep with men... no offence to any lesbians out there, I'm sure you're perfectly nice people.
How can you cry about people bashing you and not accepting you when you dont even like lesbians and say they are scary. Dont be a hypocrite.


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Old 07-05-2003, 03:19 AM   #62
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i dont like gays. i mean, its just isck. but im not homophobic. if a kid is gay, so what? i mean, os what if he is, thats his lifestyle and i got my own.

what im trying to say is even if u dont like someone for who they are, they still deserve some dignity.
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Old 07-05-2003, 04:34 AM   #63
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I dunno, dude, there are some lesbians I've met that freak me out too. I mean, mostly the real man-hating lesbians. Those ones that spike their hair and look like guys. Several I've met always acted really hostile towards me and any other man I saw them encounter.

Certainly not downing lesbians. But I'd rather have a guy wanting to sleep with me than a girl wanting to kill me.


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Old 07-05-2003, 09:26 AM   #64
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Not true InsaneSith, i know 2 lesbians and there nice quit people who never speak a word, just cause you a lesbian or gay doesn't mean you can't act like a guy/girl.


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Old 07-05-2003, 10:21 AM   #65
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Quote:
Originally posted by Homuncul
Please name one, if not some unpleasent mutation, I would agree with you then. I heard there are only sexual and asexual replication, gay animals can't replicate themselves, while everything we know bout nature says that it wants to consume and multiply, if it doesn't it's eliminated by natural selection. Do gay animals gene replicate themselves, I think they have no such opportunity, so they live and die and nothing more.
well i must say that i have no idea what the above means when translated to english, however:-

there are gay chimpanzees, horses, dogs... to name but a few. Its widely documented and has in fact been the subject of numerous natural history documentaries.


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Old 07-05-2003, 10:34 AM   #66
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Quote:
Originally posted by InsaneSith
frogs and toads can reproduce having gay sex. but only on rare occasions such as harvest moons and drought. watch jurassic park. also they have gay sex store the sperm transmorph into a "female"(they actually just form eggs to be fertalized)
once again. hom.. i beleieve you have been owned.


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Old 07-05-2003, 10:34 AM   #67
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Quote:
Originally posted by Arkum
i dont like gays. i mean, its just isck. but im not homophobic.
This is my favourite one so far!
I do get what you're saying about dignity, and letting someone lead their life an'all. But you've got to admit you didn't choose those words very well.

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dykes are bullish man hating lesbians.
I think InsaneSith meant the term 'dykes' as a type of lesbian, not an all-encompassing term for lesbians. Because there sure are different types.

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Old 07-05-2003, 10:35 AM   #68
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formerly i stated that butch lesbians scare me. This is not true really, its lesbians with MULLETS that scare me!!! you know! the ones on Trisha hehe.


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Old 07-05-2003, 10:38 AM   #69
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ANYONE with a mullet scares me.


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Old 07-05-2003, 10:44 AM   #70
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Quote:
Originally posted by InsaneSith
ANYONE with a mullet scares me.
right on, i'm an extreme mulletaphobic


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Old 07-05-2003, 10:56 AM   #71
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DAD quote:
Oh, and Jah Warrior, I have to agree - lesbians scare the hell out of me! At least I have the sense to sleep with men... no offence to any lesbians out there, I'm sure you're perfectly nice people.

Thrackan Quote:-
How can you cry about people bashing you and not accepting you when you dont even like lesbians and say they are scary. Dont be a hypocrite.

I'm sure that DAD will be first to correct me if i'm wrong, but i assume he means that he cannot see how a man can find a woman attractive let alone a woman finding a woman attractive. Its clearly just humour on DAD's part.

Come on peeps you simply must have a sense of humour in there somewhere.

BTW I'm just having a chat with my mum about the christian faith and homosexuality, she's a sunday school teacher so it could be either very funny or very interesting, maybe both


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Old 07-05-2003, 01:00 PM   #72
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If your going to say that the Bible is rubbish and what your saying is you dont like Christians then what is so wrong with me saying being gay is rubbish?
Perhaps it has to do with the fact that it is highly likely homosexuals are born as homosexuals. Homosexuality isn't a belief system in that case. Christianity, on the other hand is. This is but one of the worlds mainstream religions.

If, as some current findings indicate, homosexuality is true, then the real question is how will this benefit a species considering natural selection?

The answer might be found in looking at other species that have "self-destructive" (I use that term, since not being able to reproduce limits a species' ability to evolve). Bees are a good example. They've evolved over millions of years but have one flaw: once they sting another animal, they die. (the stinger pulls out nerve bundles, part of the digestive tract, etc.) So how could "suicide" be good for the species? The answer is that the hive itself is protected by a few sacrifices. The good of the many, outweighs the needs of the few so to speak.

One could look at homosexuality in much the same light. Overpopulation creates many problems for a society. There are many unwanted children in the world. There are many orphans of war and calamity. Food production is sufficient, but delivery and affordability is consistently problematic. For a few of our species to sacrifice themselves by not reproducing would seem to be a good thing.

Here's another thought: If homosexuality is hereditary, will not the gene pool clean itself up only if the practice is accepted and encouraged? If it is not hereditary (and it certainly cannot be contagious), then what is the problem? Homosexuals are largely interested only in Homosexuals. I've yet to see them go door-to-door asking to teach the skin-flute and spread their 'word.'

Another indication that homosexual and bisexual behavior can be beneficial to society would be to look at the bonobo monkey. This is a society that is almost exclusively bisexual. There is also very little in-house squabbles that occur. The sexual contacts between same sex monkies appears to be designed to create a harmonious society. The only problem I've noted about homosexuals in human society is the hatred that alleged non-homosexuals have toward them.

Revulsion is a cultural bias that is learned. Hatred comes from fear. One has to wonder what it is about homosexual behavior that is truly feared?


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Old 07-05-2003, 03:47 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally posted by SkinWalker
Perhaps it has to do with the fact that it is highly likely homosexuals are born as homosexuals. Homosexuality isn't a belief system in that case. Christianity, on the other hand is. This is but one of the worlds mainstream religions.
I get what your saying SK, but I believe that humans are born sinful and we can choose whether to embrace God or fall into the pit of sin.
And the reason I say being gay is "rubbish" is because if DaD is getting upset about people "gay-bashing", how do you think I would feel when he insults my religion and basically calls me and other Christans rubbish? If he can call my beliefs rubbish and I am not complaining about anything or asking for sympathy, then why cant he "take it like a man" and deal with it?

* Deleted most of the post you quoted... it seemed unnecessary, particularly since that post is directly above yours. --Skin


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Old 07-05-2003, 04:36 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally posted by Thrackan Solo
I get what your saying SK, but I believe that humans are born sinful and we can choose whether to embrace God or fall into the pit of sin.
And the reason I say being gay is "rubbish" is because if DaD is getting upset about people "gay-bashing", how do you think I would feel when he insults my religion and basically calls me and other Christans rubbish? If he can call my beliefs rubbish and I am not complaining about anything or asking for sympathy, then why cant he "take it like a man" and deal with it?
Basically you have a choice whether to be a christian or not, DAD has no choice, he just is! Just like i have no choice as to whether I am black or white purple or green.

people become christian, you are not born christian, where as you just are gay there is no choice involved. Hence to descriminate against a person on the basis of their sexuality is prejudice or biggotry or ignorance as you please. Pick whichever description suits you best


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Old 07-06-2003, 04:59 AM   #75
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Quote:
Originally posted by C'jais
As for Anakin's fear of gays hitting on straight men, I'd say the fear is unfounded.
oh you think my "fear" is unfounded? how about some gay guy trying to "convert" me while i was passed out at a party, is that unfounded? i think not, to me that's a VERY good reason to be skeptical about ALL gays until they earn my respect and trust that they WON'T try to do me when i'm unconscious, THAT'S why my opinions are what they are, you can't say that i don't know what i'm talking about, i have had first hand experience and since you won't be satisfied w/my opinions, you now have my reasons, now does anyone else wanna tell me my opinions are unfounded?



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Old 07-06-2003, 05:41 AM   #76
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Not only do I think your fears are unfounded, but I think you should edit your post so that your quoted text is less than your reply. Only quote what is necessary. It was not necessary to quote his entire post.

Now... If I was robbed by a black man, should I question all black people until they earn my respect?

If I am the victim of prejudice from a white person, should I suspect all white-eyes of racism?

Those fears are unfounded and unfair. The control group for my study was too small.

The control group for your study is too small to make those broad, sweeping assumptions about homosexuals. Afterall, heterosexuals have been known to get liquered up and take sexual advantage of others. Therefore, your fears must be grounded in some other experience or observation.

Perhaps this person made an assumption about your sexual orientation and desire to engage in this type of behavior... after all, you did "pass out at a party," which indicates substance abuse and poor decision making in the first place (particularly based upon your age).

I realize that last paragraph will likely piss you off, but my intent is not to enrage you, but rather to engage you. In critical thinking, that is. Assumptions work in all directions and are most dangerous when there is a lack of information.


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Old 07-06-2003, 07:41 AM   #77
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Just quickly, Thrackan Solo seems to have misread my last post. Cheers Jah Warrior for defending me while I was away.

Firstly, I DO NOT hate Christianity. That's a mean thing to say, and I certainly don't think that the whole idea is total rubbish. I said, IN MY OPINION, that I don't agree with the beliefs and views held by Christians... perhaps my wording of my feelings was a little harsh, but I definately do not hate religion and people who follow a certain faith. I just said I THOUGHT it was nonsense from my point of view. I'm not religious, that's what I meant.

Secondly, I have many lesbian friends. My little joke about lesbians wasn't meant ot be offensive or anti-lesbian in any way (that's why I said 'no offence to any lesbians out there' at the end of my comment.). It was a joke, people! Maybe not a funny one, but I laughed... however, according to many people out here, I'm sick and twisted anyway, so what's the problem?

Now, ep2 Anakin, you and I better have a little chat -
Your experiance of a gay guy trying to 'convert' you while you were passed out is, I can assure you, VERY RARE. This guy, whoever he was, was either drunk himself or incredibly stupid. Now, whether anything actually happened or you stopped him is totally your business, and I'm not trying to pry here, but this sort of thing NEVER happens (normally). The guy needs a serious slap round the face if he was thinking straight, because it's totally wrong to take advantage of passed-out-straight-people. Either that, or it was a complament because he thought you were cute... but it's still 100% wrong. Normal gay guys would never, EVER do such a thing.


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Old 07-06-2003, 03:16 PM   #78
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i think not, to me that's a VERY good reason to be skeptical about ALL gays until they earn my respect and trust that they WON'T try to do me when i'm unconscious, THAT'S why my opinions are what they are,
Man, if I thought the way you did, I'd be a card carrying member of the KKK. Read what you wrote there. To sum it up...

"A gay guy once tried to have sex with me when I was drunk at a party, so that's why I dont trust any gay guys!"

Does that really make any sense?

Quote:
now does anyone else wanna tell me my opinions are unfounded?
Sure do. Your opinions are unfounded. Why? Because you are making broad assumptions and generalizations about an entire population based on your experiences with one or two members of said population. It's not fair. Shall I judge all Wisconsinites (sp?) by your actions here? I certainly hope not....


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Old 07-06-2003, 03:36 PM   #79
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w00t!?!!

the thread is now descending into pointless bickering!

Yay for reasoned debate


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Old 07-06-2003, 03:43 PM   #80
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if it's the first option then **** off you p.o.s.,
Ok, now thats something you shouldnt say here no matter what someone else said.

Quote:
and people in wyoming know how to handle their alcohol,
Here's my opinion. If you get so bombed that you pass out... you didnt know how to handle your alcohol.

Anyway, it still isnt fair to be skeptical of every gay person, because you havent met every gay person. Furthermore, you are not a dog. You are a human being. You should be able to distinguish, and understand that not every gay guy in the world is the prick that you ran into at that party.

Quote:
EDIT: i'll retract the profanity when skinwalker clears up as to why it's in there in the first place. NONE of you understand because NONE of you have had that experience. you say now "i wouldn't think that way, it's just one guy" whatever, i'm not even gonna try to make anyone understand what I'M thinking and WHY i'm thinking it, have some gay guy try to rape you when you just wanna have fun w/friends and then tell me that you still trust all gay men because "just one" of the many gay men in existence tried to do that. it has a VAST impact on your life afterwards, especially since i'm still in high school. none of you will EVER understand so it's useless for me to even TRY to make you unerstand and see what i'm seeing, but whatever, that's my opinion and i stick with it til the end of time and NOBODY can tell me otherwise because also in my mind, and probably in EVERY mind in wyoming, that's foundation for mistrust.
God, I hate it when people do this. "NONE of you understand because NONE of you have had that experience."

How do you know?

Quote:
have some gay guy try to rape you when you just wanna have fun w/friends and then tell me that you still trust all gay men because "just one" of the many gay men in existence tried to do that.
Thats exactly what we're telling you.

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none of you will EVER understand
I think most of us are too mature to think that way.
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probably in EVERY mind in wyoming
Have you met every person in Wyoming? No? Then dont say things like that. It's a discredit to EVERY mind in Wyoming.


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