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Old 11-23-2003, 07:50 PM   #41
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I know I said I wasn't going to post on this again but I have to say this.

To all the normal, intelligent people here, look at the above post by Dracofyre, would any sane, fun loving person prefer to compete against someone like me who will respect you as a person or with him/her who will show you no respect as a person unless you think as he/she does?

I must leave here, I find no like minded people, this may well show that I and my kind are in fact a dieing bred in RL, I hope this isn't the case or we have a hard road in front of us as a species.
Good bye all and happy gaming,

Peace Out!


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Old 11-23-2003, 08:08 PM   #42
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STOP THIS! A new thread everyday about this rises! And everyone gets upset, flame eachother, saying ''cry more'', etc.

You make long posts, and it's the same thing every time. We understand.

Kurgan, I beg you to lock threads like this INSTANTLY, as they are just repetitive and full of flames.

There is nothing you can do about the honor thing, end of story.

Try to survive.


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Old 11-23-2003, 08:32 PM   #43
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For the record, I think it is just as bad for someone to go a server with clearly stated "honor" rules (saber down = peace, no chatkilling, etc.) and deliberately disobey those rules as it is for an "honor" player to try an impose his "code" on a server where those "rules" don't apply.

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Old 11-23-2003, 08:51 PM   #44
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Re: Sorry....but..need to....rant

Quote:
Originally posted by Khier Serakk
They're all a bunch of freaking nazis! Honour nazis! GAAH!!

WTF? what is the connection bettween nazis and honor noobs?
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Old 11-23-2003, 09:12 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally posted by Amidala from Chop Shop
For the record, I think it is just as bad for someone to go a server with clearly stated "honor" rules (saber down = peace, no chatkilling, etc.) and deliberately disobey those rules as it is for an "honor" player to try an impose his "code" on a server where those "rules" don't apply.
<------Man this dude just won't leave

For the record I agree with that statment completely, and I already knew that of you Amidala, that why I like ya

I don't want to leave these boards but I don't want to be lumped in with the "Honor Noobs", I just think the Honor Code is a good idea that has obviously been exploted.


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Old 11-23-2003, 09:26 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally posted by FK | unnamed
jk2files.com was the biggest whiny ass, no talent noob infested server in the history of that game.

I will say a couple of the guys who had rcon there were decent people (Atlas and Shroom Duck come to mind) but the rest were just crappy players and nerds on a mission of holy galactic geek vengeance.

I've been to the jk3files.com server a few times and I admit it's not as bad as before, but one thing is missing that could (and chances are will) change that:

An admin mod

The used to give admin to anyone of the regular newbie’s who played there (scratch "play", I meant to say stood around there) and groveled, sucked up and stroked their nerd egos.

If that has changed, great, but I really doubt it.
Yes, but those days have pasted. A lot of people there have grown up, and HolyWarrior was removed from power! Yay! Atlas has been brought back as an admin, that's good. I've been told by many regulars that I'm their favorite admin there. But... An admin with questionable techniques was hired, which could contribute to the nonsense.

But for those competitive players, like you unnamed, it's just not your place.
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Old 11-23-2003, 09:29 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally posted by Coraith
<------Man this dude just won't leave

For the record I agree with that statment completely, and I already knew that of you Amidala, that why I like ya

I don't want to leave these boards but I don't want to be lumped in with the "Honor Noobs", I just think the Honor Code is a good idea that has obviously been exploted.
The feeling is mutual

I hope you didn't take anything I said personally, and if you did I apologize.

You just very clearly articulated "the other side", and therefore were a perfect foil for my counterarguments.

Please don't feel you have to leave the forum, the "honor" debate is just one small part of what goes on here (just check out the goofy stuff in Yoda's Swamp). I don't think anyone here thinks you are the type of player who goes to a public server, "honor" code-following or not, and screams profanities at people for so-called "laming". No one has a problem with you playing on or running a server that has "honor" rules. Hopefully, if "newbies" come to your server, someone will explain to them that while those rules are followed there, they are not universal and it is always best to find out the rules of any new server they join without making assumptions.

I think this debate is healthier than people invading each other's servers and causing grief, no matter who is doing it or how.

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Old 11-23-2003, 11:02 PM   #48
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I see a few solutions to this animosity between the "honor people" and everyone else.

-Play single player

-Play solo against bots

-LAN parties with people of similar interests (to bow or not to bow)

-Private/password servers

-or, do what I do:
Get really sh*thoused with my wife and a couple friends, LAN up and make a server, and beat the living crap out of each other.

We started doing this when UT came out, and it's always fun. Sometimes people from outside find our games, and we let them play how they want if they aren't being *$$holes. If they are, we all get sniper rifles (in most games) or lightsabers and commence target practice. In these games, I have never called anyone a "lamer" or a "noob." I didn't even know these terms until I looked at this forum. If I called my wife a "noob," she would laugh and ask what it was. The only equivalent of "chat killing" is killing someone while they went to the kitchen for another drink. Hell, instead of some "saber down=peace" crap, we just announce our hidey-hole, and ask that we aren't targeted for decapitation.

Sorry if this got long, but it just seems like everyone is way too angry over a game.


"You have to realize that some day you are going to die. Until you know that, you are useless to me"
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Old 11-23-2003, 11:09 PM   #49
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Well I guess we agree to disagree, I will take this opportunity to thank Amidala for making me feel more welcome.....that’s right.......I’m gonna stay
All I can say is let’s bring on the fun weather that be Honor Code or not.

BTW, no need for apologies, your arguments have made me think about my stance on this, that in itself is a feat with me


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Old 11-23-2003, 11:19 PM   #50
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oh and to Master William, this is nothing to worry about, it's (for the most part) a sensible discussion between intelligent people about "honor", no need to lock it we are(for the most part) not flaming or trying to start a flame war so chill dude


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Old 11-24-2003, 12:09 AM   #51
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kurgan

And the ones that really get me are still the guys who stand around with their sabers off waiting in line to fight one on one in a FFA.
oh man i have so much fun going into those servers and just massively thermal detonating crowds of these retards. what bloody fun! and then i get screamed at and called "Stup!d @nti-hon0rz n00bie! what t3h fuk is yu0r pr0bl3m???" that stuff is hilarious


YORIMOTO says SUMiSUMi!!!


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"It is vain, sir, to extenuate the matter. Gentlemen may cry, peace, peace; but there is no peace. The war is actually begun! The next gale that sweeps from the north will bring to our ears the clash of resounding arms! Our brethren are already in the field! Why stand we here idle? What is it that gentlemen wish? What would they have? Is life so dear or peace so sweet as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery?

Forbid it, Almighty God -- I know not what course others may take; but as for me -- give me liberty or give me death!" - Patrick Henry


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Old 11-24-2003, 12:49 AM   #52
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There is nothing wrong with showing people respect and common courtesy, but people take it too far.


I'm not going to go into some server and start making racial slurs at players because that's not something I would do to people IRL.

But getting mad at the people who do not bow/lame is kind of silly, I mean it really has nothing at all to do with the way two human beings would show each other respect and common courtesy.

It's just a silly little role playing ritual some people do in a video game.


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Old 11-24-2003, 01:00 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally posted by Master William
STOP THIS! A new thread everyday about this rises! And everyone gets upset, flame eachother, saying ''cry more'', etc.

You make long posts, and it's the same thing every time. We understand.

Kurgan, I beg you to lock threads like this INSTANTLY, as they are just repetitive and full of flames.

There is nothing you can do about the honor thing, end of story.

Try to survive.
I have driven William insane!

*throws on Mr. Burns voice* Excellent...
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Old 11-24-2003, 01:11 AM   #54
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Quote:
Originally posted by FK | unnamed
There is nothing wrong with showing people respect and common courtesy, but people take it too far.


I'm not going to go into some server and start making racial slurs at players because that's not something I would do to people IRL.

But getting mad at the people who do not bow/lame is kind of silly, I mean it really has nothing at all to do with the way two human beings would show each other respect and common courtesy.

It's just a silly little role playing ritual some people do in a video game.
*Refrains from repeating himself*


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Old 11-24-2003, 01:49 AM   #55
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I play mostly Siege, and it is refreshingly free of most whining, except on Korriban (I'm guilty here as well, those detpacks can be SO frustrating; I suck at that map ).
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Old 11-24-2003, 02:40 AM   #56
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Kurgan and Amidala, those are the best posts I have read on this subject. I still do not understand why people have "duel" servers listed as FFA; i mean I have been in servers where their rules were exactly like a true duel server. Everyone had to wait, and it was 1 v.s.1: you violated this rule, you were kicked immediately. Consequently, I killed 3 peeps standing around and left. I still hold to idea that FFA means Free For All, if you play FFA, you are there to fight and die; honor does not apply.


You Rebel SCUM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"Stop that Jaden"
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Old 11-24-2003, 02:45 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally posted by Butt_Whisper
if you play FFA, you are there to fight and die; honor does not apply.
Just because it's an FFA doesn't mean that a server can't customize the way their game is played. If they want to stand around waiting for a chance to duel in an FFA, fine! It's what they like to do, it's what the server encourages. There is no gamemode for "honorable FFA" or "peaceful FFA" so FFA is all there is that allows players to be free in the map.
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Old 11-24-2003, 02:53 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally posted by TK8252MJL
Just because it's an FFA doesn't mean that a server can't customize the way their game is played. If they want to stand around waiting for a chance to duel in an FFA, fine! It's what they like to do, it's what the server encourages. There is no gamemode for "honorable FFA" or "peaceful FFA" so FFA is all there is that allows players to be free in the map.
Far be it for me to tell someone what to do with their server, bandwidth, game style of choice, etc...But I know if I went to an orgy where sex was prohibited, I'd be mad as hell. What's the use of playing a FREE FOR ALL, if it isn't indeed FREE FOR ALL?!?!


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Old 11-24-2003, 02:58 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally posted by CapNColostomy
Far be it for me to tell someone what to do with their server, bandwidth, game style of choice, etc...But I know if I went to an orgy where sex was prohibited, I'd be mad as hell. What's the use of playing a FREE FOR ALL, if it isn't indeed FREE FOR ALL?!?!
Err... Well, if you don't like how that orgy operated, go to a different one.

The server host can set whatever rule(s) they want. They pay for or host the server so that they can play how they want. Just like with your... example.
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Old 11-24-2003, 03:21 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally posted by Coraith
All I can say is let’s bring on the fun weather that be Honor Code or not.
yeah...that sounds nice...



Some of us were either made to feel real to stupid by the "elite/competitive" players because we liked to play with a regular group of people like they do, but we all didn't do it on ladders because we don't have the "skillz" or wtf'ever.

Most of these thick headed neanderthals can't appreciate the fact that some of us like to duel in ffa w/ out distractions,
those who have actually tried it know what I mean.

...and yet I go to servers with no rules posted and "lame", and get called cheater/lamer/newbie, I was even accused of using an aimbot, do they even have one for JA.

I've even played on servers were it clearly stated no rules and got the same d*** bull s***.

Yeah, that "honors" stuff is f***** stupid. I know, I suppose I'm hypocrate, oh well.

To any of you who ask for examples of these things happening to me, f*** you, do your own research.


Coraith,
Your not completely alone in this argument, but I am actually more of an "anti-honor" person now. Although I went on the <|Fear|> server a while back and enjoyed a ffa duel(yeah, just one, don't like lines) and a few true ffa's, they do both there.
I've also said that I wouldn't post anymore on this forum due to the over all hatred I recieved for mho's, so your not the only Hypocrate here, cheers mate.

Master William,
Don't mean to be a d***, but maybe if you didn't post stupid crap like that, some of these threads wouldn't get closed due to flames/spam wtf'ever (present party included ofcourse) and some people might actually get to post a reply in there own thread without it being closed because some arrogant a**holes come in and say the same s*** every time getting the thread closed once again.


end rant ::throws computer out front window into the street::
*bas____s*
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Old 11-24-2003, 03:30 AM   #61
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Quote:
Originally posted by Coraith
*Refrains from repeating himself*
*refrains from commencing in the det pack ritual*
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Old 11-24-2003, 07:08 PM   #62
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she means she's a girl lol


YORIMOTO says SUMiSUMi!!!


"When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation." - Thomas Jefferson

"It is vain, sir, to extenuate the matter. Gentlemen may cry, peace, peace; but there is no peace. The war is actually begun! The next gale that sweeps from the north will bring to our ears the clash of resounding arms! Our brethren are already in the field! Why stand we here idle? What is it that gentlemen wish? What would they have? Is life so dear or peace so sweet as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery?

Forbid it, Almighty God -- I know not what course others may take; but as for me -- give me liberty or give me death!" - Patrick Henry


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Old 11-24-2003, 07:24 PM   #63
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UNLESS you're the admin! And "honor" admins have the responsibility to inform every player that joins their server what the rules are, not just lash out at them because they're not psychic (like a real Jedi).

kurgan said it best right there.

plus i believe that, when in rome, you do as the romans do.

so if i go to kaias server, i just kill. saber on, saber off, dont matter to me (actually, because of a neat little trick kaia has, im more apt to kill saber offs before saber ons).

im more likely to adhere to "honor" on a dedicated duel server, but thats only if someone acts that way to me first. should they bow, ill bow back. if they dont....eh, no big. its just a game after all. and thats something i think too many people forget....its just a freaking game.


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Old 11-24-2003, 09:45 PM   #64
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Originally posted by Rad Blackrose
I have driven William insane!

*throws on Mr. Burns voice* Excellent...
*turns on Homer Simpson voice* WAAAH!

*runs away*


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Old 11-24-2003, 10:07 PM   #65
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Re: Re: Sorry....but..need to....rant

Quote:
Originally posted by AxVegetA

WTF? what is the connection bettween nazis and honor noobs?
It's an analogy.
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Old 11-25-2003, 12:43 AM   #66
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Quote:
Originally posted by TK8252MJL
Just because it's an FFA doesn't mean that a server can't customize the way their game is played. If they want to stand around waiting for a chance to duel in an FFA, fine! It's what they like to do, it's what the server encourages.
You have to wait in a duel server too. So why not host a "duel server"? In the end, the people who pay for the server make the rules, I agree: at least some servers are now listing the "code" as a rule to follow before entering the game. The servers I was referencing, were public servers, and the other players were trying to make everyone else conform to the "code" and attempting to turn the FFA servers into duel servers, which they did not own


You Rebel SCUM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"Stop that Jaden"
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Old 11-25-2003, 01:48 AM   #67
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Those who try to push honor codes on others in REAL, TRUE FFA servers have some strange thought in their mind that their honor code is universal of something. *shrugs*

Anyway, just ignore the honor preaching weenies. Oh, and kill them a lot while they're whining.

But if a server DOES have an honor code, I feel that players should respect that. I think that most servers dont host a duel server because they want other people to be able to move around freely while waiting, instead of being in spectator.
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Old 11-25-2003, 02:57 AM   #68
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Quote:
Originally posted by FK | unnamed
They are the majority, without a doubt.
I think I know how they became the majority.

(the following is fiction, although some real player and server names were used)

This is the story of a kid we'll call Anakin, after his favorite Star Wars movie character. Anakin got a Star Wars Jedi Knight game for his 13th birthday. It was the first action first-person-shooter game he had ever owned. Kewl, Force powers, guns and lightsaber! Anakin played Single-player and got to be a Jedi, just like the movies! Kewl! He had great fun defeating Stormtroopers, Cultists, and other bad guys. Sometimes the bad guys were standing around chatting, sometimes they were looking the other way, that was great! Just made them easier to kill! He loved firing a salvo of rockets into them or Mind Tricking them and slashing them with his mighty lightsaber. They went down with a death cry, but other than getting killed from time to time, nothing unpleasant happened to young Anakin. Certainly he never got punished, or called a noob or lamer, or got kicked out of his own game. He learned to fight aggressively and well, taking advantage of opportunities those foolish bad guys gave him.

After playing through the Single-player game 10 times at Jedi Master difficulty, Anakin saw the Multiplayer button and checked it out. At first he used Create Server or Solo Game and played against bots. Awesome! He had great battles against bots, and learned the joy of Free for All battle, the chaos, the mayhem, the kill or be killed excitement. He tried the Duel and even Power Duel mode against Jedi Master skill bots. He used his downloaded Darth Maul skin and saber staff, and defeated Luke Skywalker and Kyle Katarn, two against one! He was even better than the real Darth Maul! Wow, this game is awesome! he thought. He beat the bots hundreds of times, and not once did they complain or call him a name for killing them the "wrong" way. Anakin liked dueling, but FFA was his favorite.

Finally, bots became too easy to beat and Anakin saw that there are real humans he could play against on the Internet. He was nervous but excited, his first online game! He had studied his official Star Wars® Jedi Knight®: Jedi Academy(tm) game manual, the one that came with his game, to make sure he understood the rules correctly. He read in the manual that human opponents are more unpredictable than bots. He hoped they wouldn't be too hard to beat. Wow, what if he came in last, or even worse, didn't score even one kill. That would be soooo embarassing! He looked through the server list and saw one called True Honor Jedi server. Kewl, other honorable Jedi, just like him! And it was running Free for All, his favorite game type!

Nervous and excited, Anakin joined the game. He saw some players in a group, standing around watching some other players having a lightsaber battle. They were distracted, and some of them had funny brown balloons above their heads. A perfect opportunity for an ambush, just like in Single-player! He grabbed a nearby rocket launcher and fired off some rockets into the group, then charged in and finished off the survivors with his mighty lightsaber. Awesome! Free for All with humans was even more fun than with bots!

The next thing he knew, his screen filled up with chat. "lamer!" "lamer!" "admin, Anakin lamed me!" What's a lamer? Anakin wondered. The server had an admin mod, and the next thing Anakin knew he was several feet up in the air, as if Darth Vader himself was choking him. Then he was knocked randomly around the map as if an invisible giant hand was slapping him around. Then he was down on the ground, unable to move, as if someone had paralyzed him.
"you stupid f***ing lamer, don't do that again!" someone named Admin Palpatine chastised.
"who, me? do what? what did I do?" Anakin implored, still helpless on the ground.
"f***ing noob, don't you know saber down = peace!" the admin yelled.
"what? what's a noob?" asked Anakin, scared and bewildered. This had never happened when he played against bots!
"don't kill people who are unarmed or chatting, noob!" berated the admin.
"isn't this FFA? why are they unarmed and chatting?" Anakin asked innocently.
"this isn't FFA, didn't you see the people dueling?"
"yes, but I thought this was FFA, the loading screen said Free For All, defeat your enemies to score points, so that's what I did" said Anakin, now completely confused.
"well this isn't FFA, are you blind? we are having honorable duels here" said the admin.
"sorry, I didn't know" said Anakin, afraid and eager to fit in with the honorable Jedi.

At last Anakin's character was able to get up and move. "i'll let it go this time noob, since you r new. but if it happens again i'll ban u and you'll never get into the True Honor Jedi Server again" grumbled the admin. "sorry" said a chastened Anakin, "I promise it won't happen again". "it better not" said Admin Palpatine. "remember, lamers and chatkillers have no honor".

Anakin put away his lightsaber and retreated to a quiet corner, watching the other players duel, stand, chat, sit, and twirl some distance away. *note to self, just because it says free for all, doesn't mean it is. never attack unarmed or chatting players. saber down = peace. lamers have no honor* he repeated to himself. Online gaming sure is different from Single-player or playing against bots, he thought. Why didn't they explain these important rules in his official Star Wars® Jedi Knight®: Jedi Academy(tm) game manual?, he wondered. He felt like such an idiot.

Eager to please and fit in, Anakin quickly adopted the new Rules someone had carelessly left out of his official game manual. He made it a point to quickly bring every saber-down kill or chatkill to the attention of an admin so the "lamer" could be dealt with. He instantly yelled "stupid noob!" or "lamer!" whenever some newbie killed him while he strolled around or chatted with his saber off. When dueling, he demanded "bow moron, you honorless noob!" if some less-experienced player didn't make their character squat in front of him before dueling.

In time, he forgot about all the fun he had had in Single-player and against bots, the excitement of mad, unrestricted combat, the thrill of wiping out a room full of bad guys. Hanging out, dueling, and chatting with other honorable Jedi made him feel cool, not like those dorky noobs who would show up and lame people. Admin Palpatine was pleased. "I'm glad you finally learned about honor, Anakin" he praised, as they sat Indian-style and watched a helpless lamer choke and rise into the air as he was ampunished. Anakin swelled with pride.

One evening, True Honor Jedi Server was full, and although Anakin waited as long as his 13-year-old patience would allow (2 minutes), he couldn't get in. Hmmm, maybe I'll try another server he thought. He sorted the FFA servers by number of players, and saw "Chop Shop INCREASED SABER DAMAGE FFA-CTF" server had a lot of players. "Hmm, what does CTF mean?" he wondered. "Oh well, at least it says FFA, so I should be able to get some honorable duels there". He joined the server, turned off his lightsaber, and strolled towards some players engaged in a lightsaber battle so he could challenge someone to a duel. He was shocked as he watched his character get vaporized by a well-placed sniper shot. "lamer!" he typed, but nothing happened. Puzzled, he clicked his mouse and was instantly reborn with 125 health, 25 shields, and a lightsaber in his hands, which he again turned off. He pressed "Y" and put up his chat balloon, but before he could type "who is admin?", Davin Kabak dropped a detpack in front of him and promptly blew him up. "lamer! chatkiller!" he typed, but again he was ignored. No one was chatting much, they seemed to be too busy fighting. Now he was getting mad. He respawned yet again, and saw a Twilek female named jen. He approached her and repeatedly pressed his "K" key to challenge her to a duel. But no matter how many times he pressed his "K" key, nothing happened. Instead, jen gripped him, jumped into the air, backflipped, and flung Anakin into a lake of molten lava. "laaaaaamerrrrrrrr!!" he typed as he plummetted into the lava and slipped beneath the surface.

This was ridiculuous! He had been lamed three times in the past minute and no one had been ampunished! "stupid noobs, don't you know saber down = peace?" Anakin whined. Of course, Anakin didn't know that some of the players he was calling noobs were veteran FPS gamers who had started with the original DOOM back in 1993, back when Anakin and Admin Palpatine were still having issues with potty training. "not on this server" answered ]eVe[The Pink Panther, the player who had sniped Anakin. "didn't you read the server messages? all kills are legal here, don't whine when you die". "you're all a bunch of honorless lamers!" Anakin snivelled. "yeah, we're all a bunch of lamers, now stfu and fight" said jen. "where's the admin, I'll get all you lamers banned!" Anakin demanded. "admins not here, and even if she was she wouldn't care" Davin Kabak answered. "now quit whining or leave".

Anakin respawned and tried to fight, but his once-formidable FFA skills had withered away from too much standing around and chatting on the True Honor Jedi server. He found himself repeatedly decapitated, cut in half, and thrown to his doom. Finally, the game mercifully came to an end when {JE}RED-5{C} hit the fraglimit with 100 kills. His worst nightmare realized, not only did Anakin come in last, he didn't score even one kill. His killtracker was quiet the whole game. Anakin got in one last "LAMERS!" before he disconnected.

His pride wounded, he went back to the safety of his "peaceful FFA" True Honor Jedi server, which was no longer full. "wassup Anakin" greeted Admin Palpatine. "i've just been to hell" reported Anakin. "?" asked Palpatine. "this server called Chop Shop" moaned Anakin. "i've heard of them" said Admin Palpatine. "nothing there but lamers and chatkillers". "i HATE lamers" said Anakin, "we should all go back over there and teach those noobs some honor". "yeah, but I need your help controlling the lamers here", said Palpatine. Palpatine turned towards Anakin. "we've decided to make you an admin. you'll be able to teach noob lamers and chatkillers about true honor. come with me, my young apprentice" commanded Palpatine.

Anakin, his 13-year-old hands trembling and sweaty with excitement, made his character slowly bow before Palpatine. "yes, my master" Anakin answered.

And with that, Anakin's journey towards the Dark Side was complete.


Last edited by Amidala from Chop Shop; 11-26-2003 at 02:46 AM.
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Old 11-25-2003, 03:49 AM   #69
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That was by far the best story I have ever read in my entire life! I felt his pain, triumph, and his fall. It's funny because it's true that's how most 'Honourable Players' are born. I don't care if I go onto a clan server and people are hanging out and dueling and stuff, it can be fun. What bothers me is the constant abuse that was around in JK2, you breathe wrong and your under a vicious attack by some admins. I am by no means saying that all honour players are lying hypocritical kids... but many are. If you keep your rules on your server (after all it is a 'server' which means you have every right to do whatever you want on there, because it belongs to you) brining them to servers you have no power over is rediculous. On Chop Shop I try to explain that there is no laming on this server, as many other frequent players there do, but when they keep whining and stuff it gets a tad frustrating. Even on the JE server -which amidala is so gracious to let us use even though we crash it everytime we get on with cheats lol- while we were using the ol' cheat commands and npc spawns on KOTR flight school. some guy from a clan came and had all these messages bound to diffrent keys... like "don't shoot this ship blah blhalkaabsldkfjlksd" and soforth. we explained "uhh no there are no rules do what you want" and he went on... later while on the matrix reloaded map he started telling people what they could and couldnt do then started threatening to ban. Around this time he got kicked but he came back later and shaped up... a little. All this to say when you come to a new server ask if there are laming rules or not don't just assume everyone follows the unwritten code of conduct.

and as for admin mod for jk2 and once it comes out for jk3 don't abuse it please for everyones sake. I understand how having control over people can be a tempting thing but a lot of people take it too far. When I was made admin (actualy moderator is a better word) on the jk2 chop shop server I had already lost the novelty of this kind of stuff from when I used to run a team fortress classic server (the best game ever made btw) so I used the powers probobly only like 15 times throughout that period. Probobly the most useful command was amsleep and ampsay cuz you can get someones attention that way. kicking someone means they will just come back and a temporary ban usualy confuses people because the word ban denotes permanancy, it's better just to straighten them out

I don't think there needs to be a huge war between people who prefer honour and those who don't because it's just that a preferance. Just make sure you know where you are when you are trying to make others adhere to rules that don't necissarily apply.


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Old 11-25-2003, 04:13 AM   #70
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i smell a pulitzer Amidala! it almost made me cry.....


i actually used to be one of those saber down chatters in jk2 back in the day the first month many a year ago, cause every server i went to was like that, so i thought that was how it was, but when i went to a gun server, i was confused for the first minute, then said "whoa, this is a heck of a lot more fun than sitting around doin nuttin!" and started blowing people away.

ahh..good times...


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Old 11-25-2003, 04:42 AM   #71
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Heh cute story Amidala, but to be honest it's not just this series that gets this treatment.

Granted I will say the JK2/JA crowds seem to push it to insanely extreme levels at times, but it's like this in pretty much all online gaming now in one way shape or form.


I'm sure some of you may have heard the term "The Continuing Pussification of America" from comedians or in various social commentaries.

Online gaming is no different, for the last few years it has been slowly transforming from "the lawless wild west where anything goes" to a more happy, family friendly, sanitized, politically correct world.

I mean in pretty much every online game I could go out and play right now, there is some type of admin mod system that will cancel all of my credit cards and have me audited by the I.R.S if I dare to call someone a prick in a chat room.

Not to mention the people in charge of things are usually 13 year old neo Nazi/ dragon ball Z fanatics who’s highlight of the day is IP banning people who say the F word in a video game.

Every game I play has some type of non-stop pissing, moaning and whining in it these days it seems.
In RTCW: ET it’s spawn killing, in JK it’s laming, so on… so on…

And not to get off on some type of social commentary type of rant, but look around at the real world for a second, the days of the beer drinking, red meat eating, chain smoking John Wayne’s of this world are long gone.

You know, the type of people who didn't cry/bitch/sue every time they didn't get their way.

We now have latte sipping, sandal wearing, tree hugging pansies who dial 911 on their cell phones in fear of their life when another driver shoots them the finger on the highway… so why expect people to behave any different in their off time in recreational games?


You know as messed up as this sounds, I really miss the days in games where if I said:

"**** you" to a player...

I got a "**** you too!" back instend of "ADDDDMIIINNNNN!!!!!!!!!! DID YOU HEAR WHAT HE SAID TO MEEEEEE!!!???"




oh well.


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Old 11-25-2003, 06:16 AM   #72
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wow

*edit* regarding the story, excellent.

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Old 11-25-2003, 08:26 AM   #73
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Quote:
Originally posted by FK | unnamed
Heh cute story Amidala, but to be honest it's not just this series that gets this treatment.

Granted I will say the JK2/JA crowds seem to push it to insanely extreme levels at times, but it's like this in pretty much all online gaming now in one way shape or form.


I'm sure some of you may have heard the term "The Continuing Pussification of America" from comedians or in various social commentaries.

Online gaming is no different, for the last few years it has been slowly transforming from "the lawless wild west where anything goes" to a more happy, family friendly, sanitized, politically correct world.

I mean in pretty much every online game I could go out and play right now, there is some type of admin mod system that will cancel all of my credit cards and have me audited by the I.R.S if I dare to call someone a prick in a chat room.

Not to mention the people in charge of things are usually 13 year old neo Nazi/ dragon ball Z fanatics who’s highlight of the day is IP banning people who say the F word in a video game.

Every game I play has some type of non-stop pissing, moaning and whining in it these days it seems.
In RTCW: ET it’s spawn killing, in JK it’s laming, so on… so on…

And not to get off on some type of social commentary type of rant, but look around at the real world for a second, the days of the beer drinking, red meat eating, chain smoking John Wayne’s of this world are long gone.

You know, the type of people who didn't cry/bitch/sue every time they didn't get their way.

We now have latte sipping, sandal wearing, tree hugging pansies who dial 911 on their cell phones in fear of their life when another driver shoots them the finger on the highway… so why expect people to behave any different in their off time in recreational games?


You know as messed up as this sounds, I really miss the days in games where if I said:

"**** you" to a player...

I got a "**** you too!" back instend of "ADDDDMIIINNNNN!!!!!!!!!! DID YOU HEAR WHAT HE SAID TO MEEEEEE!!!???"




oh well.
Agreed. Although some games are worse about the whining than others. I like 'em and all but JO and JA are by far worse than any others I've played.


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Old 11-25-2003, 09:14 AM   #74
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Sometimes you feel like kickin some jedi - ass balls out - and other times you just feel like pretending your in medieval times. Either way - its all about fun.

Damn the people who scream Noob etc... It is as annoying as hell.

The honor system is a little freakish to me. Because for my first MP game I happened upon one of these types of "honor games". Here I thought I could just go chopping away - but then found out about all the other rules - and I was greatly dissapointed.

Its all in how you like to play I guess.


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Old 11-25-2003, 01:47 PM   #75
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These are the Days of Our Lives....

Quote:
Originally posted by FK | unnamed
I'm sure some of you may have heard the term "The Continuing Pussification of America" from comedians or in various social commentaries.

Not to mention the people in charge of things are usually 13 year old neo Nazi/ dragon ball Z fanatics who’s highlight of the day is IP banning people who say the F word in a video game.

And not to get off on some type of social commentary type of rant, but look around at the real world for a second, the days of the beer drinking, red meat eating, chain smoking John Wayne’s of this world are long gone.



You know, the type of people who didn't cry/bitch/sue every time they didn't get their way.


We now have latte sipping, sandal wearing, tree hugging pansies who dial 911 on their cell phones in fear of their life when another driver shoots them the finger on the highway… so why expect people to behave any different in their off time in recreational games?



You know as messed up as this sounds, I really miss the days in games where if I said:

"**** you" to a player...

I got a "**** you too!" back instend of "ADDDDMIIINNNNN!!!!!!!!!! DID YOU HEAR WHAT HE SAID TO MEEEEEE!!!???"

oh well.
Unnamed, you've made me glad I dont live in US, but I still think you are drawing a rather large bow, alot of generalisations there.

..and John Wayne was a draft dodger, right ? Yep, real tough guy

Too bad George W hasnt heard of the "Pussification" theory, otherwise..... This is a **computer game** forum so I'll stop that rant NOW oh well

Poor 13 year olds cop it on this forum, the perennial scapegoats. If it wasnt for their parents $$$ we most likely wouldnt have a game to play.... The game doesn't have a "T" rating for nothing, its the target demographic, plain and simple.

Amidala, your story was fun to read but I think once again, if I was a 'younger player' reading these threads, it would be very discouraging to venture into the world of MP....

Rather than conjuring cliched, generalistic stories, or moaning like an old fart about how things used to be in the "good ole days", we should be setting some type of example, or at least creating an environment which encourages younger players to play, and to learn to abide by the rules that have been established. This applies to a server, and in a broader sense to real life experiences, at least to the extent of communication and respect for others. Hostility begets a hostile demeanour IMHO.

PEACE & GOOD WILL to ALL 13-15 year old gamers !
[Special shout out to Mana....KUPO!!!]

MTFBWYA

*Resumes waiting for local release of KOTOR PC*
*Resumes reading NJO : TUF*


Asinus asinum fricat

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Old 11-25-2003, 02:02 PM   #76
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Just because a 13 year old orthodox honour guy, member of The Worldwide Church of Crouch Bowing is an admin, it doesn't mean its his server. Most servers are funded by people with jobs and I doubt any parent would pay over around $90 for what they see as a pointless computer game. Theres few people of the older generation that don't think playing mp games is a pointless waste of time (let alone money), and when you see arguements like this, I believe it does nothing more than solidify their arguement.

Agreed the honour guys shouldn't enforce their codes everywhere they go. However, just because a guy bows at you, it doesn't mean he's a total retard hell bent on gauging your eyes out untill you bow back. I believe the custom of bowing occupies the majority, although only a smaller circle make up this hardcore honour council. For the mosty part, I usually bow before a duel. I couldn't care less what the other guy/girl does.

My point is, its not the honour things that create the problem, they make the game more 'family friendly' (I would say British, but not wishing to add racial slurs :P).
The real problem is the crowd of honour junkies that get off on bowing. Therefore, the solution isnt to condemn the honour stuff entirely, but to just focus your disatisfaction on the group that tyranically enforces it.

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Old 11-25-2003, 02:32 PM   #77
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Amidala, that was one beautiful story..and so true, so very true.

It should be a sticky.


Got Honourz? Great.. I hope you choke on it!

I r0xx0r all j00 nooberz that mess with me. You nooberz suXor out of my way or I eat j00....

Most ridiculous Quote of the century: >)O(< ENmiTy: promoting mindless FFA and SD kills promotes disorderly conduct amoung the online community.
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Old 11-25-2003, 02:45 PM   #78
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At the end of the day, the winner is the person/team with the most frags/captures/objectives completed, not who played at being the "most honorable."

If people want to stay in last place while they tap the crouch and taunt keys, that's fine with me.

I don't believe that all the "honor" players are young kids, but it should be pointed out that many are, because of the simple fact that they are more susceptable to the "peer pressure" of the honor d00dz and their evangelization efforts.

Additionally, there's a logical reason they are more susceptable and that's that they are new to the gaming community and don't realize that in the past, this sort of thing simply didn't exist. They just assume that it's how the world works. So it's not really their fault, they're just misinformed (dare I say "brainwashed") by the cultish attitudes of some of the "honor elite" folk.

I knew a few players who are very young and they play by my "no rules" philosophy and don't whine on my server.

The thing is, some people consider the "honor" stuff "more fun."

The trouble is, that they don't realize to others (like myself) the honor thing is "less fun." If they can respect that, then the whole controversy is solved.

Btw, good story!


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Old 11-25-2003, 02:50 PM   #79
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Lol, good story, Amidala!

This is how I handle the "honor" thing.

If it's FFA, I spectate for a handful of seconds or so. (that's usually all the time I need to see if it's an "honor" server or a "fighting" server. After all, if everyone's just standing around with saber off, it's a good bet it's an "honor" server) If it's a "fighting" server I throw the "honor" codes out the window and participate in a frantic no-hands-barred slash-fest. If it's an "honor" server, I'll walk around with saber down and will chat and occassionally politely chastise individuals who have no life beyond computer games.

As far as Duels and Power Duels are concerned, I always wait to see if my opponent(s) bows first before I bow. If not, then I don't worry about it and commence fighting. (I will say "good game" when it's done, after all)

For CTF and Siege, it's all about teamwork, and how can you help your team if you're just sitting around doing nothing? I play to win in those servers regardless. (though I will leave individuals alone who are standing in an obscure corner with the chatbox on.)

Basically, I'm willing to go along with the "honor" code if need be, but I'm by no means a stickler for it. I merely adapt to the different servers and have fun in both "honor" and "fighting" servers.


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Old 11-25-2003, 05:41 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally posted by FK | unnamed
I'm sure some of you may have heard the term "The Continuing Pussification of America" from comedians or in various social commentaries.
To go off topic a minute, wasn't that George Carlin?


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