boooo

[mozzymatt]

well kotor is the story of revan its all about what he's started and why and your gonna give us everything except how it ends .... preposterous

[Da_Man_2423]

What do you mean everything except the end? What kind of ending were you hoping for?

[Ctrl Alt Del]

Think he means about the lack of a Kotor 3. Hey, here to complain about that as well? Good luck and welcome.

[southern_fox]

Think he means about the lack of a Kotor 3. Hey, here to complain about that as well? Good luck and welcome.

Yes, I'm sure thats what he was going for.

I shed no tears over the lack of a near-future third installment.

I'd really rather have whatever Bioware is cooking up with Lucasarts right now.

[Da_Man_2423]

Well games aren't made overnight, so if he is waiting for a K3, he's gonna have to be patient like everyone else.

[Rev7]

Of course.

[Zerimar Nyliram]

If there will be no Knights of the Old Republic III, I would hope that either Lucas Books or Dark Horse comics is kind enough to pick it up in story form so as not to leave us hanging.

[Seamhainn]

Dark Horse already gives us some glimpses how it all started (if all are not red herrings that is).

Take care

[Miltiades]

And that's great! It's a really interesting story, but still, it doesn't (and most likely won't) tell the story of what happened after The Sith Lords. That's Kotor 3's job.

Still, at the moment, I enjoy reading the comics, it eases the pain of waiting for Kotor 3.

[SilentScope001]

But we already know what's going to happen. I mean, do you really think the 'True Sith', whomever they are, will win?

[Ctrl Alt Del]

Originally Posted by SilentScope001

But we already know what's going to happen. I mean, do you really think the 'True Sith', whomever they are, will win?

Who knows? Maybe on one of the endings...

[Quanon]

Originally Posted by SilentScope001

But we already know what's going to happen. I mean, do you really think the 'True Sith', whomever they are, will win?

I guess you don't like to play most of the games that get released then .

Because the majority ends good , films end good , bookd end good ...

[SilentScope001]

Because the majority ends good , films end good , bookd end good ...

Is it really that bad to demand a little variety and cynical realism in works rather than simplistic stories of 'good winning over evil'? It's why we got this innovation of 'choice' anyway, in which people who get tired of traditional stories can choose to write a different ending. TSL did quite well in variety and cynical realism, despite its flaws.

An alternate, well-written ending where the True Sith takes over...hm...

[Quanon]

Originally Posted by SilentScope001

An alternate, well-written ending where the True Sith takes over...hm...

Like you said TSL gave already a certain amount of choice , so why so frightfull that that my get lost in K3 ?

Though I doubt the main badguy can still win in the end, without forcing you to redo the fight with a save-game.

I'll give you that, never seen a game where that happens

[Miltiades]

Originally Posted by SilentScope001

But we already know what's going to happen. I mean, do you really think the 'True Sith', whomever they are, will win?

Even if it's obvious the 'True Sith' lose, I want to know how, when, where and who survives of the 'good guys'. Even if we all know who wins and who loses, it'd still make a great game.

[Darca Lar]

If the developer is right that is.

[TKA-001]

What do you want instead, scope? Republic gets genocided and continuity is shot to hell.

[Miltiades]

Originally Posted by TKA-001

What do you want instead, scope? Republic gets genocided and continuity is shot to hell.

Well, that's what we'd probably get as an alternative ending. Having the games occur 4,000 years before the movies gives them a lot of freedom, but there'll always be things that can't be changed, and the Republic left standing is one of them.

[Zerimar Nyliram]

But you see, the Knights of the Old Republic games have endings that aren't so drastic that any of them could fit into continuity as far as the movies go, even the noncanonical endings. I think this was the developers' goal: that all endings were possible and could stand with the movies and be ambiguous that way. But the Republic falling would break that tradition.

[Miltiades]

Originally Posted by Zerimar Nyliram

But you see, the Knights of the Old Republic games have endings that aren't so drastic that any of them could fit into continuity as far as the movies go, even the noncanonical endings. I think this was the developers' goal: that all endings were possible and could stand with the movies and be ambiguous that way. But the Republic falling would break that tradition.

True. Both the return of Darth Revan and the Exile controlling the Sith Academy on Malachor could fit into canon. I think Kotor3 would have a similar dark side ending, where the main character turns on the Republic and the Republic loses at the Outer Rim (or even the Middle Rim) while not being destroyed completely.

[Darca Lar]

Yes, that could work. The Repulic itself could not fall in this storyline(canonically), because from my understanding it lasts until the rise of the empire.

[mozzymatt]

i don't know where they say that the republic has lasted for 24000 years anywhere. I know that in ep.1 someguy says 1000 years and i always took that to mean since darth bane. but im presuming that the republic can fall cause i dont know where it says they cant. i know that its Lucas tradition ofr the good guys to win but tradtions arent fun.

[Zerimar Nyliram]

25,000 thousand years is canon. Palpatine's "a thousand years" refers to the Ruusan Reformations of 1,000 BBY, which took place right after the New Sith Wars. So you are correct there.

The practical answer is that it was an oversight by Lucas. He wished to retcon the Republic to have existed for only a thousand years, forgetting about Obi-Wan's line in A New Hope. Thus, Expanded Universe authors had to remedy this, as well as the Rule of Two. They killed two birds with one stone.

Along those lines, there's a constantly-recurring line in the first KOTOR that needs in-universe explanation: people keep saying that the Republic has stood for 15,000 years in the game, but if we go by official continuity it would have been 21,000 years at the time of KOTOR. Did some other major reformation possibly take place circa 19,000 BBY?

[adamqd]

Originally Posted by mozzymatt

i don't know where they say that the republic has lasted for 24000 years anywhere.

The New Essential Chronology= The Republic was born with the signing of the Galactic Constitution c. 25,000 BBY, during the Unification Wars. During that time, the Humans and Duros, reverse-engineering the Force-based technologies of the Rakata, invented the hyperdrive, allowing Coruscant to become the capital of the Galactic Republic and would remain that way for twenty-five thousand years. The Republic was created by the Core Founders, and the Jedi became it's guardians. Although there is indications of certain species as far back as 3,000,000,000.

EDIT: Sorry Zerimar Nyliram, You beat me too it

[The Source]

Originally Posted by mozzymatt

well kotor is the story of revan its all about what he's started and why and your gonna give us everything except how it ends .... preposterous

If you remove "Knights of the Old Republic II" from the series, you know how "Knights of the Old Republic III" would have ended with Revan. I personally don't think they will be revisiting the Exile and Revan story any time soon. "Knights of the Old Republic I" did a great job in telling you the Revan story, and there really doesn't need any more explination.

If you think about it, a Revan storyarch in "KotOR III" will only repeate the end of "KotOR I". Revan will either end as a Sith or Jedi. - and - He/she saves, kills, or rules the gallaxy. Very predictable.

[mozzymatt]

im sorry but i strongly disagree ... did you ever think about what actually happened to revan in th eunknown regions ... revan could be dead (that would suck) yu can start off as revans half trained apprentice or some shenanigans ... you can just be some grey jedi stuggleing to find the error of his ways when BOOM you find yourself on a sith planet needing to escape ... i just dont think they'll leave it go ...


edit: considering this is a place fr argument ... just because the republic has stood for that long doesnt mean it couldbe be ruled by the sith .... but maybe it does .... im just making up my own **** probibly .... but alternate endings disregard canon anyway.

[adamqd]

that's cool, and we all like, and dislike parts of the continuity, But theres a section for Fanon if you want to make up your own history.
But like it or not there IS an official time line

[southern_fox]

If you remove "Knights of the Old Republic II" from the series, you know how "Knights of the Old Republic III" would have ended with Revan. I personally don't think they will be revisiting the Exile and Revan story any time soon. "Knights of the Old Republic I" did a great job in telling you the Revan story, and there really doesn't need any more explination.

If you think about it, a Revan storyarch in "KotOR III" will only repeate the end of "KotOR I". Revan will either end as a Sith or Jedi. - and - He/she saves, kills, or rules the gallaxy. Very predictable.

Well said.

I really don't see what a third installment would really do that would be revolutionary in terms of gameplay or story-telling. We intuitively know the ending (and the alternate ending), the basic plot outline, the main characters, the basic possible archetypes for supporting characters, the weapon of choice, probably the transport of choice, so on. Whats left? Even more details?

Starting out as a closeted Jedi with amnesia, with no weapons or allies, slowly leveling up, traveling to roughly eight planets (which are expressed using 6-8 modules/rooms), to be a galaxy-wide legend has been done. Doing it again is a rehash. Using the same game engine, which is quite dated compared to a lot of the stuff on the market now, would be an even greater crime.

There are some who would care less, but I really go for quality games over quantity (sequels for the sake of sequels). I may get flak for saying this. But to be as good a game as Mass Effect or Oblivion, you can't have "Knights of the Old Republic: The Sith Lords, Part 2". It pales in comparison.

If there were to be a third game, it would have to depart radically in order to be fresh. That being said, I did not particularly enjoy the sequel - so I could really not care too much about a game based on it. I'm excited about the possibility of an MMO though.

I'm content that Knights of the Old Republic was one of the greatest games ever made, with a story that was stronger than the recent trilogy.

[Ctrl Alt Del]

Originally Posted by southern_fox

There are some who would care less, but I really go for quality games over quantity (sequels for the sake of sequels). I may get flak for saying this. But to be as good a game as Mass Effect or Oblivion, you can't have "Knights of the Old Republic: The Sith Lords, Part 2". It pales in comparison.

Well spoken, even though you mentioned games that will or already are sequels.

[The Source]

Originally Posted by southern_fox

Well said.

I really don't see what a third installment would really do that would be revolutionary in terms of gameplay or story-telling. We intuitively know the ending (and the alternate ending), the basic plot outline, the main characters, the basic possible archetypes for supporting characters, the weapon of choice, probably the transport of choice, so on. Whats left? Even more details?

Starting out as a closeted Jedi with amnesia, with no weapons or allies, slowly leveling up, traveling to roughly eight planets (which are expressed using 6-8 modules/rooms), to be a galaxy-wide legend has been done. Doing it again is a rehash. Using the same game engine, which is quite dated compared to a lot of the stuff on the market now, would be an even greater crime.

There are some who would care less, but I really go for quality games over quantity (sequels for the sake of sequels). I may get flak for saying this. But to be as good a game as Mass Effect or Oblivion, you can't have "Knights of the Old Republic: The Sith Lords, Part 2". It pales in comparison.

If there were to be a third game, it would have to depart radically in order to be fresh. That being said, I did not particularly enjoy the sequel - so I could really not care too much about a game based on it. I'm excited about the possibility of an MMO though.

I'm content that Knights of the Old Republic was one of the greatest games ever made, with a story that was stronger than the recent trilogy.

Very, very, very true. "Kights of the Old Republic III" would need to have major overhaul changes in game engine, story-telling, and leveling up. People would get really tired of the same old - same old. Plus, how does one get around being predictable?

You mentioned another great point. We allready know the story details and such. In order to get people interested in a third installment, the writter would have to find extreme ways to refresh everything. I personally don't want to play an amnesia driven Jedi/Sith again.

I also agree that games have changed since "Knights of the Old Republic I". The latest games in the pipeline are much more advanced. "Knights of the Old Republic III" would have to be very revolutionary.

Personally, I could hold out until Lucas Arts makes something new for RPGs. I'm not a MMORPG fan. I would have to wait until they made a stand-alone RPG.

[TKA-001]

We allready know the story details and such. In order to get people interested in a third installment, the writter would have to find extreme ways to refresh everything. I personally don't want to play an amnesia driven Jedi/Sith again.

Why does everyone seem to be so unswervingly convinced that that's the only possible candidate for a K3 player character?

[Darca Lar]

Because they want to play as a force user, some from the very beginning. I agree with the force user part, but what if the next PC is:

--Someone new

--Has no teacher, so there's not much to learn but the basics or stuff from instinct

--Choices determine whether the PC lives or dies at the end of it all

Give your input...

[Da_Man_2423]

If the PC had no teacher he/she must be pretty a darn fast learner on their own by the end of the game.

[Nedak]

Originally Posted by mozzymatt

well kotor is the story of revan its all about what he's started and why and your gonna give us everything except how it ends .... preposterous

I'm pretty sure everyone agrees with that.

Now, I just wish people would learn how to type on these forums.

[JinSarigit]

I would also applaud and welcome a KOTOR III with open arms, however I'm not holding breath since EA games took over Bioware and Obsidian won't be hired simply to further obstruct the KOTOR legacy.

[Tarridus]

I don't think Obsidian would 'further obstruct' the KOTOR legacy, thats simply your pov and I'm sure you'll find others on this forum who love KOTOR II (myself included) for what they were able to do and achieve with the ludicrous deadline they were given by LA. No one ever said that any game has to focus on any one character. In fact I'd say that I would applaud a KOTOR III with a totally new main character but your entitled to disagree with me :P

[JinSarigit]

Originally Posted by Tarridus

I don't think Obsidian would 'further obstruct' the KOTOR legacy, thats simply your pov and I'm sure you'll find others on this forum who love KOTOR II (myself included) for what they were able to do and achieve with the ludicrous deadline they were given by LA. No one ever said that any game has to focus on any one character. In fact I'd say that I would applaud a KOTOR III with a totally new main character but your entitled to disagree with me :P

A new character would be almost necessary after finishing Revan's and Exile's stories. yes my pov is that KOTOR II wasn't the best, it had the most amount of cut content, the overall feel and emotion of the game (in my opinion) was not the same as KOTOR I. The ending left me saying "wtf!?". II was clearly rushed and there is no denying that. Everything beyond Peragus and Telos didn't appeal to me, and I would have quit playing if it weren't for Kreia's snide remarks and the rebuild HK sidequest.

[Darca Lar]

Originally Posted by Da_Man_2423

If the PC had no teacher he/she must be pretty a darn fast learner on their own by the end of the game.

Not necessarily, I mean yea if the PC was extremely force sensitive, then S/He could be a fast learner. But on the other hand, there are other ways than the force...which I think would be pretty innovative to enhance that option to where you might need to rely on your non-force abilities a little more.