lfnetwork.com mark read register faq members calendar
View Poll Results: Who will be the PC in KotOR III?
Revan 15 15.79%
The Exile 13 13.68%
A New Character 67 70.53%
Voters: 95. You may not vote on this poll


Thread: PC For KotOR III?
Thread Tools Display Modes
Post a new thread. Add a reply to this thread. Indicate all threads in this forum as read. Subscribe to this forum. RSS feed: this forum RSS feed: all forums
Old 08-08-2005, 08:16 PM   #1
Jeff
Rating: Awesome
 
Jeff's Avatar
 
Status: Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
Posts: 8,431
Current Game: SWTOR
Imperialist Meatbags Guild Officer The Walking Carpets Guild Officer Notable contributor LFN Staff Member 
PC For KotOR III?

There has been some guessing on what character will be the PC in kotor 3. The obvious and only choices are Revan, the Exile, or a new character. What do you all think?

I had originally thought that there would be a new PC, but after some thinking, I think we will have the Exile back. Obsidian left the door so wide open for the Exile going after Revan, it just makes sense to have the Exile again.


Follow me on Twitter
Follow StarWarsMMO.net on Twitter | Like us on Facebook
Jeff is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-08-2005, 08:18 PM   #2
The_Maker
Veteran
 
The_Maker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 966
I would think new character because it would be too complicated to have all of the right settings/inventory/influence from the Exile in K2.


The_Maker is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-08-2005, 08:39 PM   #3
Commas
Junior Member
 
Commas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: If you're going to San Francisco, Be sure to wear some flowers in your hair...
Posts: 320
i cast my vote for the exile in K3. i think it just makes the most sense concerning where the state of the KOTOR story was at the end of K2. a new character would be way to much of a stretch, for me anyway. besides, the exile's condition makes him the perfect canidate because he is the only one where it would any make sense that he starts back over at level 1, since he got his force from his partymembers and he left to follow revan without them. without anyone to make bonds with an leech the force from he would have to go back to square one until some partymembers join. playing as revan would mean you'd have to start at like, level 50 with a billion force powers (what, you think he hasn't been leveling up while he was away? you can't buy tacos with that xp) and part of the fun of kotor is building your character during those level ups. revan starting at level 1 again would make absolutley no sense at all. i am all for seeing revan as an NPC and maybe even having him join me in the party near the end for the final battle (how freakin cool would that be, the exile and revan fighting side by side against whatever the final boss would be) but as far as PCs go, i want the exile.


Zaphod Beeblebrox is my hero
DOWNLOAD THE STUFF I MADE!
Commas is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-08-2005, 08:42 PM   #4
eopiesdoor
Rookie
 
eopiesdoor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 25
I think they will probably make you be the exile, but I would like to be a new character and end up with the exile and revan in your party.
eopiesdoor is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-08-2005, 09:31 PM   #5
lukeiamyourdad
Using Teletraan I
 
lukeiamyourdad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Montréal, Québec, Canada
Posts: 8,274
LFN Staff Member 
No Revan in party. No Exile in party. New cast of characters including your PC but keep Mandalore and the droids. Because they're cool

@Commas
The Exile starting at square one doesn't make sense either. The explanation behind him starting at lvl 1 in TSL is an exile.
He/she almost had forgotten how the Force felt. He/she forgot a lot of what he/she learned when he/she was a Jedi. So even if he/she had no party member with him, he/she'd have at least a lot of knowledge about the Force to leech off whatever he/she can find.
He/she would instantly regain his/her full potential at the presence of a Force strong enemy or ally.
What I mean is that he/she'd have to unlearn what he/she has learned in order to start at square one.

Nevertheless, I think that he would bring some of his friends/disciples with him/her.


http://www.marioramos.ca/ -A friend of mine and an aspiring filmmaker.
lukeiamyourdad is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-08-2005, 09:41 PM   #6
eopiesdoor
Rookie
 
eopiesdoor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 25
I have to agree with you about the droids. They are a must have! I think the little one should play a key roll in the new character finding Revan and the exile (but that is just what I want for the next game)
eopiesdoor is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-08-2005, 09:49 PM   #7
90SK
Universal Figment
 
90SK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Somewhere...
Posts: 4,382
Current Game: Tetris
I would assume that the PC would be the Exile. Like DarthMoeller said: OE just sort of left us hanging around in K2. It's a great setup for the sequel, though I do agree with lukeiamyourdad that it would be difficult to justify the Exile having to re-learn everything. I suppose it's theasable that he would loose all the inventory from the last game, but the apperence/skills would be difficult to duplicate.

90SK is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-08-2005, 10:20 PM   #8
Jeff
Rating: Awesome
 
Jeff's Avatar
 
Status: Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
Posts: 8,431
Current Game: SWTOR
Imperialist Meatbags Guild Officer The Walking Carpets Guild Officer Notable contributor LFN Staff Member 
Well, you can still make him start at say level 25 or so, or maybe even give us the option to import our exile character from tsl. This is just an example, but in Baldur's Gate II if you don't have baldur's gate I you create a new character, and he/she starts at level 15 i think, or you can import your character if you have BG I. I think this system would be cool for tsl.


Follow me on Twitter
Follow StarWarsMMO.net on Twitter | Like us on Facebook
Jeff is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-08-2005, 10:27 PM   #9
lukeiamyourdad
Using Teletraan I
 
lukeiamyourdad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Montréal, Québec, Canada
Posts: 8,274
LFN Staff Member 
Wouldn't it be more interesting if they created a new character with a different background?


http://www.marioramos.ca/ -A friend of mine and an aspiring filmmaker.
lukeiamyourdad is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-08-2005, 10:31 PM   #10
Jeff
Rating: Awesome
 
Jeff's Avatar
 
Status: Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
Posts: 8,431
Current Game: SWTOR
Imperialist Meatbags Guild Officer The Walking Carpets Guild Officer Notable contributor LFN Staff Member 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lukeiamyourdad
Wouldn't it be more interesting if they created a new character with a different background?
It might be, but I don't think that the Exile's story is complete (and obviously it isn't). But maybe you're right. I haven't even voted yet so I can see if others opinions can sway my view.


Follow me on Twitter
Follow StarWarsMMO.net on Twitter | Like us on Facebook
Jeff is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-08-2005, 10:33 PM   #11
lukeiamyourdad
Using Teletraan I
 
lukeiamyourdad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Montréal, Québec, Canada
Posts: 8,274
LFN Staff Member 
I remember how a lot of people wanted to play Revan again yet were pleasently surprise with the Exile.

Revan's story isn't over either, we'll probably get to see the end of both their stories in KotOR 3.


http://www.marioramos.ca/ -A friend of mine and an aspiring filmmaker.
lukeiamyourdad is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-08-2005, 11:35 PM   #12
IndianaSolo
Rookie
 
IndianaSolo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Tatooine
Posts: 193
New character.

I'll be upset if it's one of Revan or the Exile.
IndianaSolo is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 12:17 AM   #13
RedHawke
Shadow Lord Of The Sith™
 
RedHawke's Avatar
 
Status: Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Stormreach CA.
Posts: 9,184
Current Game: DDO, Stormreach
Quote:
Originally Posted by lukeiamyourdad
Wouldn't it be more interesting if they created a new character with a different background?
Yes it would, also it is necissary in the realm of RPG's...

@ DarthMoeller, think of each game as an individual campaign... and as such, each player should start a new character at level one, so as to give the one creating the story the ability to properly balance out the game. Having a new campaign where you allow previously made up high-level characters is sheer folly, one that the player actually will soon regret...

Would you rather start the game having to play through the story and build your character up through the levels for the final confrentation... and happily play for 40+hours doing so?

Or do you want to start with a level 30 Revan or Exile, with very little game to play because you are allready ready for the games final encounter from the beginning? What is the point of the game this way?

Should we see Revan and the Exile in K3? Yes.
Should we be able to get them as party members? No.
Should they play a part in the game? Yes.

Just my 2 cents!


"Beware the form-fitting black armor-clad Drow hottie with twin Mineral II Greensteel Khopeshes!"
"Liella d'Orien says, '"You're the fool, Devil. -- Witness the power of this fully ARMED and OPERATIONAL Titan!"'"
----------------------------------------------------------------------
RedHawke is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 12:25 AM   #14
Jeff
Rating: Awesome
 
Jeff's Avatar
 
Status: Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
Posts: 8,431
Current Game: SWTOR
Imperialist Meatbags Guild Officer The Walking Carpets Guild Officer Notable contributor LFN Staff Member 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedHawke
Would you rather start the game having to play through the story and build your character up through the levels for the final confrentation... and happily play for 40+hours doing so?

Or do you want to start with a level 30 Revan or Exile, with very little game to play because you are allready ready for the games final encounter from the beginning? What is the point of the game this way?
I do like the sound of the 40+ hours idea, but just because you're already a high level doesn't mean you can't get higher. If they would do it like that, it would be like starting at level one in terms of game difficulty, you would just have more powers available to you. They could still make it a long and enjoyable game.

Though I am starting to learn towards your side of things...


Follow me on Twitter
Follow StarWarsMMO.net on Twitter | Like us on Facebook
Jeff is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 12:45 AM   #15
lukeiamyourdad
Using Teletraan I
 
lukeiamyourdad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Montréal, Québec, Canada
Posts: 8,274
LFN Staff Member 
I don't know. The fun of both KotOR games was training a newbie in the ways of the Force. Even with more difficulty, it wouldn't feel like I'm building up a character, just slightly improving his battle capabilities.
To me, it's no different then having a preset character.


http://www.marioramos.ca/ -A friend of mine and an aspiring filmmaker.
lukeiamyourdad is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 02:40 AM   #16
RedHawke
Shadow Lord Of The Sith™
 
RedHawke's Avatar
 
Status: Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Stormreach CA.
Posts: 9,184
Current Game: DDO, Stormreach
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarthMoeller
I do like the sound of the 40+ hours idea, but just because you're already a high level doesn't mean you can't get higher.
When designing a game, and depending greatly on the type of game, there are four types of players you need to try to have features to cater to, according to Bartle's Player Types.
Quote:
Here is a brief summary of Bartle's 4 Types:

- Achievers are driven by in-game goals, usually some form of points gathering - whether experience points, levels, or money.

- Explorers are driven to find out as much as they can about the virtual construct - including mapping its geography and understanding the game mechanics.

- Socializers use the virtual construct to converse and role-play with their fellow gamers.

- Killers use the virtual construct to cause distress on other players, and gain satisfaction from inflicting anxiety and pain on others.
So by having a pre-made character you are alienating a large percentage of your RPG game player base, mainly the Achiever players.

The Explorers and Socializers, pre-made characters would hamper their expiriences as well... Explorers because the game would be shorter, and the Socializers because the character would have less time for RP conversation options. (Yes, with pre-made characters the game would be very much shorter than with a level one character... hence hurting these player types expiriences as well.)

The Killers Player Type are not ones who would normally play an SP RPG but if they do then combat would be their focus, or they become one of the other three types while playing one.

In the end though, having pre-made characters in the game is alienating a minimum 33% of your target audience, by removing the Achievers Player Types goals is a form of marketing suicide.

Just some more food for thought.


"Beware the form-fitting black armor-clad Drow hottie with twin Mineral II Greensteel Khopeshes!"
"Liella d'Orien says, '"You're the fool, Devil. -- Witness the power of this fully ARMED and OPERATIONAL Titan!"'"
----------------------------------------------------------------------
RedHawke is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 09:40 AM   #17
eopiesdoor
Rookie
 
eopiesdoor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 25
I could be wrong, but wouldn't the Exile have lost all his power after he left his friends? If he was feeding of them to fuel the force?

Or was that from the people he killed?
eopiesdoor is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 11:21 AM   #18
lukeiamyourdad
Using Teletraan I
 
lukeiamyourdad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Montréal, Québec, Canada
Posts: 8,274
LFN Staff Member 
I think it's a bit of both.
Like I said previously, even if he lost them, he would still have the knowledge as opposed to his exile, where he forgot everything.
The second he comes into the presence of somebody who's strong in the Force, he'd regain much of his ability.
Remember that power and knowledge are two distinct elements.


http://www.marioramos.ca/ -A friend of mine and an aspiring filmmaker.
lukeiamyourdad is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 12:14 PM   #19
Commas
Junior Member
 
Commas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: If you're going to San Francisco, Be sure to wear some flowers in your hair...
Posts: 320
hes basically going back into exile though, and i think the fact that after regaining the force and then realizing all too late that he's lost it again by leaving his friends behind would devestate the exile, it was one final manipulation/betrayal by Kreia. She was defeated by the exile and now could never complete her goal, but she still had influence over him, enough to betray him one last time by making him leave without his friends, thereby leaving without the force. it was kreia's ultimate revenge.

if anything i think the exile's condition was all too convient for him to be the PC in the next game. OE was thinking ahead.


Zaphod Beeblebrox is my hero
DOWNLOAD THE STUFF I MADE!
Commas is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 12:17 PM   #20
TheOssusKeeper
Forumite
 
TheOssusKeeper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Missouri, USA
Posts: 534
i think they should continue with the exile... they pretty much left everything hanging at the end of k2...


TheOssusKeeper is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 12:58 PM   #21
Darth Havok
Rookie
 
Darth Havok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 41
Exclamation Revan's Demise

Quote:
Originally Posted by DarthMoeller
Obsidian left the door so wide open for the Exile going after Revan, it just makes sense to have the Exile again.
As far as I know, Darth Sion hints to revan being dead at the end of KOTOR 2. Revan went to the trayus academy, and was killed. Thats what I understood of it at least.


If I run out of Admirals, I'll just promote a few stormtroopers!
Darth Havok is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 02:03 PM   #22
Hermie
vs. The World.
 
Hermie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: on a highway to hell
Posts: 1,319
Current Game: On the top of it.
Forum Veteran 
Having the Exile back would be a poor choice. That would mean that you can't meet a most of the TSL characters again, because the game wouldnt know what releationship you had with all the individual characters. Also, a new character would, together with Revan and the Exile, make a powerhouse trio. How awsome isn't that?


Hermie is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 02:30 PM   #23
Darth333
Administraterror
 
Darth333's Avatar
 
Status: Administrator
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: In my secret dungeon...
Posts: 8,292
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Havok
As far as I know, Darth Sion hints to revan being dead at the end of KOTOR 2. Revan went to the trayus academy, and was killed. Thats what I understood of it at least.
huh? I never had that impression. Did you ask Traya about it?

Here are some dialogue excerpts:

Player: What happens now?
DT: It is your choice. I had hoped you would follow Revan's path, but you and Revan are... different, and your path is your own.

You may take one of the ships that orbit Malachor and depart this place. Or you may remain here on Malachor, and wait for the others, those touched by the Force, who will come in time.

[...]blablabla

Player: I will follow Revan, as I did a decade ago.
DT: Very well. There is nothing holding you here, not any longer.

DT: And then Speaking of Mandalore: Many battles does that one have left in him... as Revan intended. A general needs an army, as he needs those he trusts.

========

And there are those dialogues with Mandalore when you have enough influence:

M: After defeating Malak, Revan made the decision that he would travel to the Unknown Regions. He was searching for something.I wanted to go with him. I respected him, knew he could use me where he was going.But Revan refused, saying that he must travel alone.

Player: What does that have to do with the clans?

If DS:
M: When I offered to go with him... he laughed. Then, he attacked me. Revan, at his full power, was more than a match for me. The battle was over quickly - and then he made sure I couldn't follow him, even if I wanted to. He left me there, a broken wreck on the Outer Rim.I vowed that I would never bend knee to another. Any alliances I entered in to would be ones where I was an equal.

Player: Why would Revan attack you?

M: I'm not sure Revan knew himself. But at that moment, I think he had a reason. When he returns, though, I will be ready for him. With the full might of the Mandalorian clans at my back.

If LS:
M: Before he (Revan) departed, he left me with a simple mission. He told me where I could find the Mandalore's helmet, and that I must take it and reassemble the clans...

======

I think it should be a new character. Pursuing as the exile would surely be fun as the story was left quite opened in K2. However, I think it would be hard to explain how the exile could loose his/her force powers again to start at lvl 1... (same goes for Revan). And there's no point in starting a RPG at lvl 28...
Darth333 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 03:44 PM   #24
lukeiamyourdad
Using Teletraan I
 
lukeiamyourdad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Montréal, Québec, Canada
Posts: 8,274
LFN Staff Member 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commas
hes basically going back into exile though, and i think the fact that after regaining the force and then realizing all too late that he's lost it again by leaving his friends behind would devestate the exile, it was one final manipulation/betrayal by Kreia. She was defeated by the exile and now could never complete her goal, but she still had influence over him, enough to betray him one last time by making him leave without his friends, thereby leaving without the force. it was kreia's ultimate revenge.

if anything i think the exile's condition was all too convient for him to be the PC in the next game. OE was thinking ahead.
But that does explain why he would lose any knowledge of the Force. Also, there's absolutely no indication that none of his friends followed him.
The Exile leeches his powers from others, the second he would encounter someone capable enough, he'd regain full capabilities. It's not like he suddenly forgot how to use Force Heal.


http://www.marioramos.ca/ -A friend of mine and an aspiring filmmaker.
lukeiamyourdad is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 04:06 PM   #25
Commas
Junior Member
 
Commas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: If you're going to San Francisco, Be sure to wear some flowers in your hair...
Posts: 320
i'm not suggesting he loses his knowledge, only that he loses his ability, without others he cannot use the force, and kreia was his primary sorce of the force as they were very closely bonded, even if some of the party members come with him, they are lowly padawans who are just starting to touch upon their abilities in the force, they wouldn't be enought to keep the exile at his full capacity, so no he wouldn't lose the knowledge of how to cast the higher spells, he loses the ability to cast them. he doesnt have enough force energy on his own to be able to cast a force power such as master heal or force storm, he needs to go back to down to the lesser powers until he finds someone strong in the force he can leech off of.

but you and i have both said our opinions, and while i respect yours, i happen to disagree with it, so i am going to try to keep this from turning into one of those things where we just keep saying the same stuff over and over again and suggest that we just agree to disagree. personally, in the K3 that i want to see made, i would want to continue on as the exile, i feel like his story is not complete yet. you would rather not, and thats ok with me i'm just saying what i'd like to see and my reasoning for why i would rather have that.


Zaphod Beeblebrox is my hero
DOWNLOAD THE STUFF I MADE!
Commas is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 04:25 PM   #26
lukeiamyourdad
Using Teletraan I
 
lukeiamyourdad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Montréal, Québec, Canada
Posts: 8,274
LFN Staff Member 
His padawans would grow in power and so he would regain much more too. Even without Kreia, it would not explain why the Exile would start at lvl 1 with a single Force power. The Exile would have to start pretty powerful with already a wide array of Force powers.
Also, there's a VP problem. What would explain the Exile starting at 50 VP when he could have close to 500? He started to eat a lot of junk food? This was also an inconsistency problem with T3 starting at lvl 3.

This is not going to turn into some debate where positions are inflexible. If there can be a good and valid reason why the Exile could be K3's PC, then I'll consider it. Right now, it's near undoable, wouldn't make much sense story wise and you're stuck with an inconsistency problem with your main character. Besides, you try to come up with new arguments with the assurance that either through the number of good arguments you have or their quality will make the opposition bend. That's the fun of it.
Of course, it can be "just" opinions but we're not debating about whether or not we want something but whether or not what we want is possible (whoa I just confused myself there).


http://www.marioramos.ca/ -A friend of mine and an aspiring filmmaker.
lukeiamyourdad is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 04:37 PM   #27
Commas
Junior Member
 
Commas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: If you're going to San Francisco, Be sure to wear some flowers in your hair...
Posts: 320
well, i'd like for K3 to start roughly right where K2 ends, not enought time for any padawans that may or may not be with the exile to really get much stronger than they were in K2. if a few years has passed since the end of K2, i could imagine them stronger, but the state the are at the end of K2 would not be enough, and thats considering the exile would bring them along, which i dont think he will. like i said, i think kreia planned it like that, to leave the exile stranded in the unknown region without the force.

i always just always chalked that up to T3 being really badly damaged. but remember they also did the same thing with
spoiler:
canderous, it didn't really matter how much you leveled him or how much vp he had he had in K1, when mandalore joins the party he's a level 6 soildier, having to relearn exactly the same feats you taught him in K1. if anything canderous has only become more powerful since the end of K1, hes freakin mandalore now.
but now one ever seemed to care to much about that, while its a pretty big inconsistancy between K1 and K2, no one ever really notices it.


Zaphod Beeblebrox is my hero
DOWNLOAD THE STUFF I MADE!
Commas is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 04:42 PM   #28
lukeiamyourdad
Using Teletraan I
 
lukeiamyourdad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Montréal, Québec, Canada
Posts: 8,274
LFN Staff Member 
Oh I noticed it.
Refer to D333's earlier post. He got crippled by Revan. Also, if you talk to him, he says that he's getting older and has to rely a lot on his armor and his implants. It does provide a certain explanation of why he would be weaker. He's no Jedi, he can't pull a Yoda or a Palpatine.


http://www.marioramos.ca/ -A friend of mine and an aspiring filmmaker.
lukeiamyourdad is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 04:47 PM   #29
Mira Dona
Rookie
 
Mira Dona's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hiding in your house
Posts: 133
I think it should be a new character. After all, that is one of the elements which has been so enjoyable for the first two games. So why "fix" what isn't broken?

Having a new character is the best way to maintain that element and allow for the inclusion of the first two characters that everyone has come to love. Sure their stories are as of yet unresolved, but wouldn't it make for a more engaging player experiance to help Revan and the Exile finish those stories while looking at things through their own perspective?

You AGAIN get to chose your own alignment greating a new hero or villian male or female. Think of all the different scenarios that would come, LS Revan, DS Exile, or vise versa, perhaps both DS or both LS with varied gender match ups in conjunction with your new character. The replay value of those things alone would make for a great game experiance considereing all the various options and changes that could occur.
Mira Dona is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 04:50 PM   #30
Commas
Junior Member
 
Commas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: If you're going to San Francisco, Be sure to wear some flowers in your hair...
Posts: 320
hes only crippled if your revan was DS, mine was LS, and still why would he forget how to do a master flurry or a rapid shot. he hasn't lost the knowledge, he hasn't even really lost the ability like the exile would in the force, as you can teach him those feats again. so while they did give some explaination to why he went from level 20 to level 6, it doesnt really explain why he can go from level 6 to level 36. basically they worked with what they had, they wanted him back in the game, so the needed a reason why he could be such a low level and they made one. i think they did the same with the exile, but instead of having to make some weird tacked on explaination in K3 they thought ahead and introduced a concept that would allow them to start fresh in K3 with the same character. when you think about it, it seems just a tad convenient that he gets his force from his friends, but at the end of the game he is supposed to be leaving without them, his only source of the force (hehe i made a rhyme )


Zaphod Beeblebrox is my hero
DOWNLOAD THE STUFF I MADE!
Commas is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 06:54 PM   #31
Darth Havok
Rookie
 
Darth Havok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 41
Darth, Remember when you see carth, and he asks you to find out what happened to reven? Well, in the final encounter with Sion, you can ask him about revan, and he will tell you that revan is dead. Im pretty sure. Check it out


If I run out of Admirals, I'll just promote a few stormtroopers!
Darth Havok is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 07:03 PM   #32
Jeff
Rating: Awesome
 
Jeff's Avatar
 
Status: Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
Posts: 8,431
Current Game: SWTOR
Imperialist Meatbags Guild Officer The Walking Carpets Guild Officer Notable contributor LFN Staff Member 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Havok
Darth, Remember when you see carth, and he asks you to find out what happened to reven? Well, in the final encounter with Sion, you can ask him about revan, and he will tell you that revan is dead. Im pretty sure. Check it out
Thats what he says, but who knows better, Kreia, a Sith Lord, or Carth? Clearly Kreia would know if he was dead or not.


Follow me on Twitter
Follow StarWarsMMO.net on Twitter | Like us on Facebook
Jeff is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 09:35 PM   #33
lukeiamyourdad
Using Teletraan I
 
lukeiamyourdad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Montréal, Québec, Canada
Posts: 8,274
LFN Staff Member 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commas
i think they did the same with the exile, but instead of having to make some weird tacked on explaination in K3 they thought ahead and introduced a concept that would allow them to start fresh in K3 with the same character. when you think about it, it seems just a tad convenient that he gets his force from his friends, but at the end of the game he is supposed to be leaving without them, his only source of the force (hehe i made a rhyme )
I'm going to have to agree with you about Mandalore but here's something that's absolutely weird.
If he leaves his source of the Force, wouldn't it be pure suicide to go to the Unknown Regions, basically defenseless? The VP is still a problem as there can be no explanation as to why he'd start at lvl 1 with 50 VP. They surely didn't plan that.
Also, you can't really choose your alignment anymore can you? I mean, why are you grey at the start? You'd have to choose your alignment in the character creation screen. A tad forced.
But getting back to his source for Force power, it's such a central element of the game. It would sound weird that it's only so you can play as him in K3.

I think that if it does sound like a convenience, it would be more of a coincidence then anything else.


http://www.marioramos.ca/ -A friend of mine and an aspiring filmmaker.
lukeiamyourdad is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-09-2005, 10:04 PM   #34
IndianaSolo
Rookie
 
IndianaSolo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Tatooine
Posts: 193
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mira Dona
Having a new character is the best way to maintain that element and allow for the inclusion of the first two characters that everyone has come to love. Sure their stories are as of yet unresolved, but wouldn't it make for a more engaging player experiance to help Revan and the Exile finish those stories while looking at things through their own perspective?
It also makes it easier for the storyteller to write a story, and make it a good story. If he has to worry about taking into account everything that's happened in previous games for Revan or the Exile, the story is more "fixed" and he can't let his creative juices flow.

New characters mean that he can pretty much make up the entire backstory, and the reasons for why this character is in the position they find themselves.
IndianaSolo is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-10-2005, 01:42 AM   #35
Commas
Junior Member
 
Commas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: If you're going to San Francisco, Be sure to wear some flowers in your hair...
Posts: 320
Quote:
Originally Posted by lukeiamyourdad
I'm going to have to agree with you about Mandalore but here's something that's absolutely weird.
If he leaves his source of the Force, wouldn't it be pure suicide to go to the Unknown Regions, basically defenseless? The VP is still a problem as there can be no explanation as to why he'd start at lvl 1 with 50 VP. They surely didn't plan that.
Also, you can't really choose your alignment anymore can you? I mean, why are you grey at the start? You'd have to choose your alignment in the character creation screen. A tad forced.
But getting back to his source for Force power, it's such a central element of the game. It would sound weird that it's only so you can play as him in K3.

I think that if it does sound like a convenience, it would be more of a coincidence then anything else.
ok, i will concede the VP issue to you, but i think there is still room for alignment change. a jedi can fall to the darkside at anytime, and while its very hard to bring someone back from the darkside, its not impossible, revan returned to the light, juhani, bastila, Darth Vader, one of the most evil sith lords ever returned to the Light. i think that if the exile ended K2 as LS for example, having just reconnected with the force and then realizing that he was cut off from it all over again, but not realizing it would until after he had left his friends far behind and began to feel the effects of being cutoff once more would be so devestating he would hate Kreia for manipulating him one more time. He had just got it back, and she took it away from him, whats even worse, he fell for it, it could have been prevented by not listening to her. perhaps you wouldn't start the game as grey, but i never really understood why the exile started as grey in K2 in the first place. the lightside and the darkside are more than just what force powers you choose to use, its how you live your life, which is why canderous and hk and go-to are inherently dark despite not being force users. i would think that even tho he was exiled, he would have remained light/dark in his exile. even jolee who lived alone and did not associate himself with the jedi order for years and years still leaned toward the light a little bit. the exile's alignment would not nessisarly have to be set during character creation, it could be set the same way revan's alignment is in K2. at the beginning of the game there is a dialogue, where you would set revan's alignment and gender, and thru dialogue choices you could gain darkside/lightside points by the response you choose, the same way you would in any other dialogue. maybe you're exile wouldn't go all the way back to mastery, but you could continue him along the same alignment, and there is potential for him to fall, especially if the game desides to make light/dark choices more complex. K2 touched upon this a bit, with kreia saying helping others all the time may not always be best for them. but i want darkside points to be incredible subtle in K3. i want to gain them on accident when i think i'm doing the right thing, instead of being able to avoid them easily by just not choosing the obvious "give me money, and then i'll kill you" options.

one more thing that would bother me about a new character: we can pretty much count on the droids and the ebon hawk returning, am i to believe that this new guy who is going to get pulled into this adventure just happened to come into posession of the same ship and same driods again? i mean the return of the hawk in K2 was a stretch already, i'd rather not have to make that stretch again.

edit: oh my god thats long! i'd understand if no one wants to bother to read all that crap


Zaphod Beeblebrox is my hero
DOWNLOAD THE STUFF I MADE!
Commas is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-10-2005, 02:17 AM   #36
lukeiamyourdad
Using Teletraan I
 
lukeiamyourdad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Montréal, Québec, Canada
Posts: 8,274
LFN Staff Member 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commas
but i think there is still room for alignment change. a jedi can fall to the darkside at anytime, and while its very hard to bring someone back from the darkside, its not impossible, revan returned to the light, juhani, bastila, Darth Vader, one of the most evil sith lords ever returned to the Light.
It took them quite a shock to return to the light. Revan lost his memory, Vader saw his son being crippled and Juhani was defeated in combat. Far from the simple things KotOR throws at you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Commas
i think that if the exile ended K2 as LS for example, having just reconnected with the force and then realizing that he was cut off from it all over again, but not realizing it would until after he had left his friends far behind and began to feel the effects of being cutoff once more would be so devestating he would hate Kreia for manipulating him one more time. He had just got it back, and she took it away from him, whats even worse, he fell for it, it could have been prevented by not listening to her.
A possibility. Or he could do the Jedi thing and forgive her. But a viable possibility nonetheless.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Commas
perhaps you wouldn't start the game as grey, but i never really understood why the exile started as grey in K2 in the first place. the lightside and the darkside are more than just what force powers you choose to use, its how you live your life, which is why canderous and hk and go-to are inherently dark despite not being force users. i would think that even tho he was exiled, he would have remained light/dark in his exile. even jolee who lived alone and did not associate himself with the jedi order for years and years still leaned toward the light a little bit.
It was more a gameplay reason than anything else. Had he started as a lightsider, darksider would've had a hard time going dark while the opposite is also true. They left it so you could decide which side you'd lean too.
It is your character so you decide that. Since there's no indication of how the Exile was before the beginning of TSL, you cannot decide on a starting alignment. The compromise is therefore a grey alignment.
It will be quite different for K3 if the Exile is reintroduced since he has to start as either light or dark and you must decide at the beginning.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Commas
the exile's alignment would not nessisarly have to be set during character creation, it could be set the same way revan's alignment is in K2. at the beginning of the game there is a dialogue, where you would set revan's alignment and gender, and thru dialogue choices you could gain darkside/lightside points by the response you choose, the same way you would in any other dialogue. maybe you're exile wouldn't go all the way back to mastery, but you could continue him along the same alignment, and there is potential for him to fall, especially if the game desides to make light/dark choices more complex.
This will not be possible if facial differences between light or dark. For a second, you have the "grey" face and suddenly you zombie up? It would feel very forced.
The only way this could work would be through a dialogue between an NPC and somebody else.
Now we have T3 and HK who have the most chances of returning as NPCs (less chance that Canderous comes back though highly possible, but not as much as the droids). T3 can't talk and HK is a psychopath. Killing first, talking later. Don't know why he'd be in a conversation with a stranger either.
So that leaves you with a new NPC. Not a very good way to introduce a new character.
Or else, they decide to reuse another old NPC (yay diversity!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Commas
K2 touched upon this a bit, with kreia saying helping others all the time may not always be best for them. but i want darkside points to be incredible subtle in K3.
Though a morally challenging situation is quite interesting, it's the thing that bothered me a bit with TSL being "Star Wars-y". Star Wars seperates the light and the dark quite clearly. Alec Guiness said something about liking Star Wars because those two opposites were so clearly defined. I don't want it to become so complex that light and dark are greatly blurred. It would be bad for the Star Wars experience.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Commas
i want to gain them on accident when i think i'm doing the right thing, instead of being able to avoid them easily by just not choosing the obvious "give me money, and then i'll kill you" options.
But would you get Dark Side points for trying to do the right thing? You wanted to do something good, but made a bad decision and made a mistake.
A mistake is not voluntarily made thus Dark Side points are not justified in such a situation.
See, that's blurring the lines.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Commas
one more thing that would bother me about a new character: we can pretty much count on the droids and the ebon hawk returning, am i to believe that this new guy who is going to get pulled into this adventure just happened to come into posession of the same ship and same driods again? i mean the return of the hawk in K2 was a stretch already, i'd rather not have to make that stretch again.
Yes. Afterall, Luke Skywalker somehow planned that R2 would end up on Jabba's Barge in order to give him his lightsaber. Things happen
Seriously though, it would not be that hard. It depends on what happens after the end of TSL. At the end of KotOR, Revan sent T3 back with the Ebon Hawk to accomplish some mission (perhaps finding the Exile but we'll never truly know) and wiped HK's memory.
Perhaps the same thing could happen again. T3 is sent on a mission by the Exile for some reason and HK accompanies him (or is diactivated and stored on board).
The Force works in weird ways though, it might be its will that you find the Hawk.
Remember though, if you actually play as the Exile, you'd have to start with two pretty strong droids at your side, considering he took them with him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Commas
edit: oh my god thats long! i'd understand if no one wants to bother to read all that crap
Paragraphs help


http://www.marioramos.ca/ -A friend of mine and an aspiring filmmaker.
lukeiamyourdad is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-10-2005, 03:11 AM   #37
Commas
Junior Member
 
Commas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: If you're going to San Francisco, Be sure to wear some flowers in your hair...
Posts: 320
ok, maybe accidentle dark side points blur the line too much, but kotor's darkside options have always been blatently obvious and utterly stupid. they always just consist of killing/threatening/demanding extra credits, and make me out to be more of a thug than what i consider a "sith lord" to be. when i played K2 darkside for the first time and was presented the option of choosing sith lord as a prestige class i really didnt feal i deserved such a title, i was a punk. my darkside character might as well have been a gammorean, he acted basically the same. but this is getting way off topic.

so anyway, i'm sorry about arguing with you for so long over this. i hope you don't mind, but i think i'm just going to be done. no offense, but i'm kinda tired of debating. nothing against you or anything, you are a great debater and made really great arguments, (seriously, i hope you don't think i'm a dick, i considered this just a freindly debate) but i've stated how i feel on it, and so have you, and i'm ok with us disagreeing. besides, i can be kinda stubborn . but basically i'm just kinda over it, ya know? i hope you understand. i can only do internet debates for so long, its probably just my ADD acting up in the end i'll buy whatever game they decide to make anyway, so it doesnt really matter. for the record when there were K2 discussions swirling around after K1 and everyone was like "god i really want the PC to be Revan again, it will suck if its not Revan" i was on the other side of the fence, i was the one who was rooting for there to be a new PC, as i didn't think Revan would work again as a PC. However, i enjoyed the exile's story far more than i enjoyed revan's, and while revan's story was wrapped up nicely with a bow, the exile's was left hanging and i felt like too much was left incomplete at the end of K2, and i wouldn't be voting for the exile if i didn't really believe it could be pulled off without too many leaps of faith. clearly you think that there are too many leaps of faith, this is just us having different opinions, and thats ok with me.

so, we cool? truce?

oh and sorry about the lack of paragraphs, sometimes i just type like i talk, ya know


Zaphod Beeblebrox is my hero
DOWNLOAD THE STUFF I MADE!
Commas is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-10-2005, 03:38 PM   #38
lukeiamyourdad
Using Teletraan I
 
lukeiamyourdad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Montréal, Québec, Canada
Posts: 8,274
LFN Staff Member 
Alright were good

I don't think low of you, on the contrary. You stood your ground a lot longer and didn't turn it into a flame war.
I'm getting tired of it myself.

Oh well.


http://www.marioramos.ca/ -A friend of mine and an aspiring filmmaker.
lukeiamyourdad is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-10-2005, 05:08 PM   #39
Mira Dona
Rookie
 
Mira Dona's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hiding in your house
Posts: 133
Quote:
Originally Posted by IndianaSolo
It also makes it easier for the storyteller to write a story, and make it a good story. If he has to worry about taking into account everything that's happened in previous games for Revan or the Exile, the story is more "fixed" and he can't let his creative juices flow.
Thats both true and not so much. I think you are forgetting that a story for the Exile and Revan will most likely have to be written anyway in order to explain what they have been up to or what they are suspected of having been up too since niether story is finished. So knowledge of the previous stories (light and dark) is a nessescity (wow I KNOW I spelled that wrong). While the new writers could omit such a thing, I don't think they will since it would upset a lot of fans from the first two games.

However you are right in that they will have more free riegn with a whole new PC, and I think in the end that that will make it much easier for the writers to deliver a good (hopfully great) story.


"Some see how things are and ask, 'Why?' I dream of things that have never been and ask, 'Why not?'" - Robert F. Kennedy



In my mind's eye, 3P0.
Mira Dona is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 08-11-2005, 09:22 PM   #40
Vladimir-Vlada
Counselor Idealist
 
Vladimir-Vlada's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Republic Serbia and Monenegro, Belgrade
Posts: 1,553
I would vote for both, but I would really like:

REVAN!
Who do we like? Revan!
Who do we love? Revan!
Who is the best? REVAN!

Vladimir-Vlada is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Post a new thread. Add a reply to this thread. Indicate all threads in this forum as read. Subscribe to this forum. RSS feed: this forum RSS feed: all forums
Go Back   LucasForums > Network > Knights of the Old Republic > Game Discussion > The Unknown Regions > PC For KotOR III?

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:18 PM.

LFNetwork, LLC ©2002-2011 - All rights reserved.
Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.