lfnetwork.com mark read register faq members calendar
View Poll Results: Well, what do you think?
Great idea! 124 67.76%
Crappy idea! 59 32.24%
Voters: 183. You may not vote on this poll


Thread: Star Wars vs. Star Trek: THE MOD!
Thread Tools Display Modes
Post a new thread. Add a reply to this thread. Indicate all threads in this forum as read. Subscribe to this forum. RSS feed: this forum RSS feed: all forums
Old 09-08-2005, 10:45 PM   #1
Kurgan
Headhunter
 
Kurgan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 1997
Location: The Dawn of Time
Posts: 18,316
LFN Staff Member 10 year veteran! 
Post Star Wars vs. Star Trek: THE MOD!

Please, please tell me somebody is interested in doing this!

Just imagine, the ultimate battle of franchises! The mighty Galactic Empire vs. all of the fleets of Star Trek, in a battle to the death!

Imagine commanding a small but elite Imperial Expeditionary Force into the Milky Way Galaxy, hopping from planet to planet invading this mysterious "Federation." Fight the Klingons, the Romulans, Cardassians, the Dominion, the Borg! Since the Empire has hyperdrive they could even explore the far reaches of Trek space, and encounter the Hirogen, the Voth, and Species 8472!

Maybe an alternative scenario with the more war-like "Mirror Universe" of trek, with the Terran Empire (the evil version of the Federation). Then you could combine tech from the various factions and give them new weapons and things.

Or perhaps another scenario, you're an Alpha Quadrant alliance force making a desperate manuver against the Empire's elite scout ship. Destroy them and steal their technology! (imagine a Trek version of the assault on the Death Star or the first encounter with the Borg) Maybe something can be learned about this new enemy before it's too late.

It'd be a lot of work, and you'd probably have to make up crap to fill in some of the gaps (Star Trek is pretty skimpy on ground units), but I think it would be worth it, if the right modding tools are released for this game (and it doesn't suck!).

If only I had the time... but feel free to steal my idea!


Download JK2 maps for JA Server|BOOT CAMP!|Strategic Academy|
(JA Server: 108.178.55.189:29070)


"The Concussion Rifle is the weapon of a Jedi Knight Player, an elegant weapon, from a more civilized community." - Kyle Katarn
Kurgan is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 09-20-2005, 04:35 PM   #2
Panzer517
Rookie
 
Panzer517's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 17
btw the mod section seems to be completly dead, maybe its because noone knows about it or can't even see it.


Panzer517 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 09-28-2005, 08:48 PM   #3
RaV™
I Came I Saw I Conquered
 
RaV™'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: On Top Of The World Baby
Posts: 1,490
Well I voted good idea, but now i'm starting to regret that choice when you think about it.


http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/6469/ssigvv2.gif
Changed pic to link. Please find a sig pic that is in line with our sig rules, 500X120 and 80kb max, Forum Rules. ~ SWK Staff
RaV™ is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 09-29-2005, 01:55 AM   #4
Jan Gaarni
Grand Moff
 
Jan Gaarni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,806
LFN Staff Member Forum Veteran 
Or maybe because the game isn't out and we don't know too much about it yet?




Empire At War Moderator
&
SWGalaxies Moderator

- What we do in life, echoes in eternity!
- May the pants be with you!

A smile is the shortest distance between people - Victor Borge!


Custom Avatar by Wraith 8
Jan Gaarni is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 09-29-2005, 09:27 PM   #5
lukeiamyourdad
Using Teletraan I
 
lukeiamyourdad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Montréal, Québec, Canada
Posts: 8,274
LFN Staff Member 
Wow, I can already hear the whining!

"The Star Wars side is overpowered!"

"No you noob! Star Trek is overpowered!"

Interesting idea


http://www.marioramos.ca/ -A friend of mine and an aspiring filmmaker.
lukeiamyourdad is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 10-08-2005, 11:29 AM   #6
Jan Gaarni
Grand Moff
 
Jan Gaarni's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 5,806
LFN Staff Member Forum Veteran 
No, Luke, this is how it will go:

"The Star Wars side is overpowered!"

"No you noob! Star Trek just sucks!"





Empire At War Moderator
&
SWGalaxies Moderator

- What we do in life, echoes in eternity!
- May the pants be with you!

A smile is the shortest distance between people - Victor Borge!


Custom Avatar by Wraith 8
Jan Gaarni is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 10-23-2005, 07:16 PM   #7
vader815
Rookie
 
vader815's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 158
Star wars is not overpowered, see the borg will eventually adapt the imperial technology and use it against them, the brog are literally undefeatable


"Do what must be done, do not hasitate, show no mercy!" ~ Darth Sidious

"Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion I gain strength.
Through strength I gain power.
Through power I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The Force shall free me." ~ Sith Code
vader815 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 10-26-2005, 10:09 PM   #8
WxDude
Rookie
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 83
I think it would be a good idea...however the Star Wars physical weapons will pass right through the defenseive weapons of the Star Trek Universe and the energy weapons of Star Trek will bounce off the shields of the Star Destroyers. I play ST games and their shields are designed to protect from energy only weapons. There are no physical (i.e. Proton Torpedo) in Star Trek.
WxDude is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 11-20-2005, 12:34 PM   #9
CondorFalco
Rookie
 
CondorFalco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 54
There are conventional weapons in ST, but they have become quickly superseeded by Quantum, Energy, Phase and Temporal weapons. Melee combat would be great - Klingons with Bat'Leths and various other things, like from Klingon Honour Guard (old, pretty crap pre Elite Force game). Ground units could be built-upon those ideas from Star Trek New Worlds, a seriously failed ground-based late-TOS era RTS. Space combat would be a bit unmatched in some areas - Victory Star Destroyer would only be able to be taken down by the Kremin Timeship, the Wells Class Timeship, or a combined Borg Tactical Fusion Cube, Prometheus, Soulwolf, D'derex, Akira, Defiant, Qo'Nos class armada (think Borg Incursion from ST:Armada 2 ). Then you get the problem of the Force vs Telepaths/Telekinetics (Betazoids, and the Telekinetics I think were those strange people from TOS) and the Prophets/Pah'Wraiths (DS9) - and lightsabers vs Bat'Leths. Just throwing a few ideas into the pan.

I personally think that ST vs SW has been done to death a bit, especially in the ST gaming circuit. There have been many great ST vs SW TCs, but to have another one would require an immensly dedicated team from before EAW was released. (And as already pointed out, we don't know the modding capabilities yet, but my hope is that they will be great because of the C&C background most of the developing studio has).

I hope I didn't sound to idea flattening...

Condor out.
CondorFalco is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 11-20-2005, 06:20 PM   #10
Jeff
Rating: Awesome
 
Jeff's Avatar
 
Status: Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
Posts: 8,431
Current Game: SWTOR
Imperialist Meatbags Guild Officer The Walking Carpets Guild Officer Notable contributor LFN Staff Member 
It would be interesting at first, but I think all it would really cause would be a lot more hate between ST fans and trekkies because now they have a way to destroy eachother. But I guess it could be fun.


Follow me on Twitter
Follow StarWarsMMO.net on Twitter | Like us on Facebook
Jeff is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 11-20-2005, 08:20 PM   #11
aggie_john
Rookie
 
aggie_john's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 106
Star Wars vs Star trek would be good but you need to define a few things like the time frame.
Me personally I think the Movie era star trek would be better, their more military in their design and planning. I know DS9 had a huge war but the federation was not even close to ready for it. They cought a bunch of huge breaks in that war. Kirks age was ready for a fight on two fronts.
aggie_john is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 11-20-2005, 10:37 PM   #12
lukeiamyourdad
Using Teletraan I
 
lukeiamyourdad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Montréal, Québec, Canada
Posts: 8,274
LFN Staff Member 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Moeller
It would be interesting at first, but I think all it would really cause would be a lot more hate between ST fans and trekkies because now they have a way to destroy eachother. But I guess it could be fun.
Exactly, for once, we can settle on who's mightier then who. Star Wars will win of course
lukeiamyourdad is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 11-20-2005, 11:07 PM   #13
Commander Obi-Wan
Gold Standard
 
Commander Obi-Wan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,363
Current Game: BioShock 2
Forum Veteran 
Quote:
Originally Posted by vader815
Star wars is not overpowered, see the borg will eventually adapt the imperial technology and use it against them, the brog are literally undefeatable
Well, they were just saying how people would argue if it happened, not literally.


Commander Obi-Wan is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 11-22-2005, 12:41 PM   #14
CondorFalco
Rookie
 
CondorFalco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 54
I would love to see a fleet of Scimitars (ST: Nemesis) take on the Victory Star Destroyer and the Death Star . That would be quite fun to watch .
CondorFalco is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 11-26-2005, 05:03 AM   #15
Doc Valentine
Ha-Ha Kotor Modding
 
Doc Valentine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: In the eye of the beholder.
Posts: 1,133
Veteran Modder Helpful! 
Sorry I just dont see a mod like this really working out. I mean the idea is nice but it would probably be a bear to make, and considering we know so little about the game and the areas of modding, the possibilities are quite slim.


I don't need you no more in this world. I'll meet you in the next one, and don't be late.
Doc Valentine is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 11-26-2005, 08:32 AM   #16
Bob Lion54
Jr. Malkavian Detective
 
Bob Lion54's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: On the case! Both my minds!
Posts: 2,103
Forum Veteran Helpful! 
hehe.
I would love to fly into battle with the Enterprise E flanked by a Squaron of X-Wings.


Bob Lion54 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 11-26-2005, 11:34 AM   #17
lukeiamyourdad
Using Teletraan I
 
lukeiamyourdad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Montréal, Québec, Canada
Posts: 8,274
LFN Staff Member 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Lion54
hehe.
I would love to fly into battle with the Enterprise E flanked by a Squaron of X-Wings.

That's just wrong man...just wrong

Oh man...I'm trying to picture it now...nah it's just wrong.
lukeiamyourdad is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 12-10-2005, 03:23 PM   #18
sagasky1864
Lurker
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 6
i want a babylon 5 mod...dont see that around much..
sagasky1864 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 12-10-2005, 05:22 PM   #19
Bob Lion54
Jr. Malkavian Detective
 
Bob Lion54's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: On the case! Both my minds!
Posts: 2,103
Forum Veteran Helpful! 
^^^
hehe. That would be cool. I would have the Enterprise E flanked by a Squadron of X-Wings and a Squadron of Starfighters.

@LIAYD- now its even more wrong


Bob Lion54 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 12-27-2005, 02:10 PM   #20
Stalkerh
Rookie
 
Stalkerh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 31
hmmm.. I still have alot of resources in this area... and a group of people scattered around the world who'de be willing to take a project like this on.

This might be fun in a new game engine.... I'll check and see if anyone from the old STvsSW team for ST:Armada is interested and wants to take it on.


Stalker
Star Wars: Fleet Command Lead Developer
Stalkerh is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-19-2006, 06:04 AM   #21
cpthooker
Lurker
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 1
Well star trek would win any day, I was wanting to do this mod as I have done ships for Star Trek:Bridge Commander, I will know people who might be able to help.
cpthooker is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-19-2006, 06:24 AM   #22
Admiral Sith
Junior Member
 
Admiral Sith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 375
sorry but the largest ship Star Trek as couldnt defeat an Acclamator. Its proven heres a link http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/...veMinutes.html.



"It may be that the old astrologers had the truth exactly reversed, when they believed that the stars controlled the destinies of men. The time may come when men control the destinies of stars." -Arthur C. Clarke

"Ideals are like stars: you will not succeed in touching them with your hands, but like the seafaring man on the ocean desert of waters, you choose them as your guides, and following them, you reach your destiny." -Carl Schurz
Admiral Sith is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-19-2006, 07:41 AM   #23
ActofWar
Rookie
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 51
I never liked the idea of mixing Si-fi like this, so im affriad i vote no
ActofWar is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-19-2006, 07:44 AM   #24
TheGreenGoblin
Junior Member
 
TheGreenGoblin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 292
Quote:
Originally Posted by Admiral Sith
sorry but the largest ship Star Trek as couldnt defeat an Acclamator. Its proven heres a link http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/...veMinutes.html.

For the purposes of a mod, there's no reason they just can't make Wars/Trek roughly on equal footing to each other for the sake of gameplay.
TheGreenGoblin is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-19-2006, 02:31 PM   #25
Teradyn
Rookie
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGreenGoblin
For the purposes of a mod, there's no reason they just can't make Wars/Trek roughly on equal footing to each other for the sake of gameplay.
The minute this is done, it takes away one of the base premises of a mod. The ability to put units into a game without having to worry about sacrificing "realism" for "balance" is something modders can do but companies can not, or will not.
Teradyn is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-19-2006, 03:23 PM   #26
Xyvik
Rookie
 
Xyvik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by Teradyn
The minute this is done, it takes away one of the base premises of a mod. The ability to put units into a game without having to worry about sacrificing "realism" for "balance" is something modders can do but companies can not, or will not.
Which is why a lot of mods are piles of trash that fail less than a week after they are released. If you are attempting to make a multiplayer mod, balance -must- be at the very core of your design decisions, otherwise people will quickly figure out which side is strongest and never bother to play any other side because they would lose. And then they lose interest because it is one-sided, and go their merry ways. Realism has its place, of course, but if you don't balance things, then you wasted time making more than one side.

As for this ST vs SW discussion, the Federation would get its butt kicked by the Klingons anyway, so they are a horrible thing to base against Star Wars (as evidenced by the ST vs SW in five minutes). It can be endlessly debated about who would win, but in the end, the Borg rule, and so does Exar Kun. Now imagine if the Borg managed to assimilate a Jedi and kept his Force powers...


The Sith War: EaW Total Conversion
Arcani Arts: 3D Art

"Willkommen ins verderben"

Without a home. Without a people. Without mercy. The Arcani
Xyvik is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-19-2006, 04:19 PM   #27
Rha
Lurker
 
Rha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Belgium
Posts: 9
Quote:
Originally Posted by WxDude
I think it would be a good idea...however the Star Wars physical weapons will pass right through the defenseive weapons of the Star Trek Universe and the energy weapons of Star Trek will bounce off the shields of the Star Destroyers. I play ST games and their shields are designed to protect from energy only weapons. There are no physical (i.e. Proton Torpedo) in Star Trek.
Photon and other types of Torpedoes are physical weapons in Star Trek. They are not balls of energy. There are many references to this in movies books and bla bla bla.

They are physical warheads and the shields in Star Trek do offer protection to these weapons. They detonate on the shields and not the hull of the ship. Shields in Star Wars don’t seem to help all that much. Why would the energy weapons in Star Wars be so much deferent from that of Star Trek? Aren’t they both ionized gas.

Here are some examples of Star Trek torpedoes.
http://www.ccdump.org/photontorps.html
http://www.ccdump.org/quantumtorps.html
http://www.ccdump.org/microqtorps.html

There were Star Wars vs. Star Trek mods for the Star Trek Armada games. The space combat in EAW is alot like that game also.
Rha is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-24-2006, 10:43 PM   #28
Darth Windu
TSLRP Beta Tester
 
Darth Windu's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Coruscant
Posts: 1,973
Why do people automatically assume SW ships are so much better than ST? Fact is, Star Trek is sci-fi so there are specifics for shield power, weapons power etc. However, Star Wars is fantasy, so there are no specs. This means that balance can easily be achieved.

As for physical weapons, if ST ships shields couldn't handle physical weapons, then they would get instantly blown apart by space dust, meteorites etc not to mention the various topedoes, which are physical weapons.


Dark Lord of the Purists

Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges
Darth Windu is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-25-2006, 03:00 AM   #29
clone_troopa
Rookie
 
clone_troopa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: ?
Posts: 50
pfft... once the jedis start attacking all S-treek and the uber Death Star! course Star Wars wins...

besides.... SW got WAY bigger ships than ST size matters.... (dirty minds...)
clone_troopa is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-25-2006, 06:37 AM   #30
i_am_joey_jo
Lurker
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 2
You Geeks are Idiots

The Star Trek ships would just flank the Star Wars ships from behind their englines where they can't fire and blow them all up.

There's no need to talk about power here.

And BTW: neither is REAL!
i_am_joey_jo is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-25-2006, 08:05 AM   #31
clone_troopa
Rookie
 
clone_troopa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: ?
Posts: 50
oh fine them, my uber nuke pwns em all (btw SW got fighters for when those semi medium ST ships get behind a destroyer)
clone_troopa is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-25-2006, 09:00 AM   #32
Admiral Sith
Junior Member
 
Admiral Sith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 375
The Fighter and Bombers squadrons could just attack the ones behind the big ships and blow them up with a few laser blasts.



"It may be that the old astrologers had the truth exactly reversed, when they believed that the stars controlled the destinies of men. The time may come when men control the destinies of stars." -Arthur C. Clarke

"Ideals are like stars: you will not succeed in touching them with your hands, but like the seafaring man on the ocean desert of waters, you choose them as your guides, and following them, you reach your destiny." -Carl Schurz
Admiral Sith is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-25-2006, 03:03 PM   #33
jedi3112
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 500
I think there is much we have to know about modding EAW. One thing I would really like to know is wheter or not we can add races instead of just replacing them. I seriously think it would be strange to have both the Rebels and the Empire sharing ships. The same goes for the ST races. So I think we need to be able to add them.

I'd also like to know what programs I should use for what. I have found several files I could open with notepad, but I still have to figure out what they say. And I need to know how the appearance of the units is done, I seriously hope it can be done using programs such as milkshape or 3ds max (maybe with some tools).
jedi3112 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-25-2006, 03:47 PM   #34
Admiral Sith
Junior Member
 
Admiral Sith's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 375
You'se the extractor on the Config.meg and modify the XML folders. Someone has already created a new faction, and its very moddable



"It may be that the old astrologers had the truth exactly reversed, when they believed that the stars controlled the destinies of men. The time may come when men control the destinies of stars." -Arthur C. Clarke

"Ideals are like stars: you will not succeed in touching them with your hands, but like the seafaring man on the ocean desert of waters, you choose them as your guides, and following them, you reach your destiny." -Carl Schurz
Admiral Sith is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-26-2006, 07:23 PM   #35
splintercell56
Rookie
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 27
I thought travel from the core to the outer rim took more then a few hours? But in the sight Admiral Sith provided says it takes less then a day. All this comparing numbers and tech is a little confusing. Why not just make a good Star Trek mod no crossovers unless really needed.
splintercell56 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-26-2006, 07:49 PM   #36
Kurgan
Headhunter
 
Kurgan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 1997
Location: The Dawn of Time
Posts: 18,316
LFN Staff Member 10 year veteran! 
Post Combined my reponses into one mega post, woo!

Quote:
Originally Posted by vader815
Star wars is not overpowered, see the borg will eventually adapt the imperial technology and use it against them, the brog are literally undefeatable

That's an interesting question. Since this is a game, you couldn't just make the Borg able to adapt to anything (and the ability to adapt to "anything" is really a misunderstanding, since they are vulnerable to physical projectiles and blades, chemical weapons, and they can't adapt to bio-tech like species8472, even their vaunted shields can be overcome by high level brute force which overwhelms it). Perhaps it would be done like this:

Give a special ability to a Borg unit called "assimilate." I could see it for a ground unit sort of being like Chewbacca's "capture vehicle" ability. For a ship, I think if they did it that way you'd have to do a boarding action, but since the game doesn't have boarding actions (unless you wanted to make a level that was the "inside of a ship" that you have to win as the borg), you could just have it so that you tractor beam the ship and get the shields down, then you would have a special ability that would take the enemy ship, when it's almost destroyed and turn it to your side. Basically it would become a controllable ship, but it would have some crappy borge technology slapped onto it (black and gray tubes and metal, green lights). Perhaps you could regenerate it over time (repaired hull so it would be useful).

If you wanted to balance the ability (and this is more realistic) don't say they can suddenly build this ship after "assimilating" it, they can just use that one unit, and any others they assimilate. Perhaps make it so that you need a special "assimilation" ability research or a certain unit that can do it. Say shields block it, and of course destroying them before they can put up the tractor beam would stop it from happening. You could even say that the Borg can't figure out Empire technology, so after they steal an Acclamator or something, it suddenly can only use Borg weapons (beams, those pulse disruptors, tractor beams, etc) and has borg shields. It basically turns into a borg ship but with the speed and manuverability of the original ship (and hull strength, but not original shield strength, since they've basically gutted the ship and replaced it with their own technology inside).

It's an idea anyway!

A pure Star Trek mod would be cool, but eventually we'd need both forces to fight, just for the sheer fanboy amusement it would bring.

....

Quote:
Originally Posted by i_am_joey_jo
The Star Trek ships would just flank the Star Wars ships from behind their englines where they can't fire and blow them all up.

There's no need to talk about power here.

And BTW: neither is REAL!

How dare you! *Fires Geek Cannon*

Anyway, by being a member here you're basically admitting to a certain level of Geek-dom, so you don't have any shields, muhahahha.

Anyway, That's a common misconception. I mean, in EaW, why doesn't that strategy work (getting behind a ship and firing away at it until it's destroyed without it ever being able to fire back)? Plus, you forget about shields. A shielded Star Destroyer will laugh off the shots from Federation ships. They'd have to first take out the generator (in-game). Fighters would harass the Trek ships. After all, in Trek they focus almost exclusively on Capital ships rather than fighters. Yes the Empire would steam roll over the Federation, but that's why in making the game you could do little things to make it not seem so far-fetched (as in single player missions or equalizing certain things, but I'm not saying make Trek into an exact replica of say, the Rebels).

So anyway, these are all issues you'd have to work out in game. I'm more talking about a mod loosely based on the franchises, not an exact down to the detail "canon" representation. Because already you have the EaW version of the Rebellion and the Empire which are not exactly like the ones we see in the movies. The Trek version doesn't have to be exact either. Just enough to make you think "wow this is cool."

....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Windu
Why do people automatically assume SW ships are so much better than ST? Fact is, Star Trek is sci-fi so there are specifics for shield power, weapons power etc. However, Star Wars is fantasy, so there are no specs. This means that balance can easily be achieved.
Actually, this isn't quite correct. Both series's are Sci Fi AND sci fantasy. After all, Trek has ghosts, gods, monsters, magic, all that stuff. Sure they explain it away with technobabble, but it's still "fantastical" type stuff. And in actuality, the Trek technical manuals are NON-canon (as officially stated by Paramount which controls the franchise). Whereas the Star Wars technical books (like the Incredible Cross Sections and Essential Guides) are in the canon hierarchy (though subservient to the movies of course). So you can get technical specs. But again, that would be way too complicated.

The EaW version of the Empire/Rebellion is an aproximation accounting for gameplay mechanics (challenge, fun, balance). The Trek version could be done with a similar approach. If you wanted it 100% realistic to canon, you'd have to totally change the way the SW forces are in game, because they're not movie-perfect right now!

Quote:
As for physical weapons, if ST ships shields couldn't handle physical weapons, then they would get instantly blown apart by space dust, meteorites etc not to mention the various topedoes, which are physical weapons.
They have navigational deflectors that are apparently always on that stop space dust. Their shields are strong against energy weapons they know about (like disruptors, phasers and tractor beams), but weak against physical impactors (like asteroids, kamikaze ships, even torpedoes). Basically how space combat typically goes in Trek is they close distance, fire away with torps until the shields are down, and then use phasers or beam over boarding parties and try to capture the ship. Sometimes they encounter some powerful race that is able to fire or beam through their shields, but they eventually are able to adapt and it goes back to standard tactics. In game it would probably just work out that shields and weapons always work. Perhaps the shields are more vulnerable to projectiles, but otherwise it would always "work" the same as we see in game already.

Personal shields are like this too. Borg soldiers for example, are able to shrug off phaser shots fairly easily, but they go down like unshielded beings from physical strikes and even physical bullets.

....

Quote:
Originally Posted by CondorFalco
There are conventional weapons in ST, but they have become quickly superseeded by Quantum, Energy, Phase and Temporal weapons. Melee combat would be great - Klingons with Bat'Leths and various other things, like from Klingon Honour Guard (old, pretty crap pre Elite Force game). Ground units could be built-upon those ideas from Star Trek New Worlds, a seriously failed ground-based late-TOS era RTS. Space combat would be a bit unmatched in some areas - Victory Star Destroyer would only be able to be taken down by the Kremin Timeship, the Wells Class Timeship, or a combined Borg Tactical Fusion Cube, Prometheus, Soulwolf, D'derex, Akira, Defiant, Qo'Nos class armada (think Borg Incursion from ST:Armada 2 ). Then you get the problem of the Force vs Telepaths/Telekinetics (Betazoids, and the Telekinetics I think were those strange people from TOS) and the Prophets/Pah'Wraiths (DS9) - and lightsabers vs Bat'Leths. Just throwing a few ideas into the pan.

I personally think that ST vs SW has been done to death a bit, especially in the ST gaming circuit. There have been many great ST vs SW TCs, but to have another one would require an immensly dedicated team from before EAW was released. (And as already pointed out, we don't know the modding capabilities yet, but my hope is that they will be great because of the C&C background most of the developing studio has).

I hope I didn't sound to idea flattening...

Condor out.
Perhaps it's been done to death in the ST circuit, but I can't think of any games that have done it well in the SW section. And I'm not counting the various (often poorly done) Star Trek skins for like JA or something. I mean an actual "us vs. them" type mod for multiplayer or singleplayer, in REAL TIME.

Basically what is needed to really make this work is the ability to make custom maps, custom textures, and custom models work in-game. The rest can be done right now, and especially since somebody mentioned you can add new factions.

....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rha
Photon and other types of Torpedoes are physical weapons in Star Trek. They are not balls of energy. There are many references to this in movies books and bla bla bla.

They are physical warheads and the shields in Star Trek do offer protection to these weapons. They detonate on the shields and not the hull of the ship. Shields in Star Wars don’t seem to help all that much. Why would the energy weapons in Star Wars be so much deferent from that of Star Trek? Aren’t they both ionized gas.

Here are some examples of Star Trek torpedoes.
http://www.ccdump.org/photontorps.html
http://www.ccdump.org/quantumtorps.html
http://www.ccdump.org/microqtorps.html

There were Star Wars vs. Star Trek mods for the Star Trek Armada games. The space combat in EAW is alot like that game also.
Well like a lot of things, they have "similar" technology but it doesn't always work the same. Compare the bubble shields in Trek to the various shield types in Episode I. Clearly Star Wars has various types. Compare the travel times of Hyperdrive across the galaxy in Episode III and Episode V vs. that in Star Trek Voyager (of course Star Trek V has travel apparently to the core of the galaxy in a barely functioning Enterprise-A but still). "Stun" setting is different, etc. Anyway, the point is you'd modify it to balance for gameplay sake. You could make Trek weaker in some areas, but compensate in others.

If you were to make it a multiplayer mod you'd have to fudge realism in order to balance it. For single player you wouldn't need to, just make it equal in terms of numbers, (like fewer ships vs. larger armies or something).

Smaller mods could of course be done, but I'm thinking combining the Trek forces into one "side" would be coolest and the best eventual goal of some such mod (if any of the people who did any of the other SWvsST mods would get involved that would be awesome), sort of like how so many factions joined forces to fight the Dominion in Deep Space Nine (for those who don't know, it was the Federation, Bajorans, Klingons and eventually Romulans vs. the Dominion and the Breen). You could toss in lesser seen aliens in later shows like the Ferengi (who in TNG had warships and were considered as powerful as the Federation). The Borg were considerably more powerful in TNG than in later shows. You could give them that power level compared to the Federation, but with the cool units they'd have later (like the Tactical Cubes, spheres and such). Basically any excuse to have the "cool" units from each side brought to the fray.


Download JK2 maps for JA Server|BOOT CAMP!|Strategic Academy|
(JA Server: 108.178.55.189:29070)


"The Concussion Rifle is the weapon of a Jedi Knight Player, an elegant weapon, from a more civilized community." - Kyle Katarn
Kurgan is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-26-2006, 11:15 PM   #37
c0n5t4n7in3
Lurker
 
c0n5t4n7in3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 1
Thumbs up

I think it's a great idea, but I would wait 'till the full version to mod the game.


When a soldier fights and dies
To St.Peter he will tell:
One more soldier reporting for duty sir,
I've served my time in hell.
c0n5t4n7in3 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-27-2006, 11:29 AM   #38
Kurgan
Headhunter
 
Kurgan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 1997
Location: The Dawn of Time
Posts: 18,316
LFN Staff Member 10 year veteran! 
I'm sure you'd need to anyway due to the amount of new content you'd have to create that couldn't all be done in simple XML.

But there's nothing wrong with planning ahead! A lot of interesting mods begin before a game even comes out.


Download JK2 maps for JA Server|BOOT CAMP!|Strategic Academy|
(JA Server: 108.178.55.189:29070)


"The Concussion Rifle is the weapon of a Jedi Knight Player, an elegant weapon, from a more civilized community." - Kyle Katarn
Kurgan is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-28-2006, 01:09 AM   #39
aggie_john
Rookie
 
aggie_john's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 106
Well not to get into the which side is better conversation but there is one glaring problem with the star trek side....no real ground forces to speak of. I think you would have to make up a bunch of stuff to even it out, which could be cool if the designers were creative enough but then again I could see a bunch of people compaining that it was not genuine and crap.

Also you would need to deside which era you would make the game in... TOS/TMP era or the TNG era. You also need to deside which faction you want in. A total conversion or a versus. IE the dominion war or perhaps something never done before like the pre Star Trek wars with the alliance/new Federation against the Romulans or Kiligons or some versus war say Empire versus Federation/ Alpha Quadrant Allinace.
aggie_john is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 01-28-2006, 08:02 AM   #40
jedi3112
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by aggie_john
Well not to get into the which side is better conversation but there is one glaring problem with the star trek side....no real ground forces to speak of. I think you would have to make up a bunch of stuff to even it out, which could be cool if the designers were creative enough but then again I could see a bunch of people compaining that it was not genuine and crap.

Also you would need to deside which era you would make the game in... TOS/TMP era or the TNG era. You also need to deside which faction you want in. A total conversion or a versus. IE the dominion war or perhaps something never done before like the pre Star Trek wars with the alliance/new Federation against the Romulans or Kiligons or some versus war say Empire versus Federation/ Alpha Quadrant Allinace.
The only St ground forces I've ever seen is that thing at the beginning of nemesis. And perhaps those in New Worlds (quite unkown because the game is crap, like only saving between missions, etc.). That would be one thing to take care of.

The era mostly used is the TNG era, come to think of it I've never really seen a ST game set in another era (perhaps NW, but I only played the demo). The factions aren't that hard to decide, but do largely depend on the era. I don't think it would be a good idea to put factions together.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jedi3112
I think there is much we have to know about modding EAW. One thing I would really like to know is wheter or not we can add races instead of just replacing them. I seriously think it would be strange to have both the Rebels and the Empire sharing ships. The same goes for the ST races. So I think we need to be able to add them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Admiral Sith
Someone has already created a new faction, and its very moddable
I suggest enlarging the universe and add the following factions.

Rebels/New Republic/Seperatists/Trade Federation
Empire/Imperial Remnant/Old Republic (N1 constucted on Naboo)
Federation/Earth
Klingons
Romulans (inlude Remus for constuction of Reman ships, like the scimitar)
Borg (if TNG)
Cardassians (if TNG)
Dominion with subs (if TNG)
Vulcans (if Enterprise era)
Andorians (if Enterprise era)

At least include the major planets of ST,
Utopia Planetia (fed main shipyards, sort of functions like Kuat)
Romulus
Remus
Klingon home world
Gamma Quadrant (for dominion)
Cardassia
Delta Quadrant
Earth
Mars
Andorria
Vulcan

Add others to fill up that galaxy. Now you may need to think of some groundunits for each one, and they need to be in style, so I think the Feds would use hovering vehicles, but I don't know about the others.
jedi3112 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Post a new thread. Add a reply to this thread. Indicate all threads in this forum as read. Subscribe to this forum. RSS feed: this forum RSS feed: all forums
Go Back   LucasForums > Network > Empire At War > EaW General Discussion > Modding forum > Star Wars vs. Star Trek: THE MOD!

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:35 AM.

LFNetwork, LLC ©2002-2011 - All rights reserved.
Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.