DDRLZ - WIP - huge TSL FPs/classes gameplay rebalance mod (LONG READ WARNING!!!)

darthrevanrlz · 07-21-2006, 02:38 PM

Heya!

Well, what do you know, me *not* bugging the residents experts about something actually is a good thing...

Anyway, for those who've seen of my posts/threads, you probably deduced I was working on quite a few things.

Chalk it up to a few relaxing volleyball/soccer/tennis games (summer PWNZ

) and listening to too much Magnum in the car (Wings of Heaven PWNZ

), but progress have been going well. Not in the speedy-gonzales fast sense, but in the sense that there's nothing going wrong for a change ...

I'll probably put up a list of all changes on a basic html Geocities pages (or I'll just make a .txt file available on main page) but I'll cover the basics here...

Oh, and warning, it's a rather big project. Screw that, it's freaking HUGE. Not in the sense that one needs to be a scripting genius, but it's just complicated in the *big picture* sense since I can't really complete any part without finishing, like... 2 others...

As was said before, progress with scripting/editing is going well. Modeling is another matter, unfortunately. If anyone's interested/intrigued or has ideas, just use this thread, or PM-me.

I'm not gung-ho on the lone wolf thingie, it's just that, well, opinions on rebalance can differ quite a bit. *shrugs*

Well, here goes...

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INTRODUCTION:

A bit of context might be needed to understand where I'm going with this.

I *love* TSL. I know, the ending's rushed, but I still love the game. Now, I do have a few gripes with the *gameplay*. Chalk it up on me playing Diablo 2 back in the day for those few months before getting sick of cookie-cutting...

a) choice of starting class is *INSANELY* inconsequential.
b) Most weapons beside Lightsabers are just plain bad. We aren't given much (any, really...) reason to use, let's say, melee weapons or rifles.
c) FP system is horrible for a 27-30 lvl game. Also, I don't see why fighting classes would have *access* to the same FPs than Consulars or at the same time, for that matter. And WHAT IS IT with freakin cookie-cutting, lol?
e) Non-Jedi (other than the monstruously overpowered Hanharr) are at an insanely great disadvantage.

So, basically, I'm not ADDING much content except a few Force Powers. All I'm trying to do is to make for a more diverse gaming experience.

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COMPATIBILITY ISSUES:

- Player WILL have to start a new game to get full effect. Also, because I changed feat.2da so much, you WON'T have access to feat which I granted to classes...

- Should use the TSLPatcher. BUT since there's so much .2da editing, you'll probably be better just making a hard choice if you have another feat/power/ac/classes mod. Also, see the FP section above for insight on weither it's a good idea to install other FP mods. The short answer is: it depends weither the new FPs are overkill and overpowered. Mine aren't - they actually are GUNNING FOR THE EXACT OPPOSITE.

- I can't help but mention the USM. Great mod, but if you plan on eventually giving my material a try, I BEG OF YOU, don't get the padawan upgrades. Also, see the items sections for an insight on how I would see a "padawans' lightsabers system" working...

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DIFFICULTY SETTING COMMENT:

ALL THESE MODIFICATIONS ARE MADE WITH A BALANCE/HARDCORE MOD IN MIND!!!!!!!!! SERIOUSLY!!!!!!!!!!!

That being said, let's move on to the proposed (well, done...) changes...

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1 - .2DA / UTI EDITING!!!!!!!!!!!

*** (all that's left is to finish feat.2da and add custom items to NPCs' inventories... - at least 85-90% complete) ***

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a) NEW NON-JEDI CLASSES

Warlord (WRLD), Wookie Warrior (WKWR), Bounty Hunter (HNTR) & Infiltrator Droid (InfDRD). Don't have to tell which goes to who, now, do I?

And yes, that's right, this means Hanharr no longer gets DODGING feats (rotflmao about that one... how can a 8-foot tall titan dodge *anything*??)...

Also turned a certain historian into a *scout* and a treatorous old scow into a Jedi Master class at lvl 10. (she gets force focus via either scripting or .2dafeat, don't worry, geez). Visas also gets either assassin/watchman prestige class at lvl 20.

In other words, *everyone* has a unique starting class.

Speaking of specific NPCs, I might add here that the uti files have been pretty much redone from scratch with new starting feats/attributes. Not HUGE differences, but still, they show a bit...

For reference, here's how many attribute points NPCs get at character creation... They're all lvl 5, and I put the lvl 4 attribute point into something sensical (not like, let's say Hanharr's inexplicable pt in Dex or Mira's pt in Charisma...)

Atton, Bao, Disciple, Handmaiden, Mira = 32
Goto, Mandalore, T3, Visas = 36
Kreia = 40
Hanharr, HK = 44 (sounds bad for Hanharr, but all I did was nerf his str/con to 18)

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b) BAB - There now is 3 BAB classes

Guardians/Mrder/WpnMst/Soldier/Wookie/Warlord, HK = 30 by lvl 30
Sentinels/Assassin/Wtchmn, socut, bntyhntr, infiltr. droid = 27 by lvl 30
Counsulars/Master/Lord, Scndrl, Tech, T3 = 25 by lvl 30

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c) AC BONUS

Guardians/Mrdr/Wpnmstr & HK = +2 bonus every 5 levels.
Sentinels/Wtchmn/SithAssn, Consulars/Master/Lord, Soldier, Warlord Scoundrel, Droids = every 6 levels
Scout/TechSpec/BntyHntr = every 8 levels
Hanharr = every 10 levels

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d) SAVES

By level 20...

36 points = Hanharr, Sentinel/Wtchman (12/12/12)
33 points = Guardian/mrdr/WpnMstr, Assassin (12/12/9)
30 points = Counsular/Master/Lord, warlord, HK (12/9/9 & variables format)
27 = everyone else (12/9/6 & variables format)

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e) FEAT GAIN

By level 20:

20 feats: warlord (once every 2 lvl after lvl 20)
15 feats: soldier, Hanharr (once every 2 lvl after lvl 10)
12 feats: guardian/Mrder/WpnMstr, HK (bonus feat every 10 lvls, starting at 5)
10 feats: sentinel/Wtchman, scout, BntyHntr, T3, Goto
8 feats: counsular/Master/Lord, scoundrel, tech, Assassin

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f) FP GAIN

Counsulars stay the same - SithLord/Jedi Master now have same progression.
Sentinel/Assassin/Wtchmn - one extra every 5 levels (maybe 6, *shrugs*)
Guardians/Mrdr/WpnMst = one extra every 10 levels

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g) FEAT.2DA

REALLY too much to say, BUT the most important additions are:

1) SENTINELS NOW GET THE FIRST LEVEL OF FORCE JUMP/FOCUS!!!!!!! They're supposed to be the middle-ground class, so THERE IT IS.

- other classes get bonus *real/hardcoded* feats, but too long of a list, really...

2) Fixed the *problem*(???) about prestige classes losing conditioning, gearhead, empathy, close combat and other similar feats (the hell was that anyway?)
3) automatically granted feats which allow the droids and Mandalore to get 2 extra attacks when using a NPC-specific armband/droid belt.
4) I mention it here, but I fixed unarmed combat progression via SCRIPTING the k_oei_hench_inc file. Cross-classing is no longer an issue for Bao/Brianna and *everyone* gets it only at a different pace. Guardians are done by lvl 24, sentinels by 27 and consulars by lvl 30.
5) Smaller droids now have access to the first two ranged attacks feats VIA leveling (that's right, no more cheap item giving'em all to Goto) and the first 3 levels of Precise Shot.

6) Added a bunch of dummy feats which can be activated via armbands (built on the workbench).

6a) Dueling gets a 1,2 & 4 dmg bonus.
6b) added superior focus for ALL weapons. Only prereq is the original FOCUS feat. Fighting class get access to all 3 (highest give a 1-4 dmg), intermediate classes the first 2 and *weakest* fighting class only gets access to the first.
6c) Brought back heavy weapons feats - only includes HEAVY repeating rifles. The superior focus feats allow an extra attack when wielding those.
6d) Same thing was done for focus unarmed combat which grants an extra attack when fighting bare-handed. Dueling is the prereq to those focus feats.

***Just for the record, that last part is a LOT of trouble. Easy scripting, but they have to be repeated over and over because of weapons types (stupid double-handed weapons, gaaahh!!!). Meaning there's a lightsaber duelist armband, another one for melee/blaster dueling, another pair for vibro-doubleblades/dbl-bladed sabers, another trio for twin single-handed weapons... Not to mention each item has MANY (too much, imo) conditionals checks... A nightmare, but it had to be done so the player would only need ONE armband if they want to use the duel feats... Oh yeah, and make sure dual-wielding wouldn't get the duel bonus, eh.***

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g) WEAPONSDISCHARGE.2da

- Power Blast and Sniper shot can now be used with Speed/other increased attack effect (4 attacks cap)
- heavy weapons get one more attack than other rifles as was said earlier

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h) BASEITEMS.2DA

Damage tweaking, eh. Most noticeable are...

- Lightsabers: Small = 2-12 dmg, regular = 3-18, dbl-handed = 4-24
- Rifles: heavy weapons = 4-24, repeating rifles = 3-18, rifles = 2-12
- VibroDoubleBlades = 2-20

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i) EXPTABLE.2DA

Tweaked the exptable from lvl 10 and then on. No reason why you should get good spells on Telos, really.

Also tweaked the xptable.2da to make sure the exp *loss* when leveling doesn't happen too fast. Meaning you don't get more exp from kills. You just don't lose too much when leveling in same area.

Will only be able to test later on, but it should give one about 3-5 additional levels by the end of the game.

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2 - FORCE POWERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Gah, I pretty much REDID them all. One must note that I didn't change ONE IOTA of k_inc_force. For now, all the scripts WORK and a bunch of them have *blank* value. In other words, all I gotta do is fix dmg, ranges, durations, effects & 2DAMEMORY entries (for the TSLPatcher) here and there. Bulk of the scripting is complete. Now it's on to punching in descriptions and making new icons (GAAAHHH!!!)

A few key facts:

- Only Masters/Lords have access to the LAST TIER of OFFENSIVE powers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

- meaning that range, duration and dmg scale up with tiers and that it actually shows. A first-tier spell isn't that good. Second-tier is potent. Third-tier is the proverbial cherry on the sundae.

- Attack spells have been divided into TWO branches: one for solo attacks, and another for mass attacks. The gist here is that solo attacks are much stronger and last longer. Players will HAVE to invest in the solo tree to get access to the area effect spells

- most offensive spells give an automatic (small & short-lived) penalty to the specific save type AFTER it's been cast. I mean, just because you RESIST something doesn't mean you'll be just as strong 3 seconds later...

- Finally, AND THIS IS IMPORTANT, I put a *boss handicap* feature. Meaning they'll only receive 2/3 or 3/4 (2/3 for now, but I am frankly unsure) of the damage, failed or succeded save (meaning 1/6 or 3/8 on a succeeded save)

That being said, let's move on...

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DARK SIDE, BABY!!!!!!!

- Death Field: now is a 3-tiers spells. Changed the dmg cap for higher tiers rather than remove it. Enemies lose Str/dex/con and the caster gains some for a very short time ( betwen 2 & 4 for a very short 10 seconds)

- Drain Force: same thing only the penalty/gain is for Int/Wis/Cha. Buffed up the force gain a bit if I recall correctly.

- Poison: a damaging acid blast (think frag grenade) releases the poison. Only the solo target tree has damage attribute... Poison dmg was buffed up A LOT!!!

- Lightning: solo target now has force push. Mass area pretty much the same.

- Kill: buffed up damage (they call it KILL, damnit, KILL!!!!), there now is a MASS KILL spell... Lesser dmg, but affects, 2,3 or 5 enemies depending on tier...

- Crush: now available via leveling... (Would recommand using RedHawke's mod on this one). Didn't buff it up (ah!), but there is a Mass Crush tree (see Kill)

- scream: same attribute dmg effects, but dmg now works with a dice... Meaning the spell is about, oh, 247% time more useful.

- insanity: divided it in two trees: the solo tree will greatly cripple the target..., mass effect pretty much unchanged.

*** No real plan on adding other DS powers, really. The dual trees for offensive powers (meaning ALL DS powers, lol) are more than enough to outnumber the LS' buffs and new spells...

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GOODY TWO SHOE LIGHT SIDE:

- enlightenment: now includes force resist/immunity (universal) and the modded FPs. (see remark about RedHawke's mod on the Crush entry)

- heal/armor: armor is unchanged (already insanely strong!!) and I do have a *blank* heal script to mod it if I feel like it...

- valor: nerfed it by removing the saves bonus. BUT, the dmg gain is now 2/4/6 AND I fixed the AC problem.

- Revitalize: now has a % value matching Atton's (10/20/30) rather than the original awful ones. Never used the blasted thing, but I figured it would be unfair to not waste 10-15 minutes on it...

- Barrier: now deflects elemental/energy AND melee attacks. The catch is that it only works on a single target.

- stasis: see insanity

- droids: mmm... haven't done anything with it so far... so restrictive, really...
I mean, there are enemy droids on Peragus/Telos, the only places where you can't get destroy droid... The irony alone is reason enough to not bother with this one... Meh, we'll see.

*** NEW POWER: light side lightning - only hurts dark Jedis and there's no force points damage. Scripted it for both solo and area effect, but I'll probably ditch the solo tree due to the FP being so restrictive

*** NEW POWER: telekinesis - crush animation, only the dmg is based on CURRENT HP. Meaning you can't kill with it. Has both solo and area effect trees...

*** UNSURE: probably will add a new buff which boosts HPs/FPs, will/fort save and regen...

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UNIVERSAL:

- breach/supression/immunity: no changes there except adding lines for my modded FPs...

- speed: fixed the AC problem

- Wind FPs: push & wave have been separated. There also are solo and area effect whirlwind trees. (4 total)

Resist energy: tweaked dmg resist a bit (they're a bit lower than the LS power), ALL tiers affect all party

*** NEW POWER: Shell - same thing than resist energy only for melee attacks.

- Battle Med: removed the Regen effect. Enemy penalty starts at first tier and bonuses are of 2/3/4 depending on tier.

- Throw lightsaber: nothing ANYONE can do. Sorry, lol.

***NEW POWER - fire blast/bomb - high dmg, chance of horror, both solo target and area effect trees. Range is slightly smaller than insanity/stun to not render them useless...

***NEW POWER - cold blast/bom - average dmg, automatic slow, chance of freezing, both solo & Area effect trees... See Range comment from the fire power

*** UNSURE - maybe an ion bomb (the grenades look awesome!!) kind of thing - high dmg to droid (no stun) and half damage to other enemies.

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PRESTIGE FPs:

- removed them all except Force Camouflage (who cares, lol?). The level-up screen will say you get'em (it's hardcoded), but you WON'T. Bwahahahaha.

Why? Inspire/CrushOpp are overpowered AND overkill once you got BattleMed going on. Besides, I already buffed up Master/Lord with, well, being the only ones with access to all offensive FPs...

As for Rage, I decided to add class specific buffs to WpnMStr/Mrder, Assn/Wtchmn and Master/Lord instead. The *catch* is that these buffs are a two-parters. Guardians get their buff, so do sentinels and consulars... Only a weaponmaster/marauder can upgrade the Guardian's and... well, you get the pattern...

The SECOND catch is that these buffs can't be shared (I did that on purpose - think of it as a Force/Ltsbr form if you must) even with Force Chain.

The point here is to try to dissuade from cross-classing. Really, the first buff tiers are just plain , well, not *bad*, but rather inconsequential. Completely different story for the upgrade, though... And yes, Master/Lord DO get the weakest. That balance thingie again.

Don't get me wrong, I DID play the overpowered cnslr/assassin, cnsrl/wpnmstr builds.

Fun to play? Sure. Fair? Nope. Sensical? In one's wildest dreams.

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3 - Mini-bosses (almost complete)

Considering how modding the three Sith Lords & Atris has already be done, I just won't bother.

What I DID DO was to track down the uti files of mini-bosses (Saquesh, Serroco leader, those BntyHntr "leaders" on Iziz, jungle huge beast, Mercs bosses on Dantooine, etc.) and give them higher levels and stats. Mmm... come to think of it, will do it for Jedi Masters too...

Cannon fodder is cannon fodder. But these guys/gals aren't. For sake's I remember having one hell of a hard time butchering sand people in KOTOR... (rolls eyes)...

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4 - ITEMS (haven't done too much here besides creating some of them and testing them, I'm afraid - was too busy with the scripting, gaahhh)

- Anyway, basically I'm adding new upgrades for the workbench, custom items for NPCs, new weapons, JEDI starting-class restricted items (guardians' and sentinels' are better than counsulars' - balance once again), more LS/DS crystals/items...

- nerfed stims - rather than a 4/6 bonus, it now is 2/4. Similar nerfs to the strongest shields

- Also plan on adding some of these to the game's loot rather than just make them placeables or workbench-friendly. You know what, I'll just use some of the created ones, add them to Stoffe's loot mod, put a 80-90% chance of finding them and just load a freakin' zone during the weekend... If it works, we're in business...

- The tragic part here is that I just don't have time to *LEARN* how to model items. Installed Photoshop a few backs and let's just say I'm sucking real bad at making new icons for the FPs... That *desperately need modelist* thingie I mentioned earlier, eh.

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Oh well, it's pretty much it, I guess.

And to think I didn't even mention everything...

Can't really give a release date, but considering how most of the FP scripting and .2da editing is done, it should be done within the next few weeks. Well, at least the FPs/feats/classes part...

Cheers

DarthRevanRLZ

P.S. And I am serious about the modelist thingie

Dirtnose · 07-21-2006, 03:32 PM

Sweet Man! This is Gonna Rule When it comes out, will be a definate download for me

Jackel · 07-21-2006, 03:56 PM

*looks at long post* ... *reads long post* Somevery interesting things you have going on there *scrools 5 miles up the page to look at poster name* .. darthrevanrlz!

What sort of unique weapons etc have oyu got for each character or would that be somethign you are keeping a sa surprise for when the mod is released?

Im no modeller but I can do skins that are okaaay so I could help you out in that area once I finish my current mods that I am working on. (Once I get TSL reinstalled .. the fun of a new computer and installing everything again!...)

Torthane · 07-21-2006, 05:30 PM

Looks cool, I'll downlaod it and give it a try when you release it. Victory go with you.

Arátoeldar · 07-21-2006, 07:02 PM

:drool:tastic A must have when it comes out.

woogiee · 07-21-2006, 07:28 PM

Definately interested in this project. Will be looking forward to its release.

darthrevanrlz · 07-22-2006, 11:25 AM

UPDATE: mmm.. about to leave for a good part of the day, so might as well mention a few Force Powers-related updates...

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FURY (DS): as was mentioned in original post, Marauders don't get it anymore. Instead, it's a 3 tiers spells available to all... I'm using the icons, but not the spells lines and YES, I made stand-alone scripts. So don't worry about conflict with the old one.

Changed the defense penalty system... They're supposed to go DOWN as you get BETTER, not the OPPOSITE... Anyway, as you can see, the first level is atrocious, but it gets pretty sweet.

Solo buff, doesn't affect bond mate.

Stats:
Lvl 1: -10 def, +2 atk, +2 dmg, immunity to fear
Lvl 2: -8 def, +3 atk, +5 dmg, +2 con, immunity to fear & speed
lvl 3: -5 def, +4 atk, + 8dmg, +4 con, immunity to fear, speed & paralysis...

Might tweak the def penalty a bit, but if I do, it'll be to the player's advantage.

*** replaced the tempoHP for constitution bonus since the effects can't be properly linked... Also ditched the will saves due to the immunity to fear***
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FLASH/ION BOMB (universal) - no single target tree since the iron ray just looks too fake as a FP (kinda like the poison/biospray). Trust me on this one

Will save, Ion dmg to all, higher dmg is dealt to droids. Everyone is stunned for a round and they suffer an atk penalty for two (or three *shrugs*) rounds. The concept here is that the VERY luminous explosion just *blinds* them for a few seconds.

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REGEN (LS) - two-tier FP

Affects whole party. Mmm. Might tweak it so that caster gets bigger bonus.
First one doubles HP regen, second one adds FP regen to the mix.

EDIT: added fort & will saves

Supported by enlightenment, of course.

Figured no one would invest if I'd make it a 3 tiers with the first two tiers giving only 50% bonus. Oh well.

Oh, and I KNOW how it turns that crappy regen consular form completely obsolete. Baaahhh... The original just plain sucks. The only place I used it was inside XCom's and Stoffe's battle SIMULATORS. Those don't qualify as in-game. Thus the "me not caring in the slightest about said form" part...

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CLASS-SPECIFIC BUFFS

Doesn't affect force bond mate nor party.
First numerical value is for weaker class, second one for prestige.

Yes, only the PC, Kreia and Visas will get the upgrades. Bumbling padawans going through a botched/rushed training ARE SUPPOSED TO BE THE WEAKEST LINK. (And yes, that means I believe Luke should've gotten his a$$ handed over to him in the old movies. That being said, I still love them to death.

)

GUARDIAN/WPNMSTR/MRDR: +2/4 str, +2/4 dex, +2/4 con, +2/4 fort saves, +2/5 dmg, HP Regen for wpnmstr/mrder

SENTINEL/WTCHMN/ASSN: +1/2 all attributes, +1/2 all saves, +1/2 BBD, +1/2 dmg, +2/4 force resist, poison immunity for sentinel, *maybe* additional immunity for Wtchmn/Assn

COUNSULAR/MASTER/LORD: +2/4 int, +2/4 wiz, +2/4 cha, + 2/4 will saves, +2/5 BBD, FP Regen for master/lord

EDIT: removed atk & def bonuses

As you can see, these class-specific FPs aren't meant to be the be-all-end-all of a player. They're just a really sweet upgrade. And YES, once again I'm gung-ho on the "sentinel being middle-ground" and "impossible to Force-Kill" philosophy...

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*** Oh, I MUST point out once again that all those changes are made with Beancounter's HARDCORE MOD in mind. Enemies will have much higher hps, atk, dmg & def. Saves will go up at a slightly slower rate to not make the sentinel's balance (focus, bonus to all attributes...) irrelevant when it comes to FPs... Still not sure on that one, but I might tweak the hardcore mod to give them an extra attack. We'll see.

Bah, I'll include with the mod a version which is somewhere between "moderate" and "hard"... *shrugs*

Cheers.

DRRLZ

darthrevanrlz · 07-23-2006, 02:58 PM

Oh dear...

Those familiar with Stoffe's patcher might get a good laugh out of this one...

Started punching in values for the spells with the TSL patcher...

I'm looking at roughly 64 2DAMEMORY entries for the FPs alone... (probably will have to punch in another 15 for armbands...) Multiply by two for the strref values...

The one thing I'll remember from this is: creating FP TREES is suuuuccchhhh a hassle, lol. Especially when you have to deal with stacking bonuses/penalties and don't have access to that"RemoveRelated" function from k_inc_force...

Gets even trickier when offensive powers having different effects since:

1 - you don't want a failed cast of a stronger FP to override a succeeded cast of a weaker FP.

2 - and then there's the DMG part. Meaning most FPs need TWO checks (only override effect when success of a higher FP...) and have arguably ugly scripts. Still, they all work like they're supposed to, so...

And I haven't gotten to dummy feats and items...

Oh well, on the bright side, at least I got the TSL patcher to work...

Cheers,

DRRLZ

***stoffe*** · 07-23-2006, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darthrevanrlz

Oh dear...

Those familiar with Stoffe's patcher might get a good laugh out of this one...

Started punching in values for the spells with the TSL patcher...

I'm looking at roughly 64 2DAMEMORY entries for the FPs alone... (probably will have to punch in another 15 for armbands...) Multiply by two for the strref values...(snip)

If you already have the lines in-place in 2DA files you can use the 2DA Compare button in ChangeEdit to create TSLPatcher configuration instructions for your changes. This way you'll only need to modify the dynamic values (forcehostile/friendly, name/desc, pre-requisites and anything requiring tokens). Saves some data-entry time atl east.

darthrevanrlz · 07-23-2006, 11:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stoffe -mkb-

If you already have the lines in-place in 2DA files you can use the 2DA Compare button in ChangeEdit to create TSLPatcher configuration instructions for your changes. This way you'll only need to modify the dynamic values (forcehostile/friendly, name/desc, pre-requisites and anything requiring tokens). Saves some data-entry time atl east.

No, no, no...

Thanks for the tip, but I did mention the 2DAMEMORY function...

Trust me, comparing .2da files was the VERY FIRST THING I did with your patcher...

What I meant was that:

1 - I got in the high-dozens 2DAMEMORY entries (spell IDs & EffectIcons) to add to the changes.ini and the SCRIPTS. Tested with the 282-284 values rather than install them all with the TSLPAtcher, so I gotta go back and punch in dummy values.

On a side note, is there any way to use the *hacking* ncs files function other than manually? I don't mind at all (easier IMO), but I was just wondering if I actually *missed it* when using ChangeEdit. Oh well... *shrugs*

2 - The StrRefs for the FPs alone should end up in the 225-250 range... Since I'm not changing the original entries and did quite a bit of tweaking with the original spells...

Let's just say it can be summed up to a "copy/paste/edit/type" maddening frenzy...

And NO, I'm not finished with that. Spent most of the late afternoon & early evening at the beach playing volleyball and working on that tan...

Still, things are progressing quite nicely. Should have all spells ready and patcher-friendly by mid-week, I guess...

Cheers,

DarthRevanRLZ

***stoffe*** · 07-24-2006, 07:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darthrevanrlz

On a side note, is there any way to use the *hacking* ncs files function other than manually? I don't mind at all (easier IMO), but I was just wondering if I actually *missed it* when using ChangeEdit. Oh well... *shrugs*

No, it's "unofficial" and left out of ChangeEdit on purpose since the potential for creating problems is very high unless you know exactly what you are doing (and continually remember to do so whenever you modify the scripts in any way).

With the new "CompileList" function for making the patcher process and recompile scripts the HackList function is pretty much obsolete anyway and is only left in for backwards compatibility with older mods that use them.

The HackList function was added as a quick and dirty way of updating 2da references in scripts, which can be done more intuitively and safely with using tokens in the scripts and having the patcher recompile them.

darthrevanrlz · 07-24-2006, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stoffe -mkb-

No, it's "unofficial" and left out of ChangeEdit on purpose since the potential for creating problems is very high unless you know exactly what you are doing (and continually remember to do so whenever you modify the scripts in any way).

With the new "CompileList" function for making the patcher process and recompile scripts the HackList function is pretty much obsolete anyway and is only left in for backwards compatibility with older mods that use them.

The HackList function was added as a quick and dirty way of updating 2da references in scripts, which can be done more intuitively and safely with using tokens in the scripts and having the patcher recompile them.

Actually, the compile function is the part I don't get.

1- It doesn't seem to compile anything.

I got the source scripts, nwscript, nwnsscomp.exe and k_inc_force (include file for FPs) in the tslpatchdata folder... I don't even end up with *any* .ncs files when running the installer.

Thought it would work if I put in dummy .ncs scripts in the tslpatchdata folder, but that one's a no-no since they just weren't updated (tested it and bonuses/penalties stacked horribly).

What the hell am I doing wrong?

Sorry if I seem to just not *get it*, but I haven't seen anyone else but you using the Patcher to modify FP rows values in *scripts*. The few modders who worked on *powers* didn't do trees and .ncs files not needing any tweaking were aalways present.

And the tragically hilarious part is that you did otherwise by using the hack function...

It's probably something stupid that's missing or that I'm not doing, but, oh well...

Cheers,

DRRLZ

***stoffe*** · 07-24-2006, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darthrevanrlz

Actually, the compile function is the part I don't get.
1- It doesn't seem to compile anything.

Which version of TSLPatcher are you using? The compile functionality did not appear until fairly recent versions, and had some bugs in the early versions.
Are you using the nwnnsscomp.exe compiler that comes packed together with the TSLPatcher and its support utilities?
Are you using a corrected version of nwscript.nss? The one that comes with the game has syntax errors in it for some reason.
How have you configured things? Add the names of the files to process, in the correct order, to the CompileList. All NSS files you add to the list will be processed for tokens, but include files will not be compiled. Add include files with custom tokens before the scripts that use them. Add scripts that use such include files to the CompileList even if they don't contain any tokens themselves. Don't forget to wrap tokens in ## in the script source files.
Do any error or warning messages show up when you run the Patcher? If you set the log level to 4, the output from nwnnsscomp will be displayed in the progress log as well. Examine this for any compilation errors that might occur.

Quote:

Originally Posted by darthrevanrlz

Sorry if I seem to just not *get it*, but I haven't seen anyone else but you using the Patcher to modify FP rows values in *scripts*. The few modders who worked on *powers* didn't do trees and .ncs files not needing any tweaking were aalways present.

There is, of course, also the possibility that you aren't doing anything wrong, just doing things in a way I didn't anticipate.

I can only do so much testing on my own, and since I haven't received any bug reports or feedback in the past 6-7 months or so I can only assume that either nobody else is using the patcher, or everything appears to work.

It seems to work for the mods I have used it for, so at least it works under some circumstances.

Quote:

Originally Posted by darthrevanrlz

And the tragically hilarious part is that you did otherwise by using the hack function...

When those mods were made the CompileList function didn't exist, it's a relatively recent addition (version 1.2 if I remember correctly), which was added this January, while the bulk of my mods were made last year.

I initially created the TSLPatcher in order to be able to distribute my HL Force Powers mod, and uploaded it in case others might find it useful as well. The first version(s) pretty much just had what was needed to install that mod (including the HackList), but it has grown considerably in ability gradually since, as people have requested things they needed, or I added stuff I needed or felt like working on. The CompileList was one such requested feature.

darthrevanrlz · 07-24-2006, 07:30 PM

To answer your questions:

1 - version 1.2.7.b5. Just used the link from your sig.

2 - YES. Tried it too with the file included with latest version of KT.

3 - I've got over a 100 tested scripts. So, YEAH.

4- That's the part I don't get. As I mentioned in other posts, the only include necessary for my scripts to run is an un-modded k_inc_force. It's in the tslpatchdata folder. Even went crazy and added all the ones "related" to it in some way...

So, what... do I put it as the first entry in the compile list?

This is how my *very first* attempt looked like. After that I added the "k_inc_force.nss" to CompileList. Nope. Then I added .ncs entries to InstallList (ie. dr_coldbomb1.ncs) and it didn't change a thing either since it would install the unmodded .ncs files...

And yes, I only worked with 3 FPs. If I can get it to work for 3, it'll work for 100.

Code:

[Settings]
FileExists=1
WindowCaption=SPELLS TRY!!!!!
ConfirmMessage=N/A
LogLevel=4
InstallerMode=1
BackupFiles=1
PlaintextLog=0
LookupGameFolder=0
LookupGameNumber=2

[TLKList]
StrRef0=0
StrRef1=1
StrRef2=2
StrRef3=3
StrRef4=4
StrRef5=5

[2DAList]
Table0=spells.2da

[GFFList]

[SSFList]

[InstallList]
install_folder0=override

; ===================================================================
[spells.2da]

/////Will spare you the details, but this VERY LENGHTY part works perfectly////

; ===================================================================
; ADDITIONAL FILES TO INSTALL


[CompileList]
Replace0=dr_coldbomb1.nss
Replace1=dr_coldbomb2.nss
Replace2=dr_coldbomb3.nss
[install_folder0]
Replace0=dr_coldbomb1.tga
Replace1=dr_coldbomb2.tga
Replace2=dr_coldbomb3.tga

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

***since I can't get anything to be compiled, patcher says the .ncs files don't exist... And if I don't punch in anything about them in the InstallList (which I tried), well, of course, nothing happens .

..

5 - I don't get any mistakes when running the patcher since it isn't even *trying* to compile them. It finds the tokens and changes the values, but that's it. Well, technically that's not even true... It *says* it does, but since there's no resulting .ncs file, the .nss files in TSLpatchdata folder remain unchanged...

So far, the hacking function is the only thing I can get to work when it comes to compiling with the patcher.

*sigh*

A half-hearted Cheers,

DRRLZ

P.S. On a much more cheerful (and to-the-actual-point-of-the-thread note), I'm done with all FP icons (mostly recoloring/copying/pasting - I suck with Photoshop) and most FP descriptions...

***stoffe*** · 07-24-2006, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darthrevanrlz

2 - [nwnnsscomp version] Tried it too with the file included with latest version of KT.

Only use the tk102 version that comes with the TSLPatcher, the nwnnsscomp.exe from KotorTool won't work properly in this situation. The patcher assumes you use the supplied version and formats the commandline parameters accordingly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by darthrevanrlz

4- That's the part I don't get. As I mentioned in other posts, the only include necessary for my scripts to run is an un-modded k_inc_force. It's in the tslpatchdata folder. Even went crazy and added all the ones "related" to it in some way...

So, what... do I put it as the first entry in the compile list?

Only put scripts that either contains tokens, or scripts that use include files that contains tokens, on the compile list. There's no point in making it recompile anything else, just add NCS files to the install list for the other scripts that there isn't any need to modify.

Entries in the compile list are processed in the order they are listed. Thus, put include files before you put the script(s) that includes them, otherwise the tokens won't have been substituted before it tries to compile the script. Again, only put include files that contain tokens in the compile list. (You still have to put all include files used by the scripts in the tslpatchdata folder though, even if they are unchanged. They will be needed in order to compile the script.

Quote:

Originally Posted by darthrevanrlz

***since I can't get anything to be compiled, patcher says the .ncs files don't exist...

What does the NWNNSSCOMP output say before that, it should be posted in the progress log if you have the log level set to 4. Post the relevant log (or PM it to me if you don't want to derail this thread further).

Quote:

Originally Posted by darthrevanrlz

5 - I don't get any mistakes when running the patcher since it isn't even *trying* to compile them. It finds the tokens and changes the values, but that's it. Well, technically that's not even true... It *says* it does, but since there's no resulting .ncs file, the .nss files in TSLpatchdata folder remain unchanged...

It just skips compilation without saying why, or that it does? That should only happen if it believes the file is an include file and not a compilable script, if I remember correctly (I'm too tired to check the code now, I'll have a look at it tomorrow).

The patcher modifies temporary work copies of the NSS files where the tokens are replaced, otherwise you'd only be able to install the mod once since the tokens would then be gone.

You can tell the patcher to save the processed NSS files that it tries to compile by adding the following key under the [Settings] section in the INI file:

SaveProcessedScripts=1

This will create a new folder called "debug" inside the tslpatchdata folder where copies of all processed NSS files will be saved. You could try compiling those manually and see if nwnnsscomp.exe accepts them without complaining.

jedi7000nathan · 07-24-2006, 11:33 PM

it's one Leviathan of a mod

darthrevanrlz · 07-25-2006, 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jedi7000nathan

it's one Leviathan of a mod

Eh,

.

So much of an actual one that I'm really having second thoughts on bothering with other FP mods...

Probably will realease a TSLPatcher version and one with an already modded .2daspells file with new ForcePriority entries for EVERY spell in the game.

I'm seriously considering including Darth's floating lightsaber (might put it the zombies too, but I don't really think of that one as a serious spell... - this is SW, not Night of the Living Dead 6

) to said modded .2daspells, but that's about it...

Any other interesting FP mod out there that doesn't use the patcher?

**ChAiNz.2da** · 07-25-2006, 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darthrevanrlz

I'm seriously considering including Darth's floating lightsaber (might put it the zombies too, but I don't really think of that one as a serious spell... - this is SW, not Night of the Living Dead 6

) to said modded .2daspells, but that's about it...

Any other interesting FP mod out there that doesn't use the patcher?

Just be sure to get permission to add other modder's work

darthrevanrlz · 07-26-2006, 08:01 PM

Quick update:

Still can't get the Patcher to compile/update scripts so I just gave up on using it for now.

Meaning that I'll release a fat spells.2da which won't be compatible with other old modded spells.2da. Seriously. The checks in the scripts are made with the ACTUAL lines from the spells.2da. I used a plain spells.2da and then started punching in everything. Any mod one might add *MUST* be added to the bottom.

Not exactly happy about that, but, well, as I said, I just can't get the patcher to work. On the bright side, most FP mods non-patcher-friendly are, well, pretty small. One needs to mod ONE line in a .uti file for the WhereAmI armband and RH's correction armband, for example. Goes up to a staggering THREE or SIX (or those using Darth's floating Lsbers/zombies (still waiting for an answer on that one...)...

I've got about 65 additional lines and 45 scripts (most of them dealing with 3 fps) for a total of about 120 modded FPs.

This isn't bragging. All I'm saying is that I just won't lose a second's sleep over a few lines. Lines which I'll gladly add if given permission.

That being said, I most certainly AM using the patcher for STRREFS and other files. (How could I NOT, lol?) It's just the scripts part I have trouble with. Meaning that aside from another spells.2da, it should work with anything and not conflict with other additions made to the game's dlg file...

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As for the actual *update*...

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1 - More than half of the modded spells.2da is complete with descriptions, effects and working strrefs (OF COURSE I'm testing it periodically

).

a) Force Friendly FPs are complete and I've redone the ForcePriority list so that the buff's order is: all light-sided, then neutral and... oh, right the ONE dark-sided buff.

Then it's on to Premon/Precogn/Grace(see no. 3) and Forms.

b) And don't you Lightsiders worry, I put Force Enlightenment at the very top. LS PC gets it for free when reaching prestige class and it's available for everyone at lvl 15.

--------------------------

2 - Simplified the offensive FP system. All spells now have 2 checks. One for damage, and the other for stun/attribute damage effect. Spell won't even try the second one if the same FP or its upgrade's effects are still active and it will AUTOMATICALLY override the effect of the previous incarnation of said FP...

Tried to find an elegant way out of a dilemma the game hasn't addressed (dmg + stun effect FP), but the closest I could get was to get it to work perfectly when the enemy failed its saves.

Tragic case of "close, but no cigar", but, well, as far as I'm concerned, a 9 seconds SLOW overriding a 6 seconds STUN isn't THAT dramatic...

*shrugs*

--------------------------

3 - Added a new power. Prototype name is "Warrior's Grace." Messed with the a_pc_jedi file and made sure that only the female PC gets it upon reaching prestige class. It's basically Battle precognition only it uses the CHARISMA modifier. Couldn't do the *exact same thing* than battle precognition, now, could I?

And to those using that Handmaiden for FemPC mod, huh... just *don't learn* one of them?? For the sake of fairplay and balance??? To make any sort of check work, I'd have to *create* a BattlePrecogn which has to be cast and then remove the original one from the Handmaiden's dlg.

I'll mod it for *my* game, but a public release is another matter, eh.

Anyway, as for the choice of *how* to include it in the game, gaining a prestige class is about the *only* event which has to happen at a certain level. lvl 15 isn't that far from when the male PC gets to learn it. Good enough for me. May include various versions of the file if I get the green light from RH.

--------------------------

4 - Had overlooked a tragic flaw in my class-specific buff system. For the upgrade to be available, just HAVING the first FP is sadly not enough; it must be available to the new class.

So... basic Jedi classes still only have access to their specific buff. Prestige classes get access to ALL first level buffs and can upgrade (as planned) only one of the three. Dealt with the issue of stacking since using one class-specific buff will cancel any other active.

Am kinda ticked off at how it turned out, but then again, I don't see why a Sith Lord would waste a FP to get +1 to about everything (sentinel's) while they get their own buff which considerably buffs up their force prowess. Or why I marauder would bother with a +2 int/wiz/cha/BBD/FPRegen buff...

--------------------------

5 - Super Kreia

Doesn't really have to do with the spells.2da file in itself, but odds are I'll release it with the feat.2da and some key elements ARE in aforementioned file, so...

Aside from getting a prestige class at lvl 10, Kreia now gets ALL class-specific Jedi feats with their upgrades(jump, immunity, focus) and ALL FORCE FORMS. (gogo k_oei_inch scripting!!!).

Traitorous Sith Lords posing as half-insane old scows PWNZ...

(Well, should more than they did in game anyway)

--------------------------

Oh well, that's about it. Won't get any work done tonight since we're having "bad yet hilarious B-movies" night... Still, the odds of the massive spells.2da finished before or during the weekend are quite good. And considering how most of the other .2da are about 90% complete...

Cheers,

DRRLZ