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Old 08-12-2006, 04:32 AM   #1
Darth Raum
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M$-78 in game trailer

In The Sith Lords trailer, there is one shot where the camera is circling the landing pad on M4-78. Just thought I'd throw that out there even though we all know that it was originally intended to be in the game but was cut due to time shortage. But it just shows that with another 2-3 months, we could've had a finished kotor game, M4-78 and all.


You see, I'm actually a deathly sith lord. But since my ressurection from the body of Jaden Korr, I've been pretty busy with growing up. It can be irritating sometimes having to re-live life, but it'll be worth it when I rule the universe again as the almighty Dark Lord of the Sith.
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Old 08-12-2006, 06:35 PM   #2
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TSL is actually a finished product, though not many people seem to realize that.

I am actually helping restore (though more like make) M4-78. While it will be a fun planet to explore and do things on, TSL will be just as "finished" with or without it. It's really just adding extra gameplay.
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Old 08-13-2006, 06:23 AM   #3
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That is a point that reguarly comes up around here, and I don't know why. TSL is a complete and finished product, it is simply a buggy product. The things that were removed (such as M4-78) were originally going to be added in patches like was originally going to be done for some of the places in Kotor. This unfortunately never came to pass, and because there are places where these things COULD happen, and the scattered remainants are there, people consider TSL to be unfinished.

It is not.
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Old 08-13-2006, 07:59 AM   #4
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What about the drastically cut material at the end and the fact that nothing is explained about why you face malachor alone and where your friends are and the hk 47 droid factory quest which WAS started by picking up the translator on peragus, that was NOT finished it was left hanging after Hk-47 talked about the translater.

It is unfinished.


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Old 08-13-2006, 08:25 AM   #5
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Or indeed...

What was the outcome of the G0-T0 vs. Remote cutscene?

Where did all of the Exile's companions suddenly disappear to?


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Old 08-13-2006, 09:30 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Raum
But it just shows that with another 2-3 months, we could've had a finished kotor game, M4-78 and all.
Oh? Do you even know the reason for why that planet was cut? Is time restrictions the only reason why something will be removed?

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Old 08-13-2006, 12:52 PM   #7
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Unhappy

As always, prime makes the facts clear to the *snip* XD

Let's use nicer words shall we. I would have used 'n00bs' or 'whiners' myself. -RH

Edit: Sorry RH. "whiners"? that's a little childish :P. Kidding.

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Old 08-13-2006, 03:28 PM   #8
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It evidently was time restrictions as to why the content was cut. It has been said by nearly every person in this forum and to believe otherwise is shear ignorance of the facts.


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Old 08-13-2006, 05:10 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HerbieZ
nothing is explained about why you face malachor alone
Unlike KotOR, TSL expects you to think about these things. As the Ebon Hawk was extremely damaged, it would have been a stupid idea to just leave it there. It's most likely that the crew was repairing it. If anything, I would wonder about why only two companions can come with you on the Star Forge. The Ebon Hawk was protected by the Jedi, after all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jediphile
What was the outcome of the G0-T0 vs. Remote cutscene?
Isn't it obvious? If you're on the light side, the remote somehow got by Goto to activate the mass shadow generator. If you're on the dark side, the remote fails.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HerbieZ
the hk 47 droid factory quest which WAS started by picking up the translator on peragus, that was NOT finished it was left hanging after Hk-47 talked about the translater.
A minor thing buried deep in HK's dialogue compared to the huge plot hole in KotOR. They never even explain how Revan and Malak fell to the dark side. All that's stated is "something happened to them along the Rim", although it's never explained.

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Originally Posted by HerbieZ
It is unfinished.
How? All that those cut parts of the game really do is show scenes with obvious outcomes, or add other things that prolong the gameplay and have no relevance to the plot.
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Old 08-13-2006, 05:38 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
Quote:
Originally Posted by jediphile
What was the outcome of the G0-T0 vs. Remote cutscene?
Isn't it obvious? If you're on the light side, the remote somehow got by Goto to activate the mass shadow generator. If you're on the dark side, the remote fails.
And how? Because the way that scene ends, there is no way the Remote can fulfil his mission, since G0-T0 has total control over him and seems pretty adamant about not allowing Remote to destroy Malachor.

Sure, I know what was supposed to happen, but it's still missing from the game itself. And I actually take the fact that the matter is described in the New Essential Guide to Droids (where G0-T0's demise is mentioned, since LSF Exile is canon) to be an admission that this was missing from the game.

M4-78 may be cut content, because you don't actually need it in the plot. The same goes for the Genoharadan plot on Nar Shaddaa.

I don't think that's true for the G0-T0 vs. Remote scene or the HK factory, since both are pretty essential to how the plot eventually plays out. Without those, the story has plotholes.


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Old 08-13-2006, 06:06 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
Unlike KotOR, TSL expects you to think about these things. As the Ebon Hawk was extremely damaged, it would have been a stupid idea to just leave it there. It's most likely that the crew was repairing it. If anything, I would wonder about why only two companions can come with you on the Star Forge. The Ebon Hawk was protected by the Jedi, after all.



Isn't it obvious? If you're on the light side, the remote somehow got by Goto to activate the mass shadow generator. If you're on the dark side, the remote fails.



A minor thing buried deep in HK's dialogue compared to the huge plot hole in KotOR. They never even explain how Revan and Malak fell to the dark side. All that's stated is "something happened to them along the Rim", although it's never explained.



How? All that those cut parts of the game really do is show scenes with obvious outcomes, or add other things that prolong the gameplay and have no relevance to the plot .
My god.


In bold are words/paragraphs that made me laugh

"Most likely" & "somehow" prove there was something missing.

The fall of Malak and Revan isn't a plot hole if it was never supposed to be explained in KOTOR. I for one was never expecting it to. However the HK dialogue was clearly in place to be followed up. Whether or not you agree with my view about KOTOR, you can't make TSL comeplete by saying something else is more severly cut.

"No relevance to the plot" made me laugh the hardest. The cut content wasn't just relevent to the plot, it WAS the plot.
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Old 08-13-2006, 06:32 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
Unlike KotOR, TSL expects you to think about these things. As the Ebon Hawk was extremely damaged, it would have been a stupid idea to just leave it there. It's most likely that the crew was repairing it.
That makes the movie of the Ebon Hawk falling one of the most comical highlights of the game to know as the darkside, your entire party are creamed inside a falling ship.


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Old 08-13-2006, 07:30 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jediphile
And how? Because the way that scene ends, there is no way the Remote can fulfil his mission, since G0-T0 has total control over him and seems pretty adamant about not allowing Remote to destroy Malachor.
So? The remote can still 'fulfill' his mission without destroying Goto. All he said was that the remote couldn't move. That little droid had a blaster. He didn't need to move to fire it. And for all we know, he didn't need to. The console the remote activated said the mass shadow generator was powering up. Goto didn't seem to know that, as he said he could permit the remote to activate the generator. For all we know, Goto could've gone on about with his little talk and the generator activated in the middle of it. But as I play as a dark side character, the issue never arises with me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jediphile
I don't think that's true for the G0-T0 vs. Remote scene or the HK factory, since both are pretty essential to how the plot eventually plays out. Without those, the story has plotholes.
You have not responded to the major plothole in KotOR I pointed out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HerbieZ
That makes the movie of the Ebon Hawk falling one of the most comical highlights of the game to know as the darkside, your entire party are creamed inside a falling ship.
That is not relevant to my point.
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Old 08-14-2006, 12:45 AM   #14
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Oh? Do you even know the reason for why that planet was cut? Is time restrictions the only reason why something will be removed?
Quite so. Why people have a hard time understanding this is really strange to me.

When creating a storyline for a game you will cut things out, a large percentage of the original ideas can hit the floor during development, or be replaced by new ideas. It is the way of things.


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Old 08-14-2006, 12:55 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prime
Oh? Do you even know the reason for why that planet was cut? Is time restrictions the only reason why something will be removed?

What other reasons would there be for cutting something as important as this to the game


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Old 08-14-2006, 01:30 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by WeaponMaster
What other reasons would there be for cutting something as important as this to the game
In threads that are focused on debating, it is a good idea to read all the posts. I shall now quote myself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
I am actually helping restore (though more like make) M4-78. While it will be a fun planet to explore and do things on, TSL will be just as "finished" with or without it. It's really just adding extra gameplay.
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Originally Posted by Henz
In bold are words/paragraphs that made me laugh
You'll live a little longer if you have a happy attitude and laugh often. I'm glad to have helped.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Henz
"Most likely" & "somehow" prove there was something missing.
I do not often like speaking in very black and white terms. I see that my unwillingness to do so resulted in you misinterpreting my statements. When I speak to you in the future, I will be sure to use terms that are easier for you to comprehend.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Henz
The fall of Malak and Revan isn't a plot hole if it was never supposed to be explained in KOTOR.
Were there plans for a KotOR II when KotOR I was released on Xbox? Even if there were, loose ends in a game should be wrapped up in that game.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Henz
I for one was never expecting it to. However the HK dialogue was clearly in place to be followed up. Whether or not you agree with my view about KOTOR, you can't make TSL comeplete by saying something else is more severly cut.
I cannot make TSL more "complete" by pointing that out. But whining about a minor plot hole in one game and ignoring a major one in another game is inconsistent of you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Henz
"No relevance to the plot" made me laugh the hardest. The cut content wasn't just relevent to the plot, it WAS the plot.
I see my statement proved to complex for you to understand. What I meant was that the things missing from TSL are either scenes with obvious outcomes, OR they are things that prolong the gameplay and have no relevance to the plot. An example of the second thing I listed would the Padawan in the Enclave's sublevel (Kaevee, I think it was?) who controlled the laigreks.

Last edited by Emperor Devon; 08-14-2006 at 01:55 AM.
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Old 08-15-2006, 03:27 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
Isn't it obvious? If you're on the light side, the remote somehow got by Goto to activate the mass shadow generator. If you're on the dark side, the remote fails.
If anything is obvious, its that Revan and Malak's fall is to be explained in K3. (I really hope they make that game)

Just because those of us who are realists admit that TSL is unfinished doesn't mean we didn't enjoy and continue to enjoy the game. It just means we believe its an unfinished game. Personally, I would love to have the plot at the end of the game a little more, shall we say, existent? What happened between Remote and G0-T0? Where did Mira go after killing Hanharr? Where is Bao-Dur? And what about everyone else in the party? What happened, what happened, what happened? As a closing statement, TSL is the most enjoyable game with no ending I've ever played.
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Old 08-15-2006, 07:58 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
So? The remote can still 'fulfill' his mission without destroying Goto. All he said was that the remote couldn't move. That little droid had a blaster. He didn't need to move to fire it.
Quoting G0-T0 from the game...
Quote:
Touching. The probability of the Iridonian installing triggered commands within your core was high; I see the probabilities have played out.Of course, the probability that I would do the same is equally high. Your inability to move right now is evidence of that. If the General issues the command, only I will be here to receive it.You realize I cannot permit you... or the exile... to activate the mass shadow generator here on Malachor. In that, your programming and mine... conflict.And since you have no offensive weaponry to speak of, the probability of your programming overwriting mine is low.
Note "no offensive weaponry to speak of"... It says rather a lot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
And for all we know, he didn't need to. The console the remote activated said the mass shadow generator was powering up. Goto didn't seem to know that, as he said he could permit the remote to activate the generator. For all we know, Goto could've gone on about with his little talk and the generator activated in the middle of it. But as I play as a dark side character, the issue never arises with me.
If you're unwilling to consider the LS ending, then what's the point here? After all, it's only in that ending that Malachor V gets destroyed, so there is no question G0-T0 won the fight in that sense.

Hmm... Actually, your theory makes me wonder how he stopped Remote in the DS ending, if he didn't know the mass shadow generator was powering up... Seems to me that's either incorrect or else it's another plothole. But from the G0-T0 quote above, I'd assume the former.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
You have not responded to the major plothole in KotOR I pointed out.
Nor do I have to. Indeed, I don't even have to agree that it's a plothole, which is the case here, and therefore irrelevant to me.


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Old 08-15-2006, 10:25 PM   #19
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As for the generator powering up, I always assumed that even though it was charged up, it still needed the final command to activate, and otherwise it would just sit there ready to go without going.
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Old 08-16-2006, 04:04 PM   #20
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Well, Obvious "unfinished things" would be:
3) Where goes the rest of your crew, like T3M4, though we know about Remote/HK/G0T0. The whereabouts of Visas and the rest during the M-V incident would need some explanation.

2) Bao-Dur, and his Importance (though we could have guessed it with remote, but what of Bao-Dur?) Though maybe they want to make Bao-Dur reappear in the third game.

1) HK and him mentioning of the factory, definitely unfinished part DESIGNED to be in the game.
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Old 08-16-2006, 04:19 PM   #21
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I'm under the impression that Obsidian may have left that last detail in the game as a lead-in to a potential plot aspect in KotOR III, since the HK-50 aspect of the plot is never really resolved.
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Old 08-16-2006, 04:27 PM   #22
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The real problem is that the HK factory is an essential part of the plot, since it impacts how the G0-T0 vs. Remote conflict plays out on Malachor V. But because the HK factory was never quite finished and had to be cut, there was no choice but to cut that part from the end of the game, too, which leaves that part of the tale without any real closure.

And of course, what becomes of the rest of the Exile's companions is also quite absent. Sure, we might know what was supposed to happen, but as is, they just disappear into thin air on Malachor V... It still bugs me that Kreia actually says, "When the exile enters the Trayus Academy, he will be faced with a choice...". No, he won't, because it was cut, yet she still says it...


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Old 08-17-2006, 08:28 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
Were there plans for a KotOR II when KotOR I was released on Xbox? Even if there were, loose ends in a game should be wrapped up in that game.
There is no evidence I know of to support the idea that the fall of Malak & Revan was to be tied up, whereas we all know most loose ends in TSL were there because of cut content.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
I cannot make TSL more "complete" by pointing that out. But whining about a minor plot hole in one game and ignoring a major one in another game is inconsistent of you.
I was merely stating that pointing out other games' removed material in no way affects what was removed from TSL. I don't care what was cut from KOTOR 1 as it was covered up well. My "whining" is at the TSL story suffering because of a confusing, fragmented, rushed ending.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
I see my statement proved to complex for you to understand. What I meant was that the things missing from TSL are either scenes with obvious outcomes, OR they are things that prolong the gameplay and have no relevance to the plot. An example of the second thing I listed would the Padawan in the Enclave's sublevel (Kaevee, I think it was?) who controlled the laigreks.
But the obvious outcomes were not the ones originally intended. Was the remote supposed to be left, doomed? Who is on the Ebon Hawk as it flies off in the under-whelming final cut scene? Streamlining game-play is thing, and I'm all for working out answers; but TSL forces you to make them up because it couldn't be bothered to itself.
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Old 08-17-2006, 08:35 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by RedHawke
Quite so. Why people have a hard time understanding this is really strange to me.

When creating a storyline for a game you will cut things out, a large percentage of the original ideas can hit the floor during development, or be replaced by new ideas. It is the way of things.
It's a very good point. People do tend to cling to the cut content, even though it's possible that it was all cut for creative reasons over time/budget.
It's so easy to do though as the ending of the game is so underwhelming.
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Old 08-17-2006, 09:13 AM   #25
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A question for those going on about K2 being unfinished.

Is K1 in your opinion finished? or unfinished?
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Old 08-17-2006, 08:25 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jackel
A question for those going on about K2 being unfinished.

Is K1 in your opinion finished? or unfinished?
Finished in the sense of cut content being well hidden.
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Old 08-17-2006, 09:24 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Jediphile
Nor do I have to. Indeed, I don't even have to agree that it's a plothole, which is the case here, and therefore irrelevant to me.
Then I shall apply that theory to your argument. If you ignore my points while pressing your own, this debate will obviously go nowhere.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Henz
There is no evidence I know of to support the idea that the fall of Malak & Revan was to be tied up,
Whether they planned to tie it up or not, that doesn't matter. My point is that there is a large plothole. While I'm glad it has been explained since, it left me wondering after I finished KotOR.
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Old 08-19-2006, 04:46 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Henz
Finished in the sense of cut content being well hidden.
Well, Point being, a finished product means loose ends from cut content would not be found so easily in normal play, annoying the player and/or giving player the idea that something they have missed exist even after repeated gameplay. Such is the case when it comes to HK47/HK50 incident. That the lines clearly indicate something is to be done.

Areas you can find using cheat is ok, cause you are not SUPPOSED to get to them during normal gameplay. In fact, those secret bits are actually good, sort of an easter egg.
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Old 08-31-2006, 12:48 PM   #29
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About what the topic was really about, I've checked through the trailer several times looking for the M4-78-shot, but I can't find it. Can someone give a screenshot?
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Old 08-31-2006, 04:28 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Darth Raum
In The Sith Lords trailer, there is one shot where the camera is circling the landing pad on M4-78. Just thought I'd throw that out there even though we all know that it was originally intended to be in the game but was cut due to time shortage. But it just shows that with another 2-3 months, we could've had a finished kotor game, M4-78 and all.

Upon watching the trailer in the game, it really isn't a point of reference for what was going to appear and what wasn't. It looks to have been made very early in production: characters like Mandalore don't have proper textures, there are a lot of K1 heads being used, as well as bodies and in one case a robe texture over a K2 robe (I was really surprised when I saw that one).

M4-78 was cut for time constraint reasons and for redundancy (as the story was similar to Peragus, apparently). If the planet were important to the plot of the game, it wouldn't have been cut. It would have been a nice addition, but they really didn't "cut" anything except the prospect of fully executing the concept of the planet.
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Old 08-31-2006, 04:38 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skye
If the planet were important to the plot of the game, it wouldn't have been cut.
There actually were some plans to make M4-78 an important part of the plot very early on in development. Bao-Dur was supposed to die there and the Force bond with Kreia was supposed to be explained in more depth, but I think those were cut even before the planet was.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skye
M4-78 was cut for time constraint reasons and for redundancy (as the story was similar to Peragus, apparently).
Thankfully, M4-78 will not have a very similar story to Peragus. The only similarities I can think of would be there are a lot of droids, and gas killed off some people.


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Old 08-31-2006, 05:11 PM   #32
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Whoof. Another ''Is TSL finished, or not?'' discussion.

OK, here it goes - you may, or may not agree, but the fact is that TSL is, storywise, an unfinished game. The HK-50 factory (the biggest reason for these discussions) is a major part of the plot and it isn't in the game. That's a fact. And it's made a lot of people agitated (including me). There are many other plotholes, some major, some minor (I'd have to replay the game to present a detailed list and quite frankly I don't want to do that) and some of them are responsible for certain bugs in the game (for example there's a dialogue option in the Rebuilt Enclave that, if selected, instantly ends the conversation and kills the three masters, no regular cutscene, Kreia appears there and you have to talk to her to get a cutscene and not the one that should have been played).
Like other people said, wheter a game is finished or not is determined by how well is the cut content hidden and the plotholes wrapped up. In TSL it has been done poorly, probably due to lack of time, but the reasons are not important right now, what's important is that because of that this game is unfinished.
Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed playing TSL, despite its drawbacks, but my point is that story-wise, it's not as fine tuned and wrapped up as the first part was.

@Emperor Devon: About that 'major' plothole from K1 you mentioned. I dunno, it wasn't explained in detail in the game, but it was explained to a point by that vision of Revan and Malak discovering the first Star Map. Maybe it wasn't explained completely, but it felt wrapped up, like the rest of the story.

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Old 08-31-2006, 05:20 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by igyman
Maybe it wasn't explained completely, but it felt wrapped up, like the rest of the story.
The reasoning behind why the main antagonists of the series founded the empire that threatened the galaxy was left entirely unexplained in KotOR. How does that make it feel wrapped up?


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Old 09-01-2006, 05:41 AM   #34
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Actually, when I think of it a little further, it was explained completely.

OK, here's what we know. When Revan and Malak found the first Star Map on Dantooine, they, or rather Revan (Malak simply followed him), were drawn by it and decided to find the missing pieces of the puzzle. At the end of the road was the Star Forge. This isn't emphasised in the game, but it seems pretty obvious that they discovered that Star Map before they went to fight in the Mandalorian Wars, since they didn't return to the Academy after they went to war. It also seems obvious that finding the Star Maps was the real reason why Revan left to fight in the war.
Now, consider this:
- It was said in the game that Revan took his fleet to the Unknown Regions, after they defeated the Mandalorians and it was said that something happened to him there that turned him to the Dark Side.
- We know that he found the Star Forge and used it.
- The Star Forge is in the Unknown Regions.
- The Star Forge is a tool, for lack of a better term, of the Dark Side.

I think that the conclusion you can draw from all this is pretty obvious - When Revan found the Star Forge he completely turned to the Dark Side and Malak along with him. They were already tainted when they found that first Star Map on Dantooine.
I know what you're going to ask: Where did that taint come from? And here's the answer: both of them, especially Revan, were refered to as being arrogant and overconfident and who knows what else (mostly by Vrook, if I remember correctly) and when it comes to Jedi, those traits come with a price - the possibility of falling to the Dark Side.

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Old 09-01-2006, 01:36 PM   #35
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Being proud alone does not lead to the dark side. Usually something else is needed. I do not think that the Star Forge alone made Revan fall, because he knew it existed before he went out to conquer the galaxy. An good Jedi would've informed the Council.

TSL elaborated a bit on Revan's schemes to take over the galaxy, which was well and good, but I think that it should have been explained in KotOR as well.


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Old 09-01-2006, 04:08 PM   #36
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Well, I did my best. The explanation I posted was good enough for me, but if it's not good enough for you, I guess there's no point in trying to persuade you otherwise. To have more detailed arguments I'd have to replay K1 and right now I don't feel like it. So, to each his own - you have your opinion and I have mine.

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Old 09-01-2006, 07:20 PM   #37
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Im happy that it didnt explain the plans of Revan in K1, then it wouldent be the same as the plans he have in K2, and we would maybe never hear about the true sith. And where the taint came from the beginning, we will maybe never know, but the last step to the darkside is at the first star map, Malak say something if they do this the Jedis will never take them back
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Old 09-01-2006, 09:51 PM   #38
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The "taint" came from Malachor V, where Revan learned of the true Sith in the Trayus Academy. It's unclear how far Revan had fallen from the light at this point, but he was determined in his efforts against the Mandalorians. Perhaps he had already fallen at this point. Or perhaps it was a sacrifice, as Kreia suggests. Which is true is for the player to decide for himself or herself.

As I see it, Revan either fell to the corrupt teachings of the Trayus Academy even as he learned of the true Sith and decided he would need to fight them, since they would present a threat to his own emerging empire, or else Revan realised that the true Sith were a threat to the republic that he needed to stop even at the cost of his own soul. Kreia suggests the latter, but we really don't know. Personally, I think it's a little of both - Revan was still benevolent enough to do it for the sake of the republic, but he made the same mistake that Ulic Qel-Droma did - he thought he could wield the dark side as a tool or weapon while avoiding its corruption. And he thought he could do it alone, which is always a mistake for a jedi - the jedi are never alone! Being alone is the mark of the Sith, since there can be no trust (or friendship) among the evil and corrupted.

If so, then he erred, for after defeating the Mandalorians and claiming the StarForge, Revan's next war was not against the true Sith but against the republic - his intent to embrace the dark side in order to save the republic had corrupted him, and instead of protecting the republic, it became simply another obstacle he had to subdue, so that his own forces could grow stronger for the subsequent war against the true Sith.

But then something unexpected happened. A group of jedi infiltrated Revan's ship, and Malak used the opportunity to betray him. Revan survived, but lost his memories and was captured by the jedi, who reprogrammed his memory, as we saw in KotOR1.


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Old 09-01-2006, 10:48 PM   #39
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Emperor Devon, Prime, and Redhawke have said all that I believe is true. There are countless of reasons why the 'cut content' would be removed. If there are any issues, I blame it on bad editing. I can see small tiny pieces that were accidently omited, but the majority of the 'cut content' was omited for other reasons. I don't believe time restraints was the sole reason, which M4-78 and the HK-Factory were omitted. One could make the argument that they were removed because they were not necessary. There are too many reasons.

What drove people to the 'cut content' conspiracy is because modders found the files. If there were no such thing as modders, the average gammer would not know of their existance. Remember, Obsidian wasn't going to say anything. Until a curiosity driven person looked into the files, they didn't have a reason to say anything. People are just upset because they want more game play, and they are mad at how TSL was edited badly.

98% of the game was not supposed to be a cliffhanger. If you played the game straight through, covered all the dialouge, you will notice that you should only have a few questions:

1. (LS) Where is the Exile going?
2. (DS) Did the Exile survive Malacore?
3. What happened to Revan?

I don't see how the HK Factory or M4-78 could have changed or added to the ending. Don't get me wrong, I will enjoy their addition to the game, but they are just a curiosity. I applaud both projects, and I look forward to their endgame. However, I don't take what they create as an impact on the final game outcome. The game was officially finished.

To be honest, I have to also agree with another statement. I think the gammer should have been forced to hear about your companions' futures. If we were forced to hear about our friends, I think people will understand that TSL was a completed game.

It is very sad that people believe TSL was an incomplete game. There is a difference between 'incomplete' and 'accidental edits'.

'Cut Content' = HK-Factory & M4-78 (Intentionally removed for unknown reasons.)

'Accidental Edits' = Small tidbits of dialouge and scenes throughout the remainder of the game, which were accidently omited or left behind. (These pieces would include: GoTo vrs. Tiny Droid, What happend to my companions when we hit Malacore, and accidentally leaving in dialouge information about the factory. That is about it.)

Everything else is extra.



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Old 09-01-2006, 10:59 PM   #40
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It is very sad that people believe TSL was an incomplete game. There is a difference between 'incomplete' and 'accidental edits'.
I agree completely. Once Team Gizka finishes their project and Team Bantha and I finish ours, people will realize that they won't make the game any more complete. What will be said then? It'll be interesting to see.


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