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Old 09-12-2001, 01:54 AM   #121
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Quote:
Originally posted by Luke Skywalker:
Andromeda, just one of us that fly flight simulations or even XWA can do that with high precition, for us is a picnic.

No offense...but I am calling MAJOR BS on that. That maybe true for say, a Cessna, but the power size and force of that airliner.....so different. To say that because you play some videogame and it makes you as able as someone who goes throught 4 years of school......seriously now, remove head from sphincter
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Old 09-12-2001, 02:04 AM   #122
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Ok, you right but fly a Boing with a little knowlenge of civilian aircraft is not easy, but not imposible. My theory if that one of the terrorist use the pilot to make the corrections and when near of the building they take command in the last seconds, enough to aim without loss the overall control and sustentation force.
Damn, they convert it in a guided missile.

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Old 09-12-2001, 02:19 AM   #123
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Quote:
Originally posted by JR2000Z:
So would NATO would obviously get involved right? So this would mean that it is the beginning of WW3?
Well, see, heres the problem, with everyone condemning it, when we find out who did it, who is going to fight back against us. NO ONE.


and Secondly.....next person to quote that big dead gas bag Nostradamous gets a foot in the arse. He was/is/and always will be full of it. Don't you remember after the last set of big quakes everyone saying, "OH NO ITS THE END WE ARE ALL GUNNA DIE!!!". Yeah same ****, different color or whatever that saying is.
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Old 09-12-2001, 02:20 AM   #124
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the pilots were obviosly trained to some extent...we know that all the planes that were hyjacked had similar controls, and we also know that the pilots weren't killed immedeitley because one turned his radio mike on and controlers heard him talking to the hjacker. he was probably killed once they were over new york so that he wouldn't interfere but up till then he was the one flying.

p.s. it doesn't take that much skill to fly into a building, the trick is avoiding them.
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Old 09-12-2001, 02:20 AM   #125
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Jesus man, I've just heard the news and read through this post.
This incedent has angred me as much as any American, I spend alot of time in the US, it's almost like a second home to me, I almost cried when I heard the news, and saw it unfold before my eyes on CNN, my condoloncies(sp?) go out to all and everyone hurt by this evil act.

On the subject of flying these Airliners, a copy of a simulation such as Flight Sim 2000 would not be that difficult to get hold of and is very realistic, I personally have put many hours into that simulation and I belive I could take off fly and land it, it comes whith basic and advanced tutorials teaching flight tequnics and such. Somebody who had spent tiem with the program could easily if he hadthe will power carry out this dispicibly cowardly act.
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Old 09-12-2001, 02:23 AM   #126
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I personally would say, "**** OFF YOU STUPID BASTARD" to the hijacker and grab the controls as hard as possible and I steer it to the ground when he says, "get up so I can hit he buiding", by the time that pissant gets my cold dead hands off the stick we are hitting the harbor......
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Old 09-12-2001, 02:31 AM   #127
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Those terrorsists have knives. REAL terrorists use guns and rocket launchers.

Anybody can kill a person with a knife.

[This message has been edited by JR2000Z (edited September 11, 2001).]
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Old 09-12-2001, 02:36 AM   #128
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I heard the plane that crashed in PA was deliberately crashed by one of the pilots. If that's true, and the plane was hijacked and en route to another target, I applaud the pilot.

Frankly, I'm still in shock with the whole incident. No matter how much I pinch myself, I still can't wake up. I do agree that this is unlikely to lead to WW3, as in most of the civilized world is on our side.
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Old 09-12-2001, 02:36 AM   #129
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I heard that that head bombs on the plane too. One of the passengers called his wife and told her they had bombs on it too. Either way I would go out making sure they didn't get the building.

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Old 09-12-2001, 02:38 AM   #130
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Yeah, I heard a story that there a guy who called his family to tell him about the terrosists in the plane right before he was killed.
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Old 09-12-2001, 02:38 AM   #131
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Quote:
Originally posted by Darth Sceltor:
I heard the plane that crashed in PA was deliberately crashed by one of the pilots. If that's true, and the plane was hijacked and en route to another target, I applaud the pilot.
HERE HERE
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Old 09-12-2001, 02:42 AM   #132
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That pilot could teach us all some things about testicular fortitude.
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Old 09-12-2001, 02:43 AM   #133
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Judging from the eyewitnesses (thankfully I'm getting a LOT of coverage on the PA crash from local news), there was definitely a struggle in the cockpit that led to the plane crashing into an open field far away from ANYTHING.
There are also rumors circulating locally that a pair of ANG F-16s were sent up to intercept the plane when it turned southeast when it was up by Cleveland and was heading past Pittsburgh. It seems that their "services" weren't needed...
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Old 09-12-2001, 02:46 AM   #134
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Wow, the Gunray speaks. I figured that you'd be using this opportunity to sieze power.
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Old 09-12-2001, 05:47 AM   #135
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psssssh, thats what the storm troopers are for.
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Old 09-12-2001, 07:11 AM   #136
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My Flight Dynamics class has been cancelled earlier today. After a 20 min wait for the professor to appear, it was announced that due to the tragedy in the US he was incapable of preparing and giving the lecture.
Next class won't start until 7:45 EST.
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Old 09-12-2001, 08:49 AM   #137
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I can almost assure you that flying a 767 is not an easy task. The take off weight is 450,000 pounds. The plane is 201 feet long with a wing span of about 170 feet. A little bigger then your average cessna. I can just about bet you need some understanding of what you are doing before you jump behind the wheel.


All I can say is I hope that I get to see someone/country go up in a blaze for this one.

God,guns and guts made America free, lets keep all three.

Someone came looking for war and by God we are now going to make that Bast ard rue the day he was born.

<font color red><font size 14>U</font></font><font color white><font size 14>S</font></font><font color blue><font size 14>A</font></font>

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Old 09-12-2001, 10:46 AM   #138
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The one thing nobody's mentioned is that these guys had to be skilled enough to FIND the targets. I mean when you look out of an airplane window how do you know where you are and how whould you know which way to turn to get to Manhattan from western Mass (let alone hitting a ground target with precision, especially a low-lying one like the Pentagon.) I wouldn't, even with all the flight sim games I've played in my life. I guess I would have a rough idea, but not enough to make a bee-line like these guys did. These were fully trained pilots, no doubt AT ALL in my mind about it.
And THAT should narrow things down a bit.

[This message has been edited by edlib (edited September 12, 2001).]
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Old 09-12-2001, 11:51 AM   #139
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Absolutly Edlib. Even if you could fly the thing finding your way around the skies would be a little tough unless you had some experience.
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Old 09-12-2001, 01:23 PM   #140
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This is VERY serious, I have been following the news and:
1. People with cell phones on the hijacked planes gave detailed descriptions and seat numbers of the hijackers.
2. The hijackers used box-cutters and knives (which are easy to sneak on board a plane, before this happened)
3. People on the ground in Logan and Manhattan have been "held for questioning"
4. The Pentagon is still burning, it may all burn down since alot of it is wood.
5. Federal authorities are finding evidence linking this horror to a terrorist cell in Florida.
6. Gas station owners have been charging $5.00/gallon in my area, its so nice to know that some "people" know how to work a crisis.

Also,
"I could do it. They're very simple to control. There's a yoke that's not unlike a steering wheel that controls your left right motion. It pushes in and pulls out to control up down. You have two pedals that control the rudder. And you have the throttle quadrant. Child's play."

- No, it is'nt. Flying a REAL large passenger jet at 250 knots 100-200 feet off the ground to hit a target with any precision takes some extensive training.

BOTTOM LINE: I think the government has a good idea who funded and organized this attack at this point in time. The problem is how to tell the public WITHOUT causing WW3.
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Old 09-12-2001, 02:48 PM   #141
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hans The Great:
4. The Pentagon is still burning, it may all burn down since alot of it is wood.
No, its not going to burn down.

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Old 09-12-2001, 03:20 PM   #142
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edlib that is exactly what i was saying!!! i guess nobody understood it...either that or disregarded it cuz i'm a girl. whatever the case, that's what i meant.
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Old 09-12-2001, 03:25 PM   #143
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when i see the two towers goin down, its like something out of Independence Day. the thing is, if they go and start bombing the country where Bin Landen is, then that will start off ok.

what happens if they pick the WRONG country. that is how this cld escualte to a globabl conflict
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Old 09-12-2001, 04:51 PM   #144
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Well, the only airliner I'm directly familiar with is the 737...
The guys were commercially trained pilots, assuming the current reports are correct. And the plane in PA was intentionally grounded after three passengers apparently seized control:
Quote:
The mother of passenger Mark Bingham, 31, said she hoped his actions may have stopped an even greater disaster. The plane was the only one of four hijacked craft that did not reach its destination, crashing instead into a field.
"We know Mark was a very active and takecharge guy, he was a large man," Alice Hoglan, whose son called from the plane..."We're hoping that Mark had a chance to perhaps work with other passengers to thwart the intent of these hijackers
Quote:
Another Flight 93 passenger, Thomas Burnett, 38, called his wife to say he feared his flight was doomed but he and two other passengers planned to do something about it
That's out of the local paper.

If I was on one of those planes and me and some other guys made a stand and we siezed control of the plane, I would have grabbed the fire ax and yelled "I GOT YER JIHAD RIGHT HERE ****ER" and proceeded to behead the terrorist dog.

I heard a rumor that in PA, the state attorney general said that anyone that raises gas prices will be prosecuted for price gouging.
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Old 09-12-2001, 05:36 PM   #145
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This is an outrage against the Western World, especially the US. Even though I'm a Brit, and knew no-one that was near any of this, I'm P*ssed off.

I say we bomb every suspected terrorist and Iraqi base we know, in fact, let's all invade Iraq. I hate Hussain, and we could all use the oil.

My Prayers for the victims.
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Old 09-12-2001, 07:34 PM   #146
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Tis a sad time to live in the world. Being in close proximity to Washington as I am, it's a bit scary. Since yesterday I can occasionally hear and even see some F-16s flying overhead or near here. America will not stand down.
After we have served justice to all parties involved, I propose that they rebuild the twin towers, making them 111 stories stall, with the extra story serving as a memorial in each tower.

This is our generation's Pearl Harbor. We must come together now as another generation did before us. One of my most memorable scenes from yesterday is a man out next to the highway, holding a raised flag, a silent show of support.

As far as who did this goes, 10 to 1 odds on bin Laden. If this does turn out to be the case, an international force must be assembled to bring him to justice, should Afganastan refuse to turn him over. We will chase him to the ends of the earth and back, knowing that good and justice are on our side.
Amen.

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Old 09-12-2001, 07:36 PM   #147
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Unhappy

Quote:
Originally posted by a Zaarin (by any other name):
Agreed. The human race, for all its faults, is not that stupid.
As I said initially; you have far more faith in humanity than I do.

Quote:
Originally posted by Assassin:
Lets just hope Bush keeps his bearings and acts rationally.
Y'know, if this wasn't such a sober moment, I'd be ROTFLOL right now.

Behold, the true price of terrorism.

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Old 09-12-2001, 08:09 PM   #148
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Quote:
Originally posted by Andromeda:
edlib that is exactly what i was saying!!! i guess nobody understood it...either that or disregarded it cuz i'm a girl. whatever the case, that's what i meant.
Sorry Andy, I really didn't mean to steal your fire. I was agreeing with you and the others who took this side of the discussion, and trying to clarify the point.
In other news: I was about a block from where the action went down today in Boston. I can almost see the Westin hotel from my office window. And if I step outside I can see all of Copley square.
I suspected somthing was up when 20 or 30 cruiser went past in the span of 5 minutes. I went to my bosses office to listen to the radio, and when the words "Bomb Sniffing Dogs" came over the air he said "OK, time to go."
So an early day for me. I came home, mowed the lawn, and have been watching the patrolling fighter jets fly over about every 5 or 10 minutes.
What you might call a full day.


[This message has been edited by edlib (edited September 12, 2001).]
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Old 09-12-2001, 08:14 PM   #149
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WTC Building number 5 may collapse.

**UPDATE** The remains of WTC Bulding 5, one of the towers that collapsed, is now like it's twin, nothing more than a pile of metal and concrete.

Someone is gonna be in a big pile of dog crap REAL SOON.

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Old 09-12-2001, 08:15 PM   #150
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I bet the Free Masons will start popping in now and start doing their thing.
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Old 09-12-2001, 09:06 PM   #151
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By the way - if anyone is still concerned over this:

"In the City of God there will be a great thunder,
Two brothers torn apart by Chaos.
While the fortress endures,
The great leader will succumb.
The third big war will begin,
When the big city is burning."
- Nostradamus, 1654

Don't be. It's a hoax. I looked it up and, not only was this quote not by Nostradamus (someone made it up in a paper as an example of the kind of things he wrote, I think), but Nostradamus died in the year 1566. So just relax

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Old 09-12-2001, 09:13 PM   #152
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the towers are sisters, not brothers...
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Old 09-12-2001, 11:24 PM   #153
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http://www.snopes2.com/inboxer/hoaxes/predict.htm


HAHA, horray for snopes.

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Old 09-12-2001, 11:27 PM   #154
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Bin Laden is denying involvement, and it's quite possible that he wasn't directly involved. It's more likely that someone came up to him and said "Hey I want to bomb the WTC" and he said "I've got bombs, I've got passports, I've got people willing to die. Need any?"

Nonetheless, we need to get him. The Afghan govt. claims they are not supporting him, but not saying they're doing anything to stop him, either. Hell, all they said was that they cut telephone lines to his camps. Time for Bush to make good on his statement that "No distinction will be made between the terrorists and those that harbor them". Just get on the phone and say "You have 48 hours to turn him over to us. There will be concequences if you do not comply. Goodbye."
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Old 09-13-2001, 12:16 AM   #155
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I cant believe it took America so long to figure out that 'OMG. Hes a bad guy.'

They had a good few opertunities of getting him but all they did is let him run.
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Old 09-13-2001, 04:41 AM   #156
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We go on a Ghengis Khan type march through Iraq, Palistine and Afghanistan. We say hand him over. If they don't the whole place is slaughtered. We get the NATO Allies to cover our backs. If all three countrys are gone then be it. Then we'll see who's laughing and cheering in the streets.

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Old 09-13-2001, 05:37 AM   #157
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Then you'd be no better than the terrorists. Civility is expressed by self-control, not outrage.
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Old 09-13-2001, 05:47 AM   #158
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The time for self control is over, if we don't turn these countrys into a sheet of glass they will continue to pull of stunts like this.

They brought it on and we need to finish it.
They want an ass kicken we'll give it to them.
They want to see the fury of the U.S. ,so let's show it to them.
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Old 09-13-2001, 05:56 AM   #159
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Genghis Kahn once depopulated Persia.
Persia is Iran and Afghanistan. Maybe he had the right idea way way back...
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Old 09-13-2001, 06:56 AM   #160
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Quote:
Originally posted by GUNNER:
The time for self control is over, if we don't turn these countrys into a sheet of glass they will continue to pull of stunts like this.

They brought it on and we need to finish it.
They want an ass kicken we'll give it to them.
They want to see the fury of the U.S. ,so let's show it to them.
I disagree. No decision should be made in the absence of self control. If retaliation is the right thing to do, then it should be carefully planned and the consequences carefully considered.

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