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Old 11-05-2006, 03:32 PM   #41
darthcarth
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Accauly i think that should be the least of our worrys atm.


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Old 11-05-2006, 05:12 PM   #42
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IMO the shields of consortium buildings need to be toned down a bit. The shield of a consortium palast regenerates as fast as 2 artillery units harm it!!
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Old 11-05-2006, 05:50 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darthcarth
Accauly i think that should be the least of our worrys atm.
I second that, (I probably have pretty much no right to post here since I don't own FOC yet) but could we empower the Rebel's Orbital Bombardment a bit? Everyone says it's really weak


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Old 11-05-2006, 07:48 PM   #44
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After a bit of play testing over the weekend (most game time was dominated by CoH which has REAL balance) I am going to turn things on their head a bit, from what I said before. I think the main thing that unbalances the ZC is their income and if this was corrected then their units COULD be left as is. But I am talking seriously hampering what they can produce now. If their cost was accurate and their income equal to the other factions then I think the problem would be solved.

The Scenario: While in Skirmish on the Endor map I tried the last strategy I had left to try; holding off the ZC until I had access to ISDs and then counter attacking. Now the Endor map has 5 mines. I held control of 3 and the the fourth (in the middle of the map) for a good period until the ZC started to advance in force and destroyed it. They never made use of this mine as I had a unit which could observe it. So they had *ONE* mine and their supply depot. I tested it and a supply depot brings in 300 credits a minute. Each mine brings in approx 1100 credits a minute. So I was getting at least three times more income as the ZC (in theory). I was able to tech up to 5 and bring on Thrawn. All the while I had to fend off multiple small attacks which I did easily. I thought I had half a chance.

HOWEVER very shortly after I brought on Thrawn, I spot an Aggressor closing in with support. How were they able to tech up and afford this craft you ask while still keeping me busy with Vengeance Fr, Int IVs and Star Vipers? I have no idea. But wait it gets worse. Certain I could repel the Aggressor my confidence was high but this quickly turned to despair as out of hyperspace behind the lead aggressor arrived two more! I had only just been able to tech up and get Thrawn and they have **3** cap ships, and they bought on a fourth after I destoryed one! Yet their ships and upgrades are supposed to be expensive too. Needless to say I had lost two of my mines by then, one i go back but they did this all on ONE FRIGGIN MINE! I can't contain my anger with this game anymore. Its shelved until PG fix this crap and I will vote with my wallet and not buy any my PG guff again. If crime pays then I guess its okay for me to resort to crime too and pirate any future PG releases and save me paying for buggy and unbalanced software, especially when its inferior to some of the mods getting around! Boo to you PG.
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Old 11-05-2006, 08:52 PM   #45
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I have played a SP GC game as the rebels for quite a while now. I have yet to see a hypervelocity gun fire at my ships. Just an observation.

I also have a new concern with the rogue squadron disappearing bug. What are you supposed to do when the Empire builds the Death Star? Without Rogue squadron the rebs have no way of destroying the DS unless the consortium uses IG88 to do it.

BTW, in my GC game the empire AI has started building the Death Star twice now and cancelled production after a few seconds each time. WTH? The only nice thing about them stopping production from my perspective is the fact that my Rogue squadron disappeared from the game a long time ago and I would have no way of destroying the DS.


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Old 11-05-2006, 10:35 PM   #46
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I might just make a small clarrification too; its not simply the ZC that is the issue. I encounter the same issue (unreal income) in skirmish with any faction on medium (I havent dared play Hard after trying Med), it's just that due to the superiority of the ZC units that this effect is magnified. I know its something of an exploit if your able to grab all of the mines early in the game and have complete dominance, but rather than give the computer an improper income just to compete, fix the AI so it goes after mines and defends them rather than what is nothing more than cheating.
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Old 11-06-2006, 12:43 PM   #47
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btw. I made a threat concerning the bugs of FOC here
They should be fixed as well...
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Old 11-06-2006, 12:51 PM   #48
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more GC scenarios...


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Old 11-06-2006, 02:14 PM   #49
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Thanks for these suggestions, I will definitely have our designers check this out


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Old 11-06-2006, 04:02 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreng
more GC scenarios...
We can make our own really easily by modding one of the ones already there. I happen to play the game with my modded GC's most of the time so I could help you if you want.

What additional kinds of GC would you like?


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Old 11-06-2006, 04:11 PM   #51
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Actually I think that the center of the problem is not FoC's ZC but the way E@W handles income for AIs, which does not depend on any income generating facility like the players, in other words, CHEATED INCOME. As we know it the computer seems to be able to bring in ships like they are free, and have little to no production time sometimes.

Now being Imps or Rebels this might be ok, as even the rebels have a somewhat rigid line of terratory, and both of them have a relatively balanced space force with similar cost. So even as the income is cheated, things can be managed due to population cap and what not. Even then many players have faced legions of speceforce not possable by ordinary means of production.

The ZC however is different in that they have more powerful ships, which is being balanced by their COST. Now add this to the computer's way of generating income this can be downright wicked. The ZC brings the problem to surface, rather than being the cause of the problem.

I mean, in skirmish where the corruption money is hardly in effect the ZC is still vastly more powerful in the hands of the AI dur to their INCOME more than anything else, as shown by the examples above. My own experiance is only similar, where the computer brings in a constant stream of ships despite one destroyed depot which is sometimes even destroyed.

I don't think nerfing ZC is the solution. ZC's design is supposed to be a bit more powerful ship to ship, being more elite in terms of individual.
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Old 11-06-2006, 06:29 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rust_Lord
Its shelved until PG fix this crap.
I just did the same thing :P. Bought FoC today, played a GC as the Rebels, got majorly annoyed with the huge amounts of bugs and the seriously FUBARed Zann special abilities. I didn't even finish the game, I quit with just 5 planets left to capture. Removed the disc from the drive, put it back into the box and put it on a shelf until a patch is released.

Some things I noticed from playing that one single GC are:
No matter how fast I remove corruption from my planets, Zann corrupts them even faster. A game of cat and mouse ensues after a while.
I owned the world of Dathomir right from the start. Zann corrupted it and somehow put a fleet in orbit without the game asking if I wanted to fight it (as I had a station at level 5 + a defence fleet in orbit). I moved an assault fleet into position to attack the enemy fleet and ended up fighting the enemy fleet plus my own level 5 station.
Zann level 4-5 stations are massively over powered compared to Rebel and Imperial stations.
Auto resolve is MAJORLY f'ed up. I had one situation where I took a fleet against a level 4 Zann station, auto resolved and has zero losses. Took the same fleet against a level 5 Zann station and lost half my fleet (which was massive btw).
Rebels can't get tech for any level 5 items (B-wing and MC30), I assume this is down to the devs forgetting that they programmed Rebels not to go past level 4 in the original game and not changing it for FoC.
I stole some tech for some ground unit but was never able to build it. I hate ground combat so it didn't really matter to me, but still it should be there.
The Empire did absolutely nothing until the very end. I left a few worlds on their border unguarded whle chasing down Zann which they stole.
The Ai for the sides is totally out of whack. I was playing on Easy (as is tradition with a new game, play on easy so you can get the feel then yank it up to hard) and the Empire still had the original game Ai for easy so they didn't build anything bigger than a Victory class. Zann on the other hand built everything and in large numbers. I was regularly fending off his best stuff. I think the only reason the Empire Ai survived the battle was because I took the fight to Zann right from the word go.
Sabotage..........god I hate sabotage. It was going off constantly, and most of the time it was 4 or more going off at once. No human can set off more than 1 at the same time in two different places on a map so the Ai shouldn't be able to either. Plus it is really really pathetic. It does nothing to me other than be an annoying feature. The Ai doesn't use it as a softening up job just before an invasion, it just does it randomly around the map to piss me off.
Win conditions are f'ed up. I killed Zann around 13 times total. Lord knows how many times I killed the rest of his crew. I also killed the Emperor 4 times. As I thought I wasn't winning due to killing them in auto-resolve, I actually fought 1 of the battles against the Emperor. I caught him at Kuat cruising around in a Tartan. Went on the map, the pilot guy says that this is an opportunity we can't miss to take out the Emperor and win.....kill the Emperor.......nothing happens. I never captured all the planets to find out if that was how I was supposed to win as I quit after realising that Zann could cheat.
Zann cheats :P. I cornered his organisations on their last 2 worlds up in the top corner of the map. There was zero way for him to escape...........then suddenly he has control of one of my heavily fortified worlds in the centre of the map. WTF!? There was nothing saying the world was being taken, nothing about whether I wanted to auto-resolve the battle or anything. The world had a level 5 station and fleet, plus was defended on the ground too (so no sneaky raids). There wasn't even any corruption left on the map, other than the 2 worlds I had trapped the ZC on, so he couldn't have snuck there via the corruption lines.

Edit:
Some things people have said needs fixing that I don't think need fixing......the militia rebellion and the strengths of the Zann space units. Militia rebellion is just an annoyance. While I wish there was some way to prevent it, in the end it doesn't do anything but bug me. None of the worlds that Zann kicked me off were anywhere near his stuff for him to take. Plus I just took them back in a split second anyway.
Space unit balance is just about right. Granted level 4 and 5 Zann stations are way too powerful compared to Rebel and Imperial ones, but that is a station and not a unit. I could fend Zann off quite happily with limited forces, no matter what he threw at me. Things got bigger and bigger and I just had to develop new tricks to deal with them. I only lost a world to an invasion once and that was just bad timing (as I had taken some of the world defence to bolster an assault fleet moving to take one of his worlds :P).
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Old 11-06-2006, 08:34 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rust_Lord
Its shelved until PG fix this crap.
I was really psyched to go out and buy this game on the weekend, but posts like that made me hold off. I think it's good this community tells it like it is, a great deal of this feedback seems sincere rather than normal forum whining.

I guess it's just disappointing that, at the end of the day, this expansion was seriously rushed.

I may not end up buying FoC for a long time, if it lacks so much polish.


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Old 11-06-2006, 08:47 PM   #54
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I don't think it's going to take too too long for PG to get a patch out >_> a few weeks, a month or two maybe at high.


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Old 11-06-2006, 09:28 PM   #55
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Wink I feel ya, but... It is not broken

Yeah there are some bugs in the story campaign like the rebel tech 5 issue. That and other little nicks and nacks are going to be patched as stated in the Petro forums.

However, some of the things listed here and by other players like the corruption getting on their nerves etc.. are actual game functions(and some are beneficial in ways) and are not going to change.

There is no way the game was rushed and that becomes apparent in the story campaign. This is a game of MANY favors like a neoploitian ice cream sandwich. It so happens that the favorite flavor of the many is space multiplayer from the Imps or Rebs side. It happens that flavor needs a separate amount and different balance that singleplayer vs the AI. It is also understandable that seeing your side get bested by the new faction is annoying. The other aspect of the game(ie other flavors) are superb. GC with 3 factions with 55 planets can't be touched it rocks!

However, even with some tweaks that "are" coming like toning down the Starvipers a bit and making the cost of the BM upgrades MUCH more expensive for the ZC, there is still going to be a LARGE amount of that guerilla warfare(ie. sabtoage, corruption) to deal with because both the rebels and the ZC have that as one of their strengths.

The game is FAR from broke in GC and land skirmish FAR. Of course I enjoy these flavors and have spent tons of time since the release consuming as much of the good thing as possible.


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Old 11-06-2006, 09:38 PM   #56
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The fact that many sound files are incorrect, the Consortium can build capital ships anywhere in certain modes, Rebel tech glitch, etc. These are symptoms of a larger problem: rushed game design.

Also, not having many bugs in a short campaign mode - the most linear of all the modes - further demonstrates that this is a lack of polish.

I have no doubt PG could fix these, but if they were rushed to a quick deadline these sloppy mistakes get made. (KOTOR II, anyone?)

The idea that that this complaining is because people think the Consortium shouldn't be a powerful faction is a pretty shallow one IMO.


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Old 11-06-2006, 11:15 PM   #57
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Post I don't think you have FOC

Truthfully, you sound like you don't have the game dude, so I understand some of the uninformed things you are saying. No worries.

In terms of looking at the campaign(of course you would need to have the game to notice these things), the "overal" polish "is" there nick nacks aside. Some of those cut scenes in and in-between missions show it as well as how well the single player GC and land skirmish actually play out.

Actually the two things you mentioned are basically syntax errors that are easy to fix with notepad and have already been changed by one of the guys in the modders forum. Ok, so they were sloppy yadda yadda

I never said nor implied that the only complaints were because of the ZC's power. However, all you have to do is open your eyes and read the comments where many regular imp and reb players have stated that the ZC should be the weakest of all, it is there in the public domain.


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Old 11-07-2006, 12:48 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAGEKING-PG
Thanks for these suggestions, I will definitely have our designers check this out
Thanks SageKing its good to know PG is on top of it, and that you guys are also listening to all the feedback, positive and negative. I will admit I can be a hard and nasty jerk sometimes, and while generally very passive when I go off I can make Palpatine look like a school girl BUT I know that this game is very good and is not far from being perfect AND can be easily fixed. After all the hard work and great ideas that went into this game I do not want to see it flop or not satisfy its legion of fans....so never take my rages personal. Im just frustrated that some fairly obvious issues werent spotted before.

As I stated today in the consortium heroes thread I dont have a problem with ZC having the nastiest stuff as long as its outnumbered and expensive. My main gripe is with skirmish but I can see how some people feel about GC. I have only played a short campaign and would really need to play a longer one to really see what people are experiencing but I would hope that the funky way the ZC operates is not totally abandoned. Thats the heart and soul of the faction.
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Old 11-07-2006, 04:14 AM   #59
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Post A little omission

Ok, found a bug Not, just an omission.

I was adding Mandalorian Bio-Commandos to the ZC and I remembered that when I corrupted Mon Calamari and took the slavery option no slaves became avaliable like on other planets like the Twei'lks etc.

I use the special corruption units file to add my stuff and saw there is NO entry for Mon Calamari slaves eventhough you pay for slavery option in game. So of course I just added them in, because their is an indigenous model for them in the game already.

Another oversite by the Petro team, they should all be drawn and quarted


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Old 11-07-2006, 04:18 AM   #60
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If there is a wide variety of small bugs in any area of the game I would say that's a lack of polish. Whether or not it can be fixed by the user is irrelevant.

I said that the campaign is polished by all reports, however this is something that would be tested first, and can be tested far more quickly. It is easier to control than a fully open scenario (GC) after all. It's the multiplayer, and more 'minor' modes - skirmish - that have been the subject of gripes by large sections of the community.

The fact that small, easily fixed bugs make it through to retail is a lack of testing, almost always due to time constraints. I honestly don't think petro are sloppy; rather they were rushed. You don't see these sort of things en masse in a Blizzard game, because they always delay release until they are certain of quality. Maybe petro don't have this luxury yet, I don't know.

All up, Petro are very good in working with the community, and they'll fix up these things fairly soon. I'll just hold off buying FoC until this is done, so I can play a finalised product.

EDIT: The above is kinda OT, sorry guys. In other news, one of the devs over at the Petroglyph Forums (Delphi) has said the patch notes will be coming "in the next week or so".



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Old 11-07-2006, 10:39 AM   #61
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Hard to take a person seriously about something they don't have any personal experience with and only read about, but they know all about it, yeah right ok. When you get the game make sure to report all the little bugs you read about here


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Old 11-07-2006, 10:45 AM   #62
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good idea.


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Old 11-07-2006, 02:53 PM   #63
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The campaign itself is fine and rarely glitchy (except for that one part but fortunately I did not get the glitch as I play it)

Many of the mistakes are simple xml stuff.

I think the only true big mistake is the whole tech-up problem with Rebel, but no doubt it would be fixed in the patch.

And, we all know that the whole auto-resolve thing is really unreliable and random, so its kinda meaningless to whine about it. I mean, if you want some assurance just throw the game on fast and let your whole fleet rush the target, you will probably do better than auto-resolve most of the time if you have a big fleet.
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Old 11-08-2006, 12:01 PM   #64
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The AI doesnt build any turbolaser tower or shields would be nice if the will so conquering a planet will be more of a challenge


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Old 11-08-2006, 03:37 PM   #65
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well to be onest. i like all factions, and ssd'd arnt that tough, the lusankya was taken out by a couple of imp star deuces and some freighters........... to be onest as long as you compile a force to cover all angles youll live. for instance the fighters and bombers, just send lots of tartans, you may loose them against there cap ships but then you jump in yours. as far as i c it, you have to make some sacrifices and make sure you have a strong force covering all posible oponnent compositions


thats my view but flame me if you feel you need to

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Old 11-08-2006, 06:41 PM   #66
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Now my rage has settled a few other things to point out for PG:
* I hear they are already going to tone down the StarViper. Good. Its faster and more manueverable than an Interceptor, tougher than an Xwing, and has a nasty special ability. They are tough enough to withstand a pass by a corvette whereas other starfighters get shredded.
*I would SERIOUSLY be looking at the cost of Keldabe capital ship. They seem a tad cheap and need to be more expensive. Two of these drained the shields on a lvl 4/5 station in mere seconds and they have more weaponry than either and ISD or MC (4 TL, 2 IC, a special weapon an mass driver), with a backup engine hardpoint. These ships are simply awesome. Should be about 6K in skirmish.
*Before I went on strike I played origins of corruption GC. When i played as the Empire I captured a planet off the ZC and when it returned to the galactic screen my two units (Fett and Emperor) who participated in the battle were no longer visible or selectable, nor did the planet change from ZC control to Empire control. I loaded a save game and replayed the mission and I received 2 Fetts! (Got a screenshot of it) However once the battle was over the Fett clone disappeared.
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Old 11-09-2006, 09:54 AM   #67
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ok i just noticed something. vaders ssd doesnt take up unit pop, is that ment to happen? also when he is in ground combat he takes up 2 spaces, where as the emporer and other heros take 1, is this a bug or is it suppose to happen? and has anyone else noticed this?
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Old 11-09-2006, 06:07 PM   #68
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in the planets where bribe? (dunno the name in english) the one who dont allow to produce garrison units well the space station of the consortium didnt produce fighters the ISD's didnt produce TIEs....dunno if its intended btw the juggernaut is pretty weak a misile tower of the consortium can kill a juggernaut even when the point laser defense systems are activated...so is useless


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Old 11-09-2006, 06:34 PM   #69
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I've noticed my units have a habit of getting stuck at points. For example in GC on Bothawai, Yoda was destroying a Consortium bunker but after destroying it, would not move. He was stuck in that spot. Then last night the same thing happened in Skirmish on Felucia. The water by the imperial base, Obi-Wan got stuck. Luckily I was able to land a gallofree near him and airlift him out. But then yoda did the same thing, and I mistakenly sent in Garm and they BOTH got stuck.

This happened in EAW as well when Vader was by a buildpad.
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Old 11-09-2006, 07:14 PM   #70
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Not a bug, and not even sure is possible to "patch" into the game, but veterancy to units.

Feel free to read up on my 1.06 recommendation

http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?t=168137
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Old 11-09-2006, 07:30 PM   #71
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Grr... 30 second wait but still posted.

*edit deleted double post*
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Old 11-09-2006, 07:35 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yesh
I've noticed my units have a habit of getting stuck at points.
Yes I have noticed on some maps, not only units, but whole groups of the local population are stuck even though their animation has them running. I cant remember which maps now but this during Origins of Corruption GC.
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Old 11-09-2006, 08:34 PM   #73
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I take back my earlier comment about never seeing the hypervolcity gun in a GC game. I attacked Corellia and it was used against me.


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Old 11-10-2006, 07:51 AM   #74
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I'm not sure if this was a bug, but I'm sick of this business when you clear corruption from a world and destroys your space station and all structures. That was silly.

And I'd like some E-Wings and K-Wings - X-Wings get eaten alive by the hundereds of new imperial fighters and the B-Wings are virtually useless. I'm still using Y-Wings because at least they cost less.

Oh yeah, and I would like an end to the tired old "10 ISDs" invasion fleets that the Empire keep pulling. After half an hour of play in GC, Yavin 4 was attacked by a fleet that was made upf of Piett's and Thrawn's ISDs, the Arc Hammer and 8 vanilla ISDs AT THE SAME TIME. Come on petro, this is supposed to be a game, i.e. there is some chance of winning......

Bleh, I think I'll go off and play Dark Crusade. At least Relic are familiar with the concept of 'balance'.
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Old 11-10-2006, 09:33 AM   #75
ImpElite
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Wowee, I hope the patch is released on the 21st or soon after.

BTW welcome to the forums, TearsOfIsha!


ex-UEAW Mod Team Mapper.


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Old 11-10-2006, 02:04 PM   #76
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Originally Posted by ImpElite
Wowee, I hope the patch is released on the 21st or soon after.

BTW welcome to the forums, TearsOfIsha!
Thank you, hello to you
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Old 11-10-2006, 02:18 PM   #77
wedge2211
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Originally Posted by TearsOfIsha
I'm not sure if this was a bug, but I'm sick of this business when you clear corruption from a world and destroys your space station and all structures. That was silly.
The game manual does mention that if you remove corruption on a world where the Consortium has corrupted the militia, the world will revolt and become neutral. Seems like a funny thing to happen with 100% certainty to me (if you have a full garrison on the planet you'd think you could have some chance to put down a rebellion), but it's an interesting game mechanic. Especially since the Rebels and Imperials do derive some benefit from corruption...


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Old 11-10-2006, 04:07 PM   #78
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The game manual does mention that if you remove corruption on a world where the Consortium has corrupted the militia, the world will revolt and become neutral. Seems like a funny thing to happen with 100% certainty to me (if you have a full garrison on the planet you'd think you could have some chance to put down a rebellion), but it's an interesting game mechanic. Especially since the Rebels and Imperials do derive some benefit from corruption...
A full garrison? How does 3 companies of T-4Bs, Torpedo Artillery, Hovertanks, Infiltrators, Troops and T-47s, plus Luke, Yoda and Garm Bel Iblis grab you?

It's not 'interesting', it's blatant cheating. Perhaps next the Rebels get the ability to land full armies in raids? Give me a break.

Oh yeah, and another thing which could do with fixing for the next patch - lets have a proper "enemy fleet approaching" message. EaW's one was fine. I'm sick of hearing about the evil ysalamiri are coming to lay the smackdown on my underpowered fleets. Some people may think that the glitch is funny - I personally think it was amateurish. The testing team must have been off sick when this thing was rushed out the door.
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Old 11-12-2006, 06:03 AM   #79
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not sure if this is a bug or "feature", but in multiplayer GC when i invade some worlds i won't start with any population flags. so my pop is 1/0, and only expandable if i landed troopers. and it's next to impossible to conquer the world if the enemy rushes you. i definitely recall it happening on Kamino in the map Clusters when i was empire.
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Old 11-12-2006, 03:18 PM   #80
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I know this is old news, but the expansion makes it even worse, so could SOMETHING be done to make the ISD less worthless? A second shield generator hardpoint maybe, one for each tower?
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