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Old 12-15-2006, 05:02 AM   #41
Darth Avlectus
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WOW!

I'm away for just a few days and I get all sorts of intriguing ideas from people! You all seem to have GREAT Ideas. IMO--keep this up and it may get some kind of attention.

I don't have much--or rather I have way too many to list.
some general ideas:

Like Egyptian?
Cow-folk?
South American?

What seems to be most prominant (by frequency of being brought up) is a woman character.
How about something more of oriental like (chun li, mai shiranui, kanu untyou, DOA girls, samurai spirits--the sort of french maid ninja chick)? Maybe like that girl on power stone?

I thin the new set of comics with that darth krayt isn't too bad--that darth nihl sort of remids me of Marylin Manson...
Maybe one like a rockstar--with a voice over from the one(s) whom is being imitated after? I.E.

Rob Zombie, Cradle of Filth, Deicide, OZZY (that'd be more hilarious than scary), Alice Cooper, Quiet Riot & Twisted Sister (Hey, shut up!--I like hair bands too), ICP, Iron Maiden, mighty mighty bosstones, cannibal corpse, dimmu borgir... Just something to play with in your little meatbag heads...
Or a pro wrestler like undertaker.

At any rate--I like this...KEEP IT UP!


And I have just a little refutation to anyone who believes all sith should have red lightsabers only;
What of Exar Kun? He invented the double bladed lightsaber and it was blue let us not forget.
Before K1, revan had both a red and a purple saber--the purple one was lost-- so how about that?
What of the groups of sith on K1 you would occasionally run into that happened to have purple blades?
What about the empire's executioner and Vader's trusted but lesser known student Hethrir--he weilded a silver lightsaber?
Darth Bane, a definite sith--came up with the philosophy that there shall be no more/less than 2 sith: one to embody the power, another to crave it-- weilded a purple lightsaber didn't he?
The human incarnation of Vader--on ROTS video game if you play as anakin, YOU actually win and leave a slain Obi Wan on the platform to decend the lava fall and go to get an alternate ending that rewrites history-- were that the case or had the 'theiving Kenobi' kept his paws off of skywalker's blue saber in the actual events that unfolded, it is forseeable that Vader would have kept the blue saber and left it unaltered. What about that?

I'm just saying; while red is the most prominent color, it may not always be the color of choice fitting a particular sith or other darksider that may or may not be derived from the sith.

The entirety of your ideas is in the works for some truly great concepts I think. Try to elaborate a little more. Some of you want some completely original Ideas.

I know this is a bit of an oxymoron, but did anybody else think there should be (more) sith who are more for using sith teachings for constructive and unselfish purposes, but maybe tragically misunderstood? (I guess this is stabbing at the jedi and showing possible arrogance and evil on their side in a way.) For example, thjough it is more of a grey area, ones who believe in true love? I mean, that was "basically" Anakin's reason for becoming Vader and also the reason he left vader to don Anakin Skywalker for the last time.

I love all you meatbags--I mean fellow LFers or somesuch-- out there. Good work!
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Old 12-15-2006, 05:41 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTA:SWcity
Before K1, revan had both a red and a purple saber--the purple one was lost-- so how about that?
If you're referring to that apparition in the Tomb of Ludo Kreesh from TSL, that's, IMO, not a reliable proof. Remember the visions in K1 - Revan had only one lightsaber and it was red.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTA:SWcity
What of the groups of sith on K1 you would occasionally run into that happened to have purple blades?
Hmmmm, a programmer's mistake?

As for Exar Kun and Darth Bane, I honestly don't know, but I'll check to be sure.

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Old 12-15-2006, 06:04 AM   #43
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I was just simply making a point.

Programmres mistake I'd honestly say 50/50 chance.
Maybe the grunts were a little disgruntled?
With all that lore abou Windu I'd say it's possible either way.

Hmm, I heard something on these forums that the Rev had a purple one that he lost. Eh. No matter.

Vader is just a theorizing based upon the Anakin ending in the ROTS game. I'll admit that much. Anakin/Vader seems like somebody who'd keep it.

As for Bane, I'm slowly finding out more and more. I see in the Visual guide book him with purple. Most accounts--all in fact--have been Bane/purple that I have ever seen. I probably don't know any more than you. Somehow I just have that feeling; but I will gladly abdicate to you if you have some solid evidence that he's a red. I believe there is some novel on him and his story that was supposed to have been published earlier (april-may) this year?

Exar is definitely blue all the way around--he only had a single sided blue at first, but then made his double bladed (his last), with which he used to anihlate his former master and many others. I can't find anything to the contrary on color. Again, if at any point AFTER he turned to the dark side he had a red, you happen to find a solid article, do show us all, won't you?

Back to the matter at hand:
What of your sith lord development? I'm here if you need ideas.
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Old 12-15-2006, 03:50 PM   #44
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Well, pure force battle would not be fun in a playability point of view. Well, cause some players would prefer non attacking force powers during their game play and then when they come to the end they would get totally neutered by the event.

But ass a prosessing force ghost horde would be fun.

And well, the "beauty and the beast" combo is a bit cliche, I would just let the lady sithlord do the job on her own, with a nice3 pair of cortosis blade.

Yes, I still think a sithlord whose llife is maintained by a huge support cable is fun(maybe connected to a huge walking machine), it is basically an ancient version of the "mroe machine than man" idea, but obviously bulkier. Would be nice if you can redempt her also, if only for parody.

As for the "dead or alive" girl suggestion, I think it would look great. Though I think a sith in swimsuit is not exactly too good to the story? Dancing girl outfit, on the other hand...
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Old 12-15-2006, 04:05 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by Henz
I'd have the girl mentioned before. Who's a manipulating bitch. A more stereotypical sith guy who you think is running stuff (plot twist - OMGZ it's the girl whos da boss!!1!!11) who is a mior villain somewhen. And a big sith beast that prvides your physical violence.
Yes, she'd be a femme fatale, who appears to always just hide behind the big bosses without revealing that she's really the one running the show. Imagine how you have a few Sith lords early on, and one appears to be the top dog. Yet you meet him and kill him fairly early in the game, only to see his presumed apprentice take over as dark lord, and now he has his "master's girl" hanging at his side. And it's not until much, much later in the game that you find out that they were both just muscle to her manipulations. Sort of like a young but very beautiful Kreia, if you will...

I keep thinking "succubus", when I think of this character


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Old 12-15-2006, 04:05 PM   #46
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How about Force visions of past and even future heroes and villians? Palpatine is meant to be some malevolent Sith ghost or something right? After the Emperor was killed the thing tried for young Anakin. Was he around back then?
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Old 12-15-2006, 05:42 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jediphile
Yes, she'd be a femme fatale, who appears to always just hide behind the big bosses without revealing that she's really the one running the show. Imagine how you have a few Sith lords early on, and one appears to be the top dog. Yet you meet him and kill him fairly early in the game, only to see his presumed apprentice take over as dark lord, and now he has his "master's girl" hanging at his side. And it's not until much, much later in the game that you find out that they were both just muscle to her manipulations. Sort of like a young but very beautiful Kreia, if you will...

I keep thinking "succubus", when I think of this character
Kreia was never sexy and she would need to have that manipulative side but also could use her looks to manipulate people to do what she wanted... with the computer image based on Kate Beckingsale



"Love is the only reality and it is not a mere sentiment. It is the ultimate truth that lies at the heart of creation." - Rabindranath Tagore

"Many a doctrine is like a window pane. We see truth through it but it divides us from truth." - Kahlil Gibran
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Old 12-18-2006, 09:50 PM   #48
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Well, in my old KotOR III story that I ditched: http://lucasforums.com/showthread.php?t=171405

I had a character called Darth Zithra, except I killed her off in the background.

However, she is similar to the type of character you fellas' were talking about. This is what I wrote:

The group also learns a bit about the ‘True Sith’ from the information acquired at the warehouse. It turns out indeed that the ‘True Sith’ are the remnants of Ludo Kressh’s fleet, an Ancient Sith Lord of the Great Hyperspace War era.

Long ago, his remnants fled into un-chartered space. The remnants vowed to return to Republic space and wage war against the Republic and the Jedi Order in an attempt to avenge the deaths of their brethren and the fall of their once great Empire by crushing their long time arch-rivals, once they were strong enough again.

But like all Sith, their secluded rebuilding phase in the unknown regions soon developed into a massive civil war, such is the way of the Sith. You would assume that the civil war would inevitably cause the complete destruction of their old Empire, but no.

This is because a female Sith Lord of great power, beauty and charisma, known as Darth Zithra, discovered the technique to do exactly the same thing as Darth Sion did, and keep her body alive and intact for a long time.

She, like Sion, could hold her body together by sheer force of will and the power of hatred, channeled through the dark side. Her hatred was directed at the Republic and the Jedi, for defeating the Empire that she was born into during the Great Hyperspace War.

But Zithra was different than most Sith. She was set on uniting the fallen Sith factions that had divided amongst themselves in the massive civil war they had against each other, so she returned from the Trayus Academy at Malachor V (where she left ancient Sith tablets and scrolls detailing what happened to her armada to the Sith students who remained at the Trayus Academy and learned from the teachings she left behind) and the knowledge that Sion discovered to learn how to keep his body together.

Sion was the only other Sith Lord who could achieve Zithra’s ability, as the technique requires the individual to have a very strong hatred and affinity to the dark side of the Force, something which most great Sith have, but not to the extent of Sion and Zithra’s hatred. That is why you don’t see hundreds of Sion’s amongst the Sith.

One by one, she found and united the Sith factions who were fighting against each other, but she could never achieve true unity, as each time the Sith looked to rebuild, all their work collapsed before them as they continued to erupt into civil wars, because that is in the nature of their teachings.

So for centuries they were caught between not being completely wiped out, but also not being strong enough to launch an assault upon the Jedi Order and the Old Republic, who kept getting much stronger and stronger, with each passing century.

Darth Zithra remained alive for all this time (because the technique makes her immortal, and her will is not as easy to break as Sion’s) and she remained as the Dark Lord of the Sith for centuries, but she could not bring true union among the divided Sith.

The civil wars continued to occur in the unknown regions, without the Jedi Order or the Old Republic ever finding out, but that all changed, as when the students at the Trayus Academy wiped each other out, they left traces, beacons of their Empire, clues of their continuing existence to this day, at Malachor V, which Revan would discover many years later.

Zithra was centuries old. She was still the Dark Lord of the ‘True Sith’ and obviously she lost her beauty long ago. The ‘True Sith’ Empire was in disarray, it was on the verge of collapse, until finally, she managed to unite what little was left of the Sith, and show them that the reason why their ancestors came into the unknown regions in the first place was to unite, rebuild and return to Republic space to crush the Jedi Order and the Republic.

She also showed the remaining Sith how their own teachings have led to the downfall of their previous Empires, that when fighting against an enemy such as the Republic and the Jedi Order, they should all be united by their hatred against them and deal with them first, and only after once their enemies are gone they should fight against each other, not like the old ways, where they used to do both at the same time.

In other words, she says that the Sith should leave each other alone and work together to defeat the Republic and the Jedi Order, not divide and fight each other at the same time whilst they’re fighting a great, historical enemy. Zithra’s strong hatred was directed towards the Republic and the Jedi Order, as you can imagine.

So they united, and began rebuilding their Empire together, slowly increasing in academies, numbers, resources and so on. At the time, the Old Republic and the Jedi Order were very strong and we’re in a fantastic state, and this is when a large society of elite neo-crusading warriors known as the Mandalorians were conquering outer-rim worlds not under the jurisdiction of the Republic over the years.

Darth Zithra knew that her united Empire would need to be strong in order to defeat the very powerful Republic and Jedi Order, but she couldn’t wait for her own Empire to rebuild over many years. Heck, they might split up again.

She wanted revenge badly, but she wanted the Republic and the Jedi Order weakened, so she went exploring the deep regions of space, to look for allies that could possibly help her weaken the Republic and the Jedi Order.

At the time, the Mandalorians were looking for someone worthy to fight. They were kicking everybody’s ass, and were looking for a decent challenge. Zithra came to the Mandalorians, and at first, they tried to kill her, but couldn’t because she was very powerful and she could not die. She would not go away, so the Mandalorians were forced to hear what she had to say.

She was impressed by the size and strength of the Mandalorian armada, and she asked the Mandalorians if they were interested in fighting against the Republic and the Jedi Order. She said to them that they were very strong factions and were worthy of their attention and skill in battle.

She said that fighting against such a great enemy would give the Mandalorians all the honour and glory that they could ever imagine. It would be a battle that would be remembered forever. In exchange for hordes of gold, honour and glory, Zithra wanted the Mandalorians to attack the Republic and the Jedi Order for them.

They agreed to this of course, excited by the promise of a great battle worthy of their skill and attention, so when Zithra told the Mandalorians where to find the Republic, they departed deep outer-rim space, and began attacking Republic worlds, in an attempt to lure the Republic into battle, which succeeded, resulting in the beginning of the Mandalorian Wars.

This not only weakened the Republic and the Jedi Order, but it gave the ‘True Sith’ more time to rebuild their Empire behind the scenes. And to the unexpected delight of the ‘True Sith’, the Jedi Civil War occurred, which they did not intend to happen.

So, they just sat back and let their enemies fight it out against each other, further weakening the Republic and the Jedi Order and allowing them even more time to build up an Empire that would stomp all over any measly resistance left after the end of the Jedi Civil War.

But, for some reason, the ‘True Sith’ never attacked the Republic and the Jedi Order after the Jedi Civil War. They somehow managed to end up in another civil war again, but how they managed to end up in another civil war again is not addressed in the data that is found by the group.

This is why they never attacked anyone in KotOR II, when all their enemies were in a weak, vulnerable state. Because they were too busy fighting each other again. The data does reveal though that Darth Zithra was defeated by her apprentice Lord Astaroth during the Jedi Civil War, and he became the new Dark Lord of the ‘True Sith’.

Maybe he stuffed up Zithra’s plans and restarted a massive civil war amongst the ‘True Sith’. Either way, Astaroth defeated Zithra. He threw her into an abandoned torture chamber that was filled with explosives, enclosed her in and set the charges off, blowing her body up into pieces.

To ensure her permanent end, he then scavenged her scattered, charred body parts from the wreckage, and threw them into the depths of a volcano, to melt and completely destroy her physical body, thus killing her and ensuring she will not put her body back together ever again, because she no longer has a body!

All this was written by a scholar/historian from Zithra’s Empire, who wrote scrolls telling the story about the ‘True Sith’ Empire, so they could be passed on and read by the younger students at their academies for educational purposes.


Sounds alright eh? Meh, something like that, except if I kept Zithra alive and we saw her, she'd probably look something like Kreia, not like Bastila or anything.


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Old 12-19-2006, 10:26 AM   #49
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i wouldn't mind if KOTOR3 took place during the times of the Jedi vs. Sith comics and you have to fight Darth Bane and Zannah.
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Old 12-20-2006, 06:08 AM   #50
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I had a funny idea for who the next Sith Lord should be, but I think it might fall under the category of "ridiculouse", so bear with me.

I think the next villian in KotOR III should be a Sith Lord impersonating Darth Revan. The player should be prompted to make a decision early on if whether Revan was male or female, and then the fake Revan is adjusted accordingly. And then the big shocking revelation scene reveals that your life long Jedi Master / Mentor is actually Revan, and the opposite gender of what you chose. (That last idea is just a little mischief on my part to mess with people who refuse to play Revan as anything but one gender, then see their reaction. )
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Old 12-20-2006, 11:03 AM   #51
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Ridiculous Sith Lord?

I'll just say it once and then drop it: Darth JarJar

http://www.atomfilms.com/film/sith_apprentice.jsp



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Old 12-20-2006, 02:16 PM   #52
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There should be more than one sith lord. But one should be a man who was on the light side but then went dark and crazy. mentally insane, like Boc. He can then turn back to the light side, if you convince him.


Savior, conquerer, Hero, Villian... You are all things Revan, and yet you are nothing. In the end you belong to neither the darkness nor the light. You will forever stand alone.
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Old 12-20-2006, 03:09 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by Jediphile
Too funny!

@Sith_Reven, that's an interesting idea, but it wouldn't allow any dialogue with the Sith Lord. Mentally insane people are hard enough to have conversations with, let alone turn to the light side.

For the new villain, I'd like someone who's more of a Thrawn-like character, like InyriForge mentioned, than someone like Palpatine or Vader. I'd love the villain to have elaborate schemes and such, but there was already a Palpatine-esque Sith in KotOR II.

Inyri's post sums up my opinion on this, though.


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Old 12-21-2006, 09:48 AM   #54
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I think that the next sith lord some ancient and foregotten spieces that has never been spoke of in star wars history or something completely unexpected like a wookie.
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Old 12-21-2006, 03:06 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tbl
That will be fun. The final boss battle will be decided in dialog.
I was of course applying that to the idea I posted before: I'd have the girl mentioned before. Who's a manipulating *****. A more stereotypical sith guy who you think is running stuff (plot twist - OMGZ it's the girl whos da boss!!1!!11) who is a minor villain somewhen. And a big sith beast that provides your physical violence.

So in this case... yeah. A final boss you defeat without beating for ages; or, as igyman suggested: a fight with the force.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTA:SWcity
I know this is a bit of an oxymoron, but did anybody else think there should be (more) sith who are more for using sith teachings for constructive and unselfish purposes, but maybe tragically misunderstood? (I guess this is stabbing at the jedi and showing possible arrogance and evil on their side in a way.) For example, thjough it is more of a grey area, ones who believe in true love? I mean, that was "basically" Anakin's reason for becoming Vader and also the reason he left vader to don Anakin Skywalker for the last time.
I also like the idea of more layered and sympathetic Sith. I guess Revan can sort of fit that description. Problem is that even Anakin became the stereotypical sith guy in not a lot of time. What's needed is a more personal relationship, or look into the backstory of the villain. Otherwise they'll just be another sith villain. Most sith characters could have that tragic falling, but we just don't find out.

Last edited by Jae Onasi; 12-21-2006 at 04:36 PM. Reason: removed strong language
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Old 12-22-2006, 12:42 PM   #56
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Maybe the That Sith lord should have a twisted love relationship with the his female apprintes . First he dies some where early on , then you think she's the real deal , and somewhere on the end you fight her . She gets redeemed or killed and the true EVIL being "their child" emerges from the shadow .
Now this kid is truely a Sith on speed , using massive force powers ( thinkin like does crazy scene's in Akira ) . I think that would be truely something else .

OFcourse this might give problems with rating stuff , so make the child very unhumenly evil , he's just using the body as vessel or something .


TIQUILAAAAAAAA
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Old 12-22-2006, 02:05 PM   #57
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Well... how about this for an idea. You play as a mentally unstable jedi with a split-personality. Throughout the story you are trying to destroy your arch enemy, who, unbeknown to you is your split personality. (If you are ls, enemy is ds and so on...)
Thus, the final boss battle is between you and yourself.

DS self - "Mwahahah I've got you now!"
*chops off own arm*
LS self - "YOU LOATHSOME BEAST I SHALL SLAY YOU AND PROTECT THE INNOCENTS OF THE GALAXY!!"
*chops off other arm*
*Party Members mutter about you being a crazed maniac and ask themselves why they wasted their time offering you aid to help you in your suicidal endeavors*

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Old 12-23-2006, 06:21 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terra
Well... how about this for an idea. You play as a mentally unstable jedi with a split-personality. Throughout the story you are trying to destroy your arch enemy, who, unbeknown to you is your split personality. (If you are ls, enemy is ds and so on...)
Thus, the final boss battle is between you and yourself.

DS self - "Mwahahah I've got you now!"
*chops off own arm*
LS self - "YOU LOATHSOME BEAST I SHALL SLAY YOU AND PROTECT THE INNOCENTS OF THE GALAXY!!"
*chops off other arm*
*Party Members mutter about you being a crazed maniac and ask themselves why they wasted their time offering you aid to help you in your suicidal endeavors*
Has someone been watching Fight Club?
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Old 12-23-2006, 08:27 PM   #59
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WHOA! HOLY $***

I didn't think this would still be up in the ranks.

OK. Well, I can't fully respond to everyone but I'll do my best to address as many people as possible.

To humor those guys up there about the women--Awesome! Maybe some kind of ninja chick wearing oriental sort of a qi-pow (did I spell it right?--chinese style dress, though japanese use it too if a bit varied) combat dress? Heh--did someone say succubus? Can you say Morrigan Aensland? That'd be trippy to have some sith creature that does the whole morphing-wings thing even if there is nothig else particularly special. BTW the crystal dwarf (the one where Vader's student Hethrir gets eaten by some anti-force creature named waru at the end) makes reference to succubi and incubi. So there IS some mithical creatures referenced in the SW.

As far as you got, architect, I'm actually surprised that you aren't an author or something--you LOVE to type/write don't you? I liked in general what I saw. LucasArts should consider hiring you as a plot writer or something I guess. Maybe you could write your own book? Excellent work.

Master Kavar , Not at all--this sort of intrigue makes it interesting as a game I think.

During the Jedi Vs Sith comics? That could be one. IMO--I'd sort of like to see how this republic fails and it becomes anarchious...before the next republic rises "that has stood for a thousand years" that sidious eventually takes over. But that idea DOES utilize existing sith lords. And it seems like it is usable enough. Bane always struck me as a darkside version of Mace Windu.
"Bob Bushwhacker's guide: to how to defeat lightsaber form VII." YOU are onto something, definitely.

Convertable characters...I think that's a little too simple. Since I have so much real life experience with meatbags and managing conflicts, the choices in dialogue are kind of a no-brainer for me. Maybe someone else had a hard time--but I can't imagine who.
Maybe if the writers put some effort into it, you know, draw it out with intrigue and really force the player to think philosophically--and it takes place over a number of fights and events. Perhaps you can bring the guy or gal to your side without using the light side? Like you have a loyal follower of DS? I suppose even literally at your disposal if you are as souless and dishonorable as sidious was.

Many of you like the idea of a sith relationship-- why not have master be the woman (still pretty young and attractive) and the student be a young man she is in love with?
C'mon--does nobody like the idea of a hot teacher chick and a young dude? She could have him wrapped around her little finger.

Wookie sith--somehow it seems like a fair idea...if a bit funny. If you can make it serious I'll listen and respond--but I'll rate that borderline, not quite rediculous but could easily be. Darth jarjar? Don't mkae me laugh!

As far as revan being the sympathetic sith...while revan was awesome--shouldn't we try to at least move on a bit? Maybe someone, a bit of a maverick, who followed Revans phillosophies? Someone who is like Revan but, you know, different? Original? There should continue to be reference to the Rev. However, we need to move in a forward direction. A mystical and intrigue type ending of unknown determination is good --in moderation. For example, much as I also love MegaMan X (obviously by my avatar of Zero), Let us not imitate its storyline and its main bad guy, Sigma--which is what writers were beginning to do with sidious. We need to keep the storyline true but keep rolling out with originality so to others will follow (not lead) star wars in brinksmanship and knockoffs!

Evln, sabretooth, why haven't you two posted on this yet? I'd have thought you'd both eat this one up?!?

I love this. I've been away awhile. Keep it up Meatbags!

Happy Holidays.
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Old 12-23-2006, 09:30 PM   #60
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Many of you like the idea of a sith relationship-- why not have master be the woman (still pretty young and attractive) and the student be a young man she is in love with?
C'mon--does nobody like the idea of a hot teacher chick and a young dude? She could have him wrapped around her little finger.
Oh absolutely; it hasn't been done yet in the Old Republic series (or at any other time that I can recall) and might make a refreshing change from the same arch type Sith Lords we've already had. In fact I imagine that female Revan and Malak already had this kind of relationship prior to him betraying her.

Quote:
Wookie sith--somehow it seems like a fair idea...if a bit funny. If you can make it serious I'll listen and respond--but I'll rate that borderline, not quite rediculous but could easily be. Darth jarjar? Don't mkae me laugh!
This won't happen; Lucas has already laid down the law that there isn't to be any more force sensitive wookiees, period. Obsidian wanted Hanharr to be an optional dark Jedi character, but Lucas Arts shut that idea down pretty fast.
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Old 12-23-2006, 09:43 PM   #61
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Yes, she'd be a femme fatale, who appears to always just hide behind the big bosses without revealing that she's really the one running the show. Imagine how you have a few Sith lords early on, and one appears to be the top dog. Yet you meet him and kill him fairly early in the game, only to see his presumed apprentice take over as dark lord, and now he has his "master's girl" hanging at his side. And it's not until much, much later in the game that you find out that they were both just muscle to her manipulations. Sort of like a young but very beautiful Kreia, if you will...

I keep thinking "succubus", when I think of this character
Exactly.... then slap in some sith beast to keep the violence fan happy :P
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Old 12-24-2006, 12:26 AM   #62
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Darth jarjar? Don't mkae me laugh!
Someone's going to have to call an ambulance for me after I beat myself profusely about the head in an attempt to remove that vile image from my brain.


From MST3K's spoof of "Hercules Unchained"--heard as Roman medic soldiers carry off an unconscious Greek Hercules on a 1950's Army green canvas stretcher: "Hi, we're IX-I-I. Did somebody dial IX-I-I?"

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Old 12-24-2006, 12:48 AM   #63
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Someone's going to have to call an ambulance for me after I beat myself profusely about the head in an attempt to remove that vile image from my brain.
Don't hurt yourself too much, or you could end up like him.

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Old 12-24-2006, 12:56 AM   #64
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Darn you, Kavar. I spent a little while in Photoshop working on this.

Jae, you SO asked for it...



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We will be great failures one day, you and I
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Old 12-24-2006, 01:34 AM   #65
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*Jimbo enters thread*

"What did you people do to my wife? She's lying on the floor, curled up in the fetal position, with nasty bruises all over her head. I think she's going to have to spend at least 30 seconds on the Traumatic Brain Injury ward at the hospital...."



From MST3K's spoof of "Hercules Unchained"--heard as Roman medic soldiers carry off an unconscious Greek Hercules on a 1950's Army green canvas stretcher: "Hi, we're IX-I-I. Did somebody dial IX-I-I?"

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Old 12-24-2006, 02:15 AM   #66
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*Jimbo enters thread*

"What did you people do to my wife?
Not as bad as we could do, "Jimbo".



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We will be great failures one day, you and I

Last edited by Emperor Devon; 12-24-2006 at 03:35 AM. Reason: an awful typo
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Old 12-24-2006, 02:53 AM   #67
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Oh, great. Now you made Jimbo go to the hospital with head injuries from beating _his_ head to get the image out.

And we'd better get back on topic before I have to give me a warning.

I don't know about anyone else, but I like my bosses getting progressively harder and their stories making sense with their fights. In TSL, I had a non sequiter with Nihilus being (considerably) weaker than Sion when they had built him up as a planet-size force-sucking monster.


From MST3K's spoof of "Hercules Unchained"--heard as Roman medic soldiers carry off an unconscious Greek Hercules on a 1950's Army green canvas stretcher: "Hi, we're IX-I-I. Did somebody dial IX-I-I?"

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Old 12-24-2006, 03:07 AM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jae Onasi
Oh, great. Now you made Jimbo go to the hospital with head injuries from beating _his_ head to get the image out.
Tell him I have other pics.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jae Onasi
And we'd better get back on topic before I have to give me a warning.
C'mon, Jae! Don't you remember the good ol' days with us and RJM?

(We can still make off-topic comments on the sidelines. )

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jae Onasi
I don't know about anyone else, but I like my bosses getting progressively harder and their stories making sense with their fights. In TSL, I had a non sequiter with Nihilus being (considerably) weaker than Sion when they had built him up as a planet-size force-sucking monster.
But the problem with that is how it fit perfectly with the plot. Nihilus is a planet-draining monster, (in some cut content, he completely pwns Sion when they get into a fight) but the problem with the Exile was that she had nothing he could drain. In fact, quite the opposite. If you give a plant water, it grows. If you set it on fire, it dies; that's what happened with Nihilus. He thought when he consumed the Exile he'd get water, but he ended up getting quite the opposite. It was a totally natural reaction, and wouldn't have fit with the plot if it didn't happen.

(If that doesn't convince you, I have a tweak to make Nihilus much stronger I can send your way. )

I'd love for the KotOR III villain to be a hard nut to crack, but if there are any extenuating and plot-fitting circumstances that make him an easy one, I'd be fine with that.


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We will be great failures one day, you and I
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Old 12-24-2006, 07:52 AM   #69
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I perosnally hope there are seprate bosses for each alingment so if you was dark side youd fight a jedi if you where light youd fight a sith.
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Old 12-25-2006, 02:47 PM   #70
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What if you had a char that's just in it for the money? A third party looking out for himself and does not think of the repercussions... A dopple GO-TO, if you will... Both the good and the evil have thier own agendas, but have to work around the idiot with credits on the brain. If your actions were a decidinf factor before, they may be a little more in depth now... There's more than one way to skin a cat, right? Try tostop him/her by telling them the cons of thier actions. Show them proof... Cripple them physically/mentally/financially... Kill them... The thread of the story as well as the difficulty of the game could change with your choices in a differant way than before... Will you stop them full on putting you at constant risk? Infultrate and coup from the inside? Who knows? I dunno... just throwing it out there... I like the idea of the whole double agent thing... The Watchman char will be stretched to new lenghts.


"I am a follower of the Light, Yes... But I will lead you into the Dark to prove it."

Four more years!!!
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Old 12-25-2006, 04:34 PM   #71
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What if you had a char that's just in it for the money? A third party looking out for himself and does not think of the repercussions... A dopple GO-TO, if you will... Both the good and the evil have thier own agendas, but have to work around the idiot with credits on the brain. If your actions were a decidinf factor before, they may be a little more in depth now... There's more than one way to skin a cat, right? Try tostop him/her by telling them the cons of thier actions. Show them proof... Cripple them physically/mentally/financially... Kill them... The thread of the story as well as the difficulty of the game could change with your choices in a differant way than before... Will you stop them full on putting you at constant risk? Infultrate and coup from the inside? Who knows? I dunno... just throwing it out there... I like the idea of the whole double agent thing... The Watchman char will be stretched to new lenghts.
I do like the idea of some more grounded factors in gameplay. Politics and such. Giving the law a brian was something I suggested somewhere before. Clue them up a bit more. If you're a bad guy, give them at least the dignty to know that.
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Old 12-26-2006, 03:26 PM   #72
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Yeah , the NPC need better AI , its amazing that they don't run away or sense in some way you are a DARK EVIL CHARACTER !!!
Sertenly the more important , power persons : like the chief of police or like that Queen TSL , I was sometimes amazed how easly you could fool them .

Maybe somesort of Coven of Sith Witches would be nice "Enemy" to fight , like ten kreie's in one bunch ( ofcourse not all the same age ! ) .


TIQUILAAAAAAAA
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Old 12-27-2006, 12:39 AM   #73
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All I ask is for the boss (or bosses) to be a traditional human Sith Lord who wants to rule the universe and none of this killing the force or eating everyone from this force Sith. Also I'd like the boss to look around the same age as the PC.

My other idea for a Sith Lord would look like this:

note: I don't actually feel that strongly about Bush, I just couldn't think of anyone else to do. I was just experimenting with Photoshop.
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Old 01-04-2007, 04:49 AM   #74
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AAAAHHHHH! what are you DOING?! I should take you all and chainsaw your asses!

Frankly I doubt bush is smart enough to be hitler. But I don't want this thread to be about bush hating. We all get enough of that from the mocking and patronizing voices and personalities in the P.O.S. brain washer machine we call mass media. But congress on the other hand... I'd say they are all pretty close to being like the trade federation, regardless of alignment. They don't care as long as there's $$$ to be made.

A multitude of bosses that gets progressively harder? Sure. I'm not sexist, but, If it is a woman at the top, why not make it out to be the type of establishment that gives all strong women a bad name: femme-a-nazis

Another angle is the middle aged conniving woman--like traya, but MUUUUUUCH WORSE!

What I'd picture as a sith master woman is a woman in her middle ages like 30s and 40s possibly older. Once attractive, but now is just some cranky old B****!

She would have people like palpatine, nihilus, traya, malak, and exar wrapped around her little finger. And have a flood midless minions.
Someone who-regardless of standing in any establishment-ruled it all.
Has legions of yes men and women.
You may thinkyou know the type of woman I'm talking about but most couldn't even come close to comprehending. It'd take me days to truly explain the women I'm talking about. These are based upon some I have had the un-pleasure of meeting in childhood. My own mother was tough but she warned me about these type of women.

Such vile cruelty. Subversive, the greatest of all the evils, being very subtle about it. It has a similar effect to nihilus' but over time much grander and of greater complexity. Reverse descriminatory. Uses fallacies. Twists and convolutes words inside and out to make them say or not say whatever she wants -or doesn't.

As a girl, shepoked the guard dog woth a stick on purpose and used the whole daddy's girl thing to have it executed.

Uses people. Rubs you the wrong way. Couldn't care less.

Conniving and maniacal.

As a young woman she was a jezzabelle and a schmoozer. A real gold digger.

Steps on people to get ahead. Doesn't give a second thought. Could kill somebody like that. If looks could kill, half the population of earth would be dead already.

Just when you think you couldn't be any more pissed off, she says something to rub you the wrong way as she always does, just to be spiteful and annoying, and yet does it so ellegantly you still can't explode.

As a consellor, belittles you, badgers and browbeats you. Will take your words, and twist them so you sound like a deranged sociopath who needs medication and to be locked up. Semantics are child's play to her--a definite snake in the grass when it comes to "verbal-judo". Not something to be proud of--but it is a powerful tool when utilized a certain way.

As a lawyer, takes your top dollar and still doesn't give a flying $*** about your case.

As a ~snipped~...well, while I don't condone physical violence towards women, but if a ~snipped~ (hint hint for a boss) wants to act, dress, and fight like a man, she shouldn't complain if her face gets smashed in. She should be honored to be getting a man's treatment. Especially if she's like 6'8 and weighs 350lbs and is a lineman on your HS football team--you can't tell it's a she.

As a mother (I'm glad MY mother wasn't like this) She would:

1) Treat children coldly. A child who hurt itself falling down stairs cries and writhes in pain reaching out for her and instead of helping it or seeing if it is okay, she stares unblinkingly at it. Then walks away from it.
2) Instead of defending you and forcing the school to deal with you, affirms their complaints.
3)Based on my friend who lived in a foster home: Even though her husband is a strict and mean (compared to others) former sergent for the marines who has Post Traumatic Stress disorder and an italian with a short hot temper, she will get onto him for not being hard enough on the kids. She'll turn the kids against him and vice versa. Shell encourage one behavior, then complain about it to the dad and have him whoop the kid, then has the nerve to comfort the kid--then tell him that he got what he deserved and that the dad is just mean and that's life.
4) Turns the kid against his friends and vice versa through lies. Wants all the good attention yet shoves everyone away when their own needs surface. Insulting to the kid's friends and his parents.
5) knit pick and nag beyond what is reasonable; is never at fault and can do no wrong, yet everyone else is wrong for the littlest things re;evant or irrelevant. Even if she burnt dinner, it's someone else's fault for not helping enough or making her mad.
6) she is never pleased nor satisfied, uses "honor thy mother and thy father" as an excuse to be abusive.
7) so abrasive and such biting chafing dry sarcasm that you can't tell if she's joking or not.
8) a stepmother who controls the laundry and on a cold day gives the stepchild too little to wear to school and locks the child out of the house to send it off--without a backpack. Says that ot "isn't her kid, isn't her problem!"
9) drives all the girls out of the boy's life, yet teaches her girls to be gold diggers.

Hypocrisy is only the tip of the iceberg.

Preaches tolerance and acceptance, yet is on a warpath to eliminate strong minded people who stand up for themselves.
Has an unrealistic and ofthen times idealistic view of how people should be, yet also changes that all the time.
As a principle (especially in a california school but I won't name names or times in particular but let's just say in the last 20-40 years) is every family's worst nightmare.

Makes snitches out of people, yet looks down on people who are snitches.
That's not clever, that's spineless.

Insults your intellegence. Mocks your words. Lies both blatantly and carefully. Has such a facade that she can fool anyone. Appearing the beacon of goodness.

3 times was bad as all the popular women out there we hear of all the time. Listed in no particular order and not a reflection of my politics--I HATE politics:
Dr. Laura Sleschenger
Hillary Clinton
Ann Coulter
Dianne Fienstein
Laura Ingram
Janet Reno
Martha Stewart
Nancy Pellosi
Condoleeza Rice

Okay, anything you hear about these women--but like all rolled up into one and multiplied.

To give you an idea: Evokes the kind of anger that will make you sick within a week after your anger episode. An anger that causes you to practically mutate like the hulk--and in the morror you see not just yourself but the devil. You can lift and crush and break things you normally can't because the adrenaline is pumping through your vanes so much that your muscles practically want to explode.
Would anybody like to hear more on this type of personality--which I rhink would befit a sith woman? I think a woman character who personifies masterful, cruel, subversion and is lowlife in high places.
I know plenty from personal experience. I really could go on for days. If you need inspiration. I think honestly there could be a female sort of nihilus character but with a really juicy character. A really dynamic character. Brings out the darkest hatred. Someone who you either love or HATE! No middle road--since that's the inevitable theme of SW.

She could even be in some sort of social relationship with you, the main PC--and you wouldn't know it until the end. Where, whether light or dark, you have gone through hell and before you die you are going to take her out of this existence!

Again, just an angle to consider as far as a character's vivid substance.

Someone who benefits from both love and hatred. A woman who makes other women as well as all sentient life feel embarreased and insulted to even be living.

BTW I know I made spelling errors. SKRU U--it's late!

Please avoid using derogatory terms --Jae

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Old 01-04-2007, 07:20 AM   #75
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All I'll say about Bush here is that no matter what history will remember Bush as the worst tyrant the world has ever seen, and he does have his faults but I think it's unfair for him to be remembered this way or even to be suggested as a Sith, especially when you have Palpatine who in my mind is the evilest person I have even seen, either in film, novel, real life, doesn't matter.

Say, did I suggest an early Sidious for a Sith Lord?
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Old 01-04-2007, 03:30 PM   #76
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I'm all for a female young Sith wearing white clothes wielding a blue lightsaber.
Protagonists can be young, why not villains?

let's look at what we had till now:
Darth Malak. Young to middle aged, cyborg parts.
Darth Sion. An Abnomination.
Darth Nihilus. Weird monster-like guy without personality.
Kreia. Twisted old manipulative witch.


Why not have a villain of ordinary appearance? Elegant and lethal at the same time. What she lacks in monstrosity she makes up with personality.
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Old 01-05-2007, 05:29 AM   #77
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I'm all for a female young Sith wearing white clothes wielding a blue lightsaber.
Protagonists can be young, why not villains?

let's look at what we had till now:
Darth Malak. Young to middle aged, cyborg parts.
Darth Sion. An Abnomination.
Darth Nihilus. Weird monster-like guy without personality.
Kreia. Twisted old manipulative witch.


Why not have a villain of ordinary appearance? Elegant and lethal at the same time. What she lacks in monstrosity she makes up with personality.
That's what I am saying. Sort of. Well, that is basically it.

I suppose that if there were multiple female bosses, some could be cute and hot--in fact, that's probably a must by now so I DEFINITELY agree there. Tavion in the JK series is an attractive woman and, even though she isn't full blown sith, she revives one from the dead in jedi academy. She'd be one excellent example to go from.

However, I REALLY want to send a message of true evil... Through personality. That goes on after looks have long lost their luster.

Evil stereotypes being more than just men. They had the right idea with Traya. However, kick it up many notches. I think such an evil woman should also be very exquisite. Not just hotties but the personality. Something you'll remember long after anything else. The kind that evokes such a hatred, you would not be sorry if this person died a slow, horrible, and painful death. You would wish it upon her over and over again getting worse for all eternity, completely arrested by it and no possibility of ever escaping it. Someone whose very voice could make you insanely evil.



Some have suggested humanoid beings that are not of the expected sexes.
Androgynes (either completely both male and female and extremely deformed--regardless of evil or good OR completely nothing; a unic) for bad characters.
Or Hermaphrodites (Both male and female, but not completely both. Not as deformed-or really at all. A mixture.) could be this way. Usually have superior abilities.
The inherent, taboo, vile, twistedness would make for some extreme characters. There are some other things along this route. But this sort of discussion quickly becomes sort of no-no material even if it is PG-13, so be careful. Certainly not for the feint and weak hearted. On the flip side, the taboo is what makes it a unique character.
It isn't hard to imagine a nemesis character crossing over the gender line.

However, back to my original point.

While, yes sidious is the most evil character I have seen portrayed in a movie personality sense, I still think this could be modified to be even more of evil. More detail; I've known many old couples where the man is like palpatine in personality, yet somehow the wife is always worse than him--I know it is hard to imagine. Just remember the saying "Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned."

Nancy Allen, You did suggest an early sidious. Now I am saying make a woman version who by comparison makes him look decent. In fact, there we go. A woman version of sidious--she could be a REAL nightmare too. Combines EVERYTHING from sidious, nihilus, traya, and many others. Like... A character so evil that she not only has the personal effects on YOU (the person playing the game), and has very complex and difficult dialogue for your player in the game; but also as a character she could have all the abilities of the KOTOR sith and then some. Like a combo character who has impossibly higher stats than you could ever have, and specializes in all areas--just the tip of the iceberg, just her jedi status is "overlord" where she has access to all the special stuff and is maxed out on most if not all powers and things. I.E. Has all the best consular stuff yet has all the best guardian stuff too. To make her more interesting, her personality and alignment dynamics are the inverse of yours--but you don't know it until the end. She knows your every move and you are spending the whole game fighting an uphill battle. Your only strategies are your own unpredictability, manipulative 3 sidedness. Forcing you to be a truly wise person (in reality).

I agree with bosses that are dependent on your alignment--Who says it has to be separate bosses?--for the minions that seems like a great idea. The main boss is a metaphorically slippery and unstable one. Even if she's sane and well disciplined. She'll be good if you are bad or vice versa.
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Old 01-05-2007, 10:57 AM   #78
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Since I believe that the "true Sith" are the Legions of Lettow joined forces with travelers of the Sith species, I'd like their Dark Lord either to be of the Sith race or completely human. I'd rather go for the latter since it's closer to home. And no disfigurations or anything like that; just a normal-looking man with a brilliant mind.


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Old 01-05-2007, 11:10 AM   #79
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Hm for me, a villain doesn't have to be THAT evil, GTA:swcity...
Hard, cruel, ruthless and dedicated is enough for me, just Admiral Thrawn - like.
I don't want a maniac
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Old 01-05-2007, 11:18 AM   #80
Quanon
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Sidious ain't that evil , I've seen worse persons in movies , but he's clever and in some way charming (befote he gets electrified ) , talks real smooth ...

If I think it over , we have seen two types of evil in the Kotor games :

1) Smart , clever , manipultive : Kreia

2)Strong , monster-like : Malak , Sion ( ~Nihilus )

All of them considered human ... So far most of them where scarred or where a bit cyborg .

I think you could go to what some already proposed , a creature = energy form ( clouds ; fog , electrons ... ) , something like the C'Tan in 40K universe .

Can take any form , eats stars and any life form ... Pure evil by sheer destruction , but are they smart ?
IMO not really , just follow their 'Hunger' like Nihilus .

Maybe a droid or Virus kind of A.I. who becomes Force sensative ?


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