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Old 12-20-2006, 11:50 AM   #1
raz92
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Post Soresu and Juyo Stances

Hey everybody.

I have created a new standing Soresu stance, which is like how Obi - Wan stood in his encounter with Grievous on Utapau. I have finished it, and just needs some altering. Screens are below, and, I have finished work on a Juyo stance (Thanks to Maxstate for the idea ). Screens of the Soresu stance and Juyo stance are below.

Screens:

Soresu Stance Picture 1: http://img243.imageshack.us/img243/5830/soresu1aq4.jpg

Soresu Stance Picture 2: http://img243.imageshack.us/img243/8624/soresu2hy0.jpg

Soresu Stance Picture 3: http://img453.imageshack.us/img453/4374/soresu3sb1.jpg

Juyo Stance Picture 1: http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/384/juyo1hy1.jpg

Juyo Stance Picture 2: http://img103.imageshack.us/img103/7272/juyo2bh5.jpg

Juyo Stance Picture 3: http://img103.imageshack.us/img103/5216/juyo3sl1.jpg

Last edited by raz92; 12-26-2006 at 01:28 PM.
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Old 12-21-2006, 12:37 AM   #2
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You probably have the animation going down the spine too much. I can't remember which bone it is, but the body is basically "split" in half so that top and bottom animations can be run on the model at the same time. In this case, your animation probably just don't look good (due to the animation using too much of the spine) other animations are being played on the ledges.

As for the OJP animation file, if you want to add a new animation, you're going to have to merge your animation with the modifed ojp humanoid.gla instead of the basejka one. That way you won't be removing the additional animations that OJP already uses.


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Old 12-21-2006, 09:58 AM   #3
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I see what you mean. I'm working on another from scratch, and so far, have got it ingame, perfect, with the stance how I want it. I'm just fine-tuning the rest of the stuff. Though, if you have any other animation-making tips, I wouldn't mind knowing them.
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Old 12-21-2006, 05:36 PM   #4
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Awesome! I'm looking forward to screenies!
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Old 12-21-2006, 11:09 PM   #5
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Well, I tend to be better at giving answers to specific questions rather than general tips. I never know what things I should cover in detail.


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Old 12-24-2006, 05:39 PM   #6
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Well, the adjusting is pretty much complete, and it's finished I suppose (Yeah, I took a break doing it). Screens coming very soon. Also, does anybody know a couple of 'Cvar' commands, or whatever you call them, so I can get front and side views for the stance?

Last edited by raz92; 12-24-2006 at 05:42 PM. Reason: Forgotton Words
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Old 12-24-2006, 05:47 PM   #7
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/cg_thirdpersoncameradamp 0 should help you.
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Old 12-24-2006, 06:16 PM   #8
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Thanks. And by the way, is there a transition animation between the original OJP Soresu walking animation, to the standng one? Just because there is a small flick in my anim, that when you stop walking, the animation flicks to the left hand side for a split second, then returns to my normal standing anim. It's not much of a problem, just quite annoying. Other than this, it's fully complete.
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Old 12-25-2006, 03:26 AM   #9
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That's probably related to all the attack animations not having the same starting stance position as the animation we use as the "stance" animation. Can't say more without more information.


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Old 12-25-2006, 03:59 PM   #10
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Well, no worries. It happens to Maxstates' anims too, but mine is more noticeable, since the arms stick out quite wide, and it is based sideways. But now, we have the screenies:

http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/8...esupic1qv5.jpg

http://img123.imageshack.us/img123/7...esupic2km3.jpg

http://img123.imageshack.us/img123/8...esupic3bj5.jpg

Also, if you see anything that isn't right/doesn't look right, feel free to point it out.

Last edited by raz92; 12-25-2006 at 08:31 PM.
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Old 12-25-2006, 04:36 PM   #11
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those screens look great




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Old 12-25-2006, 08:53 PM   #12
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The left hand's fingers point upwards, palm outwards!

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Old 12-25-2006, 09:54 PM   #13
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Nice! Can't wait for them to be used ingame!
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Old 12-25-2006, 10:04 PM   #14
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I never liked the way that form looked in the movies, nor would I think ingame.

It just doesn't look like a defensive stance in terms of sword fighting at all. It also looks too "fake". I would prefer a different stance for the Soresu stance in terms of official.

Sorry for being harsh but I generally never liked the look of that stance.
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Old 12-26-2006, 06:22 AM   #15
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^Yep I prefer the look of the default blue stance too, that Soresu looks more of an Ataru to me. Back, high up and ready to strike.. nothing like a defensive style.

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Old 12-26-2006, 06:29 AM   #16
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Actuley, I always thought that stance looked pretty cool. Maybe a bit un-defensive but pretty cool. Hope you realese it!


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Old 12-26-2006, 09:37 AM   #17
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Yeah, I actually thought it looked a bit more on the offensive side, and considering Soresu is a form to achieve total protection, this stance seems less defensive, more offensive. And Maxstate, I tried my best with the fingers, but in Dragon, it's quite hard to move and rotate the fingers, so I just left it at that. I may change it though.

*Edit* I have made a few more changes, moving the lightsaber's position from above the head, to around/just above waist height, and giving the stance a more stable position with the feet. Any updates from now on, will be edited into the first post. So, check first post for the new screens.

Last edited by raz92; 12-26-2006 at 10:17 AM.
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Old 12-26-2006, 11:09 AM   #18
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Well good luck, I hope you do a nice Juyo one later too

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Old 12-26-2006, 11:16 AM   #19
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Thanks Max. Your anims are pretty cool, the Shii-Cho and Djem So have to be my favourites. I doubt mine will ever get into OJP, as don't you have to be part of the team? Plus mine aren't as good as yours. But anyway, I will probably make a Juyo stance sooner or later.
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Old 12-26-2006, 11:18 AM   #20
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I'm a ****ty animator man. I just can't find the patience to tinker with one frame all day because I have this "why reinvent the wheel" attitude towards animating; there's already so much in the files themselves that we can use, tweak, modify... why create new ones when they're not needed?

But I've always wanted more movie-like stances, and I like yours, personally I wouldn't give it to OJP Soresu though. Maybe to another stance.

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Old 12-26-2006, 11:26 AM   #21
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Yeah. Well, your anims are pretty basic, and go well with OJP, which indeed makes them look good. Also, I agree that my stance shouldn't get into OJP, as it does look a little dodgy while viewing it from the back, which is all you're really gonna do while playing with it.
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Old 12-26-2006, 11:27 AM   #22
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Never said that your stance shouldn't go into OJP dude, just said it shouldn't be Soresu ingame. Maybe a different style, but not Soresu.

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Old 12-26-2006, 11:34 AM   #23
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Stupid me, misread it. Though, is it possible to code another two more forms into OJP? Because Vapaad and Ataru aren't in, unless the team purposely left them out, due to lack of more attack anims? Anyway, i'm going to start work on the Juyo stance now, I could have it done by the end of today. If I do, i'll get screens.
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Old 12-26-2006, 11:37 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raz92
Stupid me, misread it. Though, is it possible to code another two more forms into OJP? Because Vapaad and Ataru aren't in, unless the team purposely left them out, due to lack of more attack anims? Anyway, i'm going to start work on the Juyo stance now, I could have it done by the end of today. If I do, i'll get screens.
Vaapad == Juyo, only where Juyo trusts on control of the mind and extensive training, Vaapad takes the easy way out and just 'borrows' power from the dark side as I understand it.

I think they use pretty much the same moves although different mindsets

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Old 12-26-2006, 11:40 AM   #25
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I just figured Vaapad was Juyo after going on Wookieepedia . Right now, i'm getting some reference pics, then i'll get to work on it.

*Edit* I've finished the stance, pics in first post. Point out the stuff that doesn't like right/isn't right, and i'll fix it.

Last edited by raz92; 12-26-2006 at 04:01 PM.
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Old 12-26-2006, 10:44 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raz92
Stupid me, misread it. Though, is it possible to code another two more forms into OJP? Because Vapaad and Ataru aren't in, unless the team purposely left them out, due to lack of more attack anims? Anyway, i'm going to start work on the Juyo stance now, I could have it done by the end of today. If I do, i'll get screens.
It's possible. It's just that we don't have animations for 2 new stances.


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Old 12-27-2006, 06:28 AM   #27
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We do Ace, I made this clear a lot of times.
If people use my anims, the other animations are the default Tavion and Desann.
If people don't use my anims, the other animations are the new Tavion and Desann.

Combining all of the single style animations we have we come up to 7 different styles:
Makashi
Juyo
Desann
Tavion
Yellow
Red
Blue

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Old 12-27-2006, 03:15 PM   #28
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I don't beleive people would care enough abotu the original tavion and Desann stances to justify the effort to add those extra styles.


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Old 12-27-2006, 04:25 PM   #29
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I think I would have to agree with Razor Ace on that one
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Old 12-27-2006, 06:31 PM   #30
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Well, there is also single duel and single staff styles we could try. I remember Tireces also making a few substitute anims for his single duel and single staff anims as well that made those styles more unique looking. His single dual was especially aturu looking. Adding these would definitely warrant making saber attack 3 an 8 point skill or maybe some different bonuses or something. Adding these or new styles isnt my our highest priority ion my option though, just a cool extra to really put an extra crown on our saber system being the greatest and most movielike of the mods.


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Old 12-29-2006, 08:56 AM   #31
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According to me, single handed dual stance would be more like Niman (which no one has ever seen in fight though) because it looks like how some of the Jedi (Coleman Trebor) hold their saber.

As for Ataru, it depends which Ataru we are talking about, everyone refers to Yoda's, but it's not really the true Ataru, because he uses all the Ataru power to jump because he is too short otherwise.
To me, Ataru is how Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan fight in episode 1, especially Qui-Gon.
Fast and strong swings, but slow transitions (force assisted / empowered attacks).
I don't think any stance animation looks like Ataru yet, maybe yellow is the closest though, or red...

By the way, to be honest I don't like the new Soresu stance look in defense (idle) mode... because Obi Wan just holds it like that to provoke his enemies, then when it comes to fight, he doesn't point his hand at the enemy anymore and has his saber in front of him.
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Old 12-29-2006, 09:51 AM   #32
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Well I have this theory (after ravaging through a lot of the Forms and their descriptions, and the sources behind them) that a Jedi chooses a Form, but builds his or her own style for the form. Which is why Obi's, Qui's and Yoda's Atarus are all different. They each created their own style for the Forms they picked.

For me a style or form is not just a bunch of new animations, heck, Yellow with a few transition and attack changes could be the new Vaapad as far as I'm concerned, to me it's more the mindset and way of thinking, the strategic value of a certain Form that give you the edge you're looking for.

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Old 12-29-2006, 03:56 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxstate
Well I have this theory (after ravaging through a lot of the Forms and their descriptions, and the sources behind them) that a Jedi chooses a Form, but builds his or her own style for the form. Which is why Obi's, Qui's and Yoda's Atarus are all different. They each created their own style for the Forms they picked.
Bingo.


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Old 12-29-2006, 04:31 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by razorace
Bingo.
LOL. Yeah. It almost makes me think we should make those forms selectable on the menu and only give them different bonuses, but allow players to choose the look of them in game (i.e. different stances)..but that would potentially be alot of work and we might want to focus on more important things.

Razor, I was wondering. Since you've always been the sabersystem guru, nobody else really knows it very well, and our saber system is practically at a finished level, do you think maybe once you retire from the head modder position here, you might still want to be the head "sabersystem guy" for any tweaks or bug fixes? Ensiform, robo, and maybe whoever else we have helping could focus on the other features and bugs for the mod in general, and you would have much less to do since our saber system is practically finished and be able to improve upon what is your biggest masterpiece as you feel is needed. How does that sound? Also, Happy 8,000 posts!! LOL Thats impressive.


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Old 12-29-2006, 07:20 PM   #35
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I don't know. I just don't have the time and, frankly, my interest level is low at the moment.


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Old 12-30-2006, 11:39 AM   #36
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I totally agree with you Max, the stance is the type of move you choose (blue, yellow, red, purple, green), and the style is what you do with it. That's why I was a bit perplexed when the stances were given style (form) names in OJP.
No offense, but I find it a bit pretentious, "This is the Djem-So, This is the Juyo" etc...
Again, I'm not reproaching anything, I was just a bit surprised.
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Old 12-30-2006, 08:42 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by razorace
I don't know. I just don't have the time and, frankly, my interest level is low at the moment.
I can understand that. Its got to suck not having your broadband connection anymore, and dealing with your new job will probably make your playing and coding less fun until you get more use to things and maybe even a better connection. I do think you will start to enjoy it again once you start playing it again though. I still would like to get some clans going after the public release.

You will have time eventually, once you get use to this huge transition youre going through. Its all about getting use to things. My best friend has a more than full time business and a wife and four very young kids and still finds time to write music and do alot of the things he likes to do. As long as you've been modding and as little credit you've been given, I can't blame you for starting to lose interest, but heck, with the changes you've made, we could be on the verge of a very well played mod here. You've got plenty of people to help promote it now


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Old 12-31-2006, 05:33 AM   #38
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All you need is some motivation, and time from your new job. This kind of stuff happens to me all the time. I somehow manage to see/find/do something, which makes me want to get back on track with whatever I lost interest in.
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Old 12-31-2006, 02:39 PM   #39
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Yeah, come one Razor Ace!
We are all with you!
May 2007 be the year of the best Jedi Knight mod ever released!
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Old 12-31-2006, 10:21 PM   #40
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Happy 2007 everyone!

I agree with raz, more importantly we need the community to get together and stop bickering like kids. I admit I'm guilty of it too, and I feel it's time to put our efforts together. Beta tester or not, criticism is important, but our criticism is heading seems to be heading in the wrong direction. I understand everyone has different opinions, but sometimes we have to look at things from a technical/realistic/practical perspective rather than let our emotions get the better of us. Instead of having one lump of different arguments here, I think we should work towards forming a solid, sound single solution

Oh yeah, and I'm hitting jk2files.com later to ask for some coding help, sounds good?

(sorry for thread hijack)
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