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Old 12-31-2006, 10:09 PM   #1
SilentScope001
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Atris' Teachings

There were 2 reasons why Darth Traya wanted to destroy Atris. 1) Atris kicked the Exile out...and is a part of the past. Atris must be destroyed, so that the Exile can now feel confident and ready to do what needs to be done. 2) Atris is corrupted and she must be stopped before her teachings spread.

I understand 1, but not 2...How was Atris corrupted? What was Atris' fault? You may know the answer, and see it as pretty simple, but I just want to ask to see. Atris did a couple of sins, such as learning from the Sith Holocrons, using all of the Jedi as well as the Exile as bait for Darth Nihlius and Darth Sion, respectively...but I always saw them as being manlipuated by Darth Traya herself, in the process of "destroying" her. (After all, when you kill Atris, you hear Darth Traya's voices in the Holocrons, stating that she was able to manlipuate Atris) Even #1 makes little sense if you throw in the non-canon cut content which states that Kreia got Atris to actually exile The Exile...stating it was all part of Kreia's plans.

What exactly is the problem with Atris that means that she must be stopped? Why is she wrong? What are her teachings?
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Old 12-31-2006, 10:16 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilentScope001
What exactly is the problem with Atris that means that she must be stopped? Why is she wrong? What are her teachings?
Speak with the Handmaiden sisters when you are at the academy the first time without pissing them off overly, to gain some insight into Atris plans. What they reveal paint the picture of Atris trying to rebuilt the Jedi Order not as the mostly benevolent brotherhood organization it was, but more along a fascist-like model with strict control of its members where any deviants from the straight and narrow path of the teachings (that is Atris teachings, since she is incorruptible and infallible) would be dealt with most harshly and brutally.


It's part of Atris vision to rebuild the Jedi Order into a form which would be more resistant to the lures of the Sith in the future to avoid repeat incidents of Exar Kun and Darth Revan. Anyone who shows any tendency of being lured towards the dark side, or seduced by outside influences, would be eliminated early before they became a threat. But of course in so doing she would destroy the core of what the Jedi were, and taint their ideology with Sith-like influences.

Last edited by stoffe -mkb-; 01-01-2007 at 05:27 PM. Reason: Why of course.
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Old 01-01-2007, 12:46 AM   #3
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Frankly Atris was to weak to be a Sith, so I do not know the problem of her teachings... she was a Gray Jedi.... IMO.
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Old 01-01-2007, 05:07 PM   #4
Titanius Anglesmith
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Atris' intention was not to turn the Jedi Order into Sith, but to strictly keep Jedi from becoming Sith. As stoffe -mkb- said, she would've immediately dealt with anyone who showed hints of falling to the Dark Side. This goes completely against the way the Jedi actually think, which is no one is beyond the hope of redemption.


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Old 01-01-2007, 08:22 PM   #5
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Yeah, it would have been wrong of her to try to control the Jedi like that, and as Princess Leia once said to Wilhuff Tarkin, "The more you tighten your grip, the more star systems will slip through your fingers." But in this case, it's Jedi, not star systems. So her plan would fail anyway. Think about it, once she starts to "do away" with potential dark-siders, people will start to resent her and possibly leave the Order. Not to mention that the last attempt to erase any possible dark-siders from the Order was the Padawan Massacre of Taris. which was... bad. I always thought that the best way to prevent the dark side was removing most or all the restrictions from the Order, since alot of times Jedi went dark side was because they were forced to betray the Jedi Order in a way. Two very good examples were Revan and Malak who had to leave the Order to fight in the Mandalorian Wars, and Anakin Skywalker, who had to hide his marriage from the Jedi, and in turn became a Sith because of it. I mean, if the Jedi were allowed to marry, Anakin could have just went to the other Jedi like Yoda about his wife instead of trusting Palpatine. Since I seem to be ranting a bit, I'll just end it at that.

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Old 01-02-2007, 02:07 PM   #6
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It was also implied strongly that she set her fellow Jedi up to be destroyed on Katarr. All the Masters express shock she's even alive.

Again, this is only how I see it in my head, and my head can be a rather strange place.

Atris was a historian, not a teacher. Exile is quick to point out she has never trained a Padawan. She is of the right age to see Exar Kun split the Order in her childhood. She saw the Masters adopt a harder line - forbidding children (no one blinked much at the Sunriders or the Qel-Dromas before that), seeking to sever competing ties, taking apprentices as young as they could find them, sealing themselves in Enclaves and isolating themselves from the general population, and granting the Masters' Councils great power.

As a Knight, the Mandalorian Wars cause another rupture, one that could have rended the Order like Exar Kun had. The word from the Jedi Masters was to sit by while worlds burned, because of the greater threat behind the Mandalorians. This did not sit well with Revan, so she took those who agreed with her and split the Order. The man Atris cared for (but could do nothing about it, in line with Jedi orthodoxy) was among them. He chose Revan, chose the War, over the Jedi and over her. And the Masters had let them leave. In her mind, they truly did learn nothing from Exar Kun.

So, when the lone Jedi that had served Revan returned, Atris was consumed by her bitterness. She was convinced he had fallen, and wished a stiffer sentence for him than Exile. In her mind, the Jedi were too leinent once more. However, the Council's condemnation was enough - sending the message to all who had joined Revan that the Order and the Light would not accept them back. This just added some sugar to the Molotov cocktail that was the Jedi Civil War. After all, if you're going to be treated as a Sith, might as well get the benefits from it.

In the aftermath of that, Atris came to the conclusion that she had to destroy the Jedi to save it. Her colleagues trained the likes of Exile and Revan, just as their masters had trained the likes of Exar Kun. If they survived, then they would only perpetuate the corruption. She had never trained a Padawan, but that was because she had been too busy learning from and observing their failures. If the Jedi are gone, then she can betray the Sith and destroy them. This leaves the future of the Force in one set of hands - hers. She has never been "tainted" by the war. She is a Jedi Master, surely the Force wills her to do this? Surely she adheres to the doctrine and the dogma, so she is beyond reproach and the Dark Side. She is the last true Jedi.

So, she will wait among her holocrons and focus on galactic rebuilding. She will surround herself with the Handmaidens, trained to resist the Force and never use it. They will enforce her will and cull any student that shows signs of the Dark Side, since she has observed the failures for herself. (Which is too bad, for the idea of the Handmaidens as watchers of the watchers is a bloody brilliant idea). The Jedi Order will be rebuilt from the ground up, without the mistakes of their predecessors.

Of course, she only later realizes that her foundation was made of sand. She, too, has fallen to the Dark Side and realizes it too late.


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Old 01-02-2007, 02:41 PM   #7
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Thats how it happens, isnt it? I mean, people fall to the Dark Side (mostly), because they think they're doing that for te greater good

Quote:
Originally Posted by Allronix
Of course, she only later realizes that her foundation was made of sand. She, too, has fallen to the Dark Side and realizes it too late.
And this happens during the period of time of the game. At the end, she says that there's a Atris no more.
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Old 01-02-2007, 02:53 PM   #8
Titanius Anglesmith
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Originally Posted by Ctrl_Alt_Del
And this happens during the period of time of the game. At the end, she says that there's a Atris no more.
That's because she realizes that she has become (or actually thinks she has become) Darth Traya.


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