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Old 01-19-2007, 01:27 AM   #1
Jae Onasi
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[Other]Statement on the new 6 degrees of Star Wars Canon

Statement on the new 6 degrees of Star Wars Canon

We, at WookieWikiWarrickWicketpedia, wish to clear up the confusion of ‘Canon’ in Star Wars by instituting a new classification system on how to rank the different Star Wars and Star Wars EU materials. This will replace the Canon-a, b, and c system, which was becoming just too confusing, resulting in many emails from forum administrators and moderators who were ‘having to deal with too damn many threads on arguments over Canon’.

1st degree Canon shall be The Movies. Radio adaptations, so long as they include voices from the Original Actors (and Actresses) shall also be 1st degree Canon. The Screenplays are also 1st degree Canon, but only if George Lucas put a ‘GL’ on every page. The official soundtracks are 1st degree Canon, because John Williams has included the use of both the bassoon and the triangle in his music, and quite possibly the krummhorn. Anything spoken by George Lucas is first degree Canon, including those more mundane statements like ‘I want to order a pizza’ and ‘I have to find the nearest restroom.’

2nd degree Canon shall include those radio adaptations that deviate from the script slightly but still maintain the ‘True Spirit’ of the movies. Those radio adaptations that include the voices of Harrison Ford or Liam Neeson shall automatically be changed to 1st degree Canon, because their voices are really sexy. Those adaptations that include excess amounts of Jar-Jar Binks or Ewok cuteness shall automatically be reduced to 6th degree Canon or less.

3rd degree Canon shall include any books that George Lucas decides shall be 3rd degree, which is pretty much everything else not in the 1st and 2nd degrees. It’s his world—if he wants to say a book is 1st degree or 6th degree, we shall bow to his greater wisdom. The exception are the Vong books, which shall be reduced to 6th degree or the 9th circle of Dante’s Inferno, whichever comes last. All Star Wars games are 3rd degree Canon. The Knights of the Old Republic games, because they are Really Righteous, are 2nd degree Canon. We hereby declare all permutations of Revan and Exile to be Canon, because trying to pick just one is really p!$$ing off the fans. The Star Wars Lego games would be 4th degree Canon because of the ‘cutesy factor’, except for the fact that my son really likes the games, so they stay at 3rd degree.

4th degree Canon includes any comic books. Graphic novels remain at 3rd degree because ‘graphic novel’ sounds more cool than ‘comic book.’ The exception is the Knights of the Old Republic comic book series, which is destined to become a Graphic Novel when bound together, and because they’ve drawn Zayne Carrick really cute. It’s at least 3rd degree, and we might even make that series 2nd degree if sales continue to be good.

5th degree Canon includes all fan-fiction, unless they are “Really Good,” which, by our definition, is anything with over 1,000 views on LucasForums or over 15 thumbs-ups on kotorfanmedia. If they’re “Really Good”, then they can, at the option of the administrators, moderators, machievelli, or the author, move to 4th degree. The exception is if the spam-per-view ratio approaches 1:82, in which case the fanfic shall be declared ‘spammy’ and the fic drops to 6th degree. Action figures are 5th degree Canon, unless they involve Yoda, Han Solo, or Luke Skywalker. These are 1st degree Canon because I like them and because Frank Oz rules.

6th degree Canon includes any speculative posts on any forums. It also includes any non-speculative posts, comments, jokes, pictures, and other written, visual, or aural media. Anything else not already specified shall be 6th degree Canon, unless the author finds something she really likes, in which case the Degree of Canon may be altered accordingly. Forum posts that are written by administrators or moderators shall be whatever Degree of Canon they desire, because the author feels the need to suck up, unless George Lucas declares otherwise, because his 1st degree is more equal than everyone else’s 1st degree.

We hope this clears up any confusion about Canon. If you have any further questions, please send an email to our help center at ‘we won’t answer it anyway.idiocy'. We will do our best to make sure that the answer to your questions are answered with as much obfuscation as possible, preferably by someone who does not even speak your language.

Thank you for your kind attention to this matter.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Edit:
Caveat: This is not directed at anyone in particular, but at the idea that there not only is 'canon' but now 'levels of canon.' In my personal view of the world, there is only 'Lucas' and 'Everyone Else' if we have to make that distinction in the first place. I'm particularly amused at the idea that we're even using the word 'canon' to describe all this, as if this carries the same importance as holy scriptures of the major religions....
I say, just enjoy the games the way you want.


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Old 01-19-2007, 01:54 AM   #2
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Ah yes, this old post. You're not being serious, are you?

My thoughts on canon: if you like it, it's canon. If you don't, it isn't. Your views are not canon to others, and theirs are not canon to you. This rule applies to any fics you write or games you play.

Look how simple it is now!

I mainly think this because of some of the incredibly stupid EU stuff out there. On instance is how an extragalactic Force-immune alien species of masochists invaded the galaxy barely decades after Endor, and another being how Emperor Palpatine could transfer his souls to clone bodies at will (which allowed him to become immortal and not die at Endor).

I could go on. Other bits of canon state Jedi can fuse their minds into computers and stay like that for decades, that there were practically a million Jedi still alive during the Battle of Endor, (it's not even funny how many Jedi Luke runs into after killing Vader) that a battalion of troops is capable of reinforcing an entire planet, and that General Grievous slaughtered entire regiments of clone troopers per battle.

There's a lot of EU stuff that's total nonsense, and which I hardly consider true to the movies. Of course, even they have some faults - one is how Palpatine says the Republic existed for only 1,000 years. Some bits of the EU are too established for minor lines in the movies to contradict. (Though he could have been refering to the Republic after the Ruusan Reformation, which took place then)

Of course, the basic laws of physics and what's humanly possible overrule all canon. One instance is how Revan would definitely lose if he fought 100 Mandalorians at once, contrary to fanboy belief.


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Old 01-19-2007, 02:08 AM   #3
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I thought it was time to post it in CEC.


From MST3K's spoof of "Hercules Unchained"--heard as Roman medic soldiers carry off an unconscious Greek Hercules on a 1950's Army green canvas stretcher: "Hi, we're IX-I-I. Did somebody dial IX-I-I?"

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Old 01-19-2007, 02:17 AM   #4
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Thanks for posting it Jae. You've really made me learn some things over the past few days, after posting The Padawan's Guide to Providing Good Critiques Thread.
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Old 01-19-2007, 05:02 PM   #5
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Oh, Pottsie, it's just meant to be a spoof, in the very remote event that you're taking this seriously.


From MST3K's spoof of "Hercules Unchained"--heard as Roman medic soldiers carry off an unconscious Greek Hercules on a 1950's Army green canvas stretcher: "Hi, we're IX-I-I. Did somebody dial IX-I-I?"

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Old 01-19-2007, 05:05 PM   #6
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Just by the line, "These are 1st degree Canon because I like them and because Frank Oz rules," it's obviously just a joke.


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Old 01-19-2007, 05:22 PM   #7
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I didn't know all the differents canons, thank you Jae.
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Old 01-19-2007, 05:29 PM   #8
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Hey, Frank Oz does rule!


From MST3K's spoof of "Hercules Unchained"--heard as Roman medic soldiers carry off an unconscious Greek Hercules on a 1950's Army green canvas stretcher: "Hi, we're IX-I-I. Did somebody dial IX-I-I?"

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Old 01-19-2007, 06:37 PM   #9
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Frank Oz does rule and anything involving the Yuzhong Vong should be banished to the ninth circle of hell.

Thanks for clearing up that whole parade of what is canon and what is not. Personally I think everyone should kick back and have a milkshake or a cup of coffee.

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Old 01-21-2007, 05:08 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jae Onasi
Oh, Pottsie, it's just meant to be a spoof, in the very remote event that you're taking this seriously.
Jae's views on canon are non-canon.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Canon
G-canon is "George Lucas" canon; the six Episodes and anything directly provided to Lucas Licensing by Lucas (including unpublished production notes from him or his production department that are never seen by the public). Elements originating with Lucas in the movie novelizations, reference books, and other sources are also G-canon, though anything created by the authors of those sources is C-canon. When the matter of changes between movie versions arises, the most recently released editions are deemed superior to older ones, as they correct mistakes, improve consistency between the two trilogies, and express Lucas's current vision of the Star Wars universe most closely.

C-canon is "continuity" canon, consisting of all recent works (and many older works) released under the name of Star Wars: books, comics, games, cartoons, non-theatrical films, and more. Games are a special case, as generally only the stories are C-canon, while things like stats and gameplay may not be; they also offer non-canonical options to the player, such as choosing female gender for a canonically male character. C-canon elements have been known to appear in the movies, thus making them G-canon; examples include the name "Coruscant," swoop bikes, Quinlan Vos, Aayla Secura, YT-2400 freighters, Salporin, and Action VI Transports.

S-canon is "secondary" canon; the materials are available to be used or ignored as needed by current authors. This includes mostly older works, such as much of the Marvel Star Wars comics, that predate a consistent effort to maintain continuity; it also contains certain elements of a few otherwise N-canon stories, and other things that "may not fit just right." Many formerly S-canon elements have been elevated to C-canon through their inclusion in more recent works by continuity-minded authors, while many other older works (such as The Han Solo Adventures) were accounted for in continuity from the start despite their age, and thus were always C-canon.

N-canon is "non-canon." What-if stories (such as stories published under the Infinities label) and anything else directly and irreconcilably contradicted by higher canon ends up here. N-canon is the only level that is not considered canon by Lucasfilm.


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Originally Posted by Sabretooth
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Old 01-21-2007, 03:59 PM   #11
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You sure know how to spoil the ED. For that it is ten lashes in the public square

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Old 01-21-2007, 09:54 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JediMaster12
You sure know how to spoil the ED.
I know how to spoil myself, do I?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sabretooth
We will be great failures one day, you and I
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Old 01-22-2007, 04:06 AM   #13
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A question: do you mean the seventh Canon Degree is indeed "Un-Canon"?

Sorry if my opinion is harsh, but my opinion is we should exclude out exceptions...It will confuse other LFers, you know, like, Han Solo's Action Figure falls under category of "Action Figures" which is Degree 5 Canon, but it was an exception. If so, what's the point of creating degrees of canonality? And what's the standard of "Really Good Fics"? This is fairly vague in my opinion. No, I didn't say all my fics are good, I don't want them to be canonial for Star Wars Universe.

However thanks to Jae for your effort!




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Old 01-22-2007, 07:35 AM   #14
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Whahahaha

Hillarious stuff, Jae!

Quote:
Originally posted by Jae Onasi
Anything spoken by George Lucas is first degree Canon, including those more mundane statements like ‘I want to order a pizza’ and ‘I have to find the nearest restroom.’

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Old 01-22-2007, 03:10 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
I know how to spoil myself, do I?
I meant spoil the fun ED. Drat my fast fingers on the keyboard and my cold.

Degrees of canon are fun as it conveys the opinion that we disagree with certain things.

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Old 01-22-2007, 08:26 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSI: Nihilus
A question: do you mean the seventh Canon Degree is indeed "Un-Canon"?
Yes.

The reason it exists is to apply to fan fiction and Infinities. Those stories (or in the case of the later, comics) are Star Wars but can contradict it. So it's easier just to place them in a degree of canon that's entirely false to avoid confusion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CSI: Nihilus
If so, what's the point of creating degrees of canonality?
To avoid confusion, mainly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CSI: Nihilus
And what's the standard of "Really Good Fics"?
If you've read enough books, you can tell. There's a few.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sabretooth
We will be great failures one day, you and I
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Old 01-22-2007, 10:15 PM   #17
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And usually the few are the ones that ED prefers to nitpick at to death.

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Old 01-22-2007, 10:42 PM   #18
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Quote:
Of course, even they have some faults - one is how Palpatine says the Republic existed for only 1,000 years. Some bits of the EU are too established for minor lines in the movies to contradict. (Though he could have been refering to the Republic after the Ruusan Reformation, which took place then)
Actually, George Lucas did not actually read the EU. He wrote the 1,000 year line without realizing that the Republic lasted a LOT later than 1,000 years.

The Russan Reformation was created and did as "retcon" to 'fix' George Lucas' BIG mistake. So the Republic lasted for 1000 years, as well as 20,000 years.

George Lucas also contridicated canon by declaring the Clone War to be a war against droids...and not a war against rogue clones. The war against rogue clones was retconned to be a Kamino revolt in a BF2 level.
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Old 01-23-2007, 01:52 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JediMaster12
And usually the few are the ones that ED prefers to nitpick at to death.
The more the merrier.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SilentScope001
Actually, George Lucas did not actually read the EU. He wrote the 1,000 year line without realizing that the Republic lasted a LOT later than 1,000 years.
He did indeed. Other than the money it brings in, Lucas is hardly interested in the EU. He's requested a few things, but he's not too informed about it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sabretooth
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Old 01-23-2007, 02:05 AM   #20
Jae Onasi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSI: Nihilus
A question: do you mean the seventh Canon Degree is indeed "Un-Canon"?
Sure, we can make it "7-Degree: The Un-Canon"

Quote:
Originally Posted by CSI: Nihilus
Sorry if my opinion is harsh, but my opinion is we should exclude out exceptions...It will confuse other LFers, you know, like, Han Solo's Action Figure falls under category of "Action Figures" which is Degree 5 Canon, but it was an exception. If so, what's the point of creating degrees of canonality?
Just because I can.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CSI: Nihilus
And what's the standard of "Really Good Fics"? This is fairly vague in my opinion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jae, who was Joking with the 6 Degrees
by our definition, is anything with over 1,000 views on LucasForums or over 15 thumbs-ups on kotorfanmedia.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CSI: Nihilus
However thanks to Jae for your effort!
Anytime.


From MST3K's spoof of "Hercules Unchained"--heard as Roman medic soldiers carry off an unconscious Greek Hercules on a 1950's Army green canvas stretcher: "Hi, we're IX-I-I. Did somebody dial IX-I-I?"

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Old 01-23-2007, 02:21 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
The more the merrier.
Yeah sure

The Seventh Degree of Canon is the last Circle of Dante's Inferno.

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Old 01-23-2007, 03:39 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JediMaster12
Yeah sure

The Seventh Degree of Canon is the last Circle of Dante's Inferno.
Eh, yeah, the Seven Deadly Sins are:

Pride! Envy! Gluttony! Lust! Anger! Greed! Sloth!

Respectively.




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Old 01-23-2007, 06:21 PM   #23
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You mean this schematic ? and the most idiotic canon level is way down ?



TIQUILAAAAAAAA
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Old 01-29-2007, 01:18 AM   #24
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The most idiotic non-Canon (because it is less than the 6 degrees) is wherever the author chooses to place it, which, in this case, is below at least level 7, unless it's Vong, in which case level 9 is probably still too good for it.


From MST3K's spoof of "Hercules Unchained"--heard as Roman medic soldiers carry off an unconscious Greek Hercules on a 1950's Army green canvas stretcher: "Hi, we're IX-I-I. Did somebody dial IX-I-I?"

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Old 01-29-2007, 02:36 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jae Onasi
unless it's Vong, in which case level 9 is probably still too good for it.
Quoted for emphasis.




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Old 01-29-2007, 04:22 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jae Onasi
unless it's Vong, in which case level 9 is probably still too good for it.
There be worse. Terrible as they were, the NJO books were decent enough to have lightsabers and starships.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sabretooth
We will be great failures one day, you and I
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Old 01-29-2007, 04:48 PM   #27
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So they were a cheap form of Star Wars then?

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Old 03-01-2007, 06:58 PM   #28
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To be posted tomorrow:

http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?t=174805
Statement on the new 6 degrees of Star Wars Canon
Jae Onasi

All right, I’m not going to critique it except for one plaint
You mean only three of mine are fifth degree and none higher? Whine!


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Old 03-01-2007, 09:25 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EagerWeasel
Just by the line, "These are 1st degree Canon because I like them and because Frank Oz rules," it's obviously just a joke.
That was a joke? It was the most serious part of it.

Lego Star Wars shoudl have NO canon because it openly and cutely contradicts 1st grade canon


"The beauty and genius of a work of film may be reconceived, though its first material expression be destroyed; a vanished fiction may yet again inspire the screenplay-writer; but when the last individual of a race of living directors, of artists, breathes no more, another heaven and another earth must pass before such a one can be again." -William Beebe, modified in memorial of the twentieth century

Su'cuy, vod, kar'laylirdarasuum me'suum!

Star Wars: The Plastic Director's Cut!

Last edited by Relenzo2; 03-01-2007 at 10:33 PM.
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Old 03-02-2007, 12:34 AM   #30
Jae Onasi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by machievelli
To be posted tomorrow:

http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?t=174805
Statement on the new 6 degrees of Star Wars Canon
Jae Onasi

All right, I’m not going to critique it except for one plaint
You mean only three of mine are fifth degree and none higher? Whine!


But you forgot the special clause whereby you are allowed to move a fic to 4th degree canon because you Are Special. Therefore, you may make yours 4th degree, and if you don't, I will.

And come to think of it, now that I'm a moderator, I have the power to make any post 1st degree canon, unless otherwise altered by George Lucas, so I therefore declare any mach fics shall be 1st degree because they all Rock.


From MST3K's spoof of "Hercules Unchained"--heard as Roman medic soldiers carry off an unconscious Greek Hercules on a 1950's Army green canvas stretcher: "Hi, we're IX-I-I. Did somebody dial IX-I-I?"

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Last edited by Jae Onasi; 03-02-2007 at 12:46 AM.
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Old 03-02-2007, 12:54 AM   #31
machievelli
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jae Onasi


But you forgot the special clause whereby you are allowed to move a fic to 4th degree canon because you Are Special. Therefore, you may make yours 4th degree, and if you don't, I will.

And come to think of it, now that I'm a moderator, I have the power to make any post 1st degree canon, unless otherwise altered by George Lucas, so I therefore declare any mach fics shall be 1st degree because they all Rock.

Hell, Jae, I wouldn't have promoted any of mine because it wouldn't be fair to any one else.

As for your appraisal of my work Thank you very much. No one has ever praised me hire without buying it.


'To argue with those who have renounced the use and authority of reason is as futile as to administer medicine to the dead.' Now who said that?

From the one who brought you;
What we die for...
Acceptance
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Old 03-02-2007, 01:05 AM   #32
Jae Onasi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by machievelli
As for your appraisal of my work Thank you very much. No one has ever praised me hire without buying it.
Heh, and when I get my tax refund I can even do that, too.


From MST3K's spoof of "Hercules Unchained"--heard as Roman medic soldiers carry off an unconscious Greek Hercules on a 1950's Army green canvas stretcher: "Hi, we're IX-I-I. Did somebody dial IX-I-I?"

Read The Adventures of Jolee Bindo and see the amazing Peep Surgery
Story WIP: The Dragonfighters
My blog: Confessions of a Geeky Mom--Latest post: Security Alerts!
Love Star Trek AND gaming? Check out Lotus Fleet.

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Old 03-02-2007, 01:13 AM   #33
machievelli
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jae Onasi
Heh, and when I get my tax refund I can even do that, too.
Actually some guy off the site who had peeked in and seen my stuff asked me if I had a paypal donation account because he liked my writing, and wanted to help me continue.

But I don't know how to do it or if it would even be ethical.

But that would please me. When I land where I'm going, I'll let you know. If you buy some of my work I'll pay postage both ways so I can autograph it.


'To argue with those who have renounced the use and authority of reason is as futile as to administer medicine to the dead.' Now who said that?

From the one who brought you;
What we die for...
Acceptance
KOTOR excerpts
Star Wars: The Beginning
Star Wars: Republic Dawn
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Old 03-04-2007, 02:46 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JediMaster12
...anything involving the Yuzhong Vong should be banished to the ninth circle of hell....
My thoughts exactly.

Except Traitor. That was amazing.


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