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Old 01-31-2007, 11:11 AM   #1
reven0123
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Gender related skills in k3

Now im not being sexist here just pointing out a few thing's id like to see and other's i hope in k3 now as we all know in real life a woman can't become as physically strong as a man can so instead of your female jedi guardian becoming as strong as the male make her better skilled with the saber and other melee weapons and to help balance this out make the male able to cause more damage but be less acurate the same can apply to the sentinel class, women are famous for being able to do multiple things at once and men for only being able to do one thing at once this could be reflected in the skills table in that female sentinel's are able to learn a large amount of skills to a reasnable level and men not so many as the women but more than the jedi guardian and to a high level now for the consular class this one took some thinking untill i remebered something from MGS1 in that dr Naomi tells you that women naturally have more patience than men during your fight with sniper wolf any way i thought what if the female jedi consular is able to use more force powers more potently and master them to a higher level and the men having less patience than the women have would be able to learn more force power's due to rushing ahead and not mastering them to the highest level they would also have less force points than a female consular but more than the other classes regardless of thier gender well what do you guy's anything else you would like to add and also let me know what you think of my idea good or bad.


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Old 01-31-2007, 12:12 PM   #2
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Wow, you wrote that entire thing as one run-on sentence..... seriously, just 1 period.

Sentence structure aside, I don't like the idea to an extent. I do like more context sensitive events revolving around character gender. It basically makes for 4x the gameplay. I think that making actual stats different is going to far. Maybe a segment where you are female, so you can squeeze through a tight space where as a man would have to go a seperate way for example. The more of that, the better.
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Old 01-31-2007, 12:29 PM   #3
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That was incredibly hard to read... I don't mean to be a grammar Nazi, but please try to use a few periods.

I actually don't like the idea... If I want to be a male character, but want to work on my accuracy, would that mean I'd have to use a female avatar? I just think it complicates things.
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Old 01-31-2007, 12:41 PM   #4
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I completely disagree. I'm a psychology student and alot of the above is stereotypes... Is there any real evidence for example that woman are actually better at multi-tasking? Or are you just going at a stereotype that the media feeds to you, without any real evidence to support this supposition. From all the literature I've read I havent come across any evidence proving men or woman are any better at multi-tasking than the other, I would infer intelligence would be a far greater determinator of the ability of an individual to multi-task. (sorry went into Uni mode hence long words). And while undoubtadly physically in terms of peak atheletes men are faster or stonger than woman, does this or should this come back to a computer game? At that level is there really much difference anyway, male 100m runners are only 0.whatever quicker than woman, in a fight or whatever I doubt that would really make too much difference.
Furthermore just because I'm a man doesnt make me automatically stronger than a woman... I'm pretty sure that womans olympic lifting teams can lift a substantal ammount more than me even though I'm a man. There is also the small matter of the force which means stength is no longer an issue as if you have a strong force conection regardless of gender you will be able to lift alot as you can use the force to help you, or even get it to do it for you (e.g. Yoda ESB).

So sorry, but I don't think its a particuarly good idea.



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Old 01-31-2007, 01:55 PM   #5
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I agree completely with jonathan7. Sure there are differences between men and women, but putting them into effect without completely generalizing the matter to the point of insult is another matter entirely.

Like who is smarter, men or women? Men seem to have larger brains according to british research IIRC, but women are said to multitask better. But then that's still just a generalization. It's not as if there aren't men out there who can multitask. Or women who are stronger and faster than some men (I'd bet than any female olympic athlete is probably both stronger and faster than I am).

So on that basis, who's to tell me what I can and cannot do as the gender I choose to play in an RPG? Even 2e AD&D accepted in the late 80s that letting gender influence stats was a lot more trouble than it was worth. It may be uncommon for a woman to be stronger than a man, but since any character you play in any RPG is unique, it really doesn't matter. I'd stick with that philosophy in any game.


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Old 01-31-2007, 02:24 PM   #6
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To be honest i think this is too specific content for a game. We may already have different aliens with character specifics. Who needs males and females anymore when we can have Mon Cals.


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Old 01-31-2007, 03:35 PM   #7
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Ever heard of female body builders? Women can be just as strong as men, so no, I don't like this idea.


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Old 01-31-2007, 05:22 PM   #8
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No, your character should be completely customizable.
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Old 01-31-2007, 05:59 PM   #9
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NNo, I disagree. Especially because Kotor is a game renowmed by its replaying possibilities, and people like to replay it with slight differences everytime. So, if you play as man first, and love sword fighting, you may get a little upset when you find out the woman caracter is not as powerful.
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Old 01-31-2007, 08:37 PM   #10
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I don't like this idea at all. I play as both genders and I like the different conversation options that depend upon your sex. However, I would not like a whole new character statistics system based upon your sex.

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Old 01-31-2007, 08:40 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reven0123
Now im not being sexist here just pointing out a few thing's id like to see and other's i hope in k3 now as we all know in real life a woman can't become as physically strong as a man can so instead of your female jedi guardian becoming as strong as the male make her better skilled with the saber and other melee weapons and to help balance this out make the male able to cause more damage but be less acurate
Nah. There's several problems with this idea, mainly that the things you listed can vary from individual to individual, that it would probably reduce sales of the game on account of being sexist, and that given how much stronger the Force makes a Jedi than the average person, gender wouldn't have much of a bearing then. (The average man or woman would get their ass kicked if they tried to kill 3 people)

Quote:
Originally Posted by reven0123
and men for only being able to do one thing at once
That's quite the generalization for several billion people.

Quote:
Originally Posted by reven0123
dr Naomi tells you that women naturally have more patience than men
Dr. Naomi was able to gather exact statistics on the patience of every man and woman on Earth? That certainly would strain one's patience.

Quote:
Originally Posted by reven0123
i thought what if the female jedi consular is able to use more force powers more potently and master them to a higher level
Since the most powerful Force-users in SW were men, nah.

In any case, I say keep gender to the dialogue.


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Old 01-31-2007, 08:41 PM   #12
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I dislike it intensly. The game becomes a lot different in K2 by changing gender...you get different party members, different romance options, and some new ways to complete a sidequest. So, genders do play a huge role in the KOTOR series, but for RP purposes only.
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Old 02-01-2007, 03:06 AM   #13
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Well, thats what STATS and ATTRIBUTES are for. If you want your males to be stronger , tougher with less force powers accurate give him more str and con and less wis and things.

Don't think there should be gender specific bonus, what do you want? Skill on pee standing up(crossclass for females)? Obviously the rp would be different, but I think thats good, but there is no need to do things like different bonuses and such.
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Old 02-01-2007, 08:01 AM   #14
Jae Onasi
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Every sentient is unique. I agree that if you'd like to make yours more 'gender-appropriate', whatever that is to each player, customize your stats accordingly.
There are indeed some physical differerences between men and women, but the range of strength/constitution/wisdom/intelligence differences is much greater _within_ each gender than it is _across_ genders.

It's a game, and Jedi are supposed to be a cut above the rest, so gender differences become slight.


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Old 02-01-2007, 10:46 AM   #15
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That was the one thing that pissed me off in Baldurs Gate II. Gender related attributes.
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Old 02-01-2007, 11:18 AM   #16
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right i get the idea people you dont like it and sorry about the bad grammer but i had just finished work and i was really tired.


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Old 02-01-2007, 04:25 PM   #17
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it is an interesting idea, but i can certainly some problems with it...most of which have been already stated.

even so, i think that you (reven0123) have an interesting idea, it would just needs to be tweaked down, so that each gender would have the ability of overcoming the gender related issues, without a hole lot of extra trouble.

for instance my female PC could at the start be given 2 extra strength points to even out the Gender related problems.
and that would essentially take the place of work outs or whatever, and make the hole thing seem Plausible.

all in all this idea has many shortcomings, and way too many flaws, but with work it could be an interesting addition to the game.
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Old 02-01-2007, 05:19 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonathan7
I completely disagree. I'm a psychology student and alot of the above is stereotypes... Is there any real evidence for example that woman are actually better at multi-tasking? Or are you just going at a stereotype that the media feeds to you, without any real evidence to support this supposition. From all the literature I've read I havent come across any evidence proving men or woman are any better at multi-tasking than the other, I would infer intelligence would be a far greater determinator of the ability of an individual to multi-task. (sorry went into Uni mode hence long words). And while undoubtadly physically in terms of peak atheletes men are faster or stonger than woman, does this or should this come back to a computer game? At that level is there really much difference anyway, male 100m runners are only 0.whatever quicker than woman, in a fight or whatever I doubt that would really make too much difference.
Furthermore just because I'm a man doesnt make me automatically stronger than a woman... I'm pretty sure that womans olympic lifting teams can lift a substantal ammount more than me even though I'm a man. There is also the small matter of the force which means stength is no longer an issue as if you have a strong force conection regardless of gender you will be able to lift alot as you can use the force to help you, or even get it to do it for you (e.g. Yoda ESB).

So sorry, but I don't think its a particuarly good idea.
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Old 02-05-2007, 12:46 AM   #19
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hmm interesting idea, i like it
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Old 02-05-2007, 06:11 AM   #20
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Well, I can understand the variation is needed for some particulat alien species, like Dark Elves and D&D. I remember such variation exists in Star Wars also, although examples escapes me for the moment. But generally even a simple bonus of +/-2 in stats(usually confers to a +/- 1 bonus) means a great difference in ability. And no, the sifference in gender is not big enough to confer such bonus. And if you are talking about bonus due to social differences, those would be taken care of by rp.
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Old 02-05-2007, 02:11 PM   #21
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Too many reasons have been given to limit the differences to dialogue and NPC actions. Limiting attribute bonuses based on sex really defeats the purpose of the D&D character advancement system.
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Old 02-05-2007, 09:58 PM   #22
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No time now to say much sorry, but I think your on to something. Your not being sexist but covering all your bases. So Reven0123 good idea you should delve deeper into that thought


Savior, conquerer, Hero, Villian... You are all things Revan, and yet you are nothing. In the end you belong to neither the darkness nor the light. You will forever stand alone.
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Old 02-07-2007, 04:30 AM   #23
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Yeah, I’ll jump on the band wagon and also say that it isn’t a good idea, for reasons that have already been said on this thread by other members, but mainly what jonathan7 said.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jediphile
I'd bet that any female is stronger and faster than I am.
Fixed.

Sorry man, couldn't resist.


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