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View Poll Results: Who Would Win In A Fight To The Death?
Revan 32 58.18%
Exile 16 29.09%
Stalemate: Either both give up, kill eachother, or an Other answer to be explained in post. 7 12.73%
Voters: 55. You may not vote on this poll


Thread: Revan Vs. Exile
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Old 05-31-2007, 05:20 AM   #1
True_Avery
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Question Revan Vs. Exile

[Look below before voting!]

I have not found a thread concerning this, so I shall post it since it has been mentioned a few times in the Vs. threads. Out of all Vs. I find this one to be the most interesting and am interested in seeing what the community thinks of the Kotor main characters.

Our two heroes, or our two villains from our oh so loved Kotor games. Kreia's two most valued pupils... one she feels as if she is looking into the heart of the Force, and the other who she sees the death of the Force through.

One who excelled at teachings and became a Knight at an early age, leaving the Order to nearly single handedly leading the Republic to victory, turning around and attacking the Republic in a move to save the Republic from the True Sith, surviving death and destroying Malak and the Star Forge, and finally leaving to single-handedly take on the True Sith threat to the Galaxy to finish a conflict they started by creating the Mandalorian Wars that began the horrible spiral downward for the Galaxy.

Another who excelled at bonding with anybody he/she came in contact with and absorbing their skills to learn quickly, leaving the Order behind to follow Revan to war against the Mandalorians, becoming one of Revan's best Generals and winning many key victories, did the most extreme form of Force separation to save his/her self at Malachor V and becoming a literal wound in the force, Exiled but eventually coming back to save or destroy the Jedi Order and take on the Sith threat, being the single only being to destroy Nihilus, returning to Malachor and defeating the Sith Lords Sion and Traya, and then leaving alone to find Revan to help him/her fight the True Sith threat.

Both are masters at tactical combat, Revan somewhat moreso than Exile.
Both have proven to be masters with lightsabers and won many battles with some of the best in the galaxy.
Both are strong in the Force, Revan naturally strong and Exile gaining more control after regaining connection.

Revan has advanced mastery over the Force and a nact for learning huge amounts of things extremely quickly. Revan fought with Jar'kai (Twin Sabers, if you decide to follow the scene in TSL) and defeated Jedi and Sith with ease in the quest for the Star Forge.

Exile is a wound in the Force, much like Nihilus. Like Nihilus' hunger, the Exile's natural nact for creating Force bonds with all that stay around him/her eventually got to the point of eating the Force/Sanity/Life out of each of her companions. Also a known master of lightsaber combat, though lightsaber specifics have not been given besides the Exile's personal crystal.

So, who would win in a fight between the two?

That question is far too simply and usually ends up with two people in an empty room destroying eachother... so lets add a few different scenarios.

Scenario 1#: Revan and Exile meet in unknown space, so Revan decides to test the Exile to see if taking the Exile along for the ride would be worth while and not a waste of time and energy. This is a duel, not a fight to the death... simply a test of strengths. Who would win this first duel?

Scenario 2#: Both the Exile and Revan must fight each other, preferably only till one gives up but with all the intent to win in the world. They find that advanced Force powers like Lightning, Push, ect are all not working, so they must fight only with their lightsabers and their physical bodies. Who wins the lightsaber duel?

Scenario 3#: Both the Exile and Revan must fight eachother, preferably only till one gives up but with all the intent to win in the world. Both of them misplace or find their lightsabers unable to use. They must fight only with the Force and the Force alone, no physical combat at all. Who wins the Force duel?

Scenario 4#: Revan and Exile meet and end up having to face eachother for one reason or another to the death. This is all the way, no holds bar battle to the death to which there can only be 1 standing in the end. Who triumphs over the other?

These fights should take place in a barren wasteland, infinite space and nothing but the two of them.

Scenario 1, 2, and 3 can be a winner of Revan, Exile, or a Stalemate.

Scenario 4 must have a winner of Exile or Revan, but if you have evidence or an explanation it can be a Stalemate. This Scenario is the Scenario that applies to the poll of this thread.

Now, let the fanboy/fangirl battle commence!
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Old 05-31-2007, 05:43 PM   #2
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Actually, there have been several threads like this before, though I like this one the best since it deals with multiple scenarios.

I've never been 100% sure on which one of these two would win. IMHO, they seem to be pretty equal, to one extent or the other. Both are masters with lightsabers, and both have a great command over the Force. Revan is, of course, the better tactical commander, but that wouldn't have any importance in a 1 on 1 duel. So to get on with each scenario -

Scenario #1: Stalemate

Since neither one would be trying their hardest, I think this one would just go on forever until one of them beefed up the intensity. Needless to say, this would be enough for Revan to be "impressed" enough to take the Exile along.

Scenario #2: The Exile

The Exile led multiple major battles to victory in the Mandalorian War, and after he completely lost his connection to the Force, he became more powerful than he ever had been before. He was already a great fighter in the Mando War, but after becoming stronger (and showing this by fighting off endless waves of Sith Assassins everywhere he went), I think he would be too much for Revan.

Scenario #3: Revan

Revan learned several Sith techniques at Malachor V, techniques that the Exile was unaware of. Putting them along side his other Force abilities, his knowledge of the Force would outmatch just about anyone.

Scenario #4: The Exile

I'm not going to go on some long rant about this, I'm just going to say what I think and be done with it.

The Exile is a superior lightsaber duelist, and his Force abilities are not too far behind Revan's. IMHO, having a slightly higher knowledge of the Force would not help Revan enough in a 1 on 1 battle.
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Old 05-31-2007, 05:54 PM   #3
SilentScope001
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Again, who wins? LucasArts. They're the guys who control who would win such a match.

Quote:
Scenario 1#: Revan and Exile meet in unknown space, so Revan decides to test the Exile to see if taking the Exile along for the ride would be worth while and not a waste of time and energy. This is a duel, not a fight to the death... simply a test of strengths. Who would win this first duel?
Exile. The goal of the duel is to test to see if Exile is actually good, and he is a good Jedi, hence Exile should win this duel easily. The goal is to test, not to blow up Exile.

Quote:
Scenario 2#: Both the Exile and Revan must fight each other, preferably only till one gives up but with all the intent to win in the world. They find that advanced Force powers like Lightning, Push, ect are all not working, so they must fight only with their lightsabers and their physical bodies. Who wins the lightsaber duel?
Neither. Since while the gender and alignment of Revan and Exile are canon, their class is not. So, basically, I could say Revan is a Consular who uses only pistols and the Force and Exile is an awesome Guaradin, and Exile would win that match. Therefore, it does sound meaningless...Assuming Revan and Exile are both Guardains however...

Has to be Exile. Revan's strengths seem to be running huge armies, and leading them to their death (like in Malachor V)...not running around with lightsabers and force powers. The Exile seems to be good in close combat, and due to the fact that The Exile gain more powerful by murdering stuff (thereby increasing his Lightsaber abilities), it seems obivous The Exile is great.

Quote:
Scenario 3#: Both the Exile and Revan must fight eachother, preferably only till one gives up but with all the intent to win in the world. Both of them misplace or find their lightsabers unable to use. They must fight only with the Force and the Force alone, no physical combat at all. Who wins the Force duel?
Again, class is declared uncanon. I could say Revan is a Guardain and that Exile is a Consular/Jedi Master. So, nah.

Assuming same class though: I'm betting on Exile, due to his abilities of gaining Force from his force bonds of dead people.

Quote:
Scenario 4#: Revan and Exile meet and end up having to face eachother for one reason or another to the death. This is all the way, no holds bar battle to the death to which there can only be 1 standing in the end. Who triumphs over the other?
Assuming that Exile and Revan are the same class, then I'm still betting on Exile. Sorry Revan.

Now...something to ponder:

Scenario #5: Exile and Revan have to battle with 100 Raktan ships. Who will win?

That scenario, I'll hand it over to Revan, altough that is due to what we know currently. To be quite fair, Exile may be a better general, but there is no evidence pointing towards that, and Revan was the head of the Republic's Army. The only evidence of Revan's tactical power is him winning the Battle of Malachor V by blowing up his own troopers, which doesn't sound like a very good battle.


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Old 05-31-2007, 06:17 PM   #4
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1) whatever.

2) Exile. Probably better with the lightsaber, and life without the force tightens her fighting styles.

3) Revan. I am pretty sure He acquired many lost techniques during his travel.

4) Exile? I mean, "a barren wasteland, infinite space and nothing but the two of them" SO without supplies, gears, items, weapons, clothings... Canon Revan would be transfixed by Canon Exile's pouncing puppies, and got KO before he knows it. Actually I think it would be a draw, in that both would die from the injuries. It all depends on who gets the jump first. If exile is able to get close then Revan would be in trouble, IF.

5) Revan. I mean Revan can probably beat Bastila with her Battle meditation with tactics alone.
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Old 05-31-2007, 07:03 PM   #5
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Well I'm beginning to develop a taste for these versus threads.

First off, I gotta say that I'll be fairly biased (poor choice of words) in Revan's favor. This is supposed to be my personal opinion, after all.

1) In such a scenario, I figure Revan would momentarily drop his guard somewhere along the battle to see if the Exile is smart and perceptive enough to take advantage of such opportunities. Or something along this line. Since the Exile is no pushover, I guess this would be concluded with the Exile's "victory".

2) I'm not good at finding and citing sources, but if I remember correctly, Revan has already mastered several lightsaber forms, while the Exile has just learned them from Masters. Although the Exile is known to be a quick study, I'm still putting my money on Revan.

3) I have a lot of faith in Revan's vast knowledge and Force abilities.

4) All in all, I think Revan is superior. If it were a matter of life and death, I don't think Revan would give a chance to the Exile.

5) I won't even go there.
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Old 05-31-2007, 07:59 PM   #6
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Scenario 1)

This doesn't count. Revan is trying to test the Exile, not fight him at all, so the Exile is SUPPOSED to win.



Scenario 2) Meh, stalemate. They both end up killing each other. See, they both let their guards down at the same time, attack the holes, and they end up stabbing each other, thus forcing them to give up.

Well, remember, there are many Force powers that a Jedi or Sith can subconcsiously use to steady him/herself in combat. A Jedi uses the Force running through him(/her) to boost his attributes. It isn't anything direct, but just because all of their "named" Force powers are gone doesn't mean that they don't use the Force in combat. Revan is stronger in the Force, but in my opinion, Exile is stronger in lightsaber combat.


Scenario 3)

Revan. Revan is stronger in the Force, and knows unknown (that sound weird) Sith techniques to tip the tide in combat. While the Exile can have battle meditation, that is not cannon, so it is unfair to make that assumption.

Scenario 4)

Stalemate. Picture it; Fight goes on for days and days, and when each one starts to feel fatigue, they refuel themselves with the Force until the Force out of them is sucked dry and they have to wait a week before it can regenerate. First few hours are subtle, a match of the Force, each studying each other. THen, they leap at each other.

Meh. Exile stabs Revan in heart, and at the same time, Revan is about to unleash Force Lightning - the Exile is weakened, so it is a death blow.


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Old 06-01-2007, 12:25 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EagerWeasel
The Exile is a superior lightsaber duelist, and his Force abilities are not too far behind Revan's. IMHO, having a slightly higher knowledge of the Force would not help Revan enough in a 1 on 1 battle.
Ok now where the heck did you come up with this idea??

One's knowledge and power of the force MAKE them a great dualist. Dualing ability would only vary a few percent up or down with force ability due to the fact that when "powerful" Jedi duel they can read the other's mind, but they must also use their force knowledge to cloud their thoughts. It is using the force in this way that makes Jedi one man armies (as seen in the clone wars saga, as they predict blaster shots, explosions and the enemies tactics. However it leaves them open to their allies due to the extensiveness of force use, I.e. Darth Malek's betrayal and Order 66 in Ep 3). The more powerful being has always one almost every time in the entire star wars saga. This leads me to believe Revan is most definately more powerful than the Exile.

MY ANALYSIS OF THE TWO

The Exile was a powerful Jedi and is very unique in her own way. It is her uniqueness that allows her many victories however. Lets look at her achievements:
1) served in mandalorian wars under the Jedi Revan and led many battles to victory

2) defeated enemy Sith lords:

- Darth Sion: the defeat here was breaking his will to make him release the darkside within him that was holding him together. We really don't know if Darth Sion was really that powerful. If the Exile had defeated him on Korriban then i would say the Exile would be the victor here, but Sion was the weaker apprentice of Darth Traya

- Darth Nihilus: OK this is a big achievement! This Sith lord destroyed entire planets and killed countless Jedi, even Jedi Knights and Jedi Masters. HOWEVER, the Exile defeated a severely weakened Nihilus who found his powers were useless on her. Notice the conversation dialogue "You are now weakened. Weak enough to be defeated." This leads me to believe that the Exile could not have defeated Nihilus, but at the same time we have no proof that Revan could defeat Nihilus at full strength (if Nihilus didn't drain him to death straight away...). Even though a watered down victory, a victory none the less

- Darth Traya: This was the Exile's greatest achievement. Darth Traya had a very powerful knowledge of the force and it would have taken great strength to defeat her. However, Darth Traya was severely handicapped here and only had one hand. No matter how powerful you are as a Jedi or a Sith having one hand is a severe disadvantage. While i believe that a single blade is the better choice, not having the second hand to increase your speed, damage and attack/block vercitility removes nearly every advantage it has. Even so, her knowledge of the force would have been a very powerful weapon in itself and aided her lightsaber fighting to still be a challenge. None the less, this was another fight we do not know would have been possible given Kreia's condition...



REVAN
Compare these to Revan who was THE dark lord of the Sith and then turned back to the light as a Jedi.

1) He LED the Jedi in the wars! The Exile's victories were only some of the many battles that Revan co-ordinated! This would require much more delicacy and skill so it is safe to say that Revan was a far more achieved commander than the exile.

2) He defeated Darth Malek who was the dark lord of the sith of the day. We do not have any scope really on how powerful the Exile was, so we do not know for sure if she could have defeated Malek too. Bastilla was a powerful Jedi and was used to mop the floor by Malek. We are led to believe that this was a hard fought battle by Revan, which he won. Also, Darth Malek claims that he had become more powerful than his former master Darth Revan, who was undisputably powerful. Revan defeated Malek in his new, light side equivelent, so if this is true, Revan became MORE powerful than he was as the Sith lord.


CONCLUSION
I do not believe the Exile to be weak. She was no ordinary Jedi and very powerful, capable of defeating the majority of force users. Revan was VERY powerful and i think and would win very convincingly over the Exile.

I really can't understand people's reasons behind chosing the exile?


!!!!!EVERYONE PLEASE READ THIS!!!!!

Why is everyone saying "Revan would be a consular and Exile a guardian"?? WHY? This is meant to be a real life question (so to speak) not a LAN Revan vs Exile using the KOTOR engine. The only reason we have force specialist classes and saber specialist classes is for AD&D style balance and for variety in game play. You should be regarding ALL Jedi as sentinals if anything. Look at the movies. Force powers grow with your skill with a lightsaber! Anakin loses to Dooku, his POWERS grow hence his DUALING grows and he wins the second time round. Yoda was elite in the Force right? So that means he cannot dual? Yeah right! Watch Ep3. The only controversy to this is Windu's defeat of Sidious, which was debatably a thrown fight, timed for Anakin to intervene and end his ties with the Jedi. How did Kreia put up a good fight at the end of TSL with one hand? Yes she used the force as a weapon but it also gave her some edge in the duel she to hold out for as long as she did. Take both characters as sentinals if your going to think in terms of the game engine!

!!!! PLEASE READ THE ABOVE !!!!!
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Old 06-01-2007, 12:36 AM   #8
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Quote:
CONCLUSION
I do not believe the Exile to be weak. She was no ordinary Jedi and very powerful, capable of defeating the majority of force users. Revan was VERY powerful and i think and would win very convincingly over the Exile.

I really can't understand people's reasons behind chosing the exile?
1) Revan fanboyism. People like Revan a lot, and in anger, many people choose the Exile to spite the fanboys.

2) Exile's "specialness" makes him dangerous. Revan is limited only by his Mithochordians, but The Exile is a wound in the force. Basically, the more he kills, the more powerful he becomes. The Exile killed a ton of people, and therefore, gains lot of Force Power. Revan kills someone and he gets...nothing.


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Old 06-01-2007, 12:57 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockstar
One's knowledge and power of the force MAKE them a great dualist.
Then I guess Guardians aren't such great fighters after all...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockstar
I really can't understand people's reasons behind chosing the exile?
As SilentScope said, Revan's power is limited. He can only reach a certain point where his abilities end. The Exile, however, can grow as powerful as he wants. All he has to do is kill someone, and he gets more powerful. That's part of what makes him so unique. He forms bonds, and leeches the life off others, drawing it to himself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockstar
Why is everyone saying "Revan would be a consular and Exile a guardian"??
I don't know of anyone who said that. Instead of thinking on terms of classes, why don't we all just use what we know of their abilities.
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Old 06-01-2007, 01:06 AM   #10
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I believe the Jedi Exile would, since his/her power became much stronger over the cause of the game, (Maybe because of the echo in the Force), making him/her much stronger than Revan in my opinion.
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Old 06-01-2007, 01:16 AM   #11
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I would have to go with the Exile, especially since you're going by the events that happened after the death of Kreia.

I believe that Revan was the more powerful one during the Mandalorian Wars. But when the Exile re-established his/her connection to the Force, he/she became more powerful than Revan after the defeat of Darth Traya at Malachor V.


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Old 06-01-2007, 01:50 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilentScope001

2) Exile's "specialness" makes him dangerous. Revan is limited only by his Mithochordians, but The Exile is a wound in the force. Basically, the more he kills, the more powerful he becomes. The Exile killed a ton of people, and therefore, gains lot of Force Power. Revan kills someone and he gets...nothing.
"Even then, you could see the Jedi that he slew etched onto his soul" - Kreia on Revan.

Revan may not feed on their deaths, but he gains a better understanding of the Force and gains . . . in game terms . . . emperience. You must remember, that no matter how much the Exile feeds on, he still can't surpass his Force potential, which I think is just a little bit lower than Revan's? My opinion, again, this is all speculation.

The midichlorians (not mithochordians ) still influence the Exile as the Force runs through him, even if he is not part of it. He can't kill and kill until he becomes a God .


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Old 06-01-2007, 01:58 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by Lord Spitfire
The midichlorians (not mithochordians ) still influence the Exile as the Force runs through him, even if he is not part of it. He can't kill and kill until he becomes a God .
I don't see why not. Seems to be the case with Nihilus, which is most probably what the Exile will one day become unless she can get some kind of control over her force bonds and currently mild hunger.
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Old 06-01-2007, 03:10 AM   #14
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Or you guys basing you opinion on gameplay? Like for example "Revan was a consular and therefore he would lose a lightsaber duel". Or "The Exile killed all those thungs, and it made her stronger"...
If gameplay counts, Mira utterly defeats Revan as well.


It appears to me, that those classes are only in the game to serve gameplay (they're the standart fighter-mage-hybrid classes).
In starwars however, I get the impression that the more powerful you are in the force, the more powerful you are in lightsaber combat. Sidious, Yoda, Mace, Anakin, Luke...
It makes sense: through the force you can probably obtain higher moving speed, better reflexes, you can "read" your opponent etc.

So I will leave gameplay out of this, and just base my opinion on what is said in the games.

Exile:
Very proficient at lightsaber combat, Kavar said something like "I knew you were something special the first time I saw you training with a lightsaber"

Kreia claims: "I never had a better student". That means that the Exile is equal or superior to the Revan Kreia once KNEW.

Mandalore (with cheated 100 influence ) says something like "I thought Revan was unique - but then I met you, your ethics, your way to fight. Not even our strongest warriors stand a chance against you"
This suggests that the Exile and Revan are equal in power. And unlike Kreia, Mandalore knows the "most recent" Revan.

So based on that information which exist in the game, Revan and the Exile appear to be equal in power, with Revan having more "raw" power, and the Exile increasing her power after she reconnects to the force.

But as Revan is a better tactician, and presumably has access to techniques and force powers the Exile has not, i'd say when it comes to each of those 3 scenarios, Revan is the winner. If they both have the same knowledge and experience, it's a draw.
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Old 06-01-2007, 05:02 AM   #15
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The Exile became a freak of nature, she Evolved to counter her weakness and she wouldn't be like any foe Revan has faced, and Revan (although much more powerful) would be like all the other force sensitives the Exile had fought.... But, Revan and K1 Rule!!!! No, Revan was a strategic genius, and a battle veteran I'm sure he'd find some way to trick her or trap her or something.
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Old 06-01-2007, 02:03 PM   #16
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I tend to favor Revan. The exile has unique abilities, but I've seen nothing to suggest he can use those in a fight against Revan. The exile grows powerful at the end of TSL, but Revan was already fairly potent at the end of KotOR and now five years have passed, four of which was spent entirely in enemy territory. If Revan also began to remember his abilities as a Sith, he could be insanely powerful by the time the exile finds him...

But who cares. If the devs of KotOR3 want Revan and/or exile to be killed by a couple of gizka, then they will. And frankly, listening to the fanboys, I do find myself sometimes wishing for that just to prove a point


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Old 06-01-2007, 07:18 PM   #17
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Well, to be fair I think it boils down to this:
Revan: The Brains, The Knowledge. Enough of these and one can break even own limits with weird techniques.
Exile: 1337 Skillz, pwnage built-in ability.

As said, the sooner the two get into combat range the better for Exile. But even then Revan's cunningness is not to be rekoned with so she has to be careful.

As for saber combat, force powers and saber skillz are not mutually exclusive. Though it is true that to be a good duelist you must spend quite some time with saber training, and that might take away time for training and research on other force skills. Maul would be a nice example of really refined saber duelists. That does not mean he is week with the force, just that he spends most of his time with combat related things, and less with other technique.
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Old 06-01-2007, 10:29 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by PoiuyWired
As for saber combat, force powers and saber skillz are not mutually exclusive. Though it is true that to be a good duelist you must spend quite some time with saber training, and that might take away time for training and research on other force skills. Maul would be a nice example of really refined saber duelists. That does not mean he is week with the force, just that he spends most of his time with combat related things, and less with other technique.
This shows you have no idea how the force works in combat. What use would offensive dark side powers be? Lightning? Would have been blocked. Darth Tyrannus used no force powers in Ep3 but he did in Ep2. Tell me? What did he get weaker over time? NO!

Against a formidable Jedi, dark force powers are useless as they
1) take their force focus off predicting their opponent's moves and would certainly be cut down
2) can be blocked and/or absorbed by powerful Jedi. I believe mace windu could have absorbed lightning, but why? he had his weapon out and turned the arc of lightning back at palpatine.
3) as a jedi or a Sith, the only move you have any time to do is a quick push. The force works through you as a weapon to predict your enemy and cloud your own thoughts to stop them from reading you! Read my earlier post in this thread for more info.


WHY REVAN?
Only a dark side exile would seek to kill enough enemies to grow her powers to beat him, and the canon is lightside! Either way, if you believe what i do and that the Exile cannot pass her potential, then Revan's higher potential makes him the winner both Short and Long term. Kreia said the exile was her best student. A good student means nothing of power potential. Maybe the exile was just more disciplined (which shows as she resisted the dark side while Revan... well he fell) or learned faster.
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Old 06-01-2007, 10:37 PM   #19
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A good student means nothing of power potential. Maybe the exile was just more disciplined (which shows as she resisted the dark side while Revan... well he fell) or learned faster.
Revan didn't fall . . . he embraced the Dark Side, so that once he conquered the Republic, he could prepare it for the True Sith attack .


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Old 06-05-2007, 01:36 AM   #20
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Revan. Exile was an accomplished and powerful Jedi, no doubt, but what made her special?
-Her innate ability to form bonds with others easily (irrelevant in a dueling context)
-Her force wound (also irrelevant in this context). Other than that, she was just a good Jedi.

Revan though, what was he?
-He was a great leader (in a different way from the Exile, but still irrelevant in thsi context)
-A great tactician (actually applicable here, to a certain extent. A great strategic mind is still an asset in a swordfight)
-Exceptionally powerful in the force.

Toss away Revan's strategic advantage, raw intelligence, and you still have Revan winning. It's Powerful Jedi vs Exceptionally Powerful Jedi. Why should the Exile win?

I suppose one might attempt to construct some weak argument that Revan wasn't all that more powerful than normal Jedi, but you're still left with a basically level playing field.

What I'm driving at is that if you ignore all of Revan's advantages, the Exile still has none and it's a coin toss, and it's stupid to disregard Revan's advantages anyways, so I don't see how the Exile could possibly win. (Not that the Exile would be an easy opponent for anyone, not by a long shot).


On A Scenario by Scenario basis, though:
1) I agree this is pretty meaningless. The Exile would almost certainly pass whatever test Revan had for her. But so what?
2) Revan. Revan was noted for swordsmanship, the Exile was not. Revan had a strategic, deep, thoughtful mind, the Exile was not noted for such. Revan has the advantage.
3) Tough call. Revan/stalemate. Revan was more powerful, but I'm of the opinion that any Jedi of sufficient power would be able to adequately defend themselves from (or at least balance out) any force onslaught. It could be a matter of endurance, in which case I'd give Revan the edge in the end, but then again, maybe the force wound could mean something in this regard after all. Enough to beat Revan?
4) See above. Everything accounted for, Revan has the advantage.


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Old 04-07-2008, 09:12 AM   #21
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In terms of force connection no one is close to Revan. The Exile was not powerful in a natural way, she got her powers from her "wound". Without it she would have been just above an avarage Jedi. But like Nihilus she is almost like an abomination born at Malachor.

A black hole..

Although she defeated Sion, Traya and Nihilus, so she definitely deserves some credit


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Old 04-07-2008, 09:18 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by Knight Of Honor
In terms of force connection no one is close to Revan.
Says who?

Quote:
The Exile was not powerful in a natural way, she got her powers from her "wound".
Actually, the Exile got her powers through her connections with others. The wound only showed her how to use those connections.


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Old 04-07-2008, 12:37 PM   #23
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Scenarios 1-3 are absurd. In a thread like this there's no need for sissy rules. Therefore, I'll only answer Scenario 4.

I'd say the outcome of #4 could easily depend on how far the Exile is progressed. There's a good chance he could kill Revan using the same sort of super-drain that Nihilus used, but that may depend on whether or not he's dark-sided. Aside from that, I fail to see how any of the outcomes could be determined. Unlike basically everyone else here, I don't pretend to know what Revan/Exile's capabilities are.


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Old 04-07-2008, 02:10 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by JCarter426
Says who?
Well Vandar, Zhar & the other K1 Masters say that Revan's Force potential is unlimited and that the force flows through him like no student they have ever seen before. Vandar & Vrook definetely knew the Exile, as they were on Dantooine when she was training there as a padawan.

Anyway, the outcome of this battle is a tough one to call, although I'm inclined to say Revan; but the Exile's been growing on me recently, after my last TSL playthrough, so I can't say for certain.


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Old 04-07-2008, 03:48 PM   #25
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I think Cart was asking for a canonical fact, not an in-universe character's opinion.


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Old 04-07-2008, 05:02 PM   #26
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I think Cart was asking for a canonical fact, not an in-universe character's opinion.
So you mean to say that the K1 Masters' opinion on Revan is not canon? They're not biased towards Revan as Kreia is...ok, so maybe Zhar and Vandar a little, but Vrook admits it too and he doesn't like any of the Jedi who went to the Mando Wars, and especially Revan, the first one to go to war.


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Jolee: "Twelve! No, wait! Thirteen!"
Canderous: "Nice one, old man."
Jolee: "Thank you. It takes effort to be properly irreverent at my age."
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Old 04-07-2008, 05:17 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JK24
So you mean to say that the K1 Masters' opinion on Revan is not canon?
But it's still an opinion - where does it say out of the game that Revan was the strongest Jedi?

Until someone can come up with such proof, it's still an opinion.
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Old 04-07-2008, 07:24 PM   #28
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So you mean to say that the K1 Masters' opinion on Revan is not canon?
You're damned straight.


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Old 04-07-2008, 09:17 PM   #29
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Well Vandar, Zhar & the other K1 Masters say that Revan's Force potential is unlimited and that the force flows through him like no student they have ever seen before.
Well, a few things:

1. Revan was able to train in the Force so fast because he'd already done it before.

2. It's highly probably that the masters were just stroking Revan's ego, considering what they were asking him to do.

3. None of the Council had actually "seen" the Exile at that point (nor Nihilus for that matter). Before Malachor, the Exile was just an average Jedi with an interesting gift. Immediately after Malachor, the Exile had lost her connection to the Force, so the Council didn't see her as a threat until after they noticed the connection between her and Nihilus.

And on another matter...the Exile's bonding ability would actually be useful in a duel, because it allows the Exile to learn an opponent's fighting style quite quickly, allowing her to predict their movements.


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Old 04-07-2008, 11:32 PM   #30
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1. Exile. Since Exile's being tested by Revan, to say that Revan would keep going once Exile proved her effectiveness would point to Revan being a moron. The fight would end whenever Revan were sufficiently impressed.

2. Depends. If it was over quickly Revan. If the Exile could draw it out more, then Exile would win. Revan knows more about the force. Exile is a freakishly quick study.

3. Same thing as #2. Revan knows some devastating hidden secrets about the dark side of the force if his memory's been restored. If it was a no holds barred force power fight, it wouldn't be any problem to use one of those force abilities or secrets to quickly get rid of the Exile. If he failed though, and the exile survived the initial attack, the Exile would add the new force power to her repetoire, become effective against guarding against it, and even be able to use it against Revan for the rest of the fight and beyond. And I expect that Revan would have a quite large bag of tricks, and the Exile's bag of tricks would grow quickly as the battle went on.

So if Revan had a way to win decisively from the get go, he'd win. If not, then the exile would win through attrition.

4. I'd have to go with Revan here. There's a decent case that I've seen that Revan allowed for his betrayal by Malak in order to get the council to do much of the work of clearing up his followers and getting them on his side. Also before that, he turned his back on everything once before, the Jedi order, the Republic, all he loved, etc. in order to defeat the Sith Empire. Then he did it again when he went off to fight the true Sith.

Exile turned her back on everything that mattered to her once, to save her life, out of fear.

In terms of sheer determination and willingness to sacrifice in order to gain victory, Revan is more willing to give up something important to him than the Exile is, and I think that would be what the winner out of the two would come down to.

5. In regards to the Rakata ship scenario, Revan since he was the better tactician.


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Old 04-08-2008, 12:02 AM   #31
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In terms of sheer determination and willingness to sacrifice in order to gain victory, Revan is more willing to give up something important to him than the Exile is
The Exile gave up the Force. What's more important than that?


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Old 04-08-2008, 12:29 AM   #32
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The Exile gave up the Force. What's more important than that?
Your mind. Knowing who you are.


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Old 04-08-2008, 12:37 AM   #33
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Oh, Revan certainly wins there.


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Old 04-08-2008, 01:07 AM   #34
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Exile wins. Revan was unable to become the more powerful Prestige Classes, and is thus outmatched.
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Old 04-08-2008, 03:08 AM   #35
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My answers are unbolded.

Quote:
Originally Posted by True_Avery
[Look below before voting!]

Scenario 1#: Revan and Exile meet in unknown space, so Revan decides to test the Exile to see if taking the Exile along for the ride would be worth while and not a waste of time and energy. This is a duel, not a fight to the death... simply a test of strengths. Who would win this first duel?

Stalemate, they wouldn't be properly fightin, so nothin would happen.

Scenario 2#: Both the Exile and Revan must fight each other, preferably only till one gives up but with all the intent to win in the world. They find that advanced Force powers like Lightning, Push, ect are all not working, so they must fight only with their lightsabers and their physical bodies. Who wins the lightsaber duel?

Revan, As revan is a better duelist, and one of the most powerful dudes ever. He's just in a class of his own.

Scenario 3#: Both the Exile and Revan must fight eachother, preferably only till one gives up but with all the intent to win in the world. Both of them misplace or find their lightsabers unable to use. They must fight only with the Force and the Force alone, no physical combat at all. Who wins the Force duel?

Exile, as he is a wound in the Force, but if he wasn't a wound, probably a stalemate, as they are both really powerful in the force.

Scenario 4#: Revan and Exile meet and end up having to face eachother for one reason or another to the death. This is all the way, no holds bar battle to the death to which there can only be 1 standing in the end. Who triumphs over the other?

Revan, simply because he'd outclass him with a lightsaber.


Yes
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Old 04-08-2008, 03:22 AM   #36
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Exile is a woman.

And we don't really know how skilled either one was in lightsaber combat. All we know is that they both were skilled, and that the Exile was able to quickly pick up on an opponent's style. So the Exile has the advantage in a lengthy duel.

I didn't actually answer the scenarios, so I guess I will now...

#1. What? If Revan is just testing the Exile, then the Exile is obviously going to win.

#2. Exile. As I said above, the duel would last long enough for the Exile to pick up on Revan's style and use it against him.

#3. Stalemate. DS Exile (basically a new Nihilus) would win, though (that goes for all four scenarios, really).

#4. Same as #2.


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Old 04-08-2008, 09:07 AM   #37
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Thumbs up

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Exile wins. Revan was unable to become the more powerful Prestige Classes, and is thus outmatched.
QFE.


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Old 04-08-2008, 02:50 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by JCarter426
Exile is a woman.
Not when I play.


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Old 04-12-2008, 06:55 AM   #39
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^^^^

Thats right, i dont like it either when someone is telling me what is canon or not in a game i love so much. When i play, i find my own interpretation of different things in the game to make it fit with my own imagination, until Kotor3 tell us that the exile actually was a female, its not "canon"


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Old 04-12-2008, 08:09 AM   #40
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I'm not saying that you can't play as a male Exile (I do too sometimes, same with female Revan) but it's not canon. And it has nothing to do with KOTOR 3; K2 didn't tell you that Revan was male, did it? No, but that doesnt' change the fact that he is.


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