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Old 10-22-2007, 02:35 PM   #1
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Secret Apprentice: Stronger than Revan?

The previews we've seen show how powerful the Secret Apprentice is... could he as powerful, or even stronger, than Revan? That had me wondering because some of Mace Windu's comments in AOTC seem to imply that the Jedi are no longer as powerful as they were in Revan's time, but the Secret Apprentice is apparently strong enough to make a Star Destroyer crash.
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Old 10-22-2007, 04:25 PM   #2
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Hmm, that would be a good comparison. I think in the end Revan would win. He has much more experience with the Force and was a Sith Lord after all.


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Old 10-23-2007, 01:08 PM   #3
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Comparing a freaking apprentice with Revan is pointless IMO.


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Old 10-23-2007, 03:32 PM   #4
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I think Revan was a combination of several dangerous talents. Charisma, Force power, Intelligence. It's the combination of these that makes him strong.
The Charisma to form an army around him, the intelligence to lead them to victory and use them wisely combined with his power that makes him a frontline leader as well. The complete picture.

The Apprentice, on the other hand, is a social idiot (the "Force Wrecking Ball vid" shows he can't have proper contact with Juno and asks his droid to talk to her). His Intelligence seems limited as well, since he requires orders to handle. From Darth Vader, Kotha, whoever. He seems to have no will of his own. This is hinted as well on the site, where he is described to have been 'indoctrined' by Vader.
He makes this up with his pure Force Power though.

So stronger in total image? Hell no. In terms of absolute power or midi-clorians? Yes.

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Old 10-23-2007, 05:21 PM   #5
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He is the secret APPRENTICE, revan was a master.

Most likely the apprentice will become one of the greatest siths.
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Old 10-23-2007, 07:23 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickmc
He is the secret APPRENTICE, revan was a master.

Most likely the apprentice will become one of the greatest siths.
Not likely, but he may have converted someone to Sithdom though, knowingly or not.

I would so wish to see him fighting tuskens on Tatooine, and got his behind whipped by the tribal warlord with a hockey stick.
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Old 10-24-2007, 01:37 AM   #7
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I would chalk the star destroyer and Revan observations more to the limitations of the KotOR engine in comparison with the one powering TFU. Could he have done it?? Maybe, who knows...I'm going with Revan being stronger based on his various exploits and time as a force user.


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Old 10-24-2007, 04:40 PM   #8
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The placing of Revan on the highest pedestal strikes me as a bit of fankwankerage...

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Old 10-24-2007, 04:58 PM   #9
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Darth plaguous (or however it is spelled) was the most powerful sith in my opinion. Making life with midi-chlorians is just amazing.
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Old 10-25-2007, 07:13 AM   #10
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I belive Revan is the stronger. He knew both sides of the Force thorougly, laid down the basics of the Rule of Two, recorded the ritual of the Thought Bomb, conqered the galaxy almost without effort... The only two Dark Lords I could compare him with are Darth Plagueis and Darth Sidious. Of course, IF Sidious would train the Apprentice instead of Vader, he would have some chance at least.
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Old 10-25-2007, 03:00 PM   #11
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This Apprentice doesn't even officially exist yet, or at least the game isn't released yet.
Revan has earned his stripes and is a fan favorite.
Besides, as said before it's a different game engine and is a lot more far fetched than Kotor, so imo there incomparable.


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Old 10-25-2007, 09:28 PM   #12
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Actually, maybe the apprentice is not more powerful as such, just more versatile in how he uses what power he has. We never heard anything about Revan combining force powers, but it was said that in total power he was "the heart of the force."

Sort of the difference between being able to lift and throw a two ton car in a general direction and hope for the best, vs carefully targetting with a 1 ton car. Which is better, strength or precision?
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Old 10-27-2007, 04:36 AM   #13
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Precision, of course.
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Old 10-28-2007, 02:22 PM   #14
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Precision.

But now we maybe talking about throwing a 1 ton car with Precision, or throwing the whole parking lot in a general direction.
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Old 11-05-2007, 02:35 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prime
The placing of Revan on the highest pedestal strikes me as a bit of fankwankerage...
I know I'm guilty of a little bit of it. Actually probably a lot of it, I find it hard to swallow the cannoniacal superiority of Vader and Palpatine since even with the limited game engine of KotOR it always seemed like Revan did more to me. Now the question is could he have done what the apprentice does if the limitations of the KotOR engine were removed


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Old 11-06-2007, 11:39 PM   #16
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I think Revan would win because of the time period that he/she was in. More Jedi, and more Sith. Plus the higher knoledge of the force and the training was obviously better. Plus he/she practically became a Sith Lord on their own. I will take Revan over the secret apprentice anyday, also.


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Old 11-07-2007, 02:15 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LordSerion
I belive Revan is the stronger. He knew both sides of the Force thorougly, laid down the basics of the Rule of Two, recorded the ritual of the Thought Bomb, conqered the galaxy almost without effort... The only two Dark Lords I could compare him with are Darth Plagueis and Darth Sidious. Of course, IF Sidious would train the Apprentice instead of Vader, he would have some chance at least.
I'm not sure he did all this...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fish.Stapler
I know I'm guilty of a little bit of it. Actually probably a lot of it, I find it hard to swallow the cannoniacal superiority of Vader and Palpatine since even with the limited game engine of KotOR it always seemed like Revan did more to me. Now the question is could he have done what the apprentice does if the limitations of the KotOR engine were removed
But remember, a lot of what you can do in gameplay is just that. Gameplay itself is not canon, only the story elements are. So when comparing, you have to compare what Revan did story-wise.

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Old 11-08-2007, 05:18 AM   #18
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Why are you not sure?
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Old 11-08-2007, 02:16 PM   #19
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Also, it would depend on the nature of a conflict between them I would think. Would Revan have the time to plan out strategic attacks, or would it be a direct confrontation between the two, combat force powers and light sabers only?
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Old 11-08-2007, 10:19 PM   #20
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Well, there are LEGENDARY Force Users then there are ABOVE MASTER LEVEL BUT NOT LEGENDARY Force Users , I would consider Revan Legendary and the Apprentice a very gifted yet not legendary level individual.


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Old 11-12-2007, 05:25 PM   #21
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Darth Vader had the most "potential" power, he would have been more powerful than anyone had he not gotten his arms and legs chopped off and put in a cast iron suit
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Old 11-13-2007, 10:43 AM   #22
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Old 11-13-2007, 03:01 PM   #23
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Anakin had the most potential power before he got chopped up. But Force power = # of midichlorians in cells. He lost at least half his body mass when he became Vader.
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Old 11-13-2007, 04:32 PM   #24
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It's not only about potential, it's about how well you can control it as well. For example, Anakin as Vader was more powerful, because his Master taught him how to perfectly control every bit of his remained skills.
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Old 11-13-2007, 06:01 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jvstice
Anakin had the most potential power before he got chopped up. But Force power = # of midichlorians in cells. He lost at least half his body mass when he became Vader.
Well, its more to it than body mass. I mean, its not like a hutt being a great jedi cause of body mass, or yoda being a weak one. And Secura definitely don't become a good jedi cause of her phat TnA only.
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Old 11-13-2007, 06:56 PM   #26
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But its probably true that Anakin lost a lot of midichlorians when he was cut up. They're probably spread out proportionally throughout one's body so the body mass doesn't matter. I don't really know if thats how it works or not but it would make sense.


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Old 11-14-2007, 11:38 AM   #27
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Consider also the fact that there seem to be a set amount of midichlorians in an individual and losing them seems to be permanent.

In going back to Revan, no one know exactly what he did after he disappeared. For all we know he could have accomplished greater feats.
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Old 11-14-2007, 07:57 PM   #28
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So, jedis are more powerful if they don't shave...

Now, can midichlorians be transplanted? Since they can be detected there may be ways to manupilate them.
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Old 11-14-2007, 08:31 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PoiuyWired
So, jedis are more powerful if they don't shave...
I think that's pushing it a little.


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Old 11-15-2007, 07:02 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PoiuyWired
So, jedis are more powerful if they don't shave...

Now, can midichlorians be transplanted? Since they can be detected there may be ways to manupilate them.
Well, Darth Plagueis could manipulate them. But maybe they're "coded" to the person.
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Old 11-15-2007, 07:04 AM   #31
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I think that's pushing it a little.
Maybe that's why Obi-Wan had his beard...
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Old 11-15-2007, 10:59 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LordSerion
Well, Darth Plagueis could manipulate them. But maybe they're "coded" to the person.
Are you saying it's related to the genetics of a person?
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Old 11-15-2007, 03:55 PM   #33
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Yes, something like that. Perhaps it is a wrong example, but Grievous had Sifo-Dyas's blood after his transformation into a cyborg, and he had no Force powers.
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Old 11-16-2007, 11:25 AM   #34
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Yes, something like that. Perhaps it is a wrong example, but Grievous had Sifo-Dyas's blood after his transformation into a cyborg, and he had no Force powers.
If its related to the genetics, then one could manipulate them to imbue individual with the force. This would also defeat the idea of people being imbued with the force artifiacially.
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Old 11-16-2007, 12:26 PM   #35
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If its related to the genetics, then one could manipulate them to imbue individual with the force. This would also defeat the idea of people being imbued with the force artifiacially.
Well, in KotOR you had to find genetic samples for the Rakatan researcher. He said that his people once had Force powers, but this changed, and with samples perhaps he could restore that ability.
Artifically imbue one? Like in JK2 the Force crystals did with Reborn? Or using the Valley of the Jedi/Dark Lords?
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Old 11-17-2007, 05:10 PM   #36
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Secret Apprentice 0wnz Revan


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Old 11-18-2007, 02:50 AM   #37
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I think that Revan would win. He was a leader and not a follower. This is no the Revan 'fanboy' side of me talking, this is logic talking. Revan was overall stronger, and his skills are a lot more "tuned" than, I would expect, the secret apprentice's skills and powers are. But, of course, this is all pending with the release of The Force Unleashed.

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Old 11-18-2007, 05:43 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LordSerion
Well, in KotOR you had to find genetic samples for the Rakatan researcher. He said that his people once had Force powers, but this changed, and with samples perhaps he could restore that ability.
Artifically imbue one? Like in JK2 the Force crystals did with Reborn? Or using the Valley of the Jedi/Dark Lords?
I wonder if how the ability to use the force was used in so many games that it's to hard to explain now. They didn't explain how the force was artificially imbued in the reborn and why it worked, it just did. I am also pretty sure the Rakata had a disease that took the force away and the genetic samples were related to the disease somehow.
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Old 11-18-2007, 10:04 PM   #39
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I think its too early to decide, but the secret apprentice did move a star destroyer....
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Old 11-18-2007, 10:22 PM   #40
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It's all genetics, the Rakatan researched wanted the codes so he would try to switch on genes that would make an individual Force-sensitive. (That's my theory) So it's basically inherited, I wonder who could have been Yoda's dad...

And yeah, if you get chopped like poor Ani, you decrease in Force power, I think it revolves around the amount of tissue an individual has.


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