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Old 03-09-2008, 02:44 PM   #1
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Split from this thread ~tk

Let me answer that by asking you this: how come you literally beat people with your club, I mean lightsaber, several times before they die?


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Old 03-09-2008, 08:46 PM   #2
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The Cortosis weave prevents lightsabers from penetrating their blades.

Besides, it would be too easy if the saber made the PC into a god.


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Old 03-09-2008, 09:00 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by *Don*
The Cortosis weave prevents lightsabers from penetrating their blades.
The cortosis is restricted to the blades, as you say. But what about their body armor?

I agree that the answer is gameplay based, however.


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Old 03-09-2008, 09:45 PM   #4
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Well I guess that the body armor has other properties imbibed in it that saves the wearer. Although, by reading through the item descriptions, no such property is mentioned.


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Old 03-09-2008, 09:46 PM   #5
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The Cortosis weave prevents lightsabers from penetrating their blades.
Question 3: Why are the Clone Troopers and the Stormtroopers in the SW Movies do not have "Cortosis weaves"? Or, more to the point, why do the Jedi in the SW Movies no longer have "Cortosis weaves"?

And don't pull the old fashioned "But the Empire caused a dark age in technology"! I'll just pull the, "What about the clone war era?" question.


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Old 03-09-2008, 09:53 PM   #6
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Perhaps it was just too expensive to purchase "cortosis-weaves" for an entire army of clone/storm troopers. And they are quite expendable, IMO, because most are clones. Thats the first thing that comes to my mind.

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Old 03-09-2008, 09:55 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by SilentScope001
Question 3: Why are the Clone Troopers and the Stormtroopers in the SW Movies do not have "Cortosis weaves"? Or, more to the point, why do the Jedi in the SW Movies no longer have "Cortosis weaves"?

And don't pull the old fashioned "But the Empire caused a dark age in technology"! I'll just pull the, "What about the clone war era?" question.
Probably because of the same reason why Kolto is no longer available.

Eventually, my guess is, the producer of Cortosis was either contaminated or destroyed.


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Old 03-09-2008, 09:55 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilentScope001
Question 3: Why are the Clone Troopers and the Stormtroopers in the SW Movies do not have "Cortosis weaves"? Or, more to the point, why do the Jedi in the SW Movies no longer have "Cortosis weaves"?
As said before, Cortosis wasn't ever used on armors.

Edit: My mistake. Some Dark Troopers did. But it was a very specific ore. Not all have that characteristic.


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Old 03-09-2008, 09:58 PM   #9
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Ah-hem. I beg to differ.

Cortosis

As I said, it is very expensive.

EDIT: Isn't all cortosis ore the same?

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Old 03-09-2008, 10:06 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wikipedia
In the game Jedi Outcast, Galak Fyyar processes cortosis ore into a black armor that is used by his Shadowtroopers. He also builds a suit of power armor that he uses himself. It is unknown whether all cortosis ore deposits are capable of such processing; the ore Fyyar used was smuggled from Cloud City.
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Old 03-09-2008, 11:55 PM   #11
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Ah, thank you Ctrl_Alt_Del. It doesn't specify so I guess that all that we can do is assume...

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Old 03-10-2008, 06:03 AM   #12
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Stormtroopers didn't have Cortosis armor because it wasn't invented till 1997, plus you cant have the faceless bad-guy cannon fodder being unbeatable. Also "there are two types of cortosis—cortosis ore and cortosis alloy. Cortosis ore deactivates the lightsaber, and cortosis alloy simply blocks the blade, making cortosis something of a marvel of metallurgy, as nothing known about how the ore accounts for the relationship between the actions of circuit-interruption or energy-blade blocking. It should be noted, however, that cortosis is very brittle, and breaks easily. This is why it is mixed with other metals, to form cortosis alloy. However, the alloy loses the shut-down capability of the ore. Even when mixed, however, cortosis still makes the alloy weaker. At one point in Darth Bane: Path of Destruction it says that cortosis is incredibly hard, and even resistant to lightsabers"


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Old 03-10-2008, 06:40 AM   #13
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It's not that complicated, really. They didn't outfit Clones or Stormies with Cortosis gear because they were a mass-produced army of mooks who weren't going to be fighting Jedi or anyone else with a lightsaber enough to warrant arming them with stuff that expensive. Sure, Asajj Ventress and Grievous probably killed their fair share of Clones, but arming them all with Cortosis Armor would have been mostly pointless and likely would have also bankrupted the Republic. Just because you can print your money doesn't make hyperinflation something to strive for.
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Old 03-10-2008, 07:57 AM   #14
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Simply put: it's just a reason to explain why the game has the combat system that is does instead of everything dying in one hit.


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Old 03-10-2008, 11:08 AM   #15
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Well, from what I know pure cortosis is not a great metal to make things with, other than its special property against lightsabers. This is on top of them being expensive.

Remember, lightsabers are a rare sight in battle usually, and chances are your troopers would be attacked by various blasters, dakkas, kabooms, cannons, angry monsters, huge mecha, vibroblades... well before lightsabers. So instead of expensive anti-saber equipment it would be more practical to in stead provide them with economical equipment that would work well against regular danger they would face. Now, there is no saying that elite troops may have access to such equipment. So I am not at all surprised if some Red Guard pops out a cortosis shield or something.

An alloy with enough cortosis content can resist lightsaber, much like phick or red lobsters, but they are still too expensive to be mass produced for fodders.

That having said, there was cortosis droids(coated with cortosis stuff) built designed to fight jedis during Clonewars. Oh and various characters have small vambraces of cortosis, like Vos and those Yinchorr elite forces. Those things are deadly against those sabernuts, much more than those force gauntlets in Kotor.
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Old 03-10-2008, 02:56 PM   #16
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I honestly can't imagine an explanation better than Jasper's. His statement doesn't over-analyze stuff like I've seen elsewhere.

In addition to Poiuy's and Corinthian's points, I'm pretty sure that cortosis is pretty rare by the time of the movies in addition to being expensive. I'd say that the explanation for that is that most of the sources of the material were used up by then (same thing happened with yellow and orange lightsaber crystals).
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Old 03-14-2008, 01:59 AM   #17
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Spoilers for the unwary.
Yellow and orange crystals are alive and well! The fact many prequel Era Jedi prefer Adagen (Ilum) crystals that produce green or blue blades is one oft ignored. Besides, literally dozens of yellow and orange sabers appear in the New Jedi Order.
Back on topic, there are three main 'lightsaber proof' substances. The best known is Cortosis, a very rare mineral that, like Stygm cloaking crystals were sold at very high prices by the time of the Empire. Since Jedi and Sith were considerably more numerous then (4,000-1,000 BBY) than they were during later days it would make sense for companies to advertise the 'saber proof' feature to anyone in the underworld or overworld who might want such insurense if they met with a saber. Cortosis's other features have been discussed already on this thread, though I'd like to point out that it always seems to wind up used by bounty hunters or Jedi killers in Dark Horse comics.
As for the others, there's Phirik (spelling?) alloy which is what General Grievous's body guards have their staves made of. Again, this is not a common material.
The third is Mandalorian iron (beskar) which is only available on Mandalore. Freddon Nadd's tomb was plated with the stuff and it took Exar Kun a lot of effort wit ha powered up lightsaber to cut his way through. (Tales of the Jeid Dark Lords of the SIth) The Mandies kept the stuff to themselves or very high bidders until the Empire cameand strip-mined the planet so Palpatine could have the monopoly on such a valuable substance. In the Legacy of the Force series Mandalore Boba and his people unearth a new vein of the stuff. Why on earth the Neo-crusader armor in KotOR isn't made with it I don't know, the later suites of beskar gam in Republic Commando Triple Zero and True Colors has actual Mandalorian iron in it.
Okay, we all know it's just game mechanics. If they made lightsabers able to cut properly, you'd have to install more acurate and dealy blaster to compensate then factor in fatigue, vital organs and oh... Such a mess in our once tiddy mechanical rules ins't it?

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Old 04-12-2008, 06:10 PM   #18
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I think that the metal cortosis is kind of like gold, soft, but can be cut, eventually, through with a lightsaber, or anything else. If it becomes an alloy, it will be actually stronger than the original ore. The problem, near as I can tell, is that it is costly to mine, refine, and put into items.

As for, Kolto, I believe that bacta takes it's places. If you look further down on the page that ctrl-alt-del provided us, that you find kolto on there, as well as bacta. Just read bit further, you might find interesting things on there.


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Old 04-12-2008, 06:17 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sgt. Strike
As for, Kolto, I believe that bacta takes it's places. If you look further down on the page that ctrl-alt-del provided us, that you find kolto on there, as well as bacta. Just read bit further, you might find interesting things on there.
I have no doubt. Especially seeing how the galaxy couldn't rely on a substance that comes from only one place.


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Old 04-13-2008, 07:18 AM   #20
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I do agree that cortosis was overused, especially since it's suppose to be a rare mineral. Anyway, they should have done more of what they did with the Force Pike's.



Notice the energy field around the blade? That would have made it more Star Wars like if more of the melee weapons were like that.


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Old 04-13-2008, 07:44 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Shem
Notice the energy field around the blade? That would have made it more Star Wars like if more of the melee weapons were like that.
Plus, we see that effect in ROTS, with the Electrostaffs that Grievous' guards use.
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Old 04-13-2008, 10:15 AM   #22
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Force pikes have Cortosis in them as well, don't they? My understanding is that the energy field isn't meant to protect the weapon, but to smite enemies.


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Old 04-13-2008, 10:28 AM   #23
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The electrostaff was constructed of lightsaber-resistant phrik alloy (Same as some Lightsaber Emitters) equipped with electromagnetic pulse-generating tips. Some staffs could penetrate and neutralize ray shields, most were simply used as blunt-force melee weapons. They were designed to be longer than most lightsaber blades, enabling the user to fight Jedi while remaining out of the Jedi's range.

A Force Pike was more of a Tazer/Crowd controller than a Melee weapon I think


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Old 04-13-2008, 09:07 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adamqd
A Force Pike was more of a Tazer/Crowd controller than a Melee weapon I think
Indeed. But it could be charged and used as a lethal weapon. I believe the Handmaidens used it for sparring.

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Old 04-13-2008, 09:11 PM   #25
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In any case, the energy thingamabob wasn't what protected it from lightsabers; it too was made out of some lightsaber-resistant metal. This makes sense for the Handmaidens' staffs, but not for any others (aren't Jedi supposed to be the ones controlling the crowds?).


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Old 04-14-2008, 01:47 AM   #26
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One thing that I really don't understand is why a quarterstaff is resistant to a lightsaber! I guess that that is really just something that would normally be overlooked...to me it just doesn't make sense. But then again, this is probably due to the combat system...

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Old 04-14-2008, 03:47 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by Rev7
One thing that I really don't understand is why a quarterstaff is resistant to a lightsaber! I guess that that is really just something that would normally be overlooked...to me it just doesn't make sense. But then again, this is probably due to the combat system...
Don't forget longswords, shortswords, double-bladed non-vibro swords, fighting sticks pikes...

Anyways, it's most likely because of the combat system. It would just be too damn easy if generic thugs would flee/use their fists because you cut their precious metal blades, and since Cortosis is supposed to be rare, it would be almost impossible to buy Vibro-weapons on Taris (or anywhere else, for that matter) because of the inflated cost, and that only the richest crimelords could supply it, albeit sparingly, not to mention that Vibro-weapons are supposed to vibrate at supersonic speeds, making a simple slash complete mutilation and incapacitance (most likely results in eventual death) to any being. I'm probably exagerrating here, but you get my point.

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Old 04-14-2008, 10:07 AM   #28
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The swords all supposedly have lightsaber-resistant metal. But a quarterstaff is just a stick. Unless it's made out of magical wish-granting planks, then it should be sliced in half in an instant.

Oh, and one semi-acceptable explanation for cortosis: during the KOTOR era, it wasn't rare...yet.


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Old 04-14-2008, 10:20 AM   #29
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Makes sense to me. If it was rare back then, then it wouldn't exist at all by the time of the movies.


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Old 04-14-2008, 10:43 AM   #30
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Good point, although I'm guessing that even a petty quarterstaff is made from some strong, flexible material (think plasteel or wood, only much more sturdy and durable) that's able to resist lightsaber hits for some time, and that the metals themselves, especially those of swords, are naturally resistant to lightsaber blows, except that some metals are more resistant than others (think Mandalorian Iron, except that it's not Mandalorian and is slightly less effective), which means that it would take more effort to cut through these materials, and by that time, you may have already killed the thug wielding the weapon, seeing as how fights in KOTOR are relatively short, so maybe that's why (aside from the combat system) they don't break in the games.
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Old 04-15-2008, 12:26 AM   #31
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I think the quarterstaffs were coated, treated, or something, to make them resistant to lightsabers, and even other weapons. Possibly even treated and coated. It's possible that there is a wood that was slightly resistant, to begin with, sort of like ironwood.

*Edit* Also, quarterstaffs weren't necessarily wood, but could be metal and alloyed.


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Old 04-15-2008, 12:57 AM   #32
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Maybe the lightsaber resistance was just a side-effect to having been treated to become stronger and more durable.
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Old 04-15-2008, 01:17 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sgt. Strike
I think the quarterstaffs were coated, treated, or something, to make them resistant to lightsabers, and even other weapons. Possibly even treated and coated. It's possible that there is a wood that was slightly resistant, to begin with, sort of like ironwood.

*Edit* Also, quarterstaffs weren't necessarily wood, but could be metal and alloyed.
The ingame description of the quarterstaff:

Quote:
Usually just a smooth staff of wood or light alloys, this is a very simple weapon of ancient design.
So, even if it isn't wood, I doubt that "light alloys" would be lightsaber-resistant.


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Old 04-15-2008, 01:28 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JCarter426
Oh, and one semi-acceptable explanation for cortosis: during the KOTOR era, it wasn't rare...yet.
The best explanation is that cortosis was one of those things lost to time somewhere along the line. Sounds kinda silly, but it's really the only explanation that fits. Perhaps it was overmined (since everything seems to use it in KotOR era) and then after 1000-2000 years history just forgot about it.

Remember (IIRC) that cortosis wasn't even conceived until the Spectre of the Past/Vision of the Future duology, and they seemed quite shocked at cortosis's lightsaber-inhibiting properties, so it's safe to assume that they were unaware of its existence as a mineral. It's more convenient not to explain how it was so prevalent 4000 years ago and suddenly disappears... part of me thinks they like to keep us guessing.

As for armor, I do believe the Jensaarai used cortosis weave in their battle armor.

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Old 04-15-2008, 01:40 PM   #35
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Reminds me of the Stygium crystal. It was overmined, and thought to be extinct, so everyone forgot about it. Then some fool comes and blasts the planet open and makes a fleet of invisible ships.


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Old 04-15-2008, 01:41 PM   #36
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Yeah. There could have been hidden cortosis mines on planets like Taris, and Malichor V in the Knights era that while unknown to the general public, substantially helped the galactic economy and put the real people on a roughly even footing with some jedi in the old republic. Those were big planets which I'm sure that there were areas we never explored on foot.


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Old 04-16-2008, 09:48 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JCarter426
Reminds me of the Stygium crystal. It was overmined, and thought to be extinct, so everyone forgot about it. Then some fool comes and blasts the planet open and makes a fleet of invisible ships.
That was always my theory on Kolto. Makes sense.


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Old 04-16-2008, 10:09 PM   #38
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What's up with cortosis weave?

Other than a convenient excuse for some hot sword-on-lightsaber action, nothing.


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Old 04-17-2008, 01:02 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JCarter426
The ingame description of the quarterstaff:

So, even if it isn't wood, I doubt that "light alloys" would be lightsaber-resistant.
I think cortosis, or other material, could be put together, and form a lightsaber resistant alloy, which could be used to fashion, weapons, etc. I am willing to bet that the material could be made light enough to make a light alloy. I imagine some of the material like a hard, possibly brittle, material, when refined, and mixed with other metals, actually making it light, but extremely tough.


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Old 04-17-2008, 02:38 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JCarter426
Oh, and one semi-acceptable explanation for cortosis: during the KOTOR era, it wasn't rare...yet.
OR it might have been the lightsabers were weaker, like they couldn't penetratemost alloys, and the techniques used in making a lightsaber became more effective.

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