lfnetwork.com mark read register faq members calendar

Thread: Alpha Protocol - Obsidian's new RPG
Thread Tools Display Modes
Post a new thread. Add a reply to this thread. Indicate all threads in this forum as read. Subscribe to this forum. RSS feed: this forum RSS feed: all forums
Old 03-10-2008, 10:42 PM   #1
dowon
Rookie
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 26
Alpha Protocol - Obsidian's new RPG

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=253567

Quote:
Game Informer April Issue - Alpha Protocol Cover Story (Obsidian's New Action RPG)
------------------------------

Alpha Protocol

(1 player action/RPG)

Developer: Obsidian Entertainment
Platform: PS3/360/PC
Publisher: Sega
Release: Spring 2009

"A modern day espionage focused action/RPG that takes you on a suspenseful ride in the vein of James Bond, Jack Bauer, and Jason Bourne. Take a wet-behind-the-ears greenhorn agent up through the ranks to become a bona-fide super spy."

-Main character is Michael Thorton, a fully trained but inexperienced young operative who has the world turned upside down when a mission goes wrong.

-Title "Alpha Protocol" is a phrase that is used when operatives go underground to work off the grid. Usually reserved for senior agents.

-Battle system is similar to Mass Effect but have more in common with Uncharted. It revolves around real time combat with an emphasis on gun play and high tech gadgets.

-Third person perspective, action orientated gameplay

-Close quarters combat can be a last resort or primary method of fighting depending on how you spend skill points you have earned.

-Skill system is based most closely on Fallout. It's classless, you have 10 skills and 10 ranks in each skill. Skills don't simply improve things like accuracy, they improve the way your character will perceive situations.

-The game will suit all play styles from the run and gunner to the stealth assassin.

-Extremely in depth dialog system that is a mix of Mass Effect and Indigo Prophecy. Once conversations happen, that's it, no revisiting the NPC to try to talk again and again. System is named the Dialog Stance System. You dictate your characters tone in a conversation by pressing a corresponding face button. Options can be cool and suave others can be brash/impatient.

-You can have multiple active missions in different countries and travel freely between them.

-Lots of girls and romance subplots. You'll meet tons of different girls on missions and yes you can bag them all.

-Current control scheme for selecting powers and weapons is similar to Bioshock.
I think Alpha Protocol is the Unreal 3 Project that Avellone and Mitsoda is working on.
dowon is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-11-2008, 12:28 AM   #2
SilentScope001
May The Force Serve You.
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,236
Oh noes! Mass Effect is now being copied! The Mass Effect clones will then reproduce, multiply, and invade the RPG gerne until its too late and we all get an influx of choice, choice, choice. Sooner or later, the choice of what shoe you'll wear will end up deciding the fate of millions of people. You heard it first from me.

Oh you know what? Fine. I'll splurge on the CIA rpg.


Quote:
Originally Posted by The Onion
"The Cambodian government has established many exciting-sounding 're-education camps' where both intellectuals and everyday citizens can be sent at any time," Day said. Well, we at Barnes & Noble have always supported re-education in America, and we intend to extend this policy to our new customers." For every hardcover book sold, Barnes & Noble will donate a dollar to the Cambodian government to help re-educate local children.
Full Article Here
SilentScope001 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-11-2008, 10:00 AM   #3
Jae Onasi
Antiquis temporibus, nati tibi similes in rupibus ventosissimis exponebantur ad necem
 
Jae Onasi's Avatar
 
Status: Super Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 10,911
Current Game: Guild Wars 2, VtMB, TOR
Alderaan News Holopics contributor Helpful! LucasCast staff Veteran Fan Fic Author 
Oh, geez, why can't they do it like VtMB and have a girl spy who can bag the guys? Sigh. Otherwise, it sounds like a lot of fun.

Here's the thread from the Obsidian boards. http://forums.obsidianent.com/index.php?showtopic=49167

Some people think the GI article is an April Fool's.


From MST3K's spoof of "Hercules Unchained"--heard as Roman medic soldiers carry off an unconscious Greek Hercules on a 1950's Army green canvas stretcher: "Hi, we're IX-I-I. Did somebody dial IX-I-I?"

Read The Adventures of Jolee Bindo and see the amazing Peep Surgery
Story WIP: The Dragonfighters
My blog: Confessions of a Geeky Mom--Latest post: Security Alerts!
Love Star Trek AND gaming? Check out Lotus Fleet.

Jae Onasi is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-11-2008, 11:49 AM   #4
SilentScope001
May The Force Serve You.
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,236
Quote:
Oh, geez, why can't they do it like VtMB and have a girl spy who can bag the guys? Sigh.
What makes you think Micheal Thorton is a boy?


Quote:
Originally Posted by The Onion
"The Cambodian government has established many exciting-sounding 're-education camps' where both intellectuals and everyday citizens can be sent at any time," Day said. Well, we at Barnes & Noble have always supported re-education in America, and we intend to extend this policy to our new customers." For every hardcover book sold, Barnes & Noble will donate a dollar to the Cambodian government to help re-educate local children.
Full Article Here
SilentScope001 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-13-2008, 01:02 PM   #5
Pavlos
Scruffy Englishman
 
Pavlos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: The real world/ivory towers
Posts: 1,974
Current Game: Viking Warrior Poets
Quote:
Originally Posted by SilentScope001
Oh noes! Mass Effect is now being copied! The Mass Effect clones will then reproduce, multiply, and invade the RPG gerne until its too late and we all get an influx of choice, choice, choice. Sooner or later, the choice of what shoe you'll wear will end up deciding the fate of millions of people. You heard it first from me.
It sounds more like Deus Ex than Mass Effect, to be honest with you.

Although I don't doubt Obsidian's ability to craft a story I can't help but get a negative vibe from this press release; what's with all the name dropping?

Edit: Source

Quote:
Loyalty carries a price and no one knows this more than agent Michael Thorton. A talented young agent cast out by his government, Thorton is the only one with the information needed to stop an impending international catastrophe. To do so means he must cut himself off from the very people he is sworn to protect. As players determine how to accomplish different objectives, the decisions made and actions taken in each mission will ultimately transform the type of secret agent Michael Thorton will become. Every choice the player makes as Michael Thorton will carry consequences for his future and the fate of the world.
That sounds more like an Obsidian game .
Pavlos is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-13-2008, 01:54 PM   #6
Corinthian
Banned
 
Corinthian's Avatar
 
Status: Banned
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,165
Let's hope it's actually properly completed this time and we don't get another patented Obsidian "On your way out of the dungeon, rocks fall. Everyone dies. The end."
Corinthian is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-13-2008, 03:16 PM   #7
Lantzen
Aku Soku Zan
 
Lantzen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,156
Well, could be good to play the expansion rather then whinne at the ending.

And i really like most of the new games Obsidian have done, so om looking forward to this
Lantzen is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-13-2008, 03:34 PM   #8
Pavlos
Scruffy Englishman
 
Pavlos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: The real world/ivory towers
Posts: 1,974
Current Game: Viking Warrior Poets
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lantzen
Well, could be good to play the expansion rather then whinne at the ending.
Quite. MotB is definitely a complete and well executed piece of work. At this time, it is probably Obsidian's magnum opus, despite being an expansion.
Pavlos is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-13-2008, 05:49 PM   #9
Corinthian
Banned
 
Corinthian's Avatar
 
Status: Banned
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,165
You do realize that a properly made game does not require an expansion to have a satisfactory ending. For example, Baldur's Gate II: Shadows of Amn - it had a satisfactory ending BEFORE the expansion. The expansion's ending wrapped up the overstory, but the self-contained Irenicus story was wrapped up without apparently killing the protagonists.

I mean, it'd be like if Fallout's ending were replaced by "After slaying the Master, the Vault Dweller returned to the Vault, found it had been looted by Super Mutants. He was then ambushed by a Mutant assault team. They have not been seen since."
Corinthian is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-14-2008, 12:17 PM   #10
Pavlos
Scruffy Englishman
 
Pavlos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: The real world/ivory towers
Posts: 1,974
Current Game: Viking Warrior Poets
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corinthian
You do realize that a properly made game does not require an expansion to have a satisfactory ending. For example, Baldur's Gate II: Shadows of Amn - it had a satisfactory ending BEFORE the expansion. The expansion's ending wrapped up the overstory, but the self-contained Irenicus story was wrapped up without apparently killing the protagonists.
I was more suggesting that Obsidian seems to have pulled up their socks when it comes to polishing and completing their games . I am well aware that the high quality of MotB doesn't redeem NWN2's ending (or certain questionable design decisions; a.k.a Old Owl Well). However, it more than redeems Obsidian Entertainment's reputation for creating intelligent and well-designed games.

To be honest with you, even if they have to go the mainstream route to stay afloat, I'd be happy if Obsidian carved a niche market with NWN2 expansions. Mask took me right back to the golden age and I'm not adverse to visiting it again.

I still cross my fingers in the hope that there's room for a AAA standard, intelligent RPG; one with a plot that respects your decisions and harkens back to the glory of late 90s. A guy's got to hope, right?

Edit: It be confirmed.

Obsidian Entertainment. As well as the nifty cover of Game Informer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Game Informer
If you love RPGs but are tired of swinging swords or slogging around in spacesuits, you’re in luck. Obsidian Entertainment is drawing on its Fallout and Planescape: Torment roots with its new espionage-based game Alpha Protocol. Drawing on the three J.B.s for inspiration—Jack Bauer, Jason Bourne and James Bond—the developers are giving players plenty of different ways to tackle problems. You can rely on brute force, stealth or gadgets to accomplish missions, and also navigate through a nuanced conversation system.
Edit to the edit: If anyone in the States who has access to the April copy of Game Informer could post more information from the article that would be awesome and likely rewarded with ice cream; though I cannot guarantee whether or not it will still be fresh after it's been shipped over the pond.

Edit the third: If you want the full and official press release then you can access it by clicking here... or here. I know it's the same link but I want to give the player real choices in this RPG .

Last edited by Pavlos; 03-14-2008 at 01:46 PM.
Pavlos is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-16-2008, 04:37 PM   #11
Corinthian
Banned
 
Corinthian's Avatar
 
Status: Banned
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,165
I just get tired of people going ape over Obsidian - They've made 1 mediocre game, one game that had great potential, but was unfinished. Not entirely their fault, but the fact remains, and one game that is allegedly good, but as I haven't played MOTB, I can't really give a thumb either way. It's not exactly a great track record considering these guys are considered the successors of Black Isle.

Still, now that they're not making sequels to other people's games, Avellone might get back into the swing of things.
Corinthian is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-17-2008, 05:13 PM   #12
Jae Onasi
Antiquis temporibus, nati tibi similes in rupibus ventosissimis exponebantur ad necem
 
Jae Onasi's Avatar
 
Status: Super Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 10,911
Current Game: Guild Wars 2, VtMB, TOR
Alderaan News Holopics contributor Helpful! LucasCast staff Veteran Fan Fic Author 
Just a quick note: there's a thead on NWN2 that addresses the ending as well as the problems and merits of the game in general. If you could continue NWN2 specific discussion there that would be appreciated. If it has relevance to AP then it belongs here.
Thanks.


From MST3K's spoof of "Hercules Unchained"--heard as Roman medic soldiers carry off an unconscious Greek Hercules on a 1950's Army green canvas stretcher: "Hi, we're IX-I-I. Did somebody dial IX-I-I?"

Read The Adventures of Jolee Bindo and see the amazing Peep Surgery
Story WIP: The Dragonfighters
My blog: Confessions of a Geeky Mom--Latest post: Security Alerts!
Love Star Trek AND gaming? Check out Lotus Fleet.

Jae Onasi is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-18-2008, 03:08 PM   #13
Lance Monance
Rookie
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 199
Doesn't sound all that interesting to me but it could be great.
Quote:
-Extremely in depth dialog system that is a mix of Mass Effect and Indigo Prophecy. Once conversations happen, that's it, no revisiting the NPC to try to talk again and again.
Hm. I for one am not too fond of this. On my first playthrough I usually pick dialog choices that would reflect what I would do in real life, but if I feel I don't get the right reaction, I speak to that NPC again.

Well, as long as there are no ridiculuous loading times I can still do that in AP.
Lance Monance is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-19-2008, 10:19 AM   #14
Pavlos
Scruffy Englishman
 
Pavlos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: The real world/ivory towers
Posts: 1,974
Current Game: Viking Warrior Poets
Some kindly poster on the Something Awful forums has posted up scans of the article. Beware: at ten pages, it seems about as long as Milton's Paradise Lost. I'd say it's worth it, though . The article has actually left me asking myself if Obsidian has found the right mix between a commercially viable, modern game and an intelligent old school RPG. While I reserve judgement until I actually play this thing, if what they're saying is true then it certainly seems that way.

And for the lazy ( ):
Quote:
I got the newest Game Informer in and they have a ten page article on what could possibly be the coolest idea for a WRPG I've heard of since Mass Effect. It is called Alpha Protocol by Obsidian Entertainment. What is the idea behind this RPG that has me ranting?

You are a modern super-spy. You are James Bond. You are Jack Bauer. You are Jason Borune. You are John Clark.

(What is with badass spies and short, four-five letter first names starting with "J?")

Not in the literal sense, but you get the idea. You play as rookie CIA field agent Micheal Thorton, who screws up on his first mission and gets framed in the process. He knows that something big is going down and has to figure out what, without the CIA's support. You have a list of names belonging to people all over the world as clues leading to the bigger conspiracy. The game consists of traveling around the world, tracking these people down while conversing with informants and taking on various side-operations connected to the main story.

In terms of combat, it will be much like Mass Effect. That is to say, it will be a third-person shooter. However, the game wants you to craft your own kick-ass super-spy. There are a number of different skills that you put points into to improve that particular area, like becoming better with pistols or hand-to-hand combat techniques. The developers said they want you to have freedom to develop Thorton how you want, while making sure that you can't just max all the skills and get a spy that enjoys the best of all worlds by the end of the game. You can go the Solid Snake or Sam Fisher way and lay low while enemies go past, relying on stealth. Or you can take the Jack Bauer approach and just start shooting things with your pistol.

When it comes to conversations, they are taking an approach that is like Mass Effect, but different at the same time. When starting a conversation you choose your "tone," but not what you actually say. That is determined by which tone you take. There are three tones: Smooth (And when it comes to the ladies, flirtatious), professional, and brash. This is much like Mass Effect's Paragon, Neutral, and Renegade system.

However, unlike Mass Effect, the conversations are more like cutscenes. You choose your tone and watch it play out just like a conversation in a cutscene or movie. You also have a limited amount of time while the NPC is talking to change your tone, resulting in different responses. This means the conversations are supposed to be more natural, and you won't run into times where, like in many RPGs, you get the same response no matter what you say. Also, once you have had a conversation, it's over. You can't just go back to the NPC and redo the whole thing.

The game also deals with morality, but not in a typical "Light Side vs Dark Side" ordeal. Instead, Obsidian is aiming for more the morally blurred path than outright good and evil to reflect the real world of espionage. Sometimes you have to do dirty things as a spy, which the game promises to reflect.

I bet you are all asking "Well Raven, this is a James Bond-like spy RPG...Where are the hot Bond Babes?" Don't worry, Obsidian is promising numerous hotties that you can develop relationships with, be it romantic or purely sexual. Yes, you heard me right, you can go all James Bond and, apparently, bed every one of these ladies if you work it right.

This is a highly condensed form of a ten page article, so I'm leaving a lot out. I'd suggest reading up on this game. Alpha Protocol promises to be a great RPG, blending a unique setting for the realm of RPG games with what is basically evolutions of concepts we have already seen in Mass Effect. This looks to be an action-heavy espionage thriller of an RPG for everyone sick of more fantasy or sci-fi settings (Not that there is anything wrong with that).
Source

This could actually be pretty good...

Interest++

Edit: I like the way they seem to be making sure that you cannot become a Jack of all trades but rather have to specialise in something and while I'm still not sold on the dialogue system, it does seem that it may allow us to get away from fake choice syndrome (present in NWN2, Mass Effect and God(s) only knows how many other RPGs) whereby you are presented with a dialogue choice and regardless of what you choose, you'll get the same response from the NPC.

I'm also pleased to see more games and developers straying from good and baby eating alignment schemes. Hopefully Obsidian will be able to deliver on their promises of grey morality.

But, you know, I sometimes wonder if Feargus actually knows what's coming out of his mouth. "Approaching Alpha Protocol we really looked at what we're good at. We're good at making role playing games." How insightful...

Last edited by Pavlos; 03-19-2008 at 11:01 AM.
Pavlos is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-19-2008, 11:57 AM   #15
Lantzen
Aku Soku Zan
 
Lantzen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,156
I like the idea of the side mission that leads up to the main, depending on how you completed the side mission the outcome of the main could change, ot how you go about it. Feels like you could get a big diffrence in your game depending on how you do the side quest.
Lantzen is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-29-2008, 06:23 AM   #16
Gargoyle King
Veteran
 
Gargoyle King's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: In My Own Little World!
Posts: 895
Quote:
Originally Posted by SilentScope001
Oh noes! Mass Effect is now being copied! The Mass Effect clones will then reproduce, multiply, and invade the RPG gerne until its too late and we all get an influx of choice, choice, choice. Sooner or later, the choice of what shoe you'll wear will end up deciding the fate of millions of people. You heard it first from me.
IMO Mass Effect is way overrated, i've completed it Fully with both endings, both times only taking me about 35-40 hours max to do it. The graphics are good, but not breathtaking and the story just got repetitive after a while. Plus, if you actually do the sidequests in the game the same modules are reused over and over again, with subtle changes made to try to create a new area; lazy designing on Bioware's part IMO. So maybe it won't be a clone, but better than Mass Effect which doesn't seem that hard top fathom after playing ME.
Gargoyle King is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-03-2008, 01:21 PM   #17
Pavlos
Scruffy Englishman
 
Pavlos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: The real world/ivory towers
Posts: 1,974
Current Game: Viking Warrior Poets
Game Informer gets some exclusive shots of Alpha Protocol

Quote:
Obsidian Entertainment’s new title Alpha Protocol sent the gaming industry into a frenzy when we revealed via our April cover just a few weeks ago. The company is very excited to move on to a new original IP that centers around a CIA agent named Michael Thorton. Mixing an RPG, and action game and a shooter, Alpha Protocol will no doubt be a high-octane adrenaline ride.
Shame we can't really tell much about the gameplay from these pictures. So far I have: People talk to you and you can hide behind corners with a gun. Although, it does give us an insight as to what Obsidian's art direction will be like in this game. There seems to be quite a bit of variety - classical architecture to modernist minimalism - which is always good.

By the way, does anyone else think that Thorton looks phenomenally bored staring out of that window?

Also: Who are these four-eyed goggle people?! I want to know, the uncertainty of it all is plaguing my dreams and stopping me from doing my work! I cannot function!

Last edited by Pavlos; 04-03-2008 at 01:57 PM.
Pavlos is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-23-2008, 11:48 AM   #18
Pavlos
Scruffy Englishman
 
Pavlos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: The real world/ivory towers
Posts: 1,974
Current Game: Viking Warrior Poets
The UK magazine PC Zone has released an article which Games Radar seems to have nicked.

Quote:
“Essentially, the player chooses a ‘stance’ for Thorton (suave, professional, or aggressive - although the actual breakdowns branch a great deal from this) and then Thorton responds appropriately - and amusingly,” explains Rucinski, having selected his own internal suave stance. “The dialogue system is also set up so that you can’t repeatedly have the same conversation with an NPC to try to find the ‘best’ answer or all the information available. [Pavlos: How is this amusing... ?] This means that if you are a jerk to a person you will get a reaction the next time you talk to them. It reinforces how important that first impression is.”
Nice to see that Obsidian keeps on bringing this up. I don't know how well it will sit with the mainstream "When do I shoot?" crowd of RPG players but I'm certainly pleased that at least one developer is interested in making you face the consequences of what you've said to a person. Hopefully they'll take it further than just:

Mr. X: Generic angry response to you!
Player: Can I ask you some questions?
Mr. X: Certainly!

Quote:
If James Bond is where the action comes from, Syriana has a big influence on the theme.
I salute you, Obsidian, for your good taste. Could this be to the supar spy genre what KotOR II is to Star Wars? And yes, I did get that question from the Obsidian boards. I guess that makes me a talentless hack. Oh well...


StarWarsKnights.com -- News and features will be returning shortly...

I 'gin to be a-weary of the sun,
And wish the estate o' the world were now undone.

Last edited by Pavlos; 04-23-2008 at 12:07 PM.
Pavlos is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-23-2008, 01:18 PM   #19
stoffe
Network Caretaker
 
stoffe's Avatar
 
Status: Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 5,833
Helpful! 10 year veteran! Notable contributor 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pavlos
“The dialogue system is also set up so that you can’t repeatedly have the same conversation with an NPC to try to find the ‘best’ answer or all the information available. This means that if you are a jerk to a person you will get a reaction the next time you talk to them. It reinforces how important that first impression is.”
Wouldn't people just be able to save and reload savegames between each conversation attempt and continue to do as usual in CRPGs to explore the dialog thread?

Don't see how it would be all that different from how it works in their previous games.

stoffe is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-23-2008, 01:33 PM   #20
Achilles
Dapper Chimp
 
Achilles's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 8,204
Helpful! Veteran Modder Forum Veteran 
You could, however if I read the various articles correctly there wouldn't be much point in doing so, as no one path is "better" than another.
Achilles is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-23-2008, 02:14 PM   #21
Ctrl Alt Del
Uncreative User
 
Ctrl Alt Del's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Rio de Janeiro, Brazil
Posts: 3,814
Current Game: Dishonored
Forum Veteran 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Article
Not in the literal sense, but you get the idea. You play as rookie CIA field agent Micheal Thorton, who screws up on his first mission and gets framed in the process. He knows that something big is going down and has to figure out what, without the CIA's support. You have a list of names belonging to people all over the world as clues leading to the bigger conspiracy. The game consists of traveling around the world, tracking these people down while conversing with informants and taking on various side-operations connected to the main story.
Where in the world is Carmen Sandiego?

Kidding aside, that seems a pretty good start. I don't think I've ever played a spy-based RPG, or whatever it's called.
Quote:
In terms of combat, it will be much like Mass Effect.
In terms of almost everything, it seems.
Quote:
That is to say, it will be a third-person shooter. However, the game wants you to craft your own kick-ass super-spy. There are a number of different skills that you put points into to improve that particular area, like becoming better with pistols or hand-to-hand combat techniques. The developers said they want you to have freedom to develop Thorton how you want, while making sure that you can't just max all the skills and get a spy that enjoys the best of all worlds by the end of the game. You can go the Solid Snake or Sam Fisher way and lay low while enemies go past, relying on stealth. Or you can take the Jack Bauer approach and just start shooting things with your pistol.
Amazing! Wait, it's not amazing... RPGs do that since the God made the world.
Quote:
When it comes to conversations, they are taking an approach that is like Mass Effect, but different at the same time. When starting a conversation you choose your "tone," but not what you actually say. That is determined by which tone you take. There are three tones: Smooth (And when it comes to the ladies, flirtatious), professional, and brash. This is much like Mass Effect's Paragon, Neutral, and Renegade system.
Far too much, I'd say. And seems pretty restrictive. Let's see how this ends up.
Quote:
However, unlike Mass Effect, the conversations are more like cutscenes. You choose your tone and watch it play out just like a conversation in a cutscene or movie. You also have a limited amount of time while the NPC is talking to change your tone, resulting in different responses. This means the conversations are supposed to be more natural, and you won't run into times where, like in many RPGs, you get the same response no matter what you say. Also, once you have had a conversation, it's over. You can't just go back to the NPC and redo the whole thing.
They better have a more-than-complete journal, then. What if I want to review info?

Plus, depending on how key those cutscen... er, dialogs are, how's that any different from Bioware's games?
Quote:
The game also deals with morality, but not in a typical "Light Side vs Dark Side" ordeal. Instead, Obsidian is aiming for more the morally blurred path than outright good and evil to reflect the real world of espionage. Sometimes you have to do dirty things as a spy, which the game promises to reflect.
What was the key word again? Oh right, Mass Effect look alike.
Quote:
I bet you are all asking "Well Raven, this is a James Bond-like spy RPG...Where are the hot Bond Babes?" Don't worry, Obsidian is promising numerous hotties that you can develop relationships with, be it romantic or purely sexual. Yes, you heard me right, you can go all James Bond and, apparently, bed every one of these ladies if you work it right.
Multiple love/fun interests, noted. About the sex scene, old.
Quote:
This is a highly condensed form of a ten page article, so I'm leaving a lot out. I'd suggest reading up on this game. Alpha Protocol promises to be a great RPG, blending a unique setting for the realm of RPG games with what is basically evolutions of concepts we have already seen in Mass Effect.
No doubt at the last sentence.

Although I criticized the game heavily, I'm expecting something good out of this one. But nowhere as revolutionary.


Inspiration

.Bioshock inspiration.
Ctrl Alt Del is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-23-2008, 03:15 PM   #22
mimartin
TOR ate my KotOR
 
mimartin's Avatar
 
Status: Super Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Texas
Posts: 6,027
Current Game: TOR/FO:NV
Imperialist Meatbags Guild Officer The Walking Carpets Guild Officer Alderaan News Holopics contributor 
It said “like Mass Effect” enough times to peak my interest.

I hope they do the conversation system different than Mass Effect. Steady now, but one of my criticisms of Mass Effect is the dialog system. It took absolute no brains or the ability to read to take the Paragon or Renegade path. Just simply choice the upper response every time and you are a good boy/girl, take the lower response and you are a bad boy/girl. You've already guessed the middle is Neutral.

I wish game developers would me think a little about my response. Other than that I love the dialog system in Mass Effect, but always knowing the correct response got a little old after awhile.



Last edited by mimartin; 04-23-2008 at 03:38 PM.
mimartin is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-23-2008, 03:28 PM   #23
Achilles
Dapper Chimp
 
Achilles's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 8,204
Helpful! Veteran Modder Forum Veteran 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mimartin
It said “like Mass Effect” enough times to peak my interest.
It said "Obsidian" enough times to peak mine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mimartin
I hope they do the conversation system is different than Mass Effect. Steady now, but one of my criticisms of Mass Effect is the dialog system. It took absolute no brains or the ability to read to take the Paragon or Renegade path. Just simply choice the upper response every time and you are a good boy/girl, take the lower response and you are a bad boy/girl. You've already guessed the middle is Neutral.
*falls out of chair and onto floor*
Whut?!

Quote:
Originally Posted by mimartin
I wish game developers would me think a little about my response. Other than that I love the dialog system in Mass Effect, but always knowing the correct response got a little old after awhile.
Yeah. On the flip side, I do see how doing this makes the game more cinematic. I think the trade-off is immersion. At the same time, I don't know how "immersed" I've been in the past while rolling my eyes at available dialog choice and groaning as I click some cheesy line that's kinda sorta in a far-off way in the vicinity of sounding like sometime my character might actually say.

"blah blah blah single glorious day! Blah blah poorly written Bioware dialog line blah blah"
1) I would never do such a terrible thing! I love teh pixies with all my heart!
2) Chicken gravy is my favorite
3) Blarg! I'll wear your face as a hat.
Achilles is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-23-2008, 04:41 PM   #24
Pavlos
Scruffy Englishman
 
Pavlos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: The real world/ivory towers
Posts: 1,974
Current Game: Viking Warrior Poets
Quote:
Originally Posted by stoffe
Wouldn't people just be able to save and reload savegames between each conversation attempt and continue to do as usual in CRPGs to explore the dialog thread?

Don't see how it would be all that different from how it works in their previous games.
You could do that if you wanted to but I gather that the idea behind is to force the player to think about what they're saying rather than just clicking on choices randomly.

Locking down quest lines (even if quests can still be solved through other means) is a far more effective way of getting you to think than seeing "Your Alignment has shifted +2 to Evil." Being forced to complete a quest using skills that your character is weak in (in my case that would probably be combat) because you have ticked off an NPC would certainly make you think twice about your choices.

Before now, Obsidian didn't appear too keen on the idea of locking down NPCs because you insulted them. NWN2, ever in possession of both brilliance and absolute dirt, is guilty of this. You disagree with someone, argue with them, but the quest continues on unabated by anything you say. Having a shouting match with Lord Nasher doesn't have any effect on your standing with him, it's purely cosmetic.

This sort of thing is something Obsidian seems to like. KotOR II had the influence system to make you consider what you were saying to your party members (unfortunately there was no consequence in story terms to the way you treated them) and MotB introduced the spirit eater mechanic to make you think thrice about resting.

That is provided, of course, that Obsidian delivers on this and it isn't just mindless hype along the lines of "EPIC!" and "redefining the RPG genre."


StarWarsKnights.com -- News and features will be returning shortly...

I 'gin to be a-weary of the sun,
And wish the estate o' the world were now undone.

Last edited by Pavlos; 04-23-2008 at 04:59 PM.
Pavlos is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-23-2008, 04:43 PM   #25
Jae Onasi
Antiquis temporibus, nati tibi similes in rupibus ventosissimis exponebantur ad necem
 
Jae Onasi's Avatar
 
Status: Super Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 10,911
Current Game: Guild Wars 2, VtMB, TOR
Alderaan News Holopics contributor Helpful! LucasCast staff Veteran Fan Fic Author 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Achilles
2) Chicken gravy is my favorite
*Jae chokes on her Diet Pepsi laughing*

Mod note--posts about NWN2 were split off into the NWN2 thread.


From MST3K's spoof of "Hercules Unchained"--heard as Roman medic soldiers carry off an unconscious Greek Hercules on a 1950's Army green canvas stretcher: "Hi, we're IX-I-I. Did somebody dial IX-I-I?"

Read The Adventures of Jolee Bindo and see the amazing Peep Surgery
Story WIP: The Dragonfighters
My blog: Confessions of a Geeky Mom--Latest post: Security Alerts!
Love Star Trek AND gaming? Check out Lotus Fleet.

Jae Onasi is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-23-2008, 05:00 PM   #26
Lantzen
Aku Soku Zan
 
Lantzen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,156
Yeah, i think it's good Obsidian is trying new things to the genre. Even if some of them haven't work so good at the begining atleast. Like you said about the influence didn't do so much during Kotor2, but they improved it during NWN2, and even more during MotB. So if they have a similar system in AP they maybe have perfect it. Same with the spirit eating thing from MotB, was some serious flaw in it, like changing aligment and the bug you died when you tryed to travel to some places during the wrog time of the day. But like the influence system it will probaly be improved if they continue doing similar things.

And i like the thing they doing with the dialougs, remind me of Fahrenheit and that worked pretty good. The dialougs feelt more alive when they just keept on talking, and if you didnt choose in like 3-5 seconds the game auto choose, and usaly it was the choise that gave most info. But the thing with it's just three diffrent dialougs path you can have, even if they are very diffrent could get a little boring in the long run. Think that it can feels like you dont have any controll over the conversation with just three diffrent path, maybe if they would have subpaths under the main diffrent dialougs path it would feel more like you have controll over the conversation. But since we haven't see how the system work it's to early to say anything about it
Lantzen is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-23-2008, 05:08 PM   #27
stoffe
Network Caretaker
 
stoffe's Avatar
 
Status: Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 5,833
Helpful! 10 year veteran! Notable contributor 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pavlos
You could do that if you wanted to but I gather that the idea behind is to force the player to think about what they're saying rather than just clicking on choices randomly.
Though I got the impression you couldn't pick what you are saying, just the tone it is said, with emotion-driven responses instead of canned lines?

And if, like Achilles said, it doesn't matter what you click since no path is better than the other, it would be a somewhat cosmetic choice anyway since you'd advance in the game either way.

Unless the game has some kind of log that records conversations you've had for later playback this will also make it harder for the player to remember things the NPC might have told them. Not everyone plays through games in one sitting. If you only play for a few hours each weekend it may be unreasonable for the game to expect you to remember everything you've been told a week ago.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pavlos
NWN2, ever in possession of both brilliance and absolute dirt, is guilty of this. You disagree with someone, argue with them, but the quest continues on unabated by anything you say. Having a shouting match with Lord Nasher doesn't have any effect on your standing with him, it's purely cosmetic.
Not entirely. If you consequently did piss off Lord Nasher whenever given the opportunity you will not be given the offer to join the Neverwinter Nine in the last act. So it's not entirely without consequence.

stoffe is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-23-2008, 06:05 PM   #28
Pavlos
Scruffy Englishman
 
Pavlos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: The real world/ivory towers
Posts: 1,974
Current Game: Viking Warrior Poets
Quote:
Originally Posted by stoffe
And if, like Achilles said, it doesn't matter what you click since no path is better than the other, it would be a somewhat cosmetic choice anyway since you'd advance in the game either way.
They've said that all outcomes will be rewarded equally, which is something that I'm not thrilled with. But perhaps I'm just old fashioned and expect a dedicated player (one who pumps all of his experience points into dialogue skills and who takes the time to listen and probe what an NPC is saying) to get rewarded more than someone who decides to pick up a gun and start shooting everything in sight.

But while that is true, 'equally' does not necessarily mean the same.

As always, a generic Dungeons and Dragons illustration is the best way forward: If I saved Old Mother Eppis from the nasty thugs by killing them, she may give me her son's armour of god-like powah. If I helped the nasty thugs then they may give me a cut of the 500 gold pieces she manages to have stashed away on her person - an infinite bag of holding is likely responsible for this - which comes to the same value as the armour. You advance the game and get an equal rewards but you do so in different ways and, as such, get different results.

And I would hope that the variation comes not just in rewards and the manner in which you progress the plot but also in the actual plot points. No point in having a plot branching off if it's only going to last for that one quest and have no bearing on the progression of the rest of the story.

That's how I interpreted 'equally', anyway. Of course it could be that my interpretation is wrong and yours is right, in which case the choice would be purely cosmetic. In which case, I would promptly fly to California and throw rocks at Obsidian's building before visiting Black Isle's grave and weeping over it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ctrl_Alt_Del
Although I criticized the game heavily, I'm expecting something good out of this one. But nowhere as revolutionary.
I would hardly call Mass Effect revolutionary but, then, very few games are. Not that shattering the wheel and redesigning it is the be all and end all of things. I'm quite happy with my old wheel only with speed flaps or something...


StarWarsKnights.com -- News and features will be returning shortly...

I 'gin to be a-weary of the sun,
And wish the estate o' the world were now undone.
Pavlos is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-23-2008, 06:50 PM   #29
Corinthian
Banned
 
Corinthian's Avatar
 
Status: Banned
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,165
Well, this is Obsidian's big chance to actually make a good impression on me. I'll forgive their massive screwups with NWN2's OC (I should have Mask of the Betrayer sometime within the next two weeks, incidentally, so you can stop pestering me) and KotoR 2 if they manage to do this properly, attributing their previous failures to having to work with someone else's crap.
Corinthian is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-23-2008, 07:19 PM   #30
Ctrl Alt Del
Uncreative User
 
Ctrl Alt Del's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Rio de Janeiro, Brazil
Posts: 3,814
Current Game: Dishonored
Forum Veteran 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pavlos
I would hardly call Mass Effect revolutionary but, then, very few games are. Not that shattering the wheel and redesigning it is the be all and end all of things. I'm quite happy with my old wheel only with speed flaps or something...
Pardon me, I didn't expressed myself clearly. I meant "nowhere as revolutionary as Obsidian claims it to be".

I mean, the part where it says the game will force you to focus on one weapon or ability, thus forbidding you from becoming a jack-of-all-trades. How's that anything near as new?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Corinthian
Well, this is Obsidian's big chance to actually make a good impression on me.
Us both.

Although the "spy framed by it's own kin" plot makes a lot of movie titles flash on my head.


Inspiration

.Bioshock inspiration.

Last edited by Ctrl Alt Del; 04-23-2008 at 08:26 PM.
Ctrl Alt Del is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-23-2008, 08:00 PM   #31
Corinthian
Banned
 
Corinthian's Avatar
 
Status: Banned
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,165
I'm doing my best to ignore everything they're saying until after the game has been released, after which I'll find a reputable news source (So not IGN) and take a look-see. Of course, I don't think it really matters whether I get it or not because one of my brothers almost certainly will, and I can just mooch off them.
Corinthian is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-23-2008, 10:38 PM   #32
mimartin
TOR ate my KotOR
 
mimartin's Avatar
 
Status: Super Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Texas
Posts: 6,027
Current Game: TOR/FO:NV
Imperialist Meatbags Guild Officer The Walking Carpets Guild Officer Alderaan News Holopics contributor 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pavlos
I would hardly call Mass Effect revolutionary but, then, very few games are. Not that shattering the wheel and redesigning it is the be all and end all of things. I'm quite happy with my old wheel only with speed flaps or something...

I’d agree Mass Effect was not revolutionary, but it BioWare did take many different recent game innovations and combine them in one package. However, it was nothing really new and certainly nothing like they advertised in the prerelease hype. Despite its flaws and, as pointed out in this thread, BioWare’s writing (which was fairly good in Mass Effect despite what someone that has not played the game may say ), it is a very good game and on top my favorites list. If the entire game had lived up to the quality and the moral dilemma of the downloadable content, I would say it was revolutionary. I am holding off complete judgment until the PC version is released, I want to see what the control of your NPC companions is like on the PC, as it was nonexistence on the 360 version.

Obsidian seems to have fallen into the BioWare media model by publicizing the game while it is still in early development. I hope it works out for them and does not end up disappointing the consumer, like many Mass Effect players were, that gets a game considerably different from the game that was hyped more than a year prior to its release. I do not plan to follow the hype and ending up disappointed that a feature was not included as I was disappointed with the released dialogue options and NPC control in Mass Effect.


mimartin is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-24-2008, 12:03 PM   #33
Pavlos
Scruffy Englishman
 
Pavlos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: The real world/ivory towers
Posts: 1,974
Current Game: Viking Warrior Poets
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ctrl_Alt_Del
Pardon me, I didn't expressed myself clearly. I meant "nowhere as revolutionary as Obsidian claims it to be".

I mean, the part where it says the game will force you to focus on one weapon or ability, thus forbidding you from becoming a jack-of-all-trades. How's that anything near as new?
Sorry about the misunderstanding .

Anyway, it's not revolutionary at all, I agree. But it's refreshing to see a developer advertising a game feature such as not being able to become Master of the Universe™. Provided the combat is well-balanced then it'll likely make us think a little more about which skills we choose to level up so as not to gimp our characters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ctrl_Alt_Del
Although the "spy framed by it's own kin" plot makes a lot of movie titles flash on my head.
I don't think the originality of the premise is what's important, to be honest. It's what you do with it, what your themes and techniques are that make it interesting. Some of the greatest works of literature just steal other people's stories.

Someone like Shakespeare doesn't remain popular today because his plots were original - A Midsummer Night's Dream just rips off Ovid, Hamlet is a rehash of generic revenge tragedy (man kills man, man gets revenge on man, both men die) and half of his plays are historical - but because of his unique style, his characters - like Hamlet and Iago - and the comment on society and life he was attempting to give.

Milton ripped off the book of Genesis in Paradise Lost but the reason why that epic is interesting - if not enjoyable... Milton seems more to be respected than loved - is because he takes Satan and makes him a sympathetic figure and causes you to question if the Christian god, as portrayed in Genesis, is really all that great.

Yes I have been reading a lot of renaissance literature lately. >_>

I'll shut up now.


StarWarsKnights.com -- News and features will be returning shortly...

I 'gin to be a-weary of the sun,
And wish the estate o' the world were now undone.

Last edited by Pavlos; 04-24-2008 at 12:17 PM.
Pavlos is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 04-24-2008, 04:04 PM   #34
Ctrl Alt Del
Uncreative User
 
Ctrl Alt Del's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Rio de Janeiro, Brazil
Posts: 3,814
Current Game: Dishonored
Forum Veteran 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mimartin
Obsidian seems to have fallen into the BioWare media model by publicizing the game while it is still in early development. I hope it works out for them and does not end up disappointing the consumer, like many Mass Effect players were, that gets a game considerably different from the game that was hyped more than a year prior to its release.

I did read myslef here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pavlos
But it's refreshing to see a developer advertising a game feature such as not being able to become Master of the Universe™. Provided the combat is well-balanced then it'll likely make us think a little more about which skills we choose to level up so as not to gimp our characters.
Still, that is not new at all. Almost every RPG with some depth of costumization has such a feature. If we do compare that to K2, however, that's a vast improvement, seeing how he/she became a killing machine after level ten or so.


Inspiration

.Bioshock inspiration.
Ctrl Alt Del is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 05-18-2008, 07:33 AM   #35
Lantzen
Aku Soku Zan
 
Lantzen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,156
http://www.worthplaying.com/sections...cle&artid=2209
Lantzen is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 05-18-2008, 09:17 PM   #36
Da_man
CHEATER (Apparently)
 
Da_man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Sunny Arizona
Posts: 1,173
Current Game: Team Fortress 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ctrl_Alt_Del
Still, that is not new at all. Almost every RPG with some depth of costumization has such a feature. If we do compare that to K2, however, that's a vast improvement, seeing how he/she became a killing machine after level ten or so.
Agreed. The leveling system is not too good in either KoToR. What K2 needs is a leveling system like in Oblivion, where at level one you fight a rat, but at level 23, you fight a minotaur.

To get back on topic, I'm really looking forward to Alpha Protocol. It seems like a seriuosly cool game from the GameInformer issue.

Da_man is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 05-19-2008, 02:23 AM   #37
Lantzen
Aku Soku Zan
 
Lantzen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,156
Are you kidding me ? Oblivion have the worse level system ever, later when you are on level 40 you still figth the same minotaur with +x hp or bandit with +x hp and glass weapons and armour
Lantzen is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 05-19-2008, 02:35 AM   #38
Corinthian
Banned
 
Corinthian's Avatar
 
Status: Banned
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,165
No kidding. Oblivion's leveling system was wretched, one of the worst gameplay mechanics I have ever seen. A game should not get harder as the player character grows in power, it's supposed to get easier.
Corinthian is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 05-19-2008, 04:50 AM   #39
Lantzen
Aku Soku Zan
 
Lantzen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,156
I like the way Kotor handle it, when you are level20 you are suppose to be powerful, if the enemy was at the same strength what the deal with you being the best ? And now i can't speak for evryone, but Malak was pretty hard for me the first time i meet him, and for my friend too. But on the rerun when i know how to build the characther better he wasn't such a problem. When i play now i even have the hardcore mod that Shem made, plus a normal hardcore mod and now he is a opponent that is funny to fight

In K2 i can agree that the game is pretty easy all the way thourgh, but thats probaly because you know how to build the characther from the begining, and that you didn't know how to do in K1 the first time


But i won't write about this anymore since we getting off-topic
Lantzen is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 05-19-2008, 11:52 PM   #40
Da_man
CHEATER (Apparently)
 
Da_man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Sunny Arizona
Posts: 1,173
Current Game: Team Fortress 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lantzen
Are you kidding me ? Oblivion have the worse level system ever, later when you are on level 40 you still figth the same minotaur with +x hp or bandit with +x hp and glass weapons and armour
But you have to thibnk of the time spent getting to level 40. I only just got to level 23, and I've been playing the game on and off for 6 months. By that time, I was bored cuz I had done everything in the game. The system works, until you get into the higher levels.

Da_man is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Post a new thread. Add a reply to this thread. Indicate all threads in this forum as read. Subscribe to this forum. RSS feed: this forum RSS feed: all forums
Go Back   LucasForums > Network > Knights of the Old Republic > Community > The Outlander Club > Alpha Protocol - Obsidian's new RPG

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:17 PM.

LFNetwork, LLC ©2002-2011 - All rights reserved.
Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.