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Old 03-28-2008, 01:31 AM   #1
Hayden Kered
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The Paranormal

This thread is for the discussion of the paranormal.

Are you a believer? Have you had experiences? Is it real, or just over worked imagination?

--------------------------------------

A few years ago I was living in a small house in a small town. The first night sleeping in the new house after moving in I had heard foot steps, like boots clomping, on the linoleum floor next to my bed. My back was facing the side it was on, when I rolled over to see what it was there was nothing there.

Later on in the same house I was laying on my bed reading a book, I did have my window open but there was no wind at all that evening. I all of a sudden heard some one sneeze in my room, and then my bedroom door slammed shut.

2-3 years ago riding in the car with my mom at night down a country road, I was looking ahead and had saw a man in black with what looked like a black ball cap cross the road from right to left, just a few yards in front of us. Just as I was getting to yell at my mom to watch out, the man vanished.

The house I am living at now, my wife woke up and saw a black figure with white almond shaped eyes standing in front of our window. Concerned about this and also remembering hearing about a baby/young child dying in the house years before, I decided to take some photos and was shocked at what I found:

Original photo:


Zoomed in on:



I have always been a non-believer, but after taking these photos and looking at them I fully believe.


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Old 03-28-2008, 02:01 AM   #2
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I am a sorta-believer, although I had one experience, I got off my bus on my way home from school, and was walking to the other bus stop (I catch 2 different buses). I saw a brown (no not being racist, just describing what she looked like) overweight, lady wearing an orange dress sitting at the bus stop, I hit something with my foot and looked down for a split second to see someones hubcap on the footpath, I look back up and the ladys gone, without a trace, there were stores behind the bus stop but she couldn't have gotten there, or anywhere that quickly, as I looked down for less then a second. Weird.


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Old 03-28-2008, 02:17 AM   #3
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That looks like a face.

Frrreaky.

BTW: Prepare to be bombarded by the neighborhood skeptics.


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Old 03-28-2008, 02:38 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Qliveur
That looks like a face.

Frrreaky.

BTW: Prepare to be bombarded by the neighborhood skeptics.

Damned good advice.


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Old 03-28-2008, 02:47 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Qliveur
That looks like a face.

Frrreaky.

BTW: Prepare to be bombarded by the neighborhood skeptics.
Thanks for the tip! I know there out there and ready to pounce.


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Old 03-28-2008, 02:55 AM   #6
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No, I don't think thy're ready to pounce, they're probably scared of vacumm cleaners if you've played Luigi's Mansion


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Old 03-28-2008, 03:37 AM   #7
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Well, as I see it, reflections, digital cameras, and jpeg data reduction methods are no paranormal thing.


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Old 03-28-2008, 04:56 AM   #8
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^^^
Beat me to it!

My dad says he often sees faces in the ceiling above his bed, I think he's drunk or dreaming lol


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Old 03-28-2008, 09:05 AM   #9
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I have no evidence to prove if I am right or wrong about this, but here's my three opinions: Either it is very specific random electromagnetic/other physics based phenomenom that seems very much to be like ghosts, the chances happening that it is ghosts beign very slim but by random chance it can be, or it is, possibly according to my religious beliefs, demons attempting to decieve others and trying to impersonate ghosts for whatever reason that may be, or it may actually really be ghosts of people who are dead.
And yes I've watched Ghosthunters, and a few things that I've seen on that show are pretty crazy and hard to explain...

Edit: Also, is that face coming off of a reflective picture frame in that picture?


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Old 03-28-2008, 10:00 AM   #10
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Mmm, I haven't had a personal experience (and I am hoping that it will stay that way), but I do believe that there are many things which can't be explained. One of my friends once said that a cop told his dad that such things have happened, especially with that classic scenario which plays out late at night on a deserted highway... And their advice is just to drive on and not get out of the car o.O

*shudders*

Asian ghost stories are very scary For the curious, click here. I would say that this is definitely one of the less scary ones:/



The sun goes down and the sky reddens, pain grows sharp.
light dwindles. Then is evening
when jasmine flowers open, the deluded say.
But evening is the great brightening dawn
when crested cocks crow all through the tall city
and evening is the whole day
for those without their lovers

-Kuruntokai 234, translated by A.K. Ramanujan

[Fic] Shreds of a Dying Belief
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Old 03-28-2008, 10:17 AM   #11
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Little boy seeks his mother. That's not scary. It's sad.


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Old 03-28-2008, 02:40 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hayden GS
Are you a believer? Have you had experiences? Is it real, or just over worked imagination?
I haven't had any paranormal experiences, and my logic tells me there are no ghosts the same way I don't believe in the afterlife.


Last edited by Pho3nix; 03-29-2008 at 12:37 PM.
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Old 03-28-2008, 02:49 PM   #13
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I see deadpeople.





Seriously tho, some aspects of the paranormal, I think there maybe more to, others I think are complete nonsense. I have yet to see any conclusive evidence for ghosts and reported phenomena such as that, being sceptical I think is always a heathy first position.

I am a Christian, and have been healed of appendicitus; I had been admitted to hospital and having been dosed up on the maximum dose of morphine was awaiting to see the consultant in the morning for him to give the go ahead for my appendics to be removed. However by morning I had strangely returned to normal; a prayer request had been sent out for me the previous evening. Although prayer studies haven't revealed any data to suggest prayer effects recovery. What I do no is the consultant was most confused in the morning; he said "strange, you seem to have got better, although in theory it should be impossible to spontateously get better from appendicitus". So misdiagnosis? Something that should be impossible but occured otherwise or healing? I suppose depends on your frame refereance.



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Old 03-28-2008, 06:18 PM   #14
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IMO, Physics can do some really wierd things. We have not yet fully developed full understanding of everything. Anything can happen by random chance... Note that in Ghosthunters, they always come, intending to disprove ghost claims if they can, instead of automatically assuming something odd is paranormal.


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Old 03-28-2008, 06:21 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcesious
IMO, Physics can do some really wierd things. We have not yet fully developed full understanding of everything. Anything can happen by random chance... Note that in Ghosthunters, they always come, intending to disprove ghost claims if they can, instead of automatically assuming something odd is paranormal.
Something isnt paranormal, if you assume it to be normal



"Love is the only reality and it is not a mere sentiment. It is the ultimate truth that lies at the heart of creation." - Rabindranath Tagore

"Many a doctrine is like a window pane. We see truth through it but it divides us from truth." - Kahlil Gibran
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Old 03-29-2008, 01:42 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arc
IMO, Physics can do some really wierd things. We have not yet fully developed full understanding of everything. Anything can happen by random chance... Note that in Ghosthunters, they always come, intending to disprove ghost claims if they can, instead of automatically assuming something odd is paranormal.
Ghosthunters really does scare the ba-jabbers (is that even a real word??) out of me. I have actually only seen it several times. I don't regularly watch it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hayden GS
Are you a believer? Have you had experiences? Is it real, or just over worked imagination?
Well, I personally haven't had an "experiance", and really don't plan on having any. Ever. From my Christian background, I can tell you, and I say this only because this is what I believe in my own heart, that demons are real. I can also tell you that angels are real. But that is just what I personally believe. I believe that there are 'ghosts' too. Mainly because of the same reason....

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Old 03-29-2008, 02:44 AM   #17
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I've seen enough random stuff that I can't help but believe. In Colorado just north of Colorado Springs, there is a place called Black Forest(gave that description to prevent confustion with the Black Forest in Germany). On any given night you can see lights moving amongst the trees.

In Galveston in Texas(If I remember right, might have been Corpus), there is a monument in a cemetary which if you park in the cemetary, with your stereo on, the statues actually start moving. Only worked for me once. And no I wasn't on any drugs.

Then there are some that are completely explainable. For instance every school kid in Texas knows the story of the school bus full of kids that was hit by a train(in San Antonio). Supposedly the kids will push your car off the tracks if the engine isn't running. The problem is that it is an optical illusion, the area actually slopes downward to such a degree that it only appears that they push you up hill.
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Old 03-29-2008, 07:11 AM   #18
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I am a Christian as well and so is my mother in-law. She claims that ghosts are actually familiar spirits and or demons. But one thing that I find odd is in the Bible Saul goes to seek the Witch of Endor (yes Endor is a real place not just the planet from SW) to have her call on Samuel's ghost, which she does.

1 Samuel 28:3-25

Since most of us believe the Bible word for word then is this not proof of the existence of ghost?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcesious
Edit: Also, is that face coming off of a reflective picture frame in that picture?
No that is the bottom of my window that the face is showing on. I had thought that it might be a glare from the light, but I have tried recreate the picture again (I took up to 40 photos with my digital camera) and I could never get that "face" to show up again.


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Old 03-29-2008, 07:23 AM   #19
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After looking at your pictures, I think it is possible that what you are seeing is actually lens flare. It would be far less likely if the light source were behind the camera. Not saying you didn't capture a ghost, nor that ghosts do not exist(as would be evidenced by my prior post on this subject), just that this can be easily explained as lens flare. take the image of the face, and flip it vertically and horizontally. It is just a possible explanation. Of course the blinds in the room are partially drawn back there. It could be a reflection of the light from the lamp, an outside light source from outside the room.
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Old 03-29-2008, 07:32 AM   #20
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Could be. I did send the photos into TAPS to get their professional opinion about them, I am still awaiting on an answer.


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Old 03-29-2008, 12:29 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hayden GS
Since most of us believe the Bible word for word then is this not proof of the existence of ghost?
It is not as much proof than just a reason why Christians would believe in ghosts. For anyone that doesn't believe in any gods like myself, the idea of the existence of ghosts seems just as far fetched.


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Old 03-29-2008, 01:29 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommycat
In Galveston in Texas(If I remember right, might have been Corpus), there is a monument in a cemetary which if you park in the cemetary, with your stereo on, the statues actually start moving. Only worked for me once. And no I wasn't on any drugs.
Wow. I would have to say that that would be quite hard to explain.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommycat
Then there are some that are completely explainable. For instance every school kid in Texas knows the story of the school bus full of kids that was hit by a train(in San Antonio). Supposedly the kids will push your car off the tracks if the engine isn't running. The problem is that it is an optical illusion, the area actually slopes downward to such a degree that it only appears that they push you up hill.
It always seems like when there is something that goes on(I am not necissarily talking about the 'paranormal', but rather things out of the ordinary in my walk with God), there is always an explaination on why it happened. I guess that is just why we have faith.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hayden GS
Could be. I did send the photos into TAPS to get their professional opinion about them, I am still awaiting on an answer.
Hmm, wonder what is going to come up with that. Let us know if you get on the TV show!

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Old 03-29-2008, 07:23 PM   #23
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My theory-based explanations for varous claims:

Lights in trees of Colorado Black Forest explanation: Fireflies

Statues moving: Optical illusion, or the matter is effected by shockwaves of sound passing though it.

Objects moving: Random Spike in Gravitational field of the Earth effecting the mass of an object.

Voices: Wind patterns (Even in a place where there is no noticable wind, the air still flows around in a building and can cause wierd noises.

Footsteps: Wood creaking, effected by heat, or a sound still traveling from another footstep farther away

Apparitions/shadowy figures: Random accumulation of gases, wind patterns, light reflections creating an odd shadow, or electromagnetically effected gases that have become ionized. Also, if this has happened several times in various places, the explanation could easily be that a large mass of magnetic rock, like magnesium, is underground, underneath the place where said 'paranormal' things happen often, which caused more often 'paranormal' occurences due to it's electromagnetic force.

Cold spots, or the feeling of being touched: Random occurences in tempurature flow in gases, or electromagnetic fluctuations in Earth's gravitational field.

As you can see, I have a lot of explanations, but I do admit there are some things I cannot explain/cannot fully explain...


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Old 03-29-2008, 09:50 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcesious
My theory-based explanations for varous claims:

Lights in trees of Colorado Black Forest explanation: Fireflies
Those would have to be some pretty hefty fireflies. I know what fireflies look like. I used to catch them as a kid. The lights out there, I saw as an adult. And I wasn't alone. The lights moved more in line with how they would move with a person, but without sound.

Quote:
Statues moving: Optical illusion, or the matter is effected by shockwaves of sound passing though it.
That would still be an impressive trick. The statues are quite animated.

Quote:
Objects moving: Random Spike in Gravitational field of the Earth effecting the mass of an object.
I don't think I've seen any more evidence for this theory than ghosts. It's just as far out there, just has more pseudo-science babble to make it sound more scientific.

Quote:
Voices: Wind patterns (Even in a place where there is no noticable wind, the air still flows around in a building and can cause wierd noises.
Actually usually it's the foundation settling, combined with wierd acoustical patterns of a room. For instance a dome shaped building will tend to have an 80hz hum.

Quote:
Footsteps: Wood creaking, effected by heat, or a sound still traveling from another footstep farther away
echos of your own footfalls.

Quote:
Apparitions/shadowy figures: Random accumulation of gases, wind patterns, light reflections creating an odd shadow, or electromagnetically effected gases that have become ionized. Also, if this has happened several times in various places, the explanation could easily be that a large mass of magnetic rock, like magnesium, is underground, underneath the place where said 'paranormal' things happen often, which caused more often 'paranormal' occurences due to it's electromagnetic force.
could be possible. Like the lights over the texas foothills.

Quote:
Cold spots, or the feeling of being touched: Random occurences in tempurature flow in gases, or electromagnetic fluctuations in Earth's gravitational field.
same explanation as before.

Quote:
As you can see, I have a lot of explanations, but I do admit there are some things I cannot explain/cannot fully explain...
Of course anyone who does not believe in ghosts, I recommend you head to Colorado Springs. If you are a man, go through the basement levels of the old convention center. I say man because women tend to have very frightening experiences(some have stated that they had been raped with no physical signs of it)
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Old 03-29-2008, 10:44 PM   #25
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You have some good points there... Where would I find out more about these 'moving statues' though? You know those statues and the lights in the Black Forest of colorado could easily be practical jokes created by people who like to scare people... Right?

Example:

Moving statues:

Guy1: I want to scare some people!
Guy2: I own a statue making shop, and I'm pretty good with robotics... how about we make some robotic statues seemingly identical to those certain statues in the middle of town, and replace them with our own robot statues... Then we'll make them move when people play music, and scare people...
Guy1: Sounds fun! let's do it!

Lights in forest:

Guy3: Let's go get a bunch of flashlights and play with them in the forest!
Guy4: Sounds like fun!

See my point...? Some of these things could be elaborate tricks...


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Old 03-29-2008, 11:27 PM   #26
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The lights in the forest have been happening a long time.

The statues: I found out about it from some people who lived there. Every area has their own ghost stories. I know about the Coloradi Springs ones because I took the time to visit each one of them. I even have a shirt that was shredded while in the tunnels under the CC(the rarest of the encounters, Physical manifestation and post encounter evidence). I saw the old theatre that was burned down, filled with people.

Trust me I was a skeptic before. Hence why I visited each of the places. I'm still trying to find rational explanations for every thing that I have seen. I'm trying to avoid telling the whole stories of what happened in the past for these places, as if you know the history it may color your experience should you go there. Lets just say that in the tunnels, something VERY bad happened to a woman down there.
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Old 03-30-2008, 12:16 AM   #27
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Quote:
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You have some good points there... Where would I find out more about these 'moving statues' though? You know those statues and the lights in the Black Forest of colorado could easily be practical jokes created by people who like to scare people... Right?
It is possible that these are jokes, but I think that it is highly unlikely.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommycat
I even have a shirt that was shredded while in the tunnels under the CC(the rarest of the encounters, Physical manifestation and post encounter evidence). I saw the old theatre that was burned down, filled with people.
I am really curious. Would it be possible for you to explain what happened a little bit more? Did you actually have this shirt on while it was "shredded"? And the theatre?

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Old 03-30-2008, 02:07 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommycat
Of course anyone who does not believe in ghosts, I recommend you head to Colorado Springs. If you are a man, go through the basement levels of the old convention center. I say man because women tend to have very frightening experiences(some have stated that they had been raped with no physical signs of it)
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There are plenty of natural phenomenon that we have yet to learn about completely that we might describe as paranormal right now.

Also, the brain can do amazing things. It can convince you you've seen things that you haven't (ask anyone who's had a hallucination), haven't seen things that you have, feel things you don't, don't feel things you should. The 'placebo effect', where people feel better when taking a placebo instead of a real pill occurs about 35% of the time. Why? Because people believe enough that it helps that the brain is convinced it is helping.

Sometimes the brain processes information at a level below our perception. There's a center in the brain that processes rudimentary visual input that never makes it to the higher processing parts of the brain for it to be 'perceived'. That kind of sensory function may be affection some of these 'supernatural' occurrences.

People's perceptions of events can vary widely--I've stopped at some accident scenes and asked people what happened (knowing about the accident tells you a lot about what to expect with the victim(s).). I can ask 3 people what happened and everyone will have quite different memories of the event even though it may have happened mere moments earlier.

In addition, in a high stress/high adrenaline moment, we don't always think clearly, even if we think we're thinking clearly. I was in a lodge one time and dropped a large bench on my foot one time. I thought I broke it. I didn't want the guys sitting 20 feet away to know I was hurt because then they would find my friend the paramedic who would make me go to the ER in West Virginia at midnight on a Saturday night. Jimbo was in the restroom. Did I sit down and wait for him to come out? No. I picked up the bench, walked carefully across the room trying not to limp much to avoid attracting the other guys' attention, and thought to myself "gee, I don't feel any bones grinding." Was that a rational thing to do? Absolutely not. At the time, however, it felt entirely reasonable, because the shock and adrenaline did weird things to the thinking processes.

I could easily see many paranormal experiences turning out to be an unusual but natural phenomenon, and someone seeing or hearing it became scared, and the brain processed the phenomenon in an inaccurate way as a result. Some of it may be pure fraud (crystal ball readers who are nothing more than very good at body language and pop psychology). Some of it might be things we may never fully understand.


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Old 03-30-2008, 02:29 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rev7
I am really curious. Would it be possible for you to explain what happened a little bit more? Did you actually have this shirt on while it was "shredded"? And the theatre?
It is kinda hard to explain everything. Yes, I was wearing the shirt. It was a couple of years back when I was setting up for a stage show. I had to get a few things from the basement(actually, I was the only one willing to go down there, as the crew simply refused to go down there). There's a long corridor underneath. There are areas where it is poorly lit, and while walking down there I felt this VERY uncomfortable feeling. The kind of feeling you would get eating a hamburger at a vegetarian convention. I took a few more steps and found out why the crew refused to go down there at night. I heard a scream for help. I ran to where I heard it from, and when I opened the door, I was literally knocked off my feet by nothing. I could feel something scraping at me, and when it was over, I had a shirt that was torn up(no scratches on me) and a strong desire NEVER to go down there again.

I later learned that back in the earlier days the passage used to be used to transport prisoners from the jail to the courthouse(which is now the site of the CC). It turned out that a woman was delivering food to the prisoners through that tunnel, when several very nasty prisoners were escaping. She didn't survive the ordeal, and from what I have since learned she was trapped down there over the weekend with them. The prisoners were killed before they escaped the tunnel.

The theatre is something different. It's attached to the CC though. There's a small door that leads from the CC main stage to the lower level of the old theatre. It had been closed for some time. I opened the door, and saw the theatre filled with people. I closed the door when they started staring at me. Trust me, nothing will freak you out more than the lifeless stare from a couple hundred pairs of eyes. I checked the door again, and when I opened it, there was no audience.

I later learned that the theatre next door was burned in the 1930's(which made the attire I could see make sense). The tragic accident killed all the audience members. I heard that they will clap at performances in the CC that they like.

@Jae:
Yeah I fully believe that most "paranormal" experiences are really the mind playing tricks. The situations I saw and experienced I still have a hard time believing myself. The dancing statue for instance, I still wonder if it was more due to the fact that I was on a road trip with friends, and I was told they would dance beforehand, so my mind may have actually made that up. Other times though I experienced similar experiences as others with no prior knowledge of what had hapened or what was "supposed" to happen.

Last edited by Tommycat; 03-30-2008 at 02:54 AM.
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Old 03-30-2008, 01:01 PM   #30
Rev7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jae
Also, the brain can do amazing things. It can convince you you've seen things that you haven't (ask anyone who's had a hallucination), haven't seen things that you have, feel things you don't, don't feel things you should. The 'placebo effect', where people feel better when taking a placebo instead of a real pill occurs about 35% of the time. Why? Because people believe enough that it helps that the brain is convinced it is helping.
I have to say that I agree. The brain is a very powerful thing. I have noticed that when certain things happen to me, it is normally when I have been very tired.

@Tommycat-- Wow. Perhaps that is something like that lady experienced. Just speculation though...
_______
The theatre incident reminds me of another television documentary on 'paranormal activity in Gettysburg', or along those lines. I guess that there is a college campus on some of the battle grounds. I guess that 'the paranormal' is a frequent occurance. A new student and one of the...I think it was one of the deans or someone that was/is a authority figure, got into an elevator. They pressed what floor number that they wanted to go to and the elevator was taken to the old abandoned basement. But as you can probably predict, they didn't see the basement. They saw a Civil War makeshift surgery room. The surgeon held out his hand asking for the ladies to come help him. These women didn't move, and the elevator finally kicked in. Those women were later taken back doen to that floor, and the floor was barren, dirty, and abandoned.

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Old 03-30-2008, 05:41 PM   #31
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I agree. When I was little, I used to get so tired soemtimes that I thought things in my room where moving, and I thought I saw ghosts, but when i ran scared to my parents they told me it was because I was so tired that my eyes were playing tricks on me. It's not that hard to hallucinate after all... you don't even have to be tired.


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Old 03-30-2008, 07:04 PM   #32
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I'm one of those guys that has never had any paranormal experiences but wishes that he had.

There's a house in the central forests of New Jersey where they say the New Jersey Devil was born. People who visit it late at night claim to see ghosts and other such scary things.
I went there (I think on mischief night) last year hoping to get scared. Unfortunately nothing of the sort happened. The couple next to me started screaming and yelling but I seriously couldn't see anything. I was quite disappointed.

At any rate, I really want to see a paranormal event.


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Old 03-31-2008, 03:32 PM   #33
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^
Hmm. Very interesting. I really haven't been through what would be called a "paranormal event". I have no desire to either. Why exactly do you want to see a paranormal event *Don*?

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Old 03-31-2008, 03:59 PM   #34
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^^^
Truth be told, I don't know myself.

I guess its just that I sometimes crave excitement and witnessing a paranoramal event would certainly stir things up a bit.


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Old 03-31-2008, 11:13 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rev7
^
Hmm. Very interesting. I really haven't been through what would be called a "paranormal event". I have no desire to either. Why exactly do you want to see a paranormal event *Don*?
Why do people go to horror movies, when they know that they're gonna get scared?
(To pick up chicks, lol )


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Old 04-01-2008, 12:12 AM   #36
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^Scared? I don't find blood and gore to be scary. Most horror movies that I have seen make me laugh more than they do scare me.

I thought of something just recently that might explain the "face" in the photos I posted, since the object is appearing at the base of my window perhaps at the time a car was passing by. It might just be the headlights and the camera made it appear to be a face.


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Old 04-01-2008, 10:26 AM   #37
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I've had some weird sensations, just 2 years back, we did some tests with our class on how easy it is to "fool" your body and brain.

One of our trips took us to this cave. Now caves are small, low, and there isn't much sound and for the fun of it we turned out our light.

Pitch black, I can tell you, we all had very differant feelings and a sort of "madness" going on.

Our eyes are easly fooled ( movies are a great example). When the brain gets no more information it sometimes makes it up.

Ever did that "tunnel" vision effect, just roll up a piece of paper , stare through it for a minute and then look to your hand.

You'll often get the effect there's a hole in your hand.

There's tons of things that can easly effect your brain.


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Old 04-01-2008, 10:35 AM   #38
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I personally don't believe in ghosts or anything along thos elines, but sometimes I hear some stories or pics and it makes me wonder a little, that maybe NOT ALL of the stories i've heard are made up or hoaxes


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Old 04-02-2008, 02:48 AM   #39
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It's sorta like havin a dream, there is nothin goin on so your mind makes something up, like Quanon said, but I still believe that there is more to some stories than it seems...


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Old 04-02-2008, 11:59 AM   #40
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I believe in the paranormal, but I don't have any proof or evidence or personal experiences to support me. I have a powerful imagination and horrible vision without my glasses, so I have learned not to always trust my eyes.


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