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Old 10-19-2004, 12:05 PM   #1
jadyniec
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Problems playing JO in JA

Hi,

I am trying to get all the Jedi Outcast SP levels to work in Jedi Academy, but for some reason the Yavin Swamp and Yavin Canyon levels have a problem with the water. Instead of going into the water, the player just skates across it. You can noclip into the deep water and then turn noclip off and swim, but you cannot surface. This phenomenon occurs throughout the swamp level and through about half of the canyon level. Any suggestions? (Please be specific)

Thanks!
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Old 10-19-2004, 10:01 PM   #2
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Old 10-20-2004, 02:27 PM   #3
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I think it's just a simple case of incompatibility between the two games. JA is just different enough from JO that some elements of the JO SP mode will not work properly in JA. I don't think anything can really be done about it besides using the noclip codes as you have done.


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Old 10-20-2004, 03:22 PM   #4
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As a lot of people have said, you'll get bugs in JA if you try to play JO maps in it, scripting problems, missing textures, and other stuff.

Anyways, why on earth would you want to play JO in JA?

JO SP is much better not in JA.

IMO.




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Old 10-20-2004, 03:55 PM   #5
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Wink Why play JK2 stuff in JA SP?

Well if you have both games the answer is naturally "because you can."

Otherwise there's plenty of reasons:

1) More character animations.

2) New weapons.

3) New Force Powers.

4) Graphic improvements (like the stealth effect on the Shadow Troopers, the new shadows, saber glows, etc.)

5) Possibility of coop.

6) Messing around with spawns & such.


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Old 10-20-2004, 04:22 PM   #6
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Heh, this thread made me go play that the end missions in JO again (from yavin_swamp on). Since I got my new compy a while back, I haven't played the JO SP very much, and really then only the first few levels. Well, now I'm able to max out the settings in Yavin and it looks good. I love JO.


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Old 10-21-2004, 07:47 PM   #7
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I have gotten so used to all the added movements in the JA lightsaber system that to go back to JO is like being handicapped or something. IF you can get JO to work perfectly or close to it in JA it only enhances it. You get all the good things about JA with none of the bad things, because you're basically playing JO. Anyways, the Yavin Canyon level is playable because you really don't have to go in the water, you can just go up on the "shoreline", but unfortunately, the swamp level is pretty much unplayable this way. Too bad because I think it is among the best looking levels in the JK series.
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Old 10-21-2004, 09:02 PM   #8
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Mmph. I like JO's SP saber fighting better than JA's. In MP JO's is inferior, but SP it's soo good. I don't have much of a problem with only having a single saber though, although it's just a personal preference.

I agree, the swamp levels are quite fun to play. I loved those levels in MotS, and seeing similar ones in their glory in JO was really incredible.


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Old 10-22-2004, 09:17 PM   #9
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I dunno, the lack of certain force powers in JK2 SP really annoyed me, making it feel like they made the game that way to make it artificially more difficult (ie: frustrating).

I couldn't tell much of a difference between JA & JK2 SP saber combat, other than the new moves, though. Maybe the Katas and stuff make it too easy. But the variety of opponents makes it more interesting I think.

The SP adventure for both games is worth playing through, even if JK2's is "too hard" and JA's is "too easy."


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Old 10-24-2004, 02:10 PM   #10
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Actually, I'm working on the same project for OJP as part of the CoOp gametype.

Exactly what have you done so far? Are you making sure to only grab the files needed for the maps so that they don't conflict with JKA's files?


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Old 10-24-2004, 09:17 PM   #11
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um....no. All I did was take the asset folders from JO and rename them so they could be read before the asset folders in JA. I did not change anything within the folders themselves, and with the exception of the cutscenes and some missing textures, there were no real problems up until the Yavin levels. Any suggestions on what I should/not remove from the JO folders to eliminate conflicts?
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Old 10-24-2004, 09:32 PM   #12
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Wouldn't all you'd have to do is rename the JO assets files to something like 1assets1.pk3? That way they'd be loaded before the JA ones and the filenames that are shared would be overwritten by the JA ones.


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Old 10-24-2004, 11:19 PM   #13
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Well, I tried that, but it causes an assload of problems including breaking the animation system. Maybe I did it wrong. I'll give it another shot.


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Old 10-25-2004, 12:08 AM   #14
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Well, it works now. Weird.


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Old 10-25-2004, 08:49 AM   #15
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I tried that a while ago, but I still seemed to have problems with some of the scripts and the like. For example, did you guys experience Jan not following you right away on the first level, and various elevators and cutscenes not working and things of that sort?

I'd love to know a solution for that stuff. I never looked into it much more back then...

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Old 10-25-2004, 01:48 PM   #16
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Well, I haven't been able to run the first or second levels but thats probably because I'm trying to get them to work in MP.


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Old 10-25-2004, 02:22 PM   #17
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The scripting for Jan and Lando is messed up, but it doesn't affect gameplay per se, at least not to the point where the mission objectives cannot be achieved. There are areas where you must use noclip to get through doors or what not. I can't think of any bad elevators off the top of my head, but it sounds likely. Many of the cutscenes don't work properly and cannot be skipped. For this you must enter the cam_disable command in the console. This doesn't do it for the mid-game scenes such as the meeting between Kyle and Galak-mech or the first meeting with Desann, however. Those both happen right at the end of the level though. Mostly the game is very playable in JA; but this water problem in the swamp is putting a real crimp in things...
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Old 03-27-2005, 02:22 AM   #18
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Did anyone ever figure this water thing out? I have found that the incompatabilities between JO and JA for the most part is scripting and maps. With a few minor shader probs.

Most things can be fixed through scripting but the biggest problem is JA not recognizing waypoints on maps and the brush/shader problem (or whatever, I dunno) on yavin_swamp and yavin_canyon.

I am sure a mapper out there has come across these issues. Is this a shader problem with the fog and weather? Or is it something else...
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Old 03-27-2005, 05:49 AM   #19
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The waypoints aren't being recognized?!


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Old 03-27-2005, 11:16 AM   #20
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Well not all of them...but quite a few. Mostly in cutscenes and places you'd need them the most to get NPCs to follow attack paths.

You'll see it every time you bring down the console after a level loads, the game will give you a list of errors.
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Old 03-27-2005, 05:30 PM   #21
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what is the error that you're getting?


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Old 03-27-2005, 10:41 PM   #22
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The text in red is the error in the screenshot:

http://www.geocities.com/obi_1138/shot0081.jpg

I have worked around them for the most part by finding waypoints that the NPCs do respond to.

But still other map problems...
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Old 03-28-2005, 02:20 AM   #23
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Ah, I see. well, that shouldn't be too hard to fix. Just get me the map entity define for JK2 and I'll be able to replicate those waypoints for JKA, at least in OJP CoOp.


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Old 03-28-2005, 07:24 AM   #24
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Great! ...now where would I find that?...the map entity define.
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Old 03-28-2005, 10:52 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by razorace
The waypoints aren't being recognized?!
I noticed some navgoals in JK2 SP are not in JKA SP when I tried mapping/converting some of my older maps. I had to replace the navgoals manually.
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Old 03-28-2005, 04:56 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by obijon1138
Great! ...now where would I find that?...the map entity define.
Duh...uh it was still asleep when I posted this. There are quite a few entities that are left out...I don't think I could list every single one of them.

I have played a few levels in MP and noticed that some ARE recognized. But still there are game freezes because there is not a "player" entity as there is in SP. Or is there? Although I haven't tried my scripts in MP yet.

You could decompile the maps and manually put them in as lukeskywalker1 had to do. But that would be more trouble than it's worth when you can work around most of that with scripting. I mean, that's a LOT of maps.

Still the water/weather thing on Yavin.... cannot be worked around.

Last edited by obijon1138; 03-28-2005 at 05:25 PM.
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Old 03-28-2005, 10:48 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by obijon1138
Duh...uh it was still asleep when I posted this. There are quite a few entities that are left out...I don't think I could list every single one of them.

I have played a few levels in MP and noticed that some ARE recognized. But still there are game freezes because there is not a "player" entity as there is in SP. Or is there? Although I haven't tried my scripts in MP yet.

You could decompile the maps and manually put them in as lukeskywalker1 had to do. But that would be more trouble than it's worth when you can work around most of that with scripting. I mean, that's a LOT of maps.

Still the water/weather thing on Yavin.... cannot be worked around.
No, I didn't decompile them... I was talking about maps I had made.

About the water on Yavin:

The water has a sweet shader that adds a small layer of fog over top of the water, and also adds a lot of detail to it. I think thats whats causing the "solid" like nature. I think the fog is solid, while the water is normal. The fog is on top of the water, so you just walk on top of it, but like you said, if you use NOCLIP, your in the water so you can swim. Edit the shader and it should work... maybe.
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Old 03-29-2005, 02:38 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by obijon1138
Duh...uh it was still asleep when I posted this. There are quite a few entities that are left out...I don't think I could list every single one of them.
Just email me the defines for the ones that don't work.

Quote:
I have played a few levels in MP and noticed that some ARE recognized. But still there are game freezes because there is not a "player" entity as there is in SP. Or is there? Although I haven't tried my scripts in MP yet.
"player" is still in use by JKA.


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Old 03-30-2005, 10:17 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally posted by lukeskywalker1
The water has a sweet shader that adds a small layer of fog over top of the water, and also adds a lot of detail to it. I think thats whats causing the "solid" like nature. I think the fog is solid, while the water is normal. The fog is on top of the water, so you just walk on top of it, but like you said, if you use NOCLIP, your in the water so you can swim. Edit the shader and it should work... maybe.
That shader is cool but doesn't show in JA...damn, too bad.

So I tried editing the shaders...no luck. But while switching water shaders I came across this.

http://www.geocities.com/obijon1138/water1.jpg

You will notice a seam between the player and the reborn, a marker kind of, on yavin_canyon where the water works and where the water doesn't.

Next slide... now the player mounts the seam as if it were a ledge inside the water.

http://www.geocities.com/obijon1138/water2.jpg

Next slide... now the player is submerged on the side that the water works. Notice the block or seam wall in front of him. ???????????????

http://www.geocities.com/obijon1138/water3.jpg

Quote:
Originally posted by razorace
Just email me the defines for the ones that don't work.

"player" is still in use by JKA.
I'll get you something soon...
as for the "player" entity, in MP what is a player indentified as? Like what the Icarus script will read by. In JO SP it's "kyle", in JA SP it's "player".

So what about mp? I have tried the scripts and MP doesn't respond to either. So would it be "client"?

Oh and I was wrong about the waypoints in MP. It's just the same as SP, except the NPCs have a higher response.
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Old 03-30-2005, 11:24 PM   #30
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Quote:
I'll get you something soon...
as for the "player" entity, in MP what is a player indentified as? Like what the Icarus script will read by. In JO SP it's "kyle", in JA SP it's "player".
In single player they use an entity called the "Info_Player_Start"
Its the only thing that is used in SP. In MP, however, one info_player_start is required for the map to work correctly, but after that some mappers use info_player_deathmatch (which is just a normal FFA spawnpoint) an Info_Player_deathmatch does the same thing as an Info_player_start.

As far as I know, all the entities in SP should work, except for navgoals.



Notice the extra Jedi Outcast Nav_goals. I know for a fact that Nav_goal4 is used in JK2 a lot. I was using that in my maps (see my redemption trailer in my sig, all of those walking points were nav_goal4s, but I had to switch them because of Jedi Academy)

Nav_goal4 is a small and convienent way to make NPCs walk, they are thin, so you know exactly where the NPC will go, and it doesn't clutter the map as much (in my opinion) For some reason, Raven removed them from JKA SP. Too bad.
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Old 03-31-2005, 12:14 AM   #31
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I think JA went to custom animations in most cutscenes rather than navgoals. I pretty much have had to use the spawnpoints as navgoals, it has worked for the most part. :/

Did you notice the block in the water? Strange...

In MP is there a name for the client? Just for the scripts to activate. Like this line to activate the lift at the beginning of bespin_streets:

affect ( "player", /*@AFFECT_TYPE*/ FLUSH )
{
set ( /*@SET_TYPES*/ "SET_PLAYER_LOCKED", /*@BOOL_TYPES*/ "true" );
wait ( 1000.000 );
use ( "uplift" );
}

This line activates the lift at the start of the level. In JA SP the firstperson is "player", in JO firstperson is "kyle". If JA can't find a "player" entity the script freezes and the lift won't move.
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Old 03-31-2005, 12:24 PM   #32
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Oh yeah, forgot about that.

In MP... I don't think there is a name, because you can't control the player.

You could edit the scripts. They are in the JK2 MP SDK.. I think. You should compile them with the new BehavEd compiler, which comes with the JKA MP SDK.

This wouldn't be a lot of fun though, there are hundreds of scripts, and thousands of references.
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Old 03-31-2005, 02:31 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally posted by obijon1138
as for the "player" entity, in MP what is a player indentified as? Like what the Icarus script will read by. In JO SP it's "kyle", in JA SP it's "player".

So what about mp? I have tried the scripts and MP doesn't respond to either. So would it be "client"?

Oh and I was wrong about the waypoints in MP. It's just the same as SP, except the NPCs have a higher response.
I have it set up as "player". As for who the "player" is, I have it set up to be whoever currently has the highest score. There is some issues with referring to the "player" before anyone spawns into the map, but I think I've resolved most of the issues.


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Old 03-31-2005, 04:45 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally posted by lukeskywalker1
You could edit the scripts. They are in the JK2 MP SDK.. I think. You should compile them with the new BehavEd compiler, which comes with the JKA MP SDK.

This wouldn't be a lot of fun though, there are hundreds of scripts, and thousands of references.
Already done that and you're right it wasn't much fun.
I have replaced all "kyle" lines with "player" lines. Plus have made it optional for you to choose between male and female voices and have your character choice show up in the cutscenes.

The only problems I have left to deal with:
1.The yavin_water problems
2.Galak will not spawn for the cutscenes or the boss level.
3.Navgoals-there are still a few things I can't get around.

Quote:
Originally posted by razorace
I have it set up as "player". As for who the "player" is, I have it set up to be whoever currently has the highest score. There is some issues with referring to the "player" before anyone spawns into the map, but I think I've resolved most of the issues.
If you have it fixed that way I would be glad to donate my scripts to the OJP.
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Old 04-01-2005, 02:46 PM   #35
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That would be great. If you're going to pass them over, please be sure to send the source files as well as the compiled versions.

Also, what do you mean by...
Quote:
Plus have made it optional for you to choose between male and female voices and have your character choice show up in the cutscenes.


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Old 04-01-2005, 11:03 PM   #36
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For some reason the Galak_mech model just doesn't work at all
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Old 04-02-2005, 01:34 AM   #37
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It's a different model of NPC. The code probably just isn't set up for it to load in.


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Old 04-02-2005, 11:08 PM   #38
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I'm not real sure about it. You can spawn NPC Galak and NPC galak_mech from the console.

On the maps kejim_base and doom_shields it calls out for NPC_galak both times even though they are different models on each map.

It must be some sort of code in JO that selects the model.

Oh and I meant I edited the scripts so that if you choose a male character you get a male voice and vice-versa for female chars. Just like in JA.

Except the male voice is Kyle's and the female voice is Jaden's for now....
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Old 04-03-2005, 04:28 PM   #39
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Oh ok. That's because there isn't a map entity to spawn Galak in JKA. It's easy to fix for OJP.

But isn't there only Kyle's voice availible?


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Old 04-04-2005, 06:03 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally posted by razorace
Oh ok. That's because there isn't a map entity to spawn Galak in JKA. It's easy to fix for OJP.

But isn't there only Kyle's voice availible?
No way for Galak in sp eh?

If you script the sound lines like JA, both can be available.
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