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Old 12-15-2008, 10:47 PM   #1
SD Nihil
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Where do I send the mods?

I have a bunch of pcgamemods and I'd like to se what can be done to re circulate them in the community. With that site going down many works were lost. I can't send them to KOTORFiles. Apparently they have this rule that you have to ask permission of the creator to do so. Which makes me wonder what is the harm in getting something hosted. I mean if they don't come back who cares. If they do and want it to come down okay no harm done. It's not like they can sue or anything since no one legally owns mods.

Surely something can be worked out. I'd hate for good mods to go to waste just because people don't want to offend others. I'm not bashing or anything. It just doesn't make sense. I've contributed with the KOTOR 1-2 Vista Fix and the XWing Tie Fighter 95 Compatibility Fix and getting that to the community. I just hope something can be done.


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Old 12-15-2008, 10:59 PM   #2
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You could just say that you have them and if people ask, just tell them what mods you have, I know that I'm interested in seeing what mods you have
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Old 12-15-2008, 11:01 PM   #3
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It's a matter of respect towards the mod maker and also, in some cases, of avoiding unnecessary tensions between members (we've seen our share of flame wars). Several people want to keep control on their mods and/or prefer not to see uploaded on other sites. It's their work and here at Holowan, we want to respect that.
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Old 12-16-2008, 06:14 AM   #4
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Do you happen to have a list of the mods in question?

I would be interested to see if you happen to have any mods i don't already have.


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Old 12-16-2008, 09:49 AM   #5
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Actually remember in pm we did a little exchange? I mean I know I can just exchange with one individual, but I'd like to also get them to the community on sites for circulations so all can have them.

As for fame. lol. I don't care about me gettig fame. I'm not all that needy. I'ts just a game and I'd hate for the mods on my flash drive to go to waste. Flame wars. Man some people take games too seriously. It's kinda funny though.

I'll get a list together. But Darth Payne could be able to tell you what I have. We had a little exchange.


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Old 12-16-2008, 10:04 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Darth333 View Post
It's a matter of respect towards the mod maker and also, in some cases, of avoiding unnecessary tensions between members (we've seen our share of flame wars). Several people want to keep control on their mods and/or prefer not to see uploaded on other sites. It's their work and here at Holowan, we want to respect that.
Not only that, unless you gain the permission of the original author(s), KotORFiles will reject your submission and reserve the right to punish as we see fit those who knowingly attempt to contravene our rules on permissions - up to and including bans of any length.

As Darth333 says, it's a matter of respect for the author, whether they 'care' or not.

If they're not around to ask, presuming their acceptance is arrogant and presumptious. If they are, you should ask them anyway. If they decline to respond, you can probably guess the answer is 'no'.

If the permissions issue is ambiguous or missing from their readmes, then tough. These are the rules of this community, and that is that.

This is non-negotiable.



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Old 12-16-2008, 11:12 AM   #7
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You can't send tehm to sites, but you can exchange them like with Payne. Seems kinda like the same thing of allowing distribution of the mod. Well alright. It just seems a little selfish of the mod maker to not want the mod around and to imped progress. But oh well. Heck even for my contributions I didn't have to have credit. Just helping out. In the end your relationships are what last.

As for the list I'll try to get one together. But until then you might want to ask Darth Payne. He should know from our pms what I have. Off the top of my head I do have a Mind Probe mod that allows you to raise and lower influence on your party at will. Note: For max effect have a charisma from 35-40. Next for K1 a all force powers and feats mod. Unlike the one on KOTORFiles that just allows you to have all force powers, this allows you to also have all feats. Note: Don't pick recommended or the game will freeze. Also, it will think you can still pick some force powers if you have not picked all. It kinda forces you to get all feats and powers. Once you have all feats and powers just do auto l饈evel up or press okay at the feats and powers screen. Don't click in the screen of the feats or powers.

For K2 there is this Music table fix. A fix in K1 that when you go through the doors at the landing area on Mannan they don't allow you to move until you hear the dialog about the cmera. This corrects it. You simply see the text, but can still move. Uh K2 mira bounty hunter equipment. K1 evil temple of Exar Kun. K1 Kill council. Make in K1 the Old Sith Republic. and the sith as the new Republic Empire. A flip if you will. Let's see...Revan armor. K1-2 death sabers. K1 turn Juhani on Unknown World to DS mod. I'll have to search further, but ther's more. I'll have to make a list and get back to you. That is of course if Payne can't think of the rest.

Oh that's right the K1 no fighters encounters when you go from planet to planet. K1 have 2 less fighters in space battles, or have less hitpoints on them, or have fighters do 50 percent less damage. It's got two files with the same name and you have to choose. I'll try to think of more. Oh and Hardcore Bastila. Basically, on Unknown world when you fight her she's just real tough.



Last edited by SD Nihil; 12-16-2008 at 11:31 AM.
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Old 12-16-2008, 11:39 AM   #8
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Last edited by Darth333; 12-16-2008 at 02:58 PM. Reason: link removed
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Old 12-17-2008, 11:34 AM   #9
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Okay. Well, could I host the abandoned mods on a site I make or no? I'm not trying to be annoying. I'm just asking. How come its okay to give them to someone who asks for them by sending it to them, but not put them on a site like Kfiles? But yet its okay to host them on a site I make or no? Just asking. I appreciate the answers.


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Old 12-17-2008, 11:57 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by SD Nihil View Post
How come its okay to give them to someone who asks for them by sending it to them, but not put them on a site like Kfiles?
Because unauthorised distribution of someone's work is one step away from unauthorised modification of that work.
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Old 12-17-2008, 01:25 PM   #11
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One of the original problems KotorFiles had back in 2005, was that they uploaded and hosted mods without saying a word to the original authors. It caused a major uproar. The feels of the aftermath of the drama was a bitter taste in people's mouths for many, many months. It's not worth seeing that happen again.

I took over the site in 2006 and have been there ever since. The work I put into that site to turn it around is more than words can describe. If anybody had the opportunity to look over my shoulder when I was reorganizing the site, it probably would have drained you just watching what I was doing on a daily basis just to clean up the disorganization. It was really messed up.

One of the many major things I did was to make a commitment to this community was that all mods hosted on the site will be ones that were made and sent in by the original authors. Any other types of distribution will require special permission from the original author. This is not a negotiation out of respect of the mod authors as I want KotorFiles to be a respectable site as long as I'm the manager there. Whenever the day comes that I can't be the manager there anymore, I will make sure that whoever takes over has the same vision and commitment.

I do agree that there have been some great mods that were lost in terms of getting easy access to them publicly and it's a inconvenience for those who would like to have a copy. It's sad it came down to this because of the loss of PCGM. I wished that had never happened. However, the respect to mod authors is the most important part of this community because without mod authors, there is no modding community.

The thing is now that there is a hosting site that will ALWAYS be there for the KOTOR community, it's very important to make sure that the respect to the mod authors is always there because if it isn't, KotorFiles would not continue to be the website that it is today. It would really tick me off to see that site fall apart after all I did to make it a respectable one.

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Surely something can be worked out. I'd hate for good mods to go to waste just because people don't want to offend others. I'm not bashing or anything.
My problem with a comment like this is that all the hours I put into KotorFiles would be thrown out the window. I may as well have done nothing and my only response into letting something like that happen is, "Over my dead body." You would have to kill me before I would let that happen.

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I've contributed with the KOTOR 1-2 Vista Fix and...
Trust me, that attitude and thinking wouldn't justify those actions. Believe me, I had contributed more to the community with my modding well before I ever took over KotorFiles. That is never a way to look at it. If I had that attitude, I would have been beaten down by this community before I would have known what hit me.

Again, respecting the authors is FIRST in this community because without them, there is no community.


Interested in hosting a your KOTOR or TSL mod at FileFront? Send your mod HERE and we'll validate it as soon as we can! FileFront is a good way to get publicity for your mod as we get 1000's of visitors everyday. Is my LucasForum PM box full again? If you really need to reach me, PM me at YouTube under the username: Shem L -- Watch my KOTOR videos! Download my mods from FileFront!

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Old 12-17-2008, 04:26 PM   #12
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Why would they get in a uproar over their mod being spread throughout the kotor world and getting many to use it and that even larger recognition? And if someone takes another's work and expands on it and improves upon their work that's progress. How does it make their work any les valuable if they still have the recognition of, well if this guy didn't do this I wouldn't be able to do this kind thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shem
My problem with a comment like this is that all the hours I put into KotorFiles would be thrown out the window. I may as well have done nothing and my only response into letting something like that happen is, "Over my dead body." You would have to kill me before I would let that happen.
Meaning the Files site as in you want it to be the only monopoly of where to get mods. That's a little Microsoft like, but okay. Don't want any competition? And no I'm not negotiating or complaining. Just having a little conversation about this to you. Lots of news to me. lol. Can't say I agree with it, but nothing I can do about it.


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Old 12-17-2008, 04:40 PM   #13
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Why would they get in a uproar over their mod being spread throughout the kotor world and getting many to use it and that even larger recognition? And if someone takes another's work and expands on it and improves upon their work that's progress. How does it make their work any les valuable if they still have the recognition of, well if this guy didn't do this I wouldn't be able to do this kind thing.
Maybe they don't care about recognition for their mods (like me I do things I like and that I will use ) and don't want to get anymore e-mails about their work or limit the quantity, some people also prefer not to see their mods on some sites, some want to ensure that their mods are always up to date and don't want to support multiple versions, others may be planning to expand on their existing mods, etc... The KotOR community is rather small and we try to promote respect as much as we can.

We had discussions about that in the past and modders who were active at Holowan labs back in 2004-2005 were expecting that, unless they give permission in the readme or otherwise, it means no. Almost every time some mods have been uploaded to other sites or modified in view of a public release without permission there have been some problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shem
Again, respecting the authors is FIRST in this community because without them, there is no community.
QFE and you have done great work too Shem

We also have forum rules about all that
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Old 12-17-2008, 09:35 PM   #14
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Meaning the Files site as in you want it to be the only monopoly of where to get mods. That's a little Microsoft like, but okay. Don't want any competition? And no I'm not negotiating or complaining. Just having a little conversation about this to you. Lots of news to me. lol. Can't say I agree with it, but nothing I can do about it.
Boy you really don't know much about me at all, do you? Anybody that really knows me, knows that what you said about me isn't true.

I don't want a modding monopoly with KotorFiles, far from it. Personally, what do I gain from it? I'm not making any money for it so how does that threaten me? In fact, having another strong site helps stabilizes a community in case one site falls, we have the other one. I know many who have been around the community from the early days know this because of what happened with PCGM. Not that will happen with KotorFiles because the FileFront network wouldn't allow that to happen, but I'm still all for having another strong site for hosting KOTOR mods as it helps the chances for those searching for mods find what they're looking for. I know that many mod authors would actually send their mods to both sites because it would expand the publicity of the mod they made.

I'm also for having a site like PCGM again that had the same submission-like convenience. There has been talk about reviving LucasFiles and making it a strong site last summer and not only did I support that, I even volunteered to help advise what I know needs to be done to make it successful. In fact, I did give tips publicly about it. I would offer more than that if I had the time to do it. I would also submit some of my past mods to it again if it was revived as again it helps people see your work.

The biggest thing that another strong modding site needs in order to be successful would be the strong guidelines I've established at KotorFiles, or it will fail because the people here at Holowan would not support it and you would need the support of Holowan in order for it to succeed.

I guarantee that a site ran by you and the way you would want it ran would fail and anybody with a reasonable mind that happens to read what I'm saying would back me up.


Interested in hosting a your KOTOR or TSL mod at FileFront? Send your mod HERE and we'll validate it as soon as we can! FileFront is a good way to get publicity for your mod as we get 1000's of visitors everyday. Is my LucasForum PM box full again? If you really need to reach me, PM me at YouTube under the username: Shem L -- Watch my KOTOR videos! Download my mods from FileFront!

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Old 12-18-2008, 12:29 AM   #15
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Boy you really don't know much about me at all, do you? Anybody that really knows me, knows that what you said about me isn't true.
I'll vouch for that.

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Old 12-18-2008, 01:16 AM   #16
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Boy you really don't know much about me at all, do you? Anybody that really knows me, knows that what you said about me isn't true.
I'll vouch for him too.


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Old 12-18-2008, 02:49 PM   #17
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Well I asked. And you guys have your reasons. I have mine for edisagreeing. So let's jsut leave it at that. I know now what I cannot do with regards to these rare mods. But my questions have been answered. I din't want to get into another debate like ugh Kavar's. So thanks for your answers. C ya on another thread if I have additonal questions.


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Old 12-19-2008, 02:14 AM   #18
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(I know I'm a little late to this party but I have some time now so here I go.)

To everyone interested, let me tell you all a little bit of the history concerning this issue, and it does date back to the dreadful state of things in the JK:JA Modding community, there was disrespect, drama, stealing, plagiarism, and a general rudeness that turned off many of us, and we didn't want to see that spilling over to this community, so when this place was in its infancy and seeing the general state of ugliness that occurred in the JA community we wanted to set a foundation of one of respect and cooperation.

In that endeavor I think we have succeeded.

But there are prices to pay for this and this issue is one of them, we place respect over convenience, it isn't easy for the newer members to fathom why we ask such seemingly silly things like an "Ask for permission before hosting someone else's mod" rule, but there is a real reason for why we do this... as we have seen what can happen if you don't.

Just an FYI... and my


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Old 12-20-2008, 06:44 AM   #19
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To everyone interested, let me tell you all a little bit of the history concerning this issue, and it does date back to the dreadful state of things in the JK:JA Modding community, there was disrespect, drama, stealing, plagiarism, and a general rudeness that turned off many of us
Which is one of the reasons why I quit making public mods for those games way back in the day. All other mods I've made over the years for those games were made for my own private use.


Interested in hosting a your KOTOR or TSL mod at FileFront? Send your mod HERE and we'll validate it as soon as we can! FileFront is a good way to get publicity for your mod as we get 1000's of visitors everyday. Is my LucasForum PM box full again? If you really need to reach me, PM me at YouTube under the username: Shem L -- Watch my KOTOR videos! Download my mods from FileFront!

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Old 12-20-2008, 06:55 AM   #20
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Boy you really don't know much about me at all, do you? Anybody that really knows me, knows that what you said about me isn't true.
I vouch for Shem to. The only reason my mods are on any other sites except KotOR Files is because Shem advised me to do that.



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Old 12-21-2008, 02:35 AM   #21
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I vouch for Shem to. The only reason my mods are on any other sites except KotOR Files is because Shem advised me to do that.
I remember that. You were trying to be loyal to me, but I encouraged you to distribute your mods to other places if you like the site. It's better for you in the long run.


Interested in hosting a your KOTOR or TSL mod at FileFront? Send your mod HERE and we'll validate it as soon as we can! FileFront is a good way to get publicity for your mod as we get 1000's of visitors everyday. Is my LucasForum PM box full again? If you really need to reach me, PM me at YouTube under the username: Shem L -- Watch my KOTOR videos! Download my mods from FileFront!

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