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Old 10-12-2001, 10:15 AM   #1
Aristotle
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Exclamation Nominations:

I'm not so sure the system of nominating candidates via the mods will work.. and if anything, it will just lend itself to people trying to get on the good sides of certain moderators....etc... which takes away from the purity of the process.

That may have worked early.. with a limited number of registered members and potential candidates.. but it's not likely to be effective now with the size and scope of the project.

It's much more democratic to allow ANYONE to run for the senate and make their pitch to the forums... keeps it open to everyone as it should be.

Then we'll take a list of those interested, post the list, allow people to make their last few statements on why they should be elected, and then we'll put together a fair, and secure method of voting.
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Old 10-12-2001, 11:27 AM   #2
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Only problem is, that will give idiots like viper the chance to nominate himself then have all his idiot friends log in and vote for him under several accounts.
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Old 10-12-2001, 12:22 PM   #3
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HOWEVER if someone logs in with multiple accounts the mods could catch em and void em if they have the same IP number...


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Old 10-12-2001, 03:34 PM   #4
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Yup, but it's extremely easy to get around the IP system.
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Old 10-12-2001, 04:30 PM   #5
Merek Of Nexsis
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Dial-up is too easy to get so many different IP's when logging in that they could never restrict via IP without blocking large blocks of addresses.

As long as there is a process for usurping the bad senators than everything should be OK.
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Old 10-12-2001, 06:14 PM   #6
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I agree with the Nexsis guys...
They are right that Viper could log in under 50 different names to vote for the Senate if he wanted to. Infact anybody with a 56k modem or less can do it.

Well we can have Leon decide on this factor.


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Old 10-12-2001, 06:37 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by darthfergie
I agree with the Nexsis guys...
They are right that Viper could log in under 50 different names to vote for the Senate if he wanted to. Infact anybody with a 56k modem or less can do it.

Well we can have Leon decide on this factor.
Theres a simple answer to that. If you vote you must posts the words yes or no (depending on if you are or not) than if 40 people vote that have only posted once or twice you know theres something wrong. Oh and to prevent people from flaming and trash talking there would be a 3 character limit for the posts in those threads.
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Old 10-15-2001, 08:21 AM   #8
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Looking at the scope of the forums now, i agree with the notion that Mods shouldn't nominate forummers for Senators.
I like the idea about a system that deals with bad Senators. It's still fixing problems backwards, but it's the best in these circumstances.

On the number of Senators: that is initially designed to keep debates manageable, DESPITE the number of forummers. We can always expand over time...

thanks for the input,

Paragon_Leon


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Old 10-15-2001, 09:03 AM   #9
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WOW THat was a big turn of thought...


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Old 10-15-2001, 03:55 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by Paragon_Leon
Looking at the scope of the forums now, i agree with the notion that Mods shouldn't nominate forummers for Senators.
I like the idea about a system that deals with bad Senators. It's still fixing problems backwards, but it's the best in these circumstances.

On the number of Senators: that is initially designed to keep debates manageable, DESPITE the number of forummers. We can always expand over time...

thanks for the input,

Paragon_Leon
One problem there Leo, I can almost garuntee that anyone we put up for nomination will make it. This is because people don't have to choose, they can vote for as many people as they want to, and will. If you put up a list of 10 people, i might only find 2 that i don't think are qualified for the job, so i might vote for the other 8. Now, imagine if 20 people just decided out of the blue they wanted to run. See the problem?

Thats why i think that the mods should nominate, it might not be very democratic, but without any kind of competition, it will be impossible to decide which 6 or 7 to choose if 20 get enough votes to be elected. If the mods nominate 6 or 7 people, then they can try to be elected. If they aren't, then the mods will nominate the next person "in line" so to speak. Beleieve me, there are plenty of people who wan to run, and all of them could and might collect enough votes to make it, what would happen then?
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Old 10-15-2001, 05:09 PM   #11
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never did like the nomination system


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Old 10-15-2001, 06:59 PM   #12
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Works best though...

Voting would be VERY difficult to pull off well...


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Old 10-15-2001, 08:48 PM   #13
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So why not have a specific forum just for every forummer to post 3 people they think will be the best possible representatives for the community? Then take the top 9 vote getters or whatever number of Senators the moderators want to have and there is your Senate? Simplicity is the key =)
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Old 10-15-2001, 08:57 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by Tirion *Nexsis*
So why not have a specific forum just for every forummer to post 3 people they think will be the best possible representatives for the community? Then take the top 9 vote getters or whatever number of Senators the moderators want to have and there is your Senate? Simplicity is the key =)
I hope you mean a thread not a forum...because this is about as good as you are going to get for the forum...

BTW, I think they are planning to do it that way...Seems the most logical...

(p.s.- 7 Senators as stated in the Rough Draft of Senate rules)


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Old 10-15-2001, 11:09 PM   #15
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I completely agree with what Tie said.

But also, by having the Mods nominate people, it prevents the formentioned problem of letting everyone run, regardless of qualifications and dedication. I'm not saying that only a select few should be senators, I just mean that for the first group of senators, we should have the best people for the job. We should be trying to avoid having a 'bad senator' scenerio right off the bat. It may be undemocratic, but that could be phased out as we go along. After the senate has been up and running and we've hammered out the initial problems(there will inevitably be at least one initial problem, nothings perfect), we could let everyone run. As we start this off we need stability. After thats established, we can make whatever changes are necissary.
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Old 10-15-2001, 11:27 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by Gamma732
I completely agree with what Tie said.

But also, by having the Mods nominate people, it prevents the formentioned problem of letting everyone run, regardless of qualifications and dedication. I'm not saying that only a select few should be senators, I just mean that for the first group of senators, we should have the best people for the job. We should be trying to avoid having a 'bad senator' scenerio right off the bat. It may be undemocratic, but that could be phased out as we go along. After the senate has been up and running and we've hammered out the initial problems(there will inevitably be at least one initial problem, nothings perfect), we could let everyone run. As we start this off we need stability. After thats established, we can make whatever changes are necissary.
Excellent point Gamma. I too think that the first senate should be nominated by mods so that it can be the most stable and problem free. With a strong core of those people, then any one person cannot affact the senate too much in a bad way. Howeverm without the core, the senate could fall apart or lose control.

Maybe we should strike a compromise. Hoes this:

1. 1/2 of the senators (3) are chosen by the mods. They are nominated AND elected by them. That way you have a solid foundation

2. The rest are selected from voting and nominations by the people, in a democratic process that we should strive for.

This way, we could be democratic, but still provide the means for which at least some highly qualified members make it to the senate.
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Old 10-16-2001, 12:44 AM   #17
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I say it should be all nominations or all democratic...
I say Nominations...at least for the first try...


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Old 10-16-2001, 05:12 PM   #18
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I think it could work as long as a number of senatorial candidates are Mod nominees(But only for the first group of senators).

Also, I think considering the population of the boards, there should be more then 6 senators. Its just like that problem I brough up a while back. We have 500+ people to be divided to 6 rep's. That means each rep will have a sizable number of people to represent. Having that many people to handle could create some problems. The senator is supposed to be the voice of the people...we'll have a problem when 25 of the representees disagree with the other 25 of a senator's representees. If we add ever a couple of senator slots, the size of the represented groups will decrease and there'll be a lot less friction.
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Old 10-17-2001, 08:40 AM   #19
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We will most likely go with a second and even third round of voting. Once the first batch of nominees gets going, we start a second voting round between those, eliminating those with the least votes... see how that would work ? You'll simply make people vote repeatedly for a certain person and eventually they'll have to choose someone else if their choice was eliminated in a previous round..

as far as bad forummers nominating themselves; mods can certainly prevent them from getting into office if them misbehave(d) in the forums..


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Old 10-17-2001, 10:20 AM   #20
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That sounds like an excellent way of doing the nominations leon. I cant wait to get started GIDDY! Oh and the mod nominated system still sounds good to me because it would prevent alot of problems from arising.
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