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Old 12-19-2009, 03:14 PM   #41
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I wouldn't be surprised if they used the standard Star Wars EU solution to when you want to bring back a previously killed character for more action/milking: Cloning. Starkiller 1 died, so let's bring Starkiller 2 out of storage and carry on.
Cloning could definitely be it. For now, I call that he is another Scion and is alive because he is Unleashed or something. Seems fitting with the Michael Bayness of his character.

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I think the more prevalent problem is the fact that he had just been stabbed right through the gut with a lightsaber.
Hahahaha, yeah that'd do it wouldn't it.
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Old 12-19-2009, 04:11 PM   #42
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Old 12-19-2009, 04:21 PM   #43
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Orly? What does that make Luke? John Connor?

Vader as T-101?


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Old 12-19-2009, 05:51 PM   #44
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I think LucasArts can come up with something better than cloning. Even if the first game wasn't that great I thought the story was above average for video games.


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Old 12-19-2009, 05:59 PM   #45
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Perhaps Vader saves him somehow...kinda of like Bastila did with Revan? but then Revan was still barely alive and I believe it was stated that marek was dead.


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Old 12-19-2009, 07:59 PM   #46
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Where the hell is my new X-Wing game, I've been waiting for a while now and Santa is tired of receiving the same damn list from me every year, hell it's not even a list, there's only one thing on there...


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Old 12-20-2009, 12:37 AM   #47
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I think LucasArts can come up with something better than cloning.
Don't give them too much credit. One word - midi-chlorians.

Besides, the more I think about it, the more it makes sense. Lucas obviously has a serious hardon for Clones at present, so I can see it spilling across into this either from his direct suggestion or, more likely, pandering by Blackman et al. And compared to some other potential explanations, cloning at least doesn't require too much suspension of disbelief.
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Old 12-21-2009, 08:31 AM   #48
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I wouldn't be surprised if they used the standard Star Wars EU solution to when you want to bring back a previously killed character for more action/milking: Cloning. Starkiller 1 died, so let's bring Starkiller 2 out of storage and carry on.
I don't see that being what is going to happen. Starkiller being a clone project after Vader found him just doesn't seem right and I would willing to bet that won't happen here as that would turn off fans big time and ruin the game to a degree you could never repair. Hopefully LucasArts is smarter than that.

Starkiller remembers Juno for one if you refer to the trailer and his thoughts are way too complicated to someone who is "new".

I mean Starkiller, who was right next to the Emperor when the explosion happened just happened to die with no visible marks while the Emperor didn't get a scratch on him. That always threw me off.

Anyway, what if Starkiller somehow through the Force "faked" his death to save his life? His body is about to dumped out and before that happens, he wakes up and kills the stormtroopers escorting his body and then puts on a stormtrooper outfit on and then escapes the Death Star. There's an option.

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Besides, the more I think about it, the more it makes sense. Lucas obviously has a serious hardon for Clones at present
Don't confuse stormtroopers for a main mega Force wielding character. That I know isn't Lucas' style. Especially if that was easy, it would have been done several times already and the Sith would rule the galaxy forever.


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Old 12-21-2009, 08:34 AM   #49
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Anyway, what if Starkiller somehow through the Force "faked" his death to save his life? His body is about to dumped out and before that happens, he wakes up and kills the stormtroopers escorting his body and then puts on a stormtrooper outfit on and then escapes the Death Star. There's an option.
This would explain why he isn't fighting for the Rebellion or looking for Juno. He maybe feels it's better if believed to be dead. Which, in turn, would explain what Yoda says with 'find yourself.' If, like Shem said, every Force user thinks you're dead...it has some consequences.

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Old 12-21-2009, 10:07 AM   #50
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Where the hell is my new X-Wing game, I've been waiting for a while now and Santa is tired of receiving the same damn list from me every year, hell it's not even a list, there's only one thing on there...
I want the same thing, but they don't care.


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Old 12-21-2009, 12:23 PM   #51
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This would explain why he isn't fighting for the Rebellion or looking for Juno. He maybe feels it's better if believed to be dead. Which, in turn, would explain what Yoda says with 'find yourself.' If, like Shem said, every Force user thinks you're dead...it has some consequences.
My only issue now would be that arena fight we saw in the teaser. If you're trying to lay low, that is a good way to get attention; some Jedi like man fighting like that. Then again, his need to fight like that is what is his undoing to stay hidden.


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Old 12-21-2009, 12:58 PM   #52
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The Galaxy is immense, some systems so far apart that anything other than mapped Hyperspace would take a lifetime to travel, there are Places in the Galaxy that would have little to no knowledge of Jedi, the Republic, the Sith.


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Old 12-21-2009, 03:28 PM   #53
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The Galaxy is immense, some systems so far apart that anything other than mapped Hyperspace would take a lifetime to travel, there are Places in the Galaxy that would have little to no knowledge of Jedi, the Republic, the Sith.
Seeing a rancor in the trailer should tip you off that it's close enough to the Empire.


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Old 12-21-2009, 03:55 PM   #54
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Seeing a rancor in the trailer should tip you off that it's close enough to the Empire.
How, exactly? Rancors have been shown to live on a variety of different planets, spread across known (and unknown) space.






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Old 12-21-2009, 04:07 PM   #55
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How, exactly? Rancors have been shown to live on a variety of different planets, spread across known (and unknown) space.
The only planets the have been known to be native to were Dathomir, and Felucia.


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Old 12-21-2009, 06:27 PM   #56
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And Rakata Prime.

More to the point, the mere fact that there's a rancor in the trailer (which might or might not depict an actual canonical event anyway) does nothing to indicate planetary location in regards to anything.


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Old 12-21-2009, 07:40 PM   #57
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they escaped from a ship that crashed there that makes them non-native



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Old 12-21-2009, 08:25 PM   #58
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they escaped from a ship that crashed there that makes them non-native
Whether they're native or not is a moot point because they don't need to be native to be on a planet.

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Starkiller being a clone project after Vader found him just doesn't seem right and I would willing to bet that won't happen here as that would turn off fans big time and ruin the game to a degree you could never repair.
One way or another, having the apprentice return in any form already mucks something or another up in a way that can't be repaired. I say they might as well go with the explanation which is the most reasonable in context with the universe in which the story is set.

There have only been a handful of plots in the Star Wars universe that involve a character's resurrection, but I can't for the life of me recall any which are actually good. If Starkiller actually is, tried and true, brought back to life, the same person as before, then what new direction can he really be taken in? How does it not invalidate the weight behind the ending of the first part of the story? If he dies so the rebellion can survive, but comes back less than two years later, how does that complement the original story in a good way?

Also, on the romance subplot with Juno: No, thank you. If Starkiller is alive again, the same person, then that subplot is a foregone conclusion; nothing special. The reason it worked in TFU is because it ended right after it began. I guarantee you that it wouldn't have worked if one of the two hadn't died.

If Starkiller ends up being cloned somehow, then that would, for the most part, avoid the above problems which would be posed if he's resurrected or somehow survived. If he's a clone, then he doesn't necessarily have the same memories as the real Starkiller, and he doesn't even need to have the same personality. I think that the clone possibility is the best chance of this game's story being successful, because in effect, it would be something of a brand-new character, presented with some flavoring from an existing one thrown in. He could travel the galaxy on an adventure of his own, finding himself, uncovering the legacy of the real Starkiller, pondering the meaning of his own existence (should he regard himself as the same person, should he take up that person's mission or follow his own path, how should he feel in regards to Juno if he ever meets her, etcetera), and so on.

On a related note, does anyone know if the person(s) writing this game's story is/are the same one(s) who wrote the first one's?


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Old 12-21-2009, 08:27 PM   #59
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The only planets the have been known to be native to were Dathomir, and Felucia.
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And Rakata Prime.

but yeah it doesnt matter because spaceships



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Old 12-21-2009, 09:37 PM   #60
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Starkiller cloned himself and sent the clone after Vader and Palpatine is an option, albeit a very very crappy one.

I'm personally of the mind Palpatine was "too old and to get the job done" (impotence anyone ) and that Starkiller woke up on the verge of death and recovered while being dragged off to the morgue, or while in the morgue ........or wherever.


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Starkiller remembers Juno for one if you refer to the trailer and his thoughts are way too complicated to someone who is "new".

I mean Starkiller, who was right next to the Emperor when the explosion happened just happened to die with no visible marks while the Emperor didn't get a scratch on him. That always threw me off.
Yeah really, what *was* that anyways?

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Anyway, what if Starkiller somehow through the Force "faked" his death to save his life? His body is about to dumped out and before that happens, he wakes up and kills the stormtroopers escorting his body and then puts on a stormtrooper outfit on and then escapes the Death Star. There's an option.

Don't confuse stormtroopers for a main mega Force wielding character. That I know isn't Lucas' style. Especially if that was easy, it would have been done several times already and the Sith would rule the galaxy forever.
We'll see how it goes.

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This would explain why he isn't fighting for the Rebellion or looking for Juno. He maybe feels it's better if believed to be dead. Which, in turn, would explain what Yoda says with 'find yourself.' If, like Shem said, every Force user thinks you're dead...it has some consequences.
Does anyone else hear off in the distance where the script writers are borrowing the ending of Shadows of the Empire?

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There have only been a handful of plots in the Star Wars universe that involve a character's resurrection, but I can't for the life of me recall any which are actually good. If Starkiller actually is, tried and true, brought back to life, the same person as before, then what new direction can he really be taken in? How does it not invalidate the weight behind the ending of the first part of the story? If he dies so the rebellion can survive, but comes back less than two years later, how does that complement the original story in a good way?
Either it is entirely a non canon volume or they have a very interesting explanation waiting for us. However, so far as directions...for canon your guess is as good as anyone's. I can see several directions if looking into the SW infinities comics. I was a tad disappointed to see Lucas didn't decide to give us an alternate "what if" ending to ROTS film. Like in the video game.

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If Starkiller ends up being cloned somehow, then that would, for the most part, avoid the above problems which would be posed if he's resurrected or somehow survived. If he's a clone, then he doesn't necessarily have the same memories as the real Starkiller, and he doesn't even need to have the same personality. I think that the clone possibility is the best chance of this game's story being successful,
Albeit with a bitter taste in our mouths as it would be so clich'e or just flat unlike LA style in some ways as others have already said.
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Old 12-21-2009, 10:17 PM   #61
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I mean Starkiller, who was right next to the Emperor when the explosion happened just happened to die with no visible marks while the Emperor didn't get a scratch on him. That always threw me off.
Based on what is seen in the cutscene (and quotes from the novelization), I think the explosion was a side-effect of Starkiller being done in by Palpatine's lightning (the same sort of Force energy burst that Palpatine does when he dies in ROTJ, and other Jedi elsewhere in TFU). I always figured Palpatine survived it just fine because he's a lot more powerful.

Starkiller, given a little luck, being able to take Vader in a fight? That, I can buy. I mean, it's easier to believe that Starkiller (who's had at least a decade of training and experience) can defeat Vader than to believe Luke (who had less than two years of training) could, even if he was on a dark side rage-high.

However, Starkiller putting up a real fight with Palpatine as Yoda could, I can't buy (which is easy for me because he didn't). For the same reason, that's why it doesn't surprise me that Palpatine's none the worse for wear after standing in the middle of ground zero when Starkiller kicks it.

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I'm personally of the mind Palpatine was "too old and to get the job done" (impotence anyone ) and that Starkiller woke up on the verge of death and recovered while being dragged off to the morgue, or while in the morgue ........or wherever.
What's to stop Palpatine from sensing him after he wakes up and finishing him off? Or the Imperial guards? He'd hardly be firing at all cylinders if he just woke up from a coma.

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Albeit with a bitter taste in our mouths as it would be so clich'e or just flat unlike LA style in some ways as others have already said.
It would be less bitter (and no more clichéd) than if it's the same person as the Starkiller we see in the first TFU. Also, you're right that it would be unlike LA, because LA's style is usually to suck as opposed to not suck when it comes to storylines (TFU was the first good Star Wars game story in a long while. I think the last one before it was KotOR II, five years before TFU's release).


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Old 12-21-2009, 11:18 PM   #62
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Seeing a rancor in the trailer should tip you off that it's close enough to the Empire.
If there has to be a rancor in the game, then it damn well better be killable.


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Old 12-22-2009, 12:16 AM   #63
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Game mechanics will necessitate the character returning to a newb status, which means there will have to be some sort of hand waving like amnesia (god I hope not) or cloning to justify resetting him to level 0. As I said before, cloning just seems like the logical choice to me.
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Old 12-22-2009, 01:57 AM   #64
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And Rakata Prime.
Rancors weren't truly native of that world. In KOTOR, one of the Rakatan tribes mentions how they were brought to that world. I haven't played the game is so long that I can't remember exactly where that was said, or I would have provided a reference picture like I have on my occasions in the past to prove these points.


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Old 12-22-2009, 03:07 AM   #65
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Based on what is seen in the cutscene (and quotes from the novelization), I think the explosion was a side-effect of Starkiller being done in by Palpatine's lightning (the same sort of Force energy burst that Palpatine does when he dies in ROTJ, and other Jedi elsewhere in TFU). I always figured Palpatine survived it just fine because he's a lot more powerful.
Ah, the Highlander-ish quickening effect. I mean really. I rewatched Palpatine's death scene after playing the game to determine whether that's what happened to him when Vader tossed him into the reactor and as far as I know it isn't. It was a reactor core explosion prompted by Palpatine's Force lightning which he continued to release even during his fall (I believe this has always been the official explanation), so the "quickening" effect seen in TFU doesn't really make sense.

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TFU was the first good Star Wars game story in a long while..
You thought that story was good? I tend to disagree, but different people have different tastes, so I can't deny that TFU's story could be appealing to some. I personally thought it was stupid, shallow and mostly predictable.
One of many reasons for my negative opinion is the fact that Palpatine and Vader commited countless atrocities since their rise to power and yet that just wasn't reason enough for the rebel alliance to be formed, there just had to be something else.
Point two - we know not all Jedi died in the purge, but there was never a single mention of general Rahm Kota in any of the original movies, or the prequels. I find it strange that one of the founders of the Rebel Alliance could so easily be forgotten by everyone else. What happened to him?

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Old 12-22-2009, 03:28 AM   #66
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I personally thought it was stupid, shallow and mostly predictable.
Indeed. I was eye rolling from start to finish. When people came out praising the story I couldn't believe it. It was just another example of LF retconning a half-decent story into mediocrity and absurdity.
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Old 12-22-2009, 03:38 AM   #67
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Rancors weren't truly native of that world. In KOTOR, one of the Rakatan tribes mentions how they were brought to that world. I haven't played the game is so long that I can't remember exactly where that was said, or I would have provided a reference picture like I have on my occasions in the past to prove these points.
I don't understand why its relevant that the Rancor be Native to the world they are on... Not starting an argument of Course, I just don't see how a Rancor in a Fight Arena means they're within the Borders of the Empire

I could easily say that the Giant "beast" is of unknown origin, therefore the arena must outside the Empire because we haven't seen one before. To my Knowledge, most Dueling/Gladiatorial Arena's in the EU, and Movies, Bring in Prey and Predator alike from all corners of the Galaxy.


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Old 12-22-2009, 04:11 AM   #68
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Originally Posted by adamqd View Post
I don't understand why its relevant that the Rancor be Native to the world they are on... Not starting an argument of Course, I just don't see how a Rancor in a Fight Arena means they're within the Borders of the Empire
I wouldn't have mentioned it if it didn't have significance.

I'm not sure what world that is, but it's obvious that the creatures, including the Rancor you see was obviously transported there, or it's offspring of a Rancor that was transported there.

Then that means they got the Rancor from a world that is familiar with the Empire which means you have to have knowledge of the Empire and it's territory to go and fetch one.



Look, I have already stated my feelings on some of these theories so arguing with someone who has already made up their mind is pointless. Just remember not to fall into the trap that many people do in their minds.

Speculation becomes assumption. Assumption becomes fact. Then the truth is revealed and disappointment follows while it was forgotten that it started out as speculation.

What I've learn about Star Wars and storytelling, especially if Lucas has any inspiration is that he has a simple mind a some ways. It's creative, but he likes simple solutions. I believe it will as simple as Starkiller was believed to be dead, but wasn't and finds a way to escape. He's probably avoiding his friends and the Rebellion conflict for personal reasons which we'll learn later.

We can always refer back to this thread when the game is released to see what I mean.


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Old 12-22-2009, 06:11 AM   #69
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it's obvious
In SW the obvious is only one retcon away from being false assumption. I wouldn't be at all surprised if that was some new planet in the trailer and, lo and behold, that is now the one and only true homeworld of the rancor. Not to mention all the other stuff of actual significance to the movie backstory that is bound to changed.
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Old 12-22-2009, 07:51 AM   #70
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Here is something that wouldn't shock me at all after listening to the dialogue in the trailer.

Starkiller meets Yoda and ends up going to Dagobah to see him.


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Old 12-22-2009, 10:14 AM   #71
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@post68= Hey Shem your kinda overdoing this, I'm merely asking a question, there was no snideness to my remarks, and I'm not upset... Or am I Child, or fundamentally floored in my thought process. Where has all this "Well when someone like you has made their mind up" Like I'm some kind of "Bull at A Gate" or a Hammer in a World of Nails... Please Chill out, don't take it so seriously and...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shem
Speculation becomes assumption. Assumption becomes fact. Then the truth is revealed and disappointment follows while it was forgotten that it started out as speculation.
Take your own advice.

edit: This will be my Last reply on the subject by the way, as its kind of a boring irrelevant thing, I'm getting upset about comments from a guy I'll never meet, and I got Christmas Shopping to do



Last edited by adamqd; 12-22-2009 at 10:39 AM.
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Old 12-22-2009, 05:07 PM   #72
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@post68= Hey Shem your kinda overdoing this, I'm merely asking a question, there was no snideness to my remarks, and I'm not upset... Or am I Child, or fundamentally floored in my thought process. Where has all this "Well when someone like you has made their mind up" Like I'm some kind of "Bull at A Gate" or a Hammer in a World of Nails... Please Chill out, don't take it so seriously and...
I wasn't directing all my comments to you. That is why I put "several" spaces between the paragraph that I directed at you to something I was speaking others in general.


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Old 12-24-2009, 12:48 AM   #73
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I like Shem's theory of Starkiller killing the Storm Troopers of taking him away. Hell, it could even be the first level of the game. And it'd be a nice way to introduce n00bs ( ) to the controls.

As for Starkiller having "amnesia," I too, think it's B.S. But perhaps Lucasarts could instead expand on the different force techniques? (Perhaps have a "Force Kick" in there? ) Also, recall that Starkiller never used a Force Power other than Push in a pre-rendered cutscene, so canonically speaking, they could leave the powers at level one in the new game. Because of this, people will once again be able to build up their precious-little-Jedi to their preference.
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Old 12-24-2009, 03:08 PM   #74
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I like Shem's theory of Starkiller killing the Storm Troopers of taking him away. Hell, it could even be the first level of the game. And it'd be a nice way to introduce n00bs ( ) to the controls.

As for Starkiller having "amnesia," I too, think it's B.S. But perhaps Lucasarts could instead expand on the different force techniques? (Perhaps have a "Force Kick" in there? ) Also, recall that Starkiller never used a Force Power other than Push in a pre-rendered cutscene, so canonically speaking, they could leave the powers at level one in the new game. Because of this, people will once again be able to build up their precious-little-Jedi to their preference.
Or give people the option to start with the Starkiller 'build' save from part 1. And make the enemies scale with that.
But that would be good and well thought. Not one of LA's best abilities...

But it at least avoids Shem 'forced level 1' remark. Which would suck...

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Old 01-23-2010, 06:45 PM   #75
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I was just perusing Gamestop's website as I do from time to time and they are listing a 12/31/2010 release for TFU II. Just thought I'd throw that out there.


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Old 01-23-2010, 08:38 PM   #76
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^^
Notice that 12/31/10 is the last day of 2010,TFUII is to be released sometime in 2010. GameStop likes to list games that are actually TBA 2010 as 12/31/10, for some retarded reason.


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Old 01-23-2010, 11:39 PM   #77
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didn't think about that, but according to them most of their ship dates come from the manufacturers.


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Old 01-24-2010, 12:51 AM   #78
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Game store listed ship dates hold no bearing on reality, nor any plane of existence near and/or quantumly entangled to this reality.
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Old 04-30-2010, 01:52 AM   #79
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So some new info is available on TFU2. Be warned that it contains spoilers - http://www.eucantina.net/archives/6396

Seems as if some of the speculation in this thread was correct:
spoiler:
Starkiller is indeed a clone in TFU2.

Lame, but I guess there were limited options.
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Old 04-30-2010, 02:29 AM   #80
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