lfnetwork.com mark read register faq members calendar

Thread: Boss health bar
Thread Tools Display Modes
Post a new thread. Add a reply to this thread. Indicate all threads in this forum as read. Subscribe to this forum. RSS feed: this forum RSS feed: all forums
Old 02-23-2002, 10:19 PM   #1
jesseg88
 
jesseg88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: my house
Posts: 335
Boss health bar

Will a health bar appear at the top of the screen when you fight a boss like this?

IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
jesseg88 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-23-2002, 10:54 PM   #2
Cyclone
 
Cyclone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Wash DC
Posts: 96
no
Cyclone is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-23-2002, 11:17 PM   #3
StormHammer
Fallen Jedi
 
StormHammer's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Outer spiral arm of the galaxy
Posts: 5,437
10 year veteran! 
Wouldn't that take some of the fun out of running around like a Maniac with a Panic Attack trying to stay alive and wondering how much it's going to take to kill that sucker?
StormHammer is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-23-2002, 11:26 PM   #4
JR2000Z
Ass-hole Extaordinaire
 
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: SOL system
Posts: 4,170
Yeah, it would take out all the suspense.
JR2000Z is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-24-2002, 12:07 AM   #5
Krayt Tion
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
I'm not a fan of health bars for FPS bosses, either.

I must also add that your avatar savagely mocks the convergence of my dying monitor, jesseg.
  you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-24-2002, 02:08 AM   #6
Zx2
 
Zx2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Somewhere in the universe
Posts: 73
i think bosses should have as much hp as normal players... 2 hits and their dead.....
(what gives bosses huge amounts of hp neway???)

with jk2s new kick ass AI, it shouldnt be a problem to make bots that dont need to have 10000²hp, just make them smart enough to defend themselves
Zx2 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-25-2002, 10:53 AM   #7
Rogue_Ace
 
Rogue_Ace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Good Ol' USA
Posts: 158
I'm just guessing but I think that its going to take more than a few hits to kill the bosses . As for the AI its going to be a lot better than before but i don't think it will be that good...tell me if im wrong
Rogue_Ace is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-25-2002, 12:26 PM   #8
db6
 
db6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: L3 Colonies
Posts: 123
It's also unrealistic to show a health bar for your enemy, unless there is something along the lines of "a force sense health meter on enemy"?
db6 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-25-2002, 12:36 PM   #9
txa1265
Father Jedi
 
txa1265's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Marlborough, MA, USA
Posts: 3,199
Forum Veteran 
I agree that the Boss health meter is a bit 'arcade-ish' (or playstation-ish), but I do like the idea of getting some sense of your opponant's health - remember in Doom you get that on your center HUD character? Perhaps some visualization on the boss - the boss who is *one hit away* from death should probably look a *bit* different from the superstrong foe who promises to make you quick-load half a dozen times

Mike
txa1265 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-25-2002, 01:49 PM   #10
The Bothan Spy
 
The Bothan Spy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Bothawui
Posts: 35
Quote:
Originally posted by txa1265
I agree that the Boss health meter is a bit 'arcade-ish' (or playstation-ish), but I do like the idea of getting some sense of your opponant's health - remember in Doom you get that on your center HUD character? Perhaps some visualization on the boss - the boss who is *one hit away* from death should probably look a *bit* different from the superstrong foe who promises to make you quick-load half a dozen times

Mike
I agree. Instead of a health meter they should show that they're heavily damaged.

Relating to this, you know how you can cut limbs off?? Well, if you cut someone's arm off, will they just suddenly die, or run off screaming?? Or if you cut off their leg will they thrash about on the floor in pain?? Is that too realistic/graphic/traumatic(/hilarious) for a computer game??? Personally, I don't think that everyone who loses a limb automatically dies becasue of it, 'specially since the lightsaber will cauterise the wound (and yes, we know from the E.U that this happens, even though lightsaber blades aren't "hot").
Shouldn't the game have some realism like this??


Many of my kind died to bring you this information!!
The Bothan Spy is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-25-2002, 02:43 PM   #11
Uber_Saber
 
Uber_Saber's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Undisclosed planet on the Outer Rim
Posts: 587
I hope there's something like that. If you take off the legs, they thrash around on the floor. Take off their arms and they can't hold a weapon and run around like a chicken with its head cut off.


Well, I can always hope, can't I?


Quoth the Raven; "Nevermore, nevermore."
Uber_Saber is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-25-2002, 03:02 PM   #12
Dirth Vedar
 
Dirth Vedar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 78
Hey, for wimpy stormtroopers, they probably would pass out from the pain if getting a limb cut off. So I think the enemy would drop if losing a limb. I mean, even if you lose limb, and still conscious, you'll probably want to play dead at the very least. Either way, they should be on the floor. I don't want to see half storm troopers shooting at me. The Empire does not pay these storm troopers enough for them to fight to the death after losing a few limbs. The running away... eh... it's okay, but I still think it'll hurt so much you should just drop to the ground.

As for the bosses, that's a whole different deal, because they have force power and all, so they'll have more control over their own pain, and probably be better suited to fight to the death. I also believe the bosses should have no more health than you, but to make it challenging, they should have minions that gets release periodically to hurt you, or make them excellent duelist who can block nearly anything you can throw at them (so it's hard to hit them), or they can have a butt load of force powers and keep shooting lightning at you the entire duel, but you should not be able to deal 20 blows to the body with a light saber and see no visible damage, and then have the guy just drop.

I think that boss fights should permit cutting of limbs, so the boss will lose a hand or something, and their fighting worsen, and they can begin to panic or become maniacal or something. or make them really good duelists in the beginning. Stop anything you can throw at him with blocking or dodging, but allow the boss to get tired as time goes on, until he lets his guard down and you sneak through and cut him/her in half in one blow. That's the type of boss dueling I am looking forward to.

Last edited by Dirth Vedar; 02-25-2002 at 03:20 PM.
Dirth Vedar is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-25-2002, 03:14 PM   #13
The Bothan Spy
 
The Bothan Spy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Bothawui
Posts: 35
Perhaps if you stabbed them in the foot they'd hop around in a comical way, screaming obscenities!!
I really would LOVE to see a one legged Stormie thrashing around in pain on the floor. I'd pay to see this!!


Many of my kind died to bring you this information!!
The Bothan Spy is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-25-2002, 03:16 PM   #14
Sturmgewehr
 
Sturmgewehr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 222
Still conscious even if you're dead? Now that takes skill.

Probably it will be that a limb will only come off with the final strike that kills them. I doubt we'll be seeing limbs come off bosses.



"Französische Schülerinnen schiessen besser!"
Sturmgewehr is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-25-2002, 03:21 PM   #15
simon says
 
simon says's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Maryland, USA
Posts: 100
Quote:
Perhaps if you stabbed them in the foot they'd hop around in a comical way, screaming obscenities!! I really would LOVE to see a one legged Stormie thrashing around in pain on the floor. I'd pay to see this!!
The Bothan Spy
Man you're sadistic!
simon says is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-25-2002, 03:46 PM   #16
Moses
 
Moses's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Little Rock, Arkansas, USA
Posts: 265
Yeah I don't think that bosses will be able to lose limbs, but I don't think it's totally unlikely that they might only require 1-2 hits to kill. The AI in this is supposed to be incredible, and there is specific "Jedi AI", so I wouldn't rule it out.


Strong am I with the force, but not that strong.
Moses is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-25-2002, 03:48 PM   #17
Lord Chief
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Like many others allready said before me, Id say its better to show visual damange on the boss-figure than to show a healthbar. It indeed would make JK2 look too arcade.

JK1 was a bit irritating in this perspective. The bosses you fought needed 10 to 20 full power hits to get them on their knees. Not very realistic.

I dont like the idea of minions spawning and chopping away at my back while Im fighting a boss. Takes away the suspense of a 1vs1 duel and makes it far too hectic. Indeed, it would be better to make the bosses hard to hit because they block well.
  you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-25-2002, 04:07 PM   #18
Pedro The Hutt
Jedi Knight
 
Pedro The Hutt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Indu San
Posts: 3,044
Yeah, personally I'm all for that, a boss that takes 1 or 2 hits to kill depending on where you've hit him. But ofcourse, that he's indeed also so skilled that you'd need to use alot of skill and/or a cunning trick to outsmart him and chop him in half... would make things more realistic to the SW universe as well.
Pedro The Hutt is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-25-2002, 06:28 PM   #19
GAT
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 37
Quote:
Originally posted by The Bothan Spy
Perhaps if you stabbed them in the foot they'd hop around in a comical way, screaming obscenities!!
I really would LOVE to see a one legged Stormie thrashing around in pain on the floor. I'd pay to see this!!
I *strongly* hope there are NO obscenities. If they are really keeping with the star wars universe, they will keep that to a minimum if not even including it at all.

GAT


I prefer what was to what now is;
'Cause what was wasn't what now isn't.
GAT is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-25-2002, 06:55 PM   #20
Moses
 
Moses's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Little Rock, Arkansas, USA
Posts: 265
GAT, I'm sure there are obscenities in the Star Wars universe. Yeah. I agree, keep the game clean.


Strong am I with the force, but not that strong.
Moses is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-25-2002, 07:42 PM   #21
Cmdr. Cracken
Disciple of Megatron
 
Cmdr. Cracken's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Rochester, NY, USA
Posts: 6,083
Current Game: Starcraft II,College
LFN Staff Member 10 year veteran! Forum Veteran Hot Topic Starter 
In the novels, anything with the word sith, and some bodily fluid or or other object is a swaer word. I.E: Sithspit, Sithspawn, ect.,....

Cmdr. Cracken is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-25-2002, 09:09 PM   #22
Rogue_Ace
 
Rogue_Ace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Good Ol' USA
Posts: 158
I also agree with GAT (btw GAT welcome to the fourms) on the no swearing part although I think that the manufactures will not allow it anyway excapt for the occasional sithspit ect...
Rogue_Ace is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-25-2002, 09:21 PM   #23
MuRaSaMuNe
 
MuRaSaMuNe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 591
Quote:
Originally posted by The Bothan Spy
Perhaps if you stabbed them in the foot they'd hop around in a comical way, screaming obscenities!!
I really would LOVE to see a one legged Stormie thrashing around in pain on the floor. I'd pay to see this!!
Hahah ya that would be great..
MuRaSaMuNe is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-26-2002, 12:07 AM   #24
Bar_Tender
 
Bar_Tender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 62
I can't help but think of the "Weapons Test" on the Behind the Magic disc for the lightsaber:

Lightsaber is thrown at the panicing Stormtrooper. He flinches as the saber flys over his head, then for a second, thinks "Wow! I'm alive! I'm all right!"

Then his arm falls off.

He looks at the arm, and then at the socket where it used to be. He nudges it with his foot, and then picks it up and sadly walks away
Bar_Tender is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-26-2002, 12:50 AM   #25
The Truthful Liar
In-Transit
 
The Truthful Liar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Blasting out of trajectory in a suit of terracotta
Posts: 3,548
LFN Staff Member Forum Veteran 
Post yayyyy...!!

This topik has now changed from "Will the boss have a Health Bar indicator??" to: "I'd like to see stormtroopers maliciously cut up"...

riiiiiight......

Cheers
The Truthful Liar is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-26-2002, 02:04 AM   #26
The Bothan Spy
 
The Bothan Spy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Bothawui
Posts: 35
Re: yayyyy...!!

Quote:
Originally posted by AB_Legion
This topik has now changed from "Will the boss have a Health Bar indicator??" to: "I'd like to see stormtroopers maliciously cut up"...

riiiiiight......

Cheers
Yeah, it's wicked, isn't it!!

What's everyone's favourite kind of mutilation they'd like to see in the game????
How 'bout cutting the individual eye-stalks off a Gran and beating them to death with them???
By the way, this kind of behaviour APPALLS me, and I don't condone it in ANY way. It is of the dark side, and therefore NOT for me!! Oh, hang on...


Many of my kind died to bring you this information!!
The Bothan Spy is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-26-2002, 02:33 AM   #27
Redwing
thedeadlymoose
 
Redwing's Avatar
 
Status: Super Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: California
Posts: 17,233
10 year veteran! LFN Staff Member Forum Veteran LF Jester 
Quote:
Originally posted by Zx2
i think bosses should have as much hp as normal players... 2 hits and their dead.....
(what gives bosses huge amounts of hp neway???)

with jk2s new kick ass AI, it shouldnt be a problem to make bots that dont need to have 10000²hp, just make them smart enough to defend themselves
Reborn will have personal shields in JK2. So they can probably withstand a few hits from the lightsaber.

BTW, I just realized why stormies and such fly off at mach 3 after getting hit with a saber: it's the only way to show a non-lethal saber hit except for the JK way (have the saber unrealistically go through your opponent without killing him) Likely this will happen with most AI.


Redwing is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-26-2002, 06:36 AM   #28
txa1265
Father Jedi
 
txa1265's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Marlborough, MA, USA
Posts: 3,199
Forum Veteran 
Quote:
Originally posted by The Bothan Spy
Perhaps if you stabbed them in the foot they'd hop around in a comical way, screaming obscenities!!
I really would LOVE to see a one legged Stormie thrashing around in pain on the floor. I'd pay to see this!!
... kind of like in SoF ... shoot the gun out of there hand and the stand there shaking there hand in pain, shoot them in the leg and they hop ... it is funny
txa1265 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-26-2002, 06:59 AM   #29
Pedro The Hutt
Jedi Knight
 
Pedro The Hutt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Indu San
Posts: 3,044
Quote:
Originally posted by Bar_Tender
I can't help but think of the "Weapons Test" on the Behind the Magic disc for the lightsaber:

Lightsaber is thrown at the panicing Stormtrooper. He flinches as the saber flys over his head, then for a second, thinks "Wow! I'm alive! I'm all right!"

Then his arm falls off.

He looks at the arm, and then at the socket where it used to be. He nudges it with his foot, and then picks it up and sadly walks away
Oh yeah, that thing alone was worth getting "behind the magic" for lol
Pedro The Hutt is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-26-2002, 09:44 AM   #30
db6
 
db6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: L3 Colonies
Posts: 123
What if the opposite is true, and Kyle gets his arm/leg cut off by a Reborn, what do you say to that?
db6 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-26-2002, 10:38 AM   #31
Dirth Vedar
 
Dirth Vedar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 78
Load Saved Game duh.
Dirth Vedar is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-26-2002, 10:52 AM   #32
Rogue_Ace
 
Rogue_Ace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Good Ol' USA
Posts: 158
My guess is that it wouln't be possible to cut off Kyle's arm but it sure would be funny ... unless you forgot to save it .
Rogue_Ace is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-26-2002, 12:24 PM   #33
Kurgan
Headhunter
 
Kurgan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 1997
Location: The Dawn of Time
Posts: 18,322
LFN Staff Member 10 year veteran! 
If this were an arcade game, I'd say yes. But as it is, we can't see the health of other players in MP, or of weak enemies in SP, so why the boss? Pain skins would be nice, but I'd rather keep the suspense of not knowing exactly how much power he has left at every given moment.
Kurgan is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 02-27-2002, 04:29 AM   #34
Naphtali
 
Naphtali's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 388
Yes your right, aside with the ghoul system it will be pretty much useless, I mean if the Boss Ai they make is slightly better than Jedi AI then that means they should be able to counter most to all your moves anyway, making the battle already difficult for you to even get a hit. 3rdly if you add a health bar then you struggle to get a hit in like the movies, so it could become tedious since your able to just dominate him.

Thats why yeah the BOss should be tougher but still if you get a good head slash he should be dead no matter what,


Naphtali is HARD
AS HELL
BATTLE ANYBODY I DONT CARE
WHO YOU TELL
Naphtali is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-04-2002, 05:56 PM   #35
L'Equa Sinar
 
L'Equa Sinar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Leicester, Cloud City
Posts: 364
Maybe some cool features would be such as these:

If you slice thier arm off, they run away, but after a few steps they collapse and die/passout

If you shoot a Stormy in his gun or use your saber to maybe cut his gun in half, it could malfunction, or....BACKFIRE!! Stormy 1 - Stormy 0!!!

Would be good if using guns you can take someone's knee out to slow them down, or a shot to the groin to send them down on thier knees holding their...."gungans??!??!?" And with them on thier knees, all u need to do is slice thier heads clean off!!!

Will heads be able to be taken off?? And if so, will it kill them?!??! Ok, the fatal bit was a joke, but will you be able to decapetate someone? Maybe in multiplayer too??


Away with your weapon! I mean you no harm!
L'Equa Sinar is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-04-2002, 09:53 PM   #36
Naphtali
 
Naphtali's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 388
I was hopeing they would at least have it so it will have the limb detection like goldeneye and games now too.
Where you can cut arms and their doesn't have to be blood but at least dismemberment, only with the saber at least.
I have a feeling they will probably let you change these settings


Naphtali is HARD
AS HELL
BATTLE ANYBODY I DONT CARE
WHO YOU TELL
Naphtali is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-05-2002, 09:31 AM   #37
Pedro The Hutt
Jedi Knight
 
Pedro The Hutt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Indu San
Posts: 3,044
Quote:
Originally posted by L'Equa Sinar

If you shoot a Stormy in his gun or use your saber to maybe cut his gun in half, it could malfunction, or....BACKFIRE!! Stormy 1 - Stormy 0!!!

Now that would take skill, shooting a stormtrooper rifle out of someone's hands. How are you going to give yourself the time to get a decent aim on that gun while that stormtrooper (and his friends most likely) are shooting at you? Well ofcourse you could snipe it out of his hands.. but by the time you also get there to finish him off he probably would have picked up again and sounded some alarms.
And now for cutting it in half, first you'd need to get to the stormtroopers side.. since it's as good as impossible to cut the barrel of a gun in half without also getting the hand/arm of the trooper. Also once's again you'd have to put up with the trooper trying to blast you. And if you manage to get besides him, you'd need to get the time to calculate and inniciate a slice attack that would just get the barrel of the rifle and not the enemy himself. (Who will probably resort to punching you in the face than.) But basically, it would be VERY cool if you could do that, but it would be so much easier to just shoot/cut up the trooper without damaging the gun. (besides if you cut the rifle in half you can't use it yourself )
Pedro The Hutt is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-05-2002, 11:41 AM   #38
Pipe Smoke
 
Pipe Smoke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: In a pyramid in the desert
Posts: 139
Well I have a sneaking suspicion that they are going to pussy out on all this stuff.

You'd think when they made SOF, and SOF2... that they'd push the envelope.

Maybe I'll be proven wrong... but my guess is that we'll be lucky to see even the arms coming off as in the early screenshots and in the original JK.

They have a free pass to not have a drop of blood in the game and not make a single one of us mad, because of the nature of the weapons. So, even if they went all out (which I wish they would) with cauterized dismemberment and decapitation and all of it... it'd still be very tame by most games' standards.

And certainly by Raven standards.

So I don't know how much Lucas Arts is specifying, but it seems like they're being wussier than they probably have to be.

We shall see.

This is all fairly minor in the end, I hope the batsaber thing doesn't end up being a real problem.

Overall I am psyched like you wouldn't believe for the game, and I have a feeling that despite some minor things I would've done differently about it, or a handful of what I will feel were missed opportunities, and lament... that it will be one of the all time great games just like the original.
Pipe Smoke is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-05-2002, 02:18 PM   #39
L'Equa Sinar
 
L'Equa Sinar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Leicester, Cloud City
Posts: 364
Quote:
Originally posted by Pedro The Hutt

Now that would take skill, shooting a stormtrooper rifle out of someone's hands. How are you going to give yourself the time to get a decent aim on that gun while that stormtrooper (and his friends most likely) are shooting at you? Well ofcourse you could snipe it out of his hands.. but by the time you also get there to finish him off he probably would have picked up again and sounded some alarms.
And now for cutting it in half, first you'd need to get to the stormtroopers side.. since it's as good as impossible to cut the barrel of a gun in half without also getting the hand/arm of the trooper. Also once's again you'd have to put up with the trooper trying to blast you. And if you manage to get besides him, you'd need to get the time to calculate and inniciate a slice attack that would just get the barrel of the rifle and not the enemy himself. (Who will probably resort to punching you in the face than.) But basically, it would be VERY cool if you could do that, but it would be so much easier to just shoot/cut up the trooper without damaging the gun. (besides if you cut the rifle in half you can't use it yourself )

LOL! Remind me to think next time before i post, but of course, if you approach from an angle of .214 and initiate a lightsaber uppercut at 45.67832 mph, then you could send the barrel of the bun into the air and make it land on the Stormy "Codename: Haddock" to the left of the airlock!

Ok, <reads back> think before i post......<reads again> yeah, what the hell!! That'll do!


Away with your weapon! I mean you no harm!
L'Equa Sinar is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 03-05-2002, 03:09 PM   #40
Pedro The Hutt
Jedi Knight
 
Pedro The Hutt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Indu San
Posts: 3,044
lol, sorry ^_^" I tend to go on rants. Perhaps I think too much before I post lol... ahem ^^"
Pedro The Hutt is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Post a new thread. Add a reply to this thread. Indicate all threads in this forum as read. Subscribe to this forum. RSS feed: this forum RSS feed: all forums
Go Back   LucasForums > Network > JediKnight Series > Game Discussion > Jedi Outcast > Boss health bar

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:24 AM.

LFNetwork, LLC ©2002-2011 - All rights reserved.
Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.