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Old 04-16-2002, 12:30 AM   #1
allan14
 
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Joystick or keyboard...which is your preference?

I am trying to figure out which is the best for control.
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Old 04-16-2002, 12:37 AM   #2
Mavital
 
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Keyboard / Mouse

Mavital
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Old 04-16-2002, 12:38 AM   #3
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joysticks are just damn clumsy.
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Old 04-16-2002, 12:38 AM   #4
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Keyboard/Mouse is the BEST way to play in any FPS.
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Old 04-16-2002, 12:47 AM   #5
Njal Storm
 
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definatley gamepad

this is all i use, and i am 10 times the cyber warrior i used to be....



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Old 04-16-2002, 12:47 AM   #6
CrimsonGuard
 
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I definatly prefer Mouse/Keyboard at least for FPS. I once tried to play Counter-Strike with a Joypad...it wasnŽt really funny.
Mouse/Keyboard is the best there is for FPS...well...RacingWheel might work, too.
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Old 04-16-2002, 12:49 AM   #7
CrimsonGuard
 
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Re: definatley gamepad

Quote:
Originally posted by Njal Storm
this is all i use, and i am 10 times the cyber warrior i used to be....



WTF is that???? Well...if I had something like that IŽd be the overkiller!

This thing is definatly a cheat!
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Old 04-16-2002, 01:11 AM   #8
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I can't even begin to see how somebody could play a game like this with a joystick. Joysticks are for flight/space sims and Atari 2600's.


The Nostromo is just a butchered keyboard/gamepad combo.
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Old 04-16-2002, 01:19 AM   #9
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yeah who the hell uses a damn joystick for a fps? nothing beats the mouse+keyboard combo.
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Old 04-16-2002, 01:48 AM   #10
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yeah, I have a friend on here who wants to get me a birthday present, I think I'm going to request that, the Nostromo Speedpad, I figure putting push/pull on the mouse wheel, and weapon or force power scrolling on that wheel,... :shrug: looks pretty awsome, is it as much more comfortable than a keyboard as it looks?
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Old 04-16-2002, 01:48 AM   #11
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I asked because...

I have a friend who used the Wingman Extreme Pro joystick to play the original Jedi Knight and he kicked ass. I could seldom beat him and neither could most of the guys he fought. He insists that the joystick is the best way to play. It always seemed clumsy for me as well.
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Old 04-16-2002, 02:06 AM   #12
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The joystick is very efficient if you use it in conjunction with the mouse. I configure this way:

Joystick in right hand. Primary axes give me forward, backward, strafe right and left. Buttons are fire primary and secondary, jump (which includes force jump in JO), and crouch. The hat I use for Force push and pull, grip, and ignite saber.

Mouse in left hand. Button one goes mostly unused, although I have it bound to cycle through force powers. Button two is my use key to open doors and so on. The only time I have to touch the keyboard is to activate goggles, use bacta, switch a weapon, activate Force speed, healing, or Jedi Mind trick, all of which are bound to the Function keys within easy reach.

It was a bit awkward when I first started using it, but now I can't go back to mouse-keyboard. The joystick functions for moving, strafing, and Force pushing/pulling are now merely instinctive and I never 'fat finger' a wrong key trying to move. I'm telling you, it works great!!


JM
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Old 04-16-2002, 03:15 AM   #13
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HAHA, Is that thing for real? If so, do retail stores carry them?
I'd like to see how one would feel, it looks wild.


"Well, you look like an overgrown Kowakian monkey-lizard"
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Old 04-16-2002, 03:49 AM   #14
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It's the Nostromo n50 SpeedPad, made by Belkin. $35 if you order from them, sold at CompUSA's as well.
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Old 04-16-2002, 06:18 AM   #15
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First I just used keyboard, that was back in the day of not being able to look up or down, just straight ahead.

For a while I used Joystick/Mouse, now that took coordination.

Then now I use keyboard/mouse combo, it works fine, and is more natural for me.
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Old 04-16-2002, 06:24 AM   #16
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I also use the keyboard & mouse combo, although I recently added a program called Game Commander.. which is a voice activated program. Very, very slick. Basically I use my keyboard/mouse for movements, and then i just my voice for things like force powers (except jump - still use spacebar), stance, taung, etc. For me, it's way eaiser to SAY "absorb" or "heal" when i need it then hit a key on the keyboard.



Roach
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Old 04-16-2002, 06:27 AM   #17
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Re: definatley gamepad

Quote:
Originally posted by Njal Storm
this is all i use, and i am 10 times the cyber warrior i used to be....



Hmmm, that looks kind of interesting, I like the added thumb things on the side.
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Old 04-16-2002, 06:35 AM   #18
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I use the joystick and mouse. There is no way I could use the keyboard. To many times of fat fingering the wrong keys.


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Old 04-16-2002, 12:29 PM   #19
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From my previous thread on this subject...

Here is my definitive reasoning and pros and cons as to whether or not a game pad will suffice for this game...

First off, let me say that the depth of saber attacks in Jedi Outcast almost REQUIRE a tool with a bit more precision in movement then the common keyboard can offer. I know what you're going to say: "No Game pad can beat the precision on my mouse and keyboard!" And to an extent, I agree whole-heartedly with you. HOWEVER, when it comes to diagonal movements for lightsaber attacks, it's infinitely easier to chain several diagonal attacks in a row with a joystick, rather than using 2 keys at once for each diagonal attack on a keyboard, and having to swich between them. So to conclude THAT argument, I would have to say that the ease of hitting my diagonals in succession on a joystick greatly outweighs the ability to hit those same diagonals in succession with the keyboard (remember, the mouse does NOT affect your light saber attacks, other then aim...and I'll get to that later.)

So...I ordered this:

http://ca.store.yahoo.com/merconnet.../pstopccon.html

And played around with it for a bit. Now, keep in mind that I would only DARE consider even using a joypad (in this case my PS2 controller) for this game because of the extra control it gives you over your lightsaber attacks.

Also I noticed this about using a gamepad:
The in-game menu only allows you to adjust the "dead-zone" of your joystick. The "dead-zone" is the size of the neutral area on the joystick. The neutral area is where NO action takes place (ie, you're idling.) So, there isn't an adjustment on the in-game menu to allow you to adjust the "sensitivity" of the game-pad. The sensitivity controls how FAST you turn or look (depending on which axis you adjust it for.) So, the in-game menu does NOT allow you to adjust how quickly your character will turn around using the joystick....

However, don't fear. There's a simple command that you can type into your jk2mpconfig.cfg file (just tack it on the end there) that WILL allow you to adjust the "sensitivity" of the joystick. These commands were taken from the Q3 cvar list, so I'm not 100% sure they work with Jedi Outcast, but they SHOULD. Also, I am unsure as to what the values for the cvar should be, it's all really dependent on what sensitivity "feels" right to you...just like mouse sensitivity. Anyway, here's the commands:

joy_forwardsensitivity "-1" set forward/back sensitivity (negative is inverted)
joy_forwardthreshold "0.15" set forward/back dead zone
joy_name "joystick" set joystick name
joy_pitchsensitivity "1" set pitch sensitivity (negative is inverted)
joy_pitchthreshold "0.15" set pitch dead zone
joy_sidesensitivity "-1" set side sensitivity (negative is inverted)
joy_sidethreshold "0.15" set side dead zone
joy_threshold "0.15" possibly an overall threshold setting all other joy variables removed in 1.08
joy_upsensitivity "-1" set up/down sensitivity (negative is inverted)
joy_upthreshold "0.15" set up/down dead zone
joy_yawsensitivity "-1" set yaw sensitivity (negative is inverted)

Now, with these settings, it becomes infinitely easier (and faster) to turn around with the joystick, thus saving you MANY chops in the back. Also, bear in mind that for First-Person Shooters, a Keyboard and Mouse are ALWAYS going to allow you greater control over your aim, so you should ONLY consider using a joypad for this game if you are going to follow 2 guidelines (IMO):

1. You can play the game well in 3rd person ALL the time. I say play in 3rd person because it's easier to SEE your lightsaber movements in 3rd person. Also, with a joypad, aiming becomes EXTREMELY limited with guns (as compared to keyboard and mouse-style), thus 3rd person view will make it so that you only have to really aim in the general direction of your target. Which leads me to my second point...

2. This style of play (using a game pad) is recommended ONLY for those of you that play the game for the lightsaber aspect. As I've said before, the joypad's greatest advantage comes from that fact that you can get more precise movements (diagonal chaining, moving swipes, etc.) out of the joypad. I do NOT reccomend you using the joypad if you will be picking up and using guns as primary weapons, as the AIM of the pad cannot compare to the AIM with a mouse. However, for lightsabers, directional AIM is NOT as important as WHICH attack you are performing. As far as aim goes, as long as you are facing your opponent, consider your aiming taken care of. The actual swipe/slice that you perform with the light saber is what is going to determine whether or not you break your opponent's defenses.

So to sum it up, there it is. The pro's and con's of the joypad, and even a few tips on how to tweak it once you get it. I'll see you on the battlefield.

NOTE: I've recently discovered (the hard way) that JK2 does not allow you to adjust pitch, yaw, or anything other than zero area.


-Chaff Da-Lan, Jedi Master of the Light side of the force.
Jedi Fortress! A class-based Team modification for Jedi Outcast!
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Old 04-16-2002, 06:59 PM   #20
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jedi marso

I use to use a joystick in JK1 and I think it worked well. It was very intuitive for me at the time. As the other FPSs came out I went to the keyboard (plus the joystick broke ) Now it is just habit. I bet if I were to use a joystick I could get used to it again but the fact of the matter is...what is intuitive to people is what people are going to use.


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Old 04-16-2002, 08:59 PM   #21
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I used just the keyboard for JK, I was pretty good too. Then I started using the Mouse for sniping, but never could go all the way mouse/keyboard. JO I can only do mouse/keyboardl. I could see the advantages of Joystick/mouse/keyboard, but am not that cordinated. I'll stick with having all the hotkeys I want at my disposal. Granted I wish my roomie's computer had a better keyboard. I can't stand his p.o.s.


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Old 04-16-2002, 09:02 PM   #22
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well...

Quote:
Originally posted by Lnt. Kechtt
Granted I wish my roomie's computer had a better keyboard. I can't stand his p.o.s.
Beggars can't be choosers now can we?


-Chaff Da-Lan, Jedi Master of the Light side of the force.
Jedi Fortress! A class-based Team modification for Jedi Outcast!
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Old 04-16-2002, 09:04 PM   #23
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Last time i used a joystick was on the Amiga 1200 and i dont want to go back to it , i find the joystick to clumsy as artic series said. When i lay my hand on the keyboard all the keys are at my finger tips , just dont get that on the joystick for me


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Old 04-16-2002, 09:13 PM   #24
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Keyboard and mouse for me too. I use the joystick for flight sims and driving games, but I could never get the hang of it for a FPS.


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Old 04-16-2002, 09:16 PM   #25
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Re: definatley gamepad

Quote:
Originally posted by Njal Storm
this is all i use, and i am 10 times the cyber warrior i used to be....



I've heard that this thing has problems with different key combinations just like any regular keyboard does (as multiple keys are assigned the same circuit line in the keyboard's innards). This is a shame since the thing only has what... 10 keyboard keys?

If you can't push ALL TEN of them down at the same time and have them register in the game, then this thing isn't worth the cash.

As far as the little reassignment programmable D-pad thing on the right, I can show you how to make a script that would basically do the same thing to a regular keyboard... and you'd have more keys to work with as an added bonus.

Essobie

p.s. Keyboard and mouse, of course.


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Old 04-16-2002, 09:22 PM   #26
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Re: definatley gamepad

Quote:
Originally posted by Njal Storm
this is all i use, and i am 10 times the cyber warrior i used to be....



WTF is that? i would be the ubergamer using that thing

btw> got this friend that insists on using gamepads for FPS's :LOL:

and it's not gamepad+keyboard.. it's gamepad only..

i kick his ass everytime..


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Old 04-16-2002, 09:36 PM   #27
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I have the Nostromo N50 as well.. great little device.. for some reason I couldn't get the directional control to work in JK2.. tried enabling the joystick as well but no go.. did you have to do anything special to get it going?
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Old 04-16-2002, 09:41 PM   #28
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Well, I gave the MS Strategic Commander a whirl with Outcast...but it's just too sluggish. It suffices for SP in other FPS games (I used it in RTCW quite well), but in Outcast SP it was just not responsive enough.

I also think I read somewhere that some games don't like USB devices very much, so perhaps that's been part of the problem.

So I've stuck with Keyboard/Mouse for Outcast, and shifted my default movement keys over to ESDF, which gives me a few more keys to the left to play with - I use my little finger a lot.

For anyone interested, this is my current key config...

E = Forward
D = Backward
S = Left
F = Right
Q = Quick = Force Speed
W = Wound = Force Heal
R = Repel = Force Push
V = retrieVe = Force Pull
A = Force Absorb
G = Force Grip (haven't used it MP yet)
Z = Zap = Force Lightning (haven't used it MP yet)
B = Bacta
T = Jedi Mind Trick
CapsLock = Walk
Space = Jump
LeftAlt = Use

Then I've got Fire/AltFire on my LMB/RMB, Crouch for Thumb1, Perspective for Thumb2, and Mousewheel default (weapon switch), with Mousewheel Button set to Change Stance. (It's an Intellimouse Explorer - using a PS2 adaptor, because sometimes USB craps out.)

I've found it quite a useful reconfig - and as you see, I put the keys in context to help me to remember which ones to push.
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Old 04-16-2002, 10:37 PM   #29
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"I also think I read somewhere that some games don't like USB devices very much, so perhaps that's been part of the problem."

This is true of JO I'm damn near certain I've read this in some official text. Though I can't think where . (You can getaway with a USB mouse)

I use Keyboard + Mouse

Normally I use an intellipoint optical USB. Though today I bought a Trust 250SX Cordless Optical.

Unfortunetly I've found some problems

1. It just doesn't seem to track fast enough. (whhooo! jump-o-vision)

2. It's 4th and 5th buttons seem to be unmappable in-game, defaulting to Mouse 3 fuction.

3. Button 4 is so easy to press you end up changing sabre stance every 2 seconds.

4. It's shape and wieght make reposistioning difficult to do fast.

In short, I do not recomend this mouse and it will be going back unless I can get it to work. Grrr.

What you guys recomend?


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Old 04-16-2002, 11:56 PM   #30
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About your mouse...did you install the drivers...and then reconfigure the buttons to different keyboard keys?

That's what I had to do with the Intellimouse Explorer...to get all 5 buttons working. I set the thumb buttons to PageUp and PageDn, because I don't use those keys at all on my board...and then assign those keys to whatever function I want in game, and I can use those functions via those mouse buttons.

Sorry if you already know and have tried all of that...in which case, good luck sorting out your problem.
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Old 04-17-2002, 12:02 AM   #31
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keyboard and mouse easily.


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Old 04-17-2002, 12:36 AM   #32
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The Belkin Nostromo..... It's a wonderful pice of technology, kicks a keyboard/mouse's ass. Unless you have a keyboard and a 5-Button mouse like I do.

Just to ask how many use the wasd movement style? I configure everything around the numpad 0=Jump, (.)=crouch, enter=use, + all the way aroud to / =forcepowers the regular Pg Up & down = force powers etc.


Think I'm wierd?


If so this is me this is me not caring... questions?


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Old 04-17-2002, 01:20 AM   #33
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hehehe

I use the sidewinder dualstrike and i can program 16 commands.
but in JO 16 is not enough. But neverless the thing still rocks! ! ! !
And the good thing about it is that its very easy and responsive to use in a duel to a full fledge FFA game. (Hehehe It seems like i'm advertising this! ! ! !)
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Old 04-17-2002, 01:47 AM   #34
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i never use the joystick, i find it just makes movement more complicated, it's much easier to use the standard movement keys (w a s d) rather than a joy, but thats my opinion
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Old 04-17-2002, 02:58 AM   #35
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my post matters not! muwahaha

i use keyboard/mouse duh
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Old 04-17-2002, 12:02 PM   #36
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try this...
Panther XL

I used to use it in JK, UT, & QUAKE3
Then I switched to Win2000 & then XP.....no supported drivers

I use a natural keyboard & a trackball now

I have the Nostromo but havent tried it with JK:JO
I think ill give it a shot when i get home from work today


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