How many "skilled" players really fell for 1.02 DFA?

Dunpeel · 05-10-2002, 08:15 AM

Seriously, besides the sword on the ground bug, how many of you supposed "skilled" players actually found the DFA to be too powerful? I certainly didnt because it was so easy to dodge, and im sure other skilled players would feel the same way thinking that if i got hit by it, i deserved it because i didnt dodge it when i knew it was coming. Honestly. there was simply a slow swing before it and its not hard to see at all.

Saber battles are taking far too long now with the damage decrease AND increased blocking making CTF impossible (think flag runner with absorb + speed + blue stance on). I'd much rather have the old DFA without the sword on the ground bug.

V-tecc · 05-10-2002, 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dunpeel
Seriously, besides the sword on the ground bug, how many of you supposed "skilled" players actually found the DFA to be too powerful? I certainly didnt because it was so easy to dodge, and im sure other skilled players would feel the same way thinking that if i got hit by it, i deserved it because i didnt dodge it when i knew it was coming. Honestly. there was simply a slow swing before it and its not hard to see at all.

Saber battles are taking far too long now with the damage decrease AND increased blocking making CTF impossible (think flag runner with absorb + speed + blue stance on). I'd much rather have the old DFA without the sword on the ground bug.

Answer to your question: Not I.

I even hoped for someone to make the fatal mistake of trying a DFA on me, so that i could kill them with ease.

I completely agree with you...

V-tecc (1.02)

Cougaris · 05-10-2002, 09:10 AM

Well, I did on a couple of occasions - but not through lack of foresight (DFA is easy to dodge) but through a bad connection. By the time I saw him jumping, he was already coming down on top of me. Damm lag!!! Nothing you can do in that situation.

Zek · 05-10-2002, 09:42 AM

How could I not fall for it? I always got killed by it on 2 occasions:

1.) I avoid it, but it kills me anyway because of the buggy hit detection.
2.) I don't notice he's doing it immediately, and he's close enough when he starts that once I do it's too late.

CTF has always been a lame gametype anyway.

Spider AL · 05-10-2002, 12:44 PM

Quote:

CTF has always been a lame gametype anyway.

I just love the quaint little way you blame your poor connection/lack of reflexes on a "lame" technique Zek. And as for CTF, I just love the way you think your opinion matters.

Damar Stiehl · 05-10-2002, 12:47 PM

I fell for it in the very beginning, then it became the most avoidable move in the game, barring the occassional area effect. Which is a bug as we all know.

I don't see what the big deal about it was at all, DFA avoidance was the FIRST LEVEL of the skill ladder, once you know how to do that you can say that you're getting a bit better.

Xilimyth · 05-10-2002, 12:47 PM

For one, I had NO problem with the old 1.02 DFA, EXCEPT for the fact of, like above, the clipping and hit detection. Dying before the saber actually hit and them rotating while they were in the ground to kill me.

Now I've only been DFA by players that actually have struck me. The cheap players who exploited the clipping problem get to see me evade now at least.

(I was getting bored with the saber throw or grip to counter that stupid bug anyway...)

Aiee · 05-10-2002, 12:48 PM

*shrug* If I wanted to play CTF, I'd have stuck with UT

Vulkan · 05-10-2002, 12:50 PM

A couple of times either when I lagged out or when the other guy seriously tricked me into it... But still, I didn't like having to rely on a lucky kick, lucky side swipe or throwing my saber all the time.

Luc Solar · 05-10-2002, 12:59 PM

Ummm..guys I hate to spoil this for you but 90% (yes, that is an estimate, not a fact) of the complaints about DFA said inter alia the following: "YES I DO KNOW HOW TO AVOID/COUNTER IT SO DON'T BOTHER POINTING OUT THAT IT IS EASY TO AVOID!"

This was because every DFA-complaint met the following flaming: "Learn some skillZ dude, and you won't get owned."

The problem was that every game had a few players bunnyhopping. DFA + roll/jump backwards, DFA-roll/jump backwards, DFA-roll/jump backwards. You know what I'm talking about. It was BORING, not hard to counter. (Except for when someone DFA's into a crowd from behind and you can't se them coming)

I'll say it again: BOOORING.

The other problem was that you got killed even though the attack missed you by miles and also when the DFA-whore's saber was buried deep in the floor. That was just LAME.

Xilimyth · 05-10-2002, 01:10 PM

Quote:

The other problem was that you got killed even though the attack missed you by miles and also when the DFA-whore's saber was buried deep in the floor. That was just LAME.

I actually think it was this that ticked off more players then the bunny hoppers and spammers. I actually managed to kill the spammers in 1.02, but it was the hit detection that always X'd me out in game...

DarkAgent · 05-10-2002, 02:51 PM

Yep... definitely easy to avoid in a one on one situation, but impossible to defend if you're in a saber frenzy with 5 or 6 people twirling around and madly saber thrashing and then some other guy DFA's right into the crowd (killing 2 or 3 usually).

One on one you can see it coming for miles and just roll out of the way. When it's used cheaply (as described above) it was kind of annoying.

DA

Zek · 05-10-2002, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Spider AL

I just love the quaint little way you blame your poor connection/lack of reflexes on a "lame" technique Zek. And as for CTF, I just love the way you think your opinion matters.

If you're trying to say DFA had no buggy hit detection, you're delusional. It happens in bot-only games just as much(though they rarely use it).

Just because you don't agree with my opinion doesn't mean I'm not allowed to say it. I say CTF is lame because the powers were never balanced for it; it's hard enough killing someone who keeps running in a FFA game, but when their sole objective is to make it to the other side of the map, it's just way too easy. I'm not saying it's impossible to kill them, but it should be easier.

Rogue74 · 05-10-2002, 04:37 PM

I think the only time now or then that a DFA kills me is when it's a total surprise or I'm hit from behind where I can't prepare for it. Otherwise it's easy to get out of the way or take action against.

Lord Sokar · 05-10-2002, 06:31 PM

If you are dumb enough to run into a circle of ten people battling it out, and someone outside of that cluster decides to DFA into this mess, you deserved to die.

Anyone not smart enough to back the fuk out of the circle and draw a lame DFA'er to his death deserved to die.

NOObs rejoice! 1.03 was for you!!!

flippo · 05-10-2002, 07:12 PM

anyone who likes 1.03, fell for DFA.

LooNBB · 05-10-2002, 07:37 PM

1.03 doesn't suck... you suck.

Hellshock · 05-10-2002, 07:56 PM

I have been playing JKO since the day it was out and I thought that 1.03 would be a great addition, well I thought wrong. I owned DFA spammers in 1.02 just because when someone spams a move over and over it isnt very hard to adapt to. Now with 1.03 it makes it hard to kill anyone with saber damage down so much. Strong stance should have just been lowered from 100 to 75 damage and of course the DFA glitch, the changes to Medium and light stance are good though. But I think that the blocking is just out of hand, either it should be manual blocking or fix the damage. If you play FFA you understand what I am saying. 1.03 is only good for Dueling, but even then it isn't that great.

another note, by stopping the easily countered DFA spammers, there is a new breed of pull/push + back stabbing/slashing spammers that when in a small area can easily cheap you, especially when there are a majority of them. I myself care more about a clean fair fight then racking up points, based on the fact that I pride myself on skills not kills. thanks to the new breed of spammers JKO just isnt as good.

This is my opinion, not to be taken as an insult to those that do like 1.03 for whatever reason.

Orangina_Rouge · 05-10-2002, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hellshock
1.03 is only good for Dueling

Even for duelling it s BORING
It takes age to kill someone and honestly it is more luck than skill to win

For SP it was fun to have fights last long and that was makin up for the IA wich is allways inferior to human .....but for MP it is a curse from hell....people just now spam backstab ( and RAVEN don t try to nerf backstab ....it s not the solution ...it s the SP system wich is bad for MP )

IronJedi Kaga · 05-10-2002, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dunpeel
Seriously, besides the sword on the ground bug, how many of you supposed "skilled" players actually found the DFA to be too powerful? I certainly didnt because it was so easy to dodge, and im sure other skilled players would feel the same way thinking that if i got hit by it, i deserved it because i didnt dodge it when i knew it was coming. Honestly. there was simply a slow swing before it and its not hard to see at all.

Saber battles are taking far too long now with the damage decrease AND increased blocking making CTF impossible (think flag runner with absorb + speed + blue stance on). I'd much rather have the old DFA without the sword on the ground bug.

Well I cant speak for everyone but my main problem with th dfa was not dodging but countering. I could dodge DFA all day in 1.02 yet the problem was countering. The main problem being that I was , and still am an HPB. Being an HPB I could pull of the pre-emptive dodge. However dodging with the intent to counter required that I let you dfa within reasonable distance. Yet with the ping diffrence (I usually pinged between 180-350) I couldnt dodge at close range. Further more add to the fact that you could turn the blade in midair and being anywhere near the DFA as an HPB often means instant death unless your lucky. With the no turn no ground damage dfa, its possivble to counter without getting killed due to lag.

Star ReaVeR · 05-10-2002, 10:09 PM

DFA or no DFA... everything is possible to defend yourself

The_Raptor · 05-10-2002, 10:09 PM

Personally, I think that all the saber stances should potentially be able to do one strike kills... Come on, their lightsabers, they will cut through almost ANYTHING...

Maybe... Light stance should be able to kill in one shot if the person has no shields, and 100 health.

Yellow stance can kill with one shot (enemy has 100 health) up to when they have 25 shields or less.

Red stance can kill with one hit up to 75 shields (or so).

Ofcourse, this whole option should be totally... optional...

And in order to kill in one shot, it still has to be a clean hit in a vital area (sticking in their head, chest w/o shields, slice through neck, or strong slice through torso)...

And if they don't eventually fix FP sabers for MP, i'm gonna be pissed...

PS, blasters should do more damage to enemies in SP.. Much more...

SpaceMonkey1315 · 05-10-2002, 10:13 PM

the reason people didnt like the DFA move, 1 hit 1 kill is that people would fly randomly into flurrys of deulers, and more than likely kill one...now, not only is blocking increased, but 1.03 actually makes the game balanced, why complain about things that people ALL KNOW were abused and were balanced, that is beyond me

geronimo27 · 05-10-2002, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Zek
How could I not fall for it? I always got killed by it on 2 occasions:

1.) I avoid it, but it kills me anyway because of the buggy hit detection.
2.) I don't notice he's doing it immediately, and he's close enough when he starts that once I do it's too late.

CTF has always been a lame gametype anyway.

1) Yup, that bug should have been fixed (and should have been the only thing changed about that move)
2) It's not our fault if you aren't paying close attention to the game or what others around you are doing - that is your fault. So, due to your lack of skill, you died. That's life my man.

Personally, I fell for it twice (yes, one time more than it should have taken for me to learn my lesson). After that, I created an arsenol of counters to it.

SpaceMonkey1315 · 05-10-2002, 10:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Spider AL

I just love the quaint little way you blame your poor connection/lack of reflexes on a "lame" technique Zek. And as for CTF, I just love the way you think your opinion matters.

no, actually, zek is right, CTF sucks saber only, and rather than people who randomly bash people for their opinions, he posted his ideas, and how he felt...get off his nuts

geronimo27 · 05-10-2002, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SpaceMonkey1315
the reason people didnt like the DFA move, 1 hit 1 kill is that people would fly randomly into flurrys of deulers, and more than likely kill one

This statement makes no sense and holds zero water for the following reasons:

In FFA, if two people are dueling, then a third person should not be able to hurt them due to the duel system.

In a Duel server, this obviously is not a problem, because there can be no more than two people dueling at a time.

In CTF, the action revolves around flags, not dueling. If you are wanting to duel, you should remove yourself from a CTF server.

SpaceMonkey1315 · 05-10-2002, 11:09 PM

Quote:

In CTF, the action revolves around flags, not dueling. If you are wanting to duel, you should remove yourself from a CTF server.

well put, CTF was made for more of a "quake style" game with more gun usage

Jubatus · 05-11-2002, 12:25 AM

I only play no force/saber only duel and I died alot to 1.02 DFA spamming and for one reason only; boredom.

Sometimes I would test these DFA spammers by avoiding them to see just how many times they'd do the same move over and over again seemingly without getting bored. Think the record was about 30.

And always without fail, when I told them they were being extremely boring they immediately interpreted that as me being pissed by losing to them. Kill me all you want, just don't bore me!

I could easily avoid them all day long (looking apart form the bugged hit detection) if not for my impatience. I'd simply lose my patience and make some foolish mistake and get whacked.

Must admit I had a slight chuckle with the implementation of 1.03. The days of the DFA spammers are counted, and anyone foolish enough to use that move now has it coming for them

.

Another thing; seen more than one red stancer arguing that they're more skilled because they use single 'well-aimed' attacks and the rest of us are just swinging our sabers around wildly hoping for a miracle. While this may be true in a some cases, it clearly shows they know not of what they speak. I use yellow stance exclusively and I know what I am doing every split second even though it may seem chaotic.

There also seems to be an inherent coincidence between red stancers and players that play only for the scores. Had a little talk with one of them once and he argued that only winning is fun and it was the sole reason he played. Furthermore he insinuated that my talk of having fun playing with people as much as against them and to not being a bore with his DFA spamming was a product of me losing/being a loser. Now, my philosophy kinda dictates I should feel sorry for such types, but somehow I just wanna put them out of their misery and free the world of them by crushing their cute little skulls with an

.

Did I mention red stance single move spammers are BORING?

Knowing that this post will change nothing I am

Jubatus