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Old 05-23-2002, 07:32 AM   #41
KnightHawk420
 
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Demangel.....


Want to be an admin?
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Old 05-23-2002, 07:42 AM   #42
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my god, the risks that are here...

gotta be yanks
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Old 05-23-2002, 09:08 AM   #43
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Possibly hawk :)

I just started experimenting with running my own servers, if your night hawk server has decent ping for me (live on LI NY USA) I might be up for adminning a few hours a week

If not close enough My own server will be up fairly soon, still working the kinks out of it. It will be one of those, up for 4 or six hours a night kind of servers most likely if that. Least until I can get a Pc I can use for a truly dedicated server that is heheh.

Just ran across this great program that sets up your servers for you, and works fine with 1.03, I think a lot of folks might be using it now heheh

PM me or something sometime if you wanna talk about adminning


We all have to die, the only question is... Do you want it on your feet? or on your knees...
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Old 05-23-2002, 12:44 PM   #44
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nice thread....

cool to actually do some reading instead of lame moves all the time(as u guys call it....see ur point doh).

Started playing around a week ago, and well..my goal in multi player games is to win(of course). MAinly i got my butt kicked the 3-4 first days..and now with push/backstabbing combo, i win...ALOT.

The problem with the move is that people get kills so freeking fast....its just to do a pull, roll and kill...constanly. Most people dont have a clue about how to counter it. I belive i manage to counter it around 50% of the times or so...if 1 vs 1 fighting. In a "mob"...lol....fat chance....everyone are running backwards and 1 hit is usually instant death....sigh....Beeing able to beat a "backstabber" in score is impossible when u use different fighting styles(I belive)(well..guns and capture the flag is exeptions).

So...heh...how the **** can i WIN(lol..i NEEEED to win or at least have a fair chance, without rolling and backstabbing all the time) and STILL play fair...?

If anyone got a name of a server where that can be done....tell me...please..


The fasters way to end a war is to loose it. George Orwells

-=Groomz=-
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Old 05-23-2002, 01:00 PM   #45
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It can be done, although it is more difficult. Most of the times you only have 2 or three out of 15 people constantly backstabbing and really racking up kills quickly. If you keep these guys busy and engage them in fights where they can't apply this tactic, you will find out pretty quick that they don't have much else in their bag of tricks.

Usually I do it like this:
I check into a server and take a look at the scores. If the first five players have somewhat equal points, then there is a fair chance of having a nice gameplay on this server.

If you have a number one on the server with 25 kills and the next around 7 its a sure sign that there is one backstab whore at work. Seek him out and keep him busy. Most of the time it does the trick.

Sometimes I even do not bother about being number one on the server anymore. If I can have some nice 1v1 duels scoring 10 kills in 20 minutes thats more fun than getting 30 kills in the same time by just pull/backstabbing.
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Old 05-23-2002, 02:48 PM   #46
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Quote:
It can be done, although it is more difficult.
Here Bluez, you've hit the nail right on the head. It's more difficult to win while playing properly, than it is to win while spamming backstab. Especially in FFA. In duels, well NF duels are a lot of fun post-1.03, but that's the only game setting that's been helped by the gameplay tweaks.

To me, it just doesn't seem right that the quickest, easiest way to win is to use nothing but backstab. It reduces the game to the level of "pong."


[FW] Spider AL
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Hewwo, meesa Jar-Jar Binks. Yeah. Excusing me, but me needs to go bust meesa head in with dissa claw-hammer, because yousa have stripped away meesa will to living.
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Old 05-23-2002, 03:07 PM   #47
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Anyone who is truely spamming one particular move is predictable, therefore easy to kill. I am still a noob, far from an expert saberist or even a truly skilled one, but after playing this game for a little over a week, I have no problems with bs and dfa spammers.

Play the game and have fun and stop whining on the forums.

I am still looking for the "Proper way to play the game" guide in the manuel, but it doesnt seem to be in there, must be a "Jedi Master Forum dweeb" whiner created rule.

Anyone got a link to the Official "Proper way to play" guide? If not stop using the idiotic vebiage.

D4
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Old 05-23-2002, 05:30 PM   #48
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Quote:
Play the game and have fun and stop whining on the forums.
C'mon gimme a break. Seriously. We are not whining. This post is not about "backstab whores, I cannot counter them". We are beyond that

This is about game balancing. If players new to the game can easily rack up kills and only experienced players with deep knowledge of the game can find a way to counter this, the game is out of balance. Period.

Even if you are skilled and counter backstab, say by quickly hitting protect, it's not even really a counter. It just keeps you from being killed in an instant.

Normally it is the other way round, the skilled players kill with ease and the newbies have to look for a way to counter it.

People always say "just play the game, it's all in there for a reason". Well, get real, cause it's not. Or do you really think Raven intended players to fight butt first?

So there.

Last edited by Bluezman; 05-24-2002 at 06:49 AM.
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Old 05-24-2002, 06:44 AM   #49
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.....

Well....for me the backstabbing move was kind of a periode...*lol* Like when i was i kid and tough it was really funny to say word as ****, fart...ext. Now i KNOW backstabbing works as hell....so im getting tired of using it and wanne learn how to do more moves instead...

but....well...im 24 years old now...and some of my m8`s are still in the "fat, ****" periode...lol...so guess some players wil keep on doing it to the game get more balanced...

And...as said by other people also - i am NOT here whining!!!....just here to talk about the backstabbing. Perhapst the best way would be to start a ABS Group(Anonomus Backstabbing Support group)
. Im now properly rehabilitated, and i will try to help anyone who wants my help!. The ones who dont...no worries - ill kill u(try at least)!!...thanks for the rehab guys!


The fasters way to end a war is to loose it. George Orwells

-=Groomz=-
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Old 05-24-2002, 06:57 AM   #50
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ROFL!

*new sign/notice on the The betty ford clinic's welcome sign*

"The new Assfighters wing has been opened to the public, if you or someone you love is an assfighter, please... please... seek help right away, or call our assfighters prevention hotline at 1-800 ass-spam."

LOL funny **** groomz, but I got your point well enough sonot to worry man, glad you've turned to the light side, I always knew there was good in you... I felt it...


We all have to die, the only question is... Do you want it on your feet? or on your knees...
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Old 05-24-2002, 04:53 PM   #51
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Demangel....hehehe

The server we were on is mine. It's dedicated and I rent it.

HFB 1.03 - 65.113.118.85

Sometimes its a full force server, sometimes its a no force server...depends on my mood

Lately I haven't been playing too much because it seems every time I log on it's nothing but a spammer's wet dream...and I don't want to kick everyone so I leave and find something else to do.

Anyhow...if you know of more ppl that like to *fight* and have a good time just let me know...I'd be happy to alter the server for a good evening of some intense Jedi action. Also if you get your server going, post the info and I'll be there (provided I get a decent ping...stuck on a 56k...ugh!!)


P.S. Check out this link for configuring your force powers on your server...

http://game.projectjj.dk/jk2jo.php
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Old 05-25-2002, 07:21 AM   #52
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hehe np googly

sooner or later I will PM you when my friend gets back from his family trip. He isn't very good, but plays by the "non lame-fun" rules, and has some potential in that area.

I found a great program to do all the grunt work for me, it's called Jedirunner. Sure it's not perfect, but for what I needed done it does it just fine.

a few clicks and away I go.

so I'll PM you when i know I will be playing ETC, and when I will be running my server for a few hours (me there or otherwise).

My server times will however be weeknights after 11 PM EST about 90% of the time. the rest of the time will be before 11 on nights I don't work, and on rare occasions on weekends when I'm not out at work or drunk making an ass out of myself trying to get some girls attention heheh.

the server should be up for around 4-6 hours whenever I make the effort to run it.

Unless I give you a password for it, if you see a password on it, it's cuz I am testing somehting out ETC. But if you have a password feel free to jump on in and we'll play. I will most likely keep it password protected for a while to keep out lamers, and only let in fun people I know.

Might even do some lite role playing once in a blue moon for those interested. Not like hi there my name is demangel whats your name role playing but like: "ok guys, heres the setup for this map/battle. One team has the best player as a master with one padawan of decent skill, the other team of four has the rest. the first two are Jedi for example, the four dark jedi/reborn (some motivational reasons will be given for the battle situation, like The object is to be the first to kill the other team once. no respawn until one team is dead. if you want to spawn don't jump into the fight and go to the staging area." stuff like that.

Little things like that if everyone is in the mood for it. Kind of like grouped duels. Or duel of the fates fights but with twists.

currently My server should run in a fairly stable capicity with 4-6 players max so long as the pings are low enough (less than 150 for example, my max ping setting is at 150 to keep it safe). I am on a fast cable connection (optimum online, fastes cable connection in the USA or so I am told by all in the know. though a t1 or O3 would allow more connections at once with less trouble, my cable SEEMS to do fine for 10 or so on all other games, and so far it has run stable with 4-6 with only momentary lag at player joining on rare occasions (hiccups). so maybe one day well get ten people together and see how stressed my connection can be without being over burdened.

Until I get a hub/router or whatever and a second hand Pc capable of running the server program it's all on one machine.

So until I learn how to be an admin from within the game (not sure how to set up admins in JKII so they can work from the console for banning/kicking), I will be keeping the server private to those I know will play nice. or at least be entertaining

General server setup is Nf limited force (Once I turn on force power I usualy turn them all on save for lightning and sometimes saber throw, but with padawan points at most usualy).

However jump will always be available at FF level. Jump is too much fun to disable, and too nuetral to be used wrong unless you got a kick script or autofire or somehting


We all have to die, the only question is... Do you want it on your feet? or on your knees...
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Old 05-25-2002, 02:36 PM   #53
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Everything is lame when it kills you
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Old 05-25-2002, 04:39 PM   #54
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OK this is making me sick

To all the people who say "stop whining, blah blah blah moves are easy to counter!"

Your missing the point by a mile.

The thing is, it's not FUN, to "duel" someone who does the same fookin move over and over and over and over. What the hell is the point of even playing someone like that? I don't have fun killing ass fighters, nor do I have fun killing DFA spammers or sweep spammers. I seriously don't know how you can tolerate such idiotic things then turn around and SMILE about it. Jeez, ya must be either the happiest or the most boring people on the planet.

Sure it's just a game and you play to have fun. But after doing the exact same thing for the 50,000th time, the fun factor drops to almost nothing.

I've pretty much stopped playing on public servers and play strictly with my clan. On the very rare occasion will I join a public server, but the sheer volume of losers out there is just disgusting.

80% of the players are either

a) WTF?! YPOU KILLED ME?!! FAG!! (what? like your supposed to be god or something?)
b) spam whores
c) RPG players (ROTFL)
d) ones who enforce the most STUPID rules like "no force push!!!"

or e) l33t hax0r d00ds with their bloody scripts. There's nothing more annoying then getting pulled and hit with a heavy downwards swing EVERY SINGLE TIME. Like, you can't even touch the guy cause the second you swing at him, your on the ground and dead. Even if you have push to counter pull.
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Old 05-25-2002, 05:04 PM   #55
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Unfortunately, this is how it is.

Many people who play online games:

1) Hate to lose.

2) Hate to learn new things once they are set in their ways (it takes time and effort after all).

3) Hate to admit that there are others out there that might be more experienced, or simply more skilled than they are.


So as a result, when you get a few kills on somebody or really mop the floor with them, instead of saying "good game" and trying to improve and learn from their mistakes that allowed them to lose, they'll complain about lag, or make some other excuse like that you were cheating or using some unbeatable script, or just insult the game mechanics and say a power is "cheap" or "unstoppable."

Most of the time, people simply don't know the counters to things or haven't mastered the timing of various attacks or weapons or powers, and this deficiency they blame on the game or the other player and call them "lame." This is silly. I wrote up a nice strategy page, as many others have done, detailing the basics of the game and some of the tricks to help you become a better player. Anybody can visit Outcast Strategy (in the list of hosted sites on the main JK2.net page, it's down at the moment though) or any of the other dozen or so strategy pages to learn how to be better. The accusations of "newbie" for everything are also silly. The game will be celebrating its 2 month anniversary in about 4 days and the recent 1.03 patch changed several things that has forced people to relearn portions of the game. There is no shame in simply learning... maybe even admitting that you aren't a JK2 master after your first match. ; )

My philosophy is that instead of whining, people should just start working on their gaming skills, and just admit to themselves that they can't expect to win every single gosh-darn time and shouldn't have to to enjoy themselves. And all this stuff about people insisting that you can only saber duel, those folks need to realize that there's a large number of players that enjoy other gametypes besides just that. It seems a pity that Raven spends all this time putting in all these weapons, force powers, and game types for people to use and then you get folks who whine and complain when you don't want to duel them or lightsaber challenge them in the middle of a battle. I like dueling, but there's a lot more stuff to play, I think that some folks would be better off if they at least gave those other features a shot. It might even make them enjoy the game more!

I just take it in stride, sometimes if I'm feeling nice, I'll give people pointers, and if I really get beaten badly, I'll lose gracefully, rather than try to spoil it for the person who beat me fair and square. If I do something stupid like start typing and get shot or turn my saber off and get bowled over, then I just laugh it off and keep playing. I think the whole kick-voting against good players is incredibly stupid, but there's no way to prevent it when those kinds of people populate servers. I guess the best thing is to just join games with rules you like, and move on if they're being lame.

It's a game, and when it stops being fun because people take it too seriously or act all petty and egostistical, then there's really no point, is there? It's not the game's fault, it's the players. But with all the variety this game provides, I think there should be something for everyone (even those people who mistakenly try to turn it into an RPG, who I think should have their own private servers for that purpose, not try to force it on every public game they join, etc). ; )
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Old 05-25-2002, 05:17 PM   #56
Luc Solar
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Just got out of a game:

(Low force, no absorb, only push, pull, jump etc.)

I see a guy, walk towards him.. he pulls & tries to backstab. I jump away just in time. I back up a bit.

He pulls & tries to backstab. I jump away just in time.
He pulls & tries to backstab. I jump away just in time.
He pulls & tries to backstab. I jump away just in time.

He pulls & tries to backstab. I jump away and DFA him.

I say: "well, it seems we have a pull & backstab-spammer here."
Dude: "So what? It's a move just like any other move?!"
I say: No. And you spam it.
Dude: WTF!? It is in the game, shut up you loser, stop whining!

*sigh* "It is in the game".. That's the worst crap ever. I bet the guy had a great time owning newbies with his l337 technique...I think it's just sad.


Got Honourz? Great.. I hope you choke on it!

I r0xx0r all j00 nooberz that mess with me. You nooberz suXor out of my way or I eat j00....

Most ridiculous Quote of the century: >)O(< ENmiTy: promoting mindless FFA and SD kills promotes disorderly conduct amoung the online community.
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Old 05-25-2002, 05:33 PM   #57
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GE is exactly right. JKII multi-player games have become so disgusting because most of the
players run around using the same easy kill spam moves over and over again, endlessly. To
make up for their lack of skill with the saber.

It's not like it's debatable that the backstab and spin move are cheap and completely
unbalanced moves in JKII. Just look at what people do on servers, the proof is in the pudding.
You know something is *grotesquely* wrong with saber combat when players constantly turn
their back to you or run backwards because they know it will likely give them an easy kill,
even against a superior opponent.

In a real light saber duel, turning your back like that would be suicide. You'd die in seconds.

And that's the way it should be in JKII. If some idiot turns his back on you it should open him
to almost certain death. Not be some pathetically unrealistic way for him to get easy kills
by exploiting a huge flaw in the JKII dueling system.

If you don't have the skill to fight and win while dueling in a realistic manner (always keeping
your flanks and back away from the enemy), then you deserve to die. The JKII dueling system
should not be providing a crutch to unskilled players with these cheap exploits in
the dueling system.

Fortunately, it's easy to fix this problem. Just make it so that the backstab and
spin move are modified so that they are vastly more difficult to use, so people can't rely
on them to kill players they can't beat any other way. If necessary, remove them entirely.
Because as it is right now, saber dueling in JKII has become a joke. All you see is lame players
constantly running backwards at you or trying to turn their back on you so they can't get the
almost automatic kill that the backstab and spin moves provide.

I ask that the JK II team *please* fix and/or get rid of these backstab and spin moves.
Turning your back on an enemy in a saber duel should get you killed, not give you easy kills.
Which is what we have right now.
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Old 05-26-2002, 05:58 AM   #58
Luc Solar
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Dude, STFU! It is in the game! The move is IN THE GAME so stop whining you l00ser.

Uh..LOL! Yeah, well I am kidding, of course. I just wanted to see how stupid I'd feel saying that.

But seriously folks, how can we get rid of the assfighters? Seriously.

A) Taunt them to death?

B) Put down you saber and walk away every time they try to buttrape you?

C) Sidestep again and again untill they give up?

D) Kill them?
------------------------------

None of these seem to do the trick..

A) They usually don't listen. They're too busy backstabbing.

B) Not so fun + they'll just move on stabbing someone else.

C) They are usually to dumb to give up. Since running backwards and hitting the floor with their saber is all they do...why give up? It's not like they would do anything differently anyways.

D) They respawn. Always.

I'd appreciate any hints 'n tips on how to deal with these people.


Got Honourz? Great.. I hope you choke on it!

I r0xx0r all j00 nooberz that mess with me. You nooberz suXor out of my way or I eat j00....

Most ridiculous Quote of the century: >)O(< ENmiTy: promoting mindless FFA and SD kills promotes disorderly conduct amoung the online community.
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Old 05-26-2002, 06:42 AM   #59
Vestril
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Quote:
I'd appreciate any hints 'n tips on how to deal with these people.
Ok, here is what I suggested to someone in a different thread, I've modified it slightly for your benefit

Lose to one of them, keep trying to beat him, but 'lose' every time. I know it's usually hard to lose to them, like literally hard, but it will be easy for this time, because you're going to try to 'ass fight' too. So lose a bunch, and then shower them with praise, telling them that they are Jedi Knight gods. Then request to become their apprentice. Spend a lot of time learning the ways of the ass fighter, befriend the ass fighter.

Then, get him to tell you where he lives. Once he's told you, go to his house and use a garden hose to soak him, and his PC.

Repeat.



Vestril was here!!!!!!!!!
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Old 05-26-2002, 07:09 AM   #60
Luc Solar
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LoL!

Vestril...you, sir, are a genious!
Don't know if I am able to pull it off, but I'll try my best...I mean...worst..whatever.


Got Honourz? Great.. I hope you choke on it!

I r0xx0r all j00 nooberz that mess with me. You nooberz suXor out of my way or I eat j00....

Most ridiculous Quote of the century: >)O(< ENmiTy: promoting mindless FFA and SD kills promotes disorderly conduct amoung the online community.
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Old 05-26-2002, 03:24 PM   #61
Vestril
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Quote:
Originally posted by Luc Solar
LoL!

Vestril...you, sir, are a genious!
Don't know if I am able to pull it off, but I'll try my best...I mean...worst..whatever.
*bows deeply* Anything to get rid of an ass-fighter.


Vestril was here!!!!!!!!!
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Old 05-27-2002, 01:58 AM   #62
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kurgan
Unfortunately, this is how it is.

Many people who play online games:

1) Hate to lose.

2) Hate to learn new things once they are set in their ways (it takes time and effort after all).

3) Hate to admit that there are others out there that might be more experienced, or simply more skilled than they are.


So as a result, when you get a few kills on somebody or really mop the floor with them, instead of saying "good game" and trying to improve and learn from their mistakes that allowed them to lose, they'll complain about lag, or make some other excuse like that you were cheating or using some unbeatable script, or just insult the game mechanics and say a power is "cheap" or "unstoppable."

Most of the time, people simply don't know the counters to things or haven't mastered the timing of various attacks or weapons or powers, and this deficiency they blame on the game or the other player and call them "lame." This is silly.
Kurgan nailed it perfectly, right square on the head.
Print that out, have it bronzed and hang it right above your monitors.
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Old 05-27-2002, 02:05 AM   #63
BlackDove
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Uhm, I knew it before he said it...since it's so obvious...anyone else?


There are only two constants in this world.
1. I kill you.
2. You cry for a lightsabre damage nerf.
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Old 05-27-2002, 03:55 AM   #64
Nathan Wind
 
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good call kurgan
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Old 05-27-2002, 04:21 AM   #65
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this thread has gotten more attention than it deserves.
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