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Old 07-28-2002, 08:55 AM   #1
Synax
 
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Light stance Lunge/uppercut... while running?

Well I'm not sure if this is the best place to ask this, but its come to my attention recently. With the arrival of 1.04 and the backstab nerf (thank god) there has been the nerf to jump lunge. I think we're all familiar with it... where someone does the light/blue stance crouching lunge while in the air? Well you can't do it anymore.

However I've started seeing a new reincarnation of this attack. People are running up to me at full speed, and without pausing lunging (Or maybe you call it uppercut). Now everytime I try this I just roll... because to do the attack you need to press 'duck+forward+primary attack' and if you duck while running you just roll.

Anyone have any idea on how this is done? Not knowing has put me at a big disadvantage in several games already, and I was always a fan of the jump-lunge.

I did have someone a long time ago try to explain it as binding a second key to 'Forward' then while you're holding down your primary run key you tap the secondary one and crouch+attack to make it work. However I could never do it, I spent a long time rolling over and over alone in my own server trying to.

So could anyone explain the run-lunge trick to me? I know its not just letting go of 'forward' and then doing the normal lunge, there are people out there who are doing it without any pause at all and they never accidently roll at me. Hopefully at least someone else has seen what I'm talking about.
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Old 07-28-2002, 11:22 AM   #2
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The running blue lunge is no trick, you just have to be able to press all the keys and it'l work, the only problem is timing, which people have to work on, and maybe swich their keyboard config around
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Old 07-28-2002, 02:51 PM   #3
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Yeah..i have this same problem. I think it's just a bug in the game because it doesnt seem to work unless you stop running for a second and then do the lunge. When you let go of forward to do the lunge, the animation continues for half a second; If you try to do the lunge during this half second you roll. A counter ive found for this (which sucks, btw :P ) is to press back right before you try the lunge. That seems to make it easier for me to do it. You can run at full speed, turn, whatever you want as long as you tap the back button right after you let go of forward to do the lunge.




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Old 07-28-2002, 03:01 PM   #4
Agen
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run to them and when you get there just tap duck and fire, works for me. and it looks like your jsut running. you can hardly see the duck at all unless you study it for ages.
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Old 07-28-2002, 10:23 PM   #5
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Another way is right when you get to your target and hit duck+walk at the sametime, since you can't roll walking, everytime you do forward+duck+attack while walking you lunge everytime, instead of rolling. Harder to do, but pays off if you can master it.
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Old 07-28-2002, 11:17 PM   #6
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It's not a bug & it could be done before 1.04 too. If you're running you just have to let up off of forward the split second before executing the lunge keypress sequence.

The bind thing someone told you doesn't sound like it would work. If you want to bind it just bind the entire move as it is done from the manual:

bind x "+movedown; + forward; + attack"

Last edited by ToppDog; 07-29-2002 at 03:35 AM.
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Old 07-29-2002, 03:11 AM   #7
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Awesome!

Wow thanks alot guys, I just got it to work for me everytime now! I bound a key to do the lunge, and now while I'm running towards them I quickly hold down my walk key and then hit my lunge button, always works with almost no pause. I really appreciate the help.
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Old 07-29-2002, 04:11 AM   #8
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you can do it without a script, you just have to press crouch+attack+forward at the exact same time
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Old 07-29-2002, 08:03 AM   #9
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Yea I have pulled it off a few times without using the bound key now that I think of it... but it was so rare I figured it a bug or just graphical glitch that it worked. I guess I'm not very good at hitting all 3 at the same exact time while running.
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Old 07-29-2002, 04:30 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by Synax
Yea I have pulled it off a few times without using the bound key now that I think of it... but it was so rare I figured it a bug or just graphical glitch that it worked. I guess I'm not very good at hitting all 3 at the same exact time while running.
Another one has fallen to the dark side of scripting.
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Old 07-29-2002, 05:01 PM   #11
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Hmm I guess it looks that way... spending hours and hours practicing the simultaneous pressing of those three keys doesn't appeal to me, I don't even spend that much time playing the game. Oh well I already embraced the rest of the dark side in the game!
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Old 07-29-2002, 06:14 PM   #12
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There is nothing wrong with binding a simple move like that to a key. Combo moves like this are there because it's easier for programmers to transfer the game to a console platform (X-Box, Playstation2, Gamecube, etc.) where they have to use combos because there aren't enough buttons on the controllers. It has nothing to do with cheating & is not really an advantage since anybody can do it. It's not like hacking.
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Old 07-29-2002, 06:57 PM   #13
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The uppercut is no problem in 1.04. Its only a problem in NF servers, but in FFA NF i see a lot of DFA's...


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Old 07-30-2002, 11:26 AM   #14
Luc Solar
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Quote:
Originally posted by ToppDog
There is nothing wrong with binding a simple move like that to a key.
...
It has nothing to do with cheating & is not really an advantage since anybody can do it. It's not like hacking.

Yes, there is something wrong with binding moves to a single key.

Yes, it is cheating and yes, it gives an unfair advantage.



....honestly, I can't believe the stupidity of some people! You really need to win *that* bad?


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Old 07-30-2002, 02:10 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by Luc Solar


Yes, there is something wrong with binding moves to a single key.

Yes, it is cheating and yes, it gives an unfair advantage.

I just want to know one thing. Do you have any keys bound for text messags?

Many of the so called anit-scripters in this forum have keys bound for chatting/insults. So remember that any change to the game engine/bind is a cheat if you want to be close minded about scripts. Even coloring your name is a script of sorts, if you stick to the definition that scriipting is any change to the game/engine that is not allowed by default in the menu system of the game.

So if you are going to condone scripts make sure that you do not do this. I am not saying that you do, just asking a question and making a general statement to others. So please save the flames...I am just curious about your (and everyones) stand on these few points.


Just play the game......do not complain about it!
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Old 07-30-2002, 02:22 PM   #16
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I really dont give two hoots if someone scripts. If they wanna script fine, you can still counter and whip their a$$. Oh and btw a cheat is some way to alter the intent of the game to your advantage. Since scripting is a big part of the engine I dont see it as cheating. Hell isnt the challenge key actually a bind hence a script?


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Old 07-30-2002, 02:40 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by Luc Solar



Yes, there is something wrong with binding moves to a single key.

Yes, it is cheating and yes, it gives an unfair advantage.

....honestly, I can't believe the stupidity of some people! You really need to win *that* bad?
It's not cheating because YOU have the same ability. It's not like hacking. An unfair advantage? No more so than playing with better ping, or with a faster PC, or with an optical mouse, or even a mouse with a scroll button for that matter. All of those things can give you an unfair advantage if your opponent doesn't have them. Does that make you a cheater? No.

We all know the difference between binds that do moves a player couldn't possibly do on his own, & ones that simply replicate simple keypresses.

Some people use controllers & have moves bound because they are not using buttons for the movement keys. If they use a button to do a move while using a joystick, etc. to move around I am not going to call them a cheater.

There is no rule that says you must use the default setup to play the game, & as long as customizations are permitted within the game, people should be allowed to do as they please.

Unlike a lot of people, I do not whine when someone uses a script against me. I consider it a challenge to find a way to beat it.

So lay off Synax & let him play the game how he chooses.

Last edited by ToppDog; 07-30-2002 at 07:30 PM.
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Old 07-30-2002, 03:22 PM   #18
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yah!!... IF you cant beat the ppl who scripts... well join them =)

i dont script.. i once did, and I sucked (i stil suck but o well) big time...


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Old 07-30-2002, 03:45 PM   #19
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Binding an attack to a key is as old as Quake I. Nothing wrong with it in my mind.

I can pull off the lunge just fine pressing the keys, but I try to bind as much stuff as I can so that it's within easy reach. I have lunge on a mouse button, force powers around my movement keys, etc. For the record, I never bound backstab, or spin-stab.

Does it make me unbeatable? Heck no. I'm about as average a player as it gets. That's why I hardly ever did backstab; I wasn't really good enough to knock folks down and do it.

I just can't do all the nice, fancy keyboard tricks that I used to. My hands and wrists don't really work that well anymore, but hey, carpal does that to ya

Anything that takes the strain off my hands and wrists when I'm playing a game I like, is a good thing, IMO.


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Old 07-30-2002, 04:43 PM   #20
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I agree with all of you guys that scripts are not cheating. I do not use attack scripts but I do use a nostromo controller and then scripts for all of my system settings. Scripts can not make a bad player better. A good player knows when to make moves and when to duck. Scripts can sometimes make it a little easier, but in my ho the best player will always win the fight. Plus if they did not want us to do it they could have fixed the code by now!


Just play the game......do not complain about it!
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Old 07-30-2002, 08:53 PM   #21
Datheus
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Honestly.. binding lunge isn't that big of a deal.. I mean.. if they can hit you with a scipted lunge, they probably could have hit you with a non scripted lunge, it's not like you can't dodge scripted attacks... Now... if you were to bind Pull + Backstab... you should go die

I personally choose not to play with any binds at all, which... does get annoying when I roll instead of lunge and miss what would have been a clean hit
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Old 07-31-2002, 07:37 AM   #22
Luc Solar
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*sigh*

Fine, I'll try to explain:


Cheating means that you gain an unfair advantage by being able to do things easier.

No, it is not cheating to use a mouse with 3 buttons instead of some basic 2-button mouse. No, it is not cheating to use a mouse with 480 buttons together with a 67-button joystick.

Yes, it is cheating to use a mouse with only 1 button, if by pressing that single button you are able to execute a move that would normally require pressing multiple buttons.

No, it is not cheating to type "^3" infront of your name to colour it yellow, instead of white. That does not give you an unfair advantage.

No, I do not feel like being a hypocrite if I say: "killing is bad", but then head out driving my car even though I know dozens of insects will get crushed on my windshield as a result of my actions.

See a pattern here? The point is: UNFAIR ADVANTAGE. Get MORE with LESS SKILL/EFFORT.

You really think that if something "can be done" it is not cheating? If you can use scripts, it is not cheating because someone else can do that too? Is binding a "complex, very difficult to pull off"- move to a single button cheating, but binding a move that's a bit easier to execute isn't? So...it's like...cheating-just-a-little? Uh...?

Here's a question to all you binders/scripters/hackers/whatever:

Why?

Why do you do it?

Could the answer be that using them makes beating opponents easier? ...yes?


I refuse to believe that I'm the only person who sees the difference between

a) binding ONE action (f.ex taunt) to ONE button and

b) binding MULTIPLE ACTIONS (f.ex throw-pull-kick-speed-run forward-switch to walking-crouch-forward-attack) to ONE button.

This all seems so obvious, yet so many people out there simply don't "get it".


(And no, countering a scriptkiddie is not the issue here.)


Got Honourz? Great.. I hope you choke on it!

I r0xx0r all j00 nooberz that mess with me. You nooberz suXor out of my way or I eat j00....

Most ridiculous Quote of the century: >)O(< ENmiTy: promoting mindless FFA and SD kills promotes disorderly conduct amoung the online community.
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Old 07-31-2002, 08:52 AM   #23
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Doh!

Why do people still insist on calling them "Light" and "Heavy" when they are really "Fast" and "Strong"?

I admit, I slipped up once or twice, but c'mon people....

Oh well, little pet peeve of mine. ; )
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Old 07-31-2002, 09:35 AM   #24
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Re: Doh!

Quote:
Originally posted by Kurgan
Why do people still insist on calling them "Light" and "Heavy" when they are really "Fast" and "Strong"?

I admit, I slipped up once or twice, but c'mon people....

Oh well, little pet peeve of mine. ; )
To drive you and only you nuts!


Just play the game......do not complain about it!
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Old 07-31-2002, 10:37 AM   #25
Luc Solar
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Hey Kurgan...why don't you lighten up a bit. There's no need to take it so seriously, light?

A light guy like you surely understands that even though some of us light use imprecise terms every now and then, we're not trying to pick a light with you. We're all very sorry, I'm sure.


But honestly, I don't really know what you're talking about...I've never heard anyone use the term "light stance", maybe it's all in your head, hmmm?

Anyways...I sure hope everything is all-light with you, man. Take it easy.



Got Honourz? Great.. I hope you choke on it!

I r0xx0r all j00 nooberz that mess with me. You nooberz suXor out of my way or I eat j00....

Most ridiculous Quote of the century: >)O(< ENmiTy: promoting mindless FFA and SD kills promotes disorderly conduct amoung the online community.
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Old 07-31-2002, 10:56 AM   #26
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Whoa I never meant for this to turn into a "Scripters vs anti-scripters" thread. In response to your complaints, you are making the lunge out to be alot more complex than it is. Its merely pressing 3 keys at once, its not a series of complex combination attacks, just pressing 3 keys at once. I choose to let the computer do that for me. Why you ask? Well my hand isn't a fast as the computer, its harder for me to press all 3 of those keys at once while running over and over with much success. So yes I suppose I do it because its easier. To me its more fun to do the move I want to do instead of accidently rolling or something else.

Its not that I'm doing something I couldn't do without the script, its just that its relieving me of some the stress of doing it manually. So yes I'm sure many of you would define that as cheating, oh well I suppose. I refuse to embrace the idea that moves should be in the most complex manner possible. And with so many people out there doing it, it hardly gives me an advantage over everyone.

To be fair though I never start lunging like a maniac until its done to me. I actually prefer the fights where no special moves are used; no backstabs, no strong jumping slash, no medium twirling jump and no lunge. Fights like that can be really interesting, but usually aren't possible on public servers. So rather than looking at it like I use the script to get an advantage on people, look at it like I use the script to even the playing field when others use it on me.

P.S. All in all I think people are making more of this than necessary. You really want to complain about people cheating and doing things you can't you should look at Counterstrike's history, which I endured for years. Having a script press 3 buttons for you with only 1 key is hardly on par with that.
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Old 07-31-2002, 11:33 AM   #27
Luc Solar
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You seem like a decent guy...and I didn't mean to flame you.


I enjoy arguments, and "what's cheating/what isn't" is a pretty interesting subject.


I loathe the kiddies who are loaded up with god knows how many cheats and are busy "pwning" everyone and letting them know how much they "suxx0rZ" 'cause they were just "owned".

Having fun is one thing, having fun on the expense of others is kinda lame.

You do not seem like a "serious" gamer, so your scripted lunge might not become a "problem". But it is cheating nevertheless.

Counter Strike is a joke. I don't want JO to become one too.

I can't tell you not to use scripts, but please at least be honest about it if someone asks.

No wait...I can't tell you to do that either...damn.

Oh well, peace to you all, I'm in a way too good mood to argue with anyone today.


Got Honourz? Great.. I hope you choke on it!

I r0xx0r all j00 nooberz that mess with me. You nooberz suXor out of my way or I eat j00....

Most ridiculous Quote of the century: >)O(< ENmiTy: promoting mindless FFA and SD kills promotes disorderly conduct amoung the online community.
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Old 07-31-2002, 02:12 PM   #28
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I said it before, and I'll say it again.

I bound lunge to a mouse button...it's the only "special" that really requires multiple buttons at the same time that aren't naturally within my reach.

Yellow stance overhead slash...W + Space + Mouse1...easy for me. My fingers are on those keys already.

Red stance DFA? Simple enough. Don't have to do anything special there.

But the lunge requires the forward + crouch...that's just a little tougher for me, as I have to stretch my hand a bit just to reach the keys for that one. So, I just bound it to an unused mouse button. I don't see the big deal. As I said before, it doesn't give me much of an advantage, because I'm an average player as it is

I bound it because I do use it a lot. I think it's a great counter-move for certain attacks. I've told some opponents who spam DFA at me that they'd better land the move, otherwise I'll make them pay for leaving an opening (sidestep and lunge as they land). My preferred method of attack is trying to time red stance swings to hit Still working on that one.

Now, I don't want to sound like I'm begging for pity, I know that's how it looks. I just want people to understand that there ARE some valid reasons for certain things to be done. Binding things to keys or buttons saves me strain on my hands and wrists. If you don't like it, come on over and pay for a doctor's visit to have them fixed up, and I'll gladly unbind


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Old 07-31-2002, 02:57 PM   #29
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I don't care if people consider scripts cheats or not, but it is a fact that they eliminate human errors and makes it possible to ALWAYS pull of certain moves. People use scripts to give themselves a better chance of winningm, not to make the game more fun or challenging. Bu eliminating human errors you also remove some of the fun and I think scripting sucks badly.... cheating or not. I will never use scripts for the simple reason it makes the game less challenging for me and that means less fun. I would rather loose 90% of all games than take aways some of the work I have to do to win a fight. So yes I think scripting suck and I think the people who use scripts only do it to be able to win better. My major beef with fighting scripters is that they are bloody boring to fight... they never make that human error that I can exploit and if I also uses scripts it all just comes down to grinding at each other. But I do not expect sportsmanship in an online game... the scripts are here and there isn't anything we can do about it. The whole talk about cheating is also crap... there is nothing we can do to make people stop cheating. I play computer games for fun and I want a challenge. I find no fun in sabering down a newbie (unless he's a lamer too, then it gives me some satisfaction). I would rather give him some tips... and why? To make the game more challenging and more fun for ME.

Oh well lets just get on with playing and remember people... most of us can see when you use a script... you can deny it all you want but we will know. I will never tell you that you use a script, but know that in my world you're just less of a man/woman.
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Old 07-31-2002, 05:00 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by RahnDelSol
I said it before, and I'll say it again.

I bound lunge to a mouse button...it's the only "special" that really requires multiple buttons at the same time that aren't naturally within my reach.

Yellow stance overhead slash...W + Space + Mouse1...easy for me. My fingers are on those keys already.

Red stance DFA? Simple enough. Don't have to do anything special there.

But the lunge requires the forward + crouch...that's just a little tougher for me, as I have to stretch my hand a bit just to reach the keys for that one. So, I just bound it to an unused mouse button. I don't see the big deal. As I said before, it doesn't give me much of an advantage, because I'm an average player as it is

I bound it because I do use it a lot. I think it's a great counter-move for certain attacks. I've told some opponents who spam DFA at me that they'd better land the move, otherwise I'll make them pay for leaving an opening (sidestep and lunge as they land). My preferred method of attack is trying to time red stance swings to hit Still working on that one.

Now, I don't want to sound like I'm begging for pity, I know that's how it looks. I just want people to understand that there ARE some valid reasons for certain things to be done. Binding things to keys or buttons saves me strain on my hands and wrists. If you don't like it, come on over and pay for a doctor's visit to have them fixed up, and I'll gladly unbind
Some people can be sooooooooo dense.
Remap your keys! Just map crouch to alt or shift! thats what I do...



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Old 07-31-2002, 05:34 PM   #31
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Actually binding it to a script key doesn't make it work all the time. I still roll alot or just do a normal downward slash, its not perfect by any means. Now perhaps I'm just not binding it right, but its far from 100%, more like 75%. And the way I look it at... when I was able to jump-lunge I could do 100% of the time from the air, I'm less of a threat now than I used to be.
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Old 07-31-2002, 08:58 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally posted by Synax
Actually binding it to a script key doesn't make it work all the time. I still roll alot or just do a normal downward slash, its not perfect by any means. Now perhaps I'm just not binding it right, but its far from 100%, more like 75%. And the way I look it at... when I was able to jump-lunge I could do 100% of the time from the air, I'm less of a threat now than I used to be.
Exactly! I have the special moves bound using the exact keypress sequences described in the manual. They don't always work for me either. I roll a lot when trying to do the lunge too.

You people that are complaining about these scripts are either very dense, or have not been playing PC games long enough to notice how much things have changed within the gaming industry within the last 5 - 10 years.

So let me tell you once more. PC games these days aren't designed like they used to be at all. Companies that used to design PC games used to be very small outfits that took time to turn out a good product with plenty of controller support, etc. & their main focus was on games for the PC. Whereas today, the companies are bigger & want to make their games designed so that they can more easily be transferred to other gaming platforms such as X-Box, Playstation, Gamecube, etc.

So instead of designing a game specifically for the PC with all the controller/keyboard options available to the PC, they make it as generic as possible with little or no controller support & with keypress commands that can be easily adapted to console type controllers with a limited number of buttons.

If this game had been made several years ago the spacial moves would have been assigned to ONE key each. There wouldn't be any combo type key sequences to perform a certain move, just the ONE key.

I would prefer this anyway, & if there was a way to alter the game so that I could assign a separate key for each move that had nothing to do with the other movement/attack keys I would do it. The way it is now puts limitations on how I would like to fight.

I don't like doing a special move by accident because I happed to hit the movement & attack keys "just right" when I'm only trying to move & attack. Sometimes you just want to run, jump & attack in medium without doing the yellow twirl DFA thingy if you get my drift.

Last edited by ToppDog; 07-31-2002 at 09:14 PM.
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Old 07-31-2002, 10:00 PM   #33
Mero Vilul
 
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Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 122
All I can say is:
If you use scripts, never complain when another player use a "far more superior script than yours"... You set the rules by allowing scripts, so don't be upset when someone have a better script than you. The end.

I don't use scripts, and I'm still only met ONE people who could match me in a one on one duel (he fakenicked, so I don't know hes real name though).

Take Care.
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